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[Tamanon]

BTW, today might mark a banner day for McCain losing support from the elderly. First his silly "Social Security is a disgrace!" quote and today's the Medicare bill that they're one vote short on passing, and he chose not to attend.

 

[GhaleonEB]

BTW, today might mark a banner day for McCain losing support from the elderly. First his silly "Social Security is a disgrace!" quote and today's the Medicare bill that they're one vote short on passing, and he chose not to attend.

Oh, that's not going to play well. He skipped out on the veteran's bill as well, though that was a landslide. He's really dodging votes that cater to his base.

 

[reilo]

With the Iran missile test news.

OOH! A HELPFUL CHART ON IRAN-US RELATIONS!

Lame but expected development, Obama has to live in the Land of Chocolate so during his interviews this morning he has to ratchet up the hype saying Iran is a serious threat. Can't have any qualifications or the retards jump on it and it spreads to the retards with college degrees.

I guessed before I saw this that we could destroy Iran with whatever carriers we got in the area.

I was watching a show on History about the aircraft dogfights in Desert Storm. We either blow them out of the sky before they even see us or one dude got outmaneuvered and ate sand with his MIG when he try to hang.

Like I said, Iran and Ahmedinidjad are nobodies.

 

[mckmas8808]

BTW, today might mark a banner day for McCain losing support from the elderly. First his silly "Social Security is a disgrace!" quote and today's the Medicare bill that they're one vote short on passing, and he chose not to attend.

WTF!? Why didn't he vote? What is the medicare bill about?

 

[reilo]

WTF!? Why didn't he vote? What is the medicare bill about?

McCain has missed over 350+ senate votes. He doesn't need a reason. He probably never read the bill, anyhow.

 

[Tamanon]

WTF!? Why didn't he vote? What is the medicare bill about?

It's the medicare bill about scaling back benefits. The one that's going to probably cause a good amount of doctors to stop taking Medicare.

 

[ToyMachine228]

It's the medicare bill about scaling back benefits. The one that's going to probably cause a good amount of doctors to stop taking Medicare.

Which means the shit is going to hit the fan. Health care is vital to senior citizens lives, and the majority of them and other retired people rely on Medicare.

 

[Guileless]

The New York Times saw the latest offer to Iran in June. Some of you seem to have the wrong idea about the state of Iran diplomacy wherein the State Dept. is helpless as 'the neocons' strut around like the mean CIA guy from the last Bourne movie.

The United States has refused to negotiate directly with Iran until it suspends enrichment, but it has also promised a full regional dialogue with Iran, which would include Iraq, Syria and Middle East peace, if enrichment stops. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice has said of the Iranian government: “We would be willing to meet with them but not while they continue to inch toward nuclear weapons under the cover of talks...”

The six world powers “will refrain from any new action in the Security Council,” while Iran “will refrain from any new nuclear activity, including the installation of any new centrifuges,” the fast-spinning machines that enrich uranium.

As before, the new proposal recognizes Iran’s right to peaceful nuclear energy. It pledges to support construction of modern light-water reactors, to arrange for the timely provision of enriched fuel and to cooperate in trade, energy, agriculture, the environment and civil aviation.

The only thing Sen. Obama could do differently from a diplomacy standpoint is meet directly with Iran along with the Europeans before Iran suspends enrichment and offer it essentially the same deal. That would be a change, but it is hardly revolutionary. The deal they are being offered now provides them with enriched fuel appropriate for civil power generation and recognizes their right to civilian nuclear power; they don't need to enrich uranium themselves. Enriching fuel is hard, expensive, and insisting on the right to control the process has no plausible explanation beyond reserving the capability to create weapons.

 

[soul creator]

well, at least old people can always rely on the invisible hand of the market

 

[Tamanon]

The New York Times saw the latest offer to Iran in June. Some of you seem to have the wrong idea about the state of Iran diplomacy wherein the State Dept. is helpless as 'the neocons' strut around like the mean CIA guy from the last Bourne movie.



