Not surprising at all considering the cutoff date for registrations were in October. I expect many Sanders supporters there won't have been registered in time.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2016 |OT4| Tyler New Chief Exit Pollster at CNN
- Thread starter Spoiled Milk
- Start date
- Status
Not surprising at all considering the cutoff date for registrations were in October. I expect many Sanders supporters there won't have been registered in time.
Agreed. It is important to seek some input from outsiders (independents, Republicans) but it doesn't mean every contest has to be open to anybody. That's what the general is for.
That's the point of Closed primaries which I'm all right with. But if you want people to join your party you should make it easier at a moment when the enthusiasm is High. Not trying with all your heart to make it incredible difficult. We want more democrats not less. Hell I will be fine with a 'you need to have changed your affiliation before the date of the IOWA caucus'. october its absolutuley arbitrary.
Well, do remember that it is New York. Pretty much everyone around here registers as a Democrat.
Butts-a-plenty
Banned
Most of human society is arbitrary.
I'm not from Upstate New York, but I'd imagine they'd take issue with your statement!
metalslimer
Member
Yeah I think closed primaries are fine but it should be like a month advance notice not 6. Closed primaries are not voter disenfranchisement either way though. I don't like the hodgepodge of systems we currently have going on.
Cutoff date for new registrations was March 26.
Cutoff date to change party was in October.
They're trying to make it sound like new registrations were cut off in October, when that's not the case. That's why a lot of people grumble that if you wanted a say in the party, you should have been in it in the first place. It's people who registered independent/Republican probably complaining that their registration had been changed without their notice and that their deadline was in October.
I'm sort of muddled on this myself. Is it disenfranchisement when one was already a registered voter?
I got here in January. It sucks. Inherently antidemocratic.
The primary got moved back, used to be Super Tuesday.
Should they have moved the date up as a result? Probably. At the same time, why should independents get a say in who the Democrats choose to represent them?
Pretty sure if you had registered it would have been fine. The October deadline is for people looking to change their party registration.
Personally, I don't think it is disenfranchisement. If you want a say in who a party's nominee is, you should be a member of that party. Not someone changing over to influence that party's voting process.
The deadline should be voting day.
Then people just re-register as a Dem for the primary and change back so they won't be bothered by calls or people going door to door right after. If you don't want to be part of a political party so they won't bother you, then you've got to take the bad with the good.
metalslimer
Member
In the scenario that the republicans had locked up a nominee pretty fast would people really want republicans playing a crucial role in the democratic primaries? I don't think you should be able to switch immediately or if you could there should be a waiting period before immediately switching back
Open primaries work in other states!
Just let anybody in. Probably leads to more moderate/electable candidates. Many more legitimate party switchers than trolls.
You were just complaining you got there in January. Did you fail to register in the interceding two months?
This is just saying you don't believe in closed primaries.
Why should the Democratic Party work to make it easier for people who aren't Democrats to choose their nominee?
I remember somebody telling me I missed the October deadline so I didn't bother. That doesn't happen if anybody can just show up and vote.
Macho Madness
Member
It's not even the party, it's the state.
If you're engaged enough to bother voting in a primary or participating in a caucus, then you can go online and take five minutes to check when the deadlines are. I swear, people put more thought into making sure their Amazon Prime doesn't expire than the voting process.
You know how else it doesn't happen? You take some personal responsibility and do your own research rather than asking joe schmoe off the street when deadlines are.
You know how else it doesn't happen? You take some personal responsibility and do your own research rather than asking joe schmoe off the street when deadlines are.
Open primaries work in other states!
Just let anybody in. Probably leads to more moderate/electable candidates. Many more legitimate party switchers than trolls.
The way I look at it is, if you can't be bothered to be associated with a party for less than one day every four years...
NY doesn't really have a problem finding electable candidates on either side, outside of the tea party madness.
October deadline is only for people changing their party affiliation. You moved here so you were under the March deadline.
EDIT: A change in address update just needs to be done 20 days before the actual primary. So you had until the end of March to register, which is longer than the 25th deadline for new voters.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Open primaries work in other states!
Just let anybody in. Probably leads to more moderate/electable candidates. Many more legitimate party switchers than trolls.
In California we have semi closed primaries, so independents can vote but not people in another party. I prefer that - keeps our candidates from being tinted red by rogue republicans.
StopMakingSense
Member
Technically - 'Decline to State' can, 'Independents' can't, and only if the party allows it. (Republicans don't for example).
gutter_trash
Banned
Pretty much this.
There is too much Operation Chaos going on with party switching then goof voting for the worst candidate in the other party
It is a party primary after all
Yes.
It's in their interest to expand the party. Restricting outsiders from being involved in the process goes against that goal.