The only thing Sen. Obama could do differently from a diplomacy standpoint is meet directly with Iran along with the Europeans before Iran suspends enrichment and offer it essentially the same deal. That would be a change, but it is hardly revolutionary. The deal they are being offered now provides them with enriched fuel appropriate for civil power generation and recognizes their right to civilian nuclear power; they don't need to enrich uranium themselves. Enriching fuel is hard, expensive, and insisting on the right to control the process has no plausible explanation beyond reserving the capability to create weapons.

Well....you mean besides wanting to be more independent of foreign influence on your energy. But, that doesn't sound as sinister.

 

[GhaleonEB]

CNN is reporting that Kennedy - he of the brain cancer and chemotherapy - might fly to Washington for the Senate vote on Mecidcare. Sounds like it's not likely, but hell. If he's trying to come, it makes McCain look even worse for not bothering to show up.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/07/09/kennedy-weighing-senate-comeback/

 

[Lv99 Slacker]

From Slashdot: Nancy Pelosi vs. the Internet
Wednesday July 09, @02:00PM

"A story popped up on the ChicagoBoyz Blog. It says 'Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who would like very much to reimpose the old, so-called, "Fairness Doctrine" that once censored conservative opinion on television and radio broadcasting, is scheming to impose rules barring any member of Congress from posting opinions on any internet site without first obtaining prior approval from the Democratic leadership of Congress. No blogs, twitter, online forums — nothing.'"

 

[reilo]

From Slashdot: Nancy Pelosi vs. the Internet
Wednesday July 09, @02:00PM

The hell.

 

[Mandark]

The only thing Sen. Obama could do differently from a diplomacy standpoint is meet directly with Iran along with the Europeans before Iran suspends enrichment and offer it essentially the same deal.

He could do a lot different. Like say...

giving Iran security guarantees, withdrawing US support and tolerance for groups like the MEK, Pejak, and Jundallah, and allowing Iran to join the multilateral institutions that would integrate it further into the world economy.

There was no mention of that in the article, other than a vague and completely unenforceable promise of "dialogue and cooperation on nonproliferation, regional security and stabilization issues" after Iran has made the biggest concession.

There's a slight difference between using diplomacy as a means of negotiation to work out a mutually beneficial agreement and expecting someone to give in to your demands before you even maybe talk about theirs.



PS "Some of you seem"? C'mon. That's just passive aggressive.

 

[Jonm1010]

From Slashdot: Nancy Pelosi vs. the Internet
Wednesday July 09, @02:00PM

While I agree that a revamped type of the fairness doctrine would be a good thing, however, if the rest of that is true, I would be be strongly against it.

 

[PhoenixDark]

I don't. Young people can go to rallies and scream their lungs out for Obama, but if they forget to vote in November, or lose interest (as so many usually do), it doesn't matter how loud they were at that rally. And it doesn't matter if McCain's supporters are sleepy old people, as long as they show up and vote for him, that's all that matters.

Exactly. You can laugh at the old people all you want but they'll be out in force come November. Their level of "enthusiasm" is irrelevant when compared to things that are actually important (to them) - whether it's judges or Iran or whatever.

 

[Karma Kramer]

Can someone sum up Obama's tax cut plan... my mother thinks her taxes will go up even though she makes less then 227,000 a year.

 

[bob_arctor]

Can someone sum up Obama's tax cut plan... my mother thinks her taxes will go up even though she makes less then 227,000 a year.

 

[Byakuya769]

bu bu but, I always learned that McCain was for the middle class working man!!!

 

[ronito]

bu bu but, I always learned that McCain was for the middle class working man!!!

of course he is. If he helps out the rich the rich in turn help the working man. Sheesh, it's called Urination Economics.

 

[reilo]

bu bu but, I always learned that McCain was for the middle class working man!!!

Didn't you know? The ultra-rich will share all their excess profits with all the minimum-wage earning citizens they employ by giving them lucrative bonuses after every month. Durr.

 

[ToyMachine228]

Can someone sum up Obama's tax cut plan... my mother thinks her taxes will go up even though she makes less then 227,000 a year.

From what I understand, your taxes will go up if you are single, and make over $200,000 a year, or are married and combined make over $250,000 a year.

 

[LizardKing]

i like all of the other obama numbers, but if you make 3 million a year your taxes will go up 25%? i'm all for progressive taxes but i think that's a little steep. should be about half that considering they already pay about 35%. No one should pay over 50% of their income in income tax, let alone 60%.

 

[esbern]

REV. JESSE JACKSON APOLOGIZES TO SEN. BARACK OBAMA FOR 'CRUDE AND HURTFUL COMMENTS' CAUGHT BY OPEN MIC... DEVELOPING...

from drudge. any idea here?

 

[reilo]

i like all of the other obama numbers, but if you make 3 million a year your taxes will go up 25%? i'm all for progressive taxes but i think that's a little steep. should be about half that considering they already pay about 35%. No one should pay over 50% of their income in income tax, let alone 60%.

$700K of $2.9mil is ~25%.

 

[Guileless]

The temporary suspension of enrichment in exchange for a freeze on efforts to get sanctions at the Security Council is not a big concession. It's temporary, and as North Korea demonstrated not particularly meaningful. Not only has it been talked about, but the Iranians are already assured of getting what they claim to ultimately want with a civilian nuclear energy program. Iran is violating the NPT. Iran is a theocracy and a state sponsor of terror. Iran turned the American embassy into an anti-American propaganda museum. Iran's president gives speeches like a comic book villain. You can argue over the specifics of diplomatic strategy, but Europe and the US are not dealing with a conventional government that deserves the benefit of the doubt.

If Pres. Obama goes to Tehran and dazzles the mullahs into renouncing enrichment and accepting permanent inspections, I will donate $100 to his re-election campaign in 2012 and you can all ridicule me in the world peace thread. I really hope that happens. I sure as hell don't want to pay $10 for a gallon of gas after an Israeli air strike.

 

[Mandark]

i like all of the other obama numbers, but if you make 3 million a year your taxes will go up 25%? i'm all for progressive taxes but i think that's a little steep. should be about half that considering they already pay about 35%. No one should pay over 50% of their income in income tax, let alone 60%.

That's the average change for everyone making over $2.9 million, which includes people making $10 million, $200 million, $1 billion, etc.

 

[mckmas8808]

While I agree that a revamped type of the fairness doctrine would be a good thing, however, if the rest of that is true, I would be be strongly against it.

Any form of the fairness doctrine is bad. We don't need it!

This is one point where the market can do what it does.

 

[Bishman]

Obama's remix A Milli: http://www.zshare.net/audio/14937102dd1da11e/

 

[Tamanon]

CNN describes words as very disparaging?

WTF could Jackson say and why would it pertain to Obama?:lol

And McCain not being at the Medicare vote is going to look even worse. Ted Kennedy flew in for the vote.

 

[Lucky Forward]

http://cnnwire.blogs.cnn.com/2008/07/09/jackson-apologizes-for-obama-words/

Jackson apologizes for Obama words
Posted: 04:14 PM ET
NEW YORK (CNN) — The Rev. Jesse Jackson apologized Tuesday for “crude and hurtful” remarks he made against Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama after finishing an interview with a Fox News correspondent.

Jackson told CNN that the interview had wrapped up and he didn’t realize his remarks were captured by a “hot” microphone.

Jackson didn’t elaborate on the context of his remarks, except to say he was trying to explain that Obama was hurting his relationship with black voters by recently conducting “moral” lectures at African-American churches.

“My appeal was for the moral content of his message to not only deal with the personal and moral responsibility of black males, but to deal with the collective moral responsibility of government and the public policy which would be a corrective action for the lack of good choices that often led to their irresponsibility,” Jackson said in a statement issued Tuesday afternoon.

 

[syllogism]

I heard on the internets that he said he wanted to "rip Obama's nuts off" because he was talking down to black people about faith

 

[LizardKing]

That's the average change for everyone making over $2.9 million, which includes people making $10 million, $200 million, $1 billion, etc.

oh it's the average? that's a different story then. i was thinking if you made 3 million or more your taxes would just go up 700k. and reilo, these are hikes/cuts not total amount paid. so i meant the 25% plus the 35% they already pay. but if it's an average that's different. does anyone know the percentages per bracket?

 

[Gaborn]

I heard on the internets that he said he wanted to "rip Obama's nuts off" because he was talking down to black people about faith

You have to love Christian love. The Rightwing nutjobs want to assassainate Hugo Chavez, the left wing nutjobs want to castrate Obama.

 

[bob_arctor]

I heard on the internets that he said he wanted to "rip Obama's nuts off" because he was talking down to black people about faith

Hmm. Just going by the CNN snippet above, sounds like Obama pissed off Jesse in the way Bill Cosby pisses off some black folks.

 

[reilo]

How was Obama talking "down to black people" exactly?

Was Bill Cosby doing the same thing, too?

I guess Jesse Jackson hates anything that doesn't fit his agenda.

 

[syllogism]

Drudge is now saying Fox News will air the tape

 

[Tamanon]

Jesse was probably pissed that more people were actually listening to Obama than do him when he takes the pulpit.

And hell this won't be bad at all, it would've been worse if Jackson had said something bad about white people when talking about Obama.

 

[Mandark]

You don't get it! They're crazy Muslims and none of the old rules apply!

Right now I'll just say that I disagree and that the data's on my side.

 

[reilo]

Jesse was probably pissed that more people were actually listening to Obama than do him when he takes the pulpit.

I'm really perplexed how one man manages to piss off his own race, any opposing race, people on his side of politics, people on opposite side of politics, and every motherfucker inbetween!

It's like one group wants Obama to be everything what they stand for and not even make any considerations towards any other group. So when he does say something they don't like, they label him as being completely anti-whatever group they are a part of.

 

[GhaleonEB]

How was Obama talking "down to black people" exactly?

Was Bill Cosby doing the same thing, too?

I guess Jesse Jackson hates anything that doesn't fit his agenda.

Pretty much.

 

[reilo]

Pretty much.

If Obama doesn't get elected, I can see Jesse Jackson coming out and proclaiming that the white man engineered all this to bring a black man down.

 

[bob_arctor]

How was Obama talking "down to black people" exactly?

Was Bill Cosby doing the same thing, too?

I guess Jesse Jackson hates anything that doesn't fit his agenda.

Well, if you read his quote, it seems he was pissed that Obama seemed to blaming the black man for all his problems. So while he may have agreed w/ Obama about personal/moral responsibility, he felt Obama didn't mention enough the role of government and policy in shaping the bad choices black males are faced with and their responsibility in that regard. I think.

 

[maximum360]

Drudge is now saying Fox News will air the tape

Now isn't that surprising.

 

[Gaborn]

I'm really perplexed how one man manages to piss off his own race, any opposing race, people on his side of politics, people on opposite side of politics, and every motherfucker inbetween!

It's like one group wants Obama to be everything what they stand for and not even make any considerations towards any other group. So when he does say something they don't like, they label him as being completely anti-whatever group they are a part of.

I think it's because of the expectations Obama has been setting. He's extremely good with rhetoric, and because of the power of the imagery, because he's young, good looking, and half black people want to perceive him as more than he is. Look at all the comparisons he draws to JFK. Now, I can't say I think all that much of JFK on policy, but I certainly recognize he's a powerful figure in the psyche of the US, particularly on the left side of the spectrum. Any time you start drawing comparisons of that nature, fairly or not it raises expectations on all sides, and when you don't quite meet them on a litany of issues you're going to disappoint and even anger a bunch of people. The more Obama is hyped the more he's going to make people upset if he can't live up to the billing his supporters give him.

 

[reilo]

Well, if you read his quote, it seems he was pissed that Obama seemed to blaming the black man for all his problems. So while he may have agreed w/ Obama about personal/moral responsibility, he felt Obama didn't mention enough the role of government and policy in shaping the bad choices black males are faced with and their responsibility in that regard. I think.

I think the government responsibility was implied, but the entire point of Obama's speech was that the best way to succeed is to bring yourself up and not rely on others [ie the government] to completely and utterly bring you out of whatever undesirable situation you are in.

I think that holds true no matter what race or heritage you are.

 

[GhaleonEB]

CNN describes words as very disparaging?

WTF could Jackson say and why would it pertain to Obama?:lol

And McCain not being at the Medicare vote is going to look even worse. Ted Kennedy flew in for the vote.

Holy shit. He actually came.

From NBC's Ken Strickland
Sen. Ted