How is this any different from the argument for voter ID? Just take personal responsibility and get an ID!
You can say primaries are different from a real election because they are party-driven, but why should they be? The democratization of the primaries was a good thing.
Why? I would argue the opposite. Holding closed primaries creates a strong incentive for politically involved people to join the party closest to their interests, which grows the party.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Makai has a point. Open primaries produce more competitive candidates.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
You have to prove that the number of people who are motivated to join a party because of closed primaries is larger than the number of people who are on the fence but are brought into the party because of a welcoming persona and centrist candidates.
I DOUBLE POSTED NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The people they need to pick up to win in the general are the politically disinterested moderates. Politcally involved people who are close to their interests are their base. They're free.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I'm not so sure anymore. Before the internet, election spoiling would be a lot harder to organize. Now with Facebook/Twitter and the like, it seems like closed primaries may be the best long term option.
Not dug in about this though.
Not dug in about this though.
Democrats basically control state level offices in NY. They don't need to look good to republicans. Like if all the independents and republicans and all the third party guys in NYC voted in lockstep the democrats would still win the mayor's office. The only time republicans or independents win in NYC is when they run to the left and the dems fuck up.
It's more competitive upstate, but the numbers from NYC dems are still too insane to overcome in a statewide election. Party can't get a whole lot stronger here.
Politically disinterested moderates, by definition, don't vote in primaries. Most politically involved people don't vote in primaries!
More would if it were freer. There is a negative correlation between voting restrictions and turnout.
StopMakingSense
Member
I mean, one thing I feel about open primaries is that it weirdly codifies the two-party system. Keeping them closed keeps them party processes, that the state is merely facilitating by letting them piggyback on the primary.
Macho Madness
Member
I fucking knew it.
Abinash117
Member
Not necessary, I believe they don't need to pick up people whom are politically disinterested because they are disinterested making it open isn't going suddenly make them interested in the party. The real way is the party attempts to get disinterested people in their party, by having them sign up for the party by doing rallies, townhalls,voter resignation events, advertising, etc all of which is even done before the primaries. It isn't necessary to have that during open primaries. Plus you get people who aren't really interested in the Democrat party itself but instead the candidate which can mean you get a voters who aren't loyal and therefor won't vote for Democrats when needed.
If what you said is true then there needs to be data that the indies and reps joined the democrat party after voting in open primaries and actually stay in there for a bit.
While the argument that the primaries should be open and registration should be possible up to the day of, there's a few practical things that I can think of that could explain why NY would have the rules they do.
NY is very high population and having registration up until the day of would probably going to make the process of voting very messy, especially in NYC. I guess part of the reason why the deadline for new registrations is set almost a month before is most likely because of the high volume of processing that high-interest elections might cause.
For what it is worth, NY has no voter ID laws, and after my registration has been processed I have never been asked for ID or anything other than my voting districts and my name when I walk in to vote. It's an incredibly painless process, very smooth and fast. I can be in and out in less than 10 minutes. If having early deadlines contribute to the ease of the voting process, I honestly wouldn't mind having early deadlines.
However, the caveats to the above is that my smooth experience might have something to due with NY's abysmal voter turnout rate. Less people voting = less people in line = faster for me.
But I don't think the low turnout rate is due to any of the problems of early deadlines or registrations. I think it's mostly just apathy from being in a solid blue state. Turnout being the number of registered voters that actually vote, it's not a case of voting restrictions hurting turnout but rather people just not bothering. People can register to vote when they get their drivers' licenses, then probably never vote. It's not even hard to get registered; forms are available in multiple languages at my local library all year round. It's just that people aren't interested until it's close to an election, and then they want to have their say.
I see the deadline popping up on my twitter feed today. So this is going to be the big excuse, eh?
I don't like the date. It's asinine. But it hasn't been hidden. It's been well known. And both sides' voters must adhere to the rule. Any claims of "rigging" will elicit eyerolls.
Team Bernie likes playing the rulebook game to finagle extra delegates here and there from other states, right? They're technically playing by the rules in those instances too, which is why I tend to not complain about such a thing.
I don't like the date. It's asinine. But it hasn't been hidden. It's been well known. And both sides' voters must adhere to the rule. Any claims of "rigging" will elicit eyerolls.
Team Bernie likes playing the rulebook game to finagle extra delegates here and there from other states, right? They're technically playing by the rules in those instances too, which is why I tend to not complain about such a thing.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Ok, well, I was talking about other states. Closed primaries are pretty common everywhere else in the country.
Are you one of us again?
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
So I went on Sanders for President and they are digging up nude photos of DWS. Brahs needs to get back to phone banking.
Poodlestrike
Banned
HylianDramatis is right, this silliness must stop.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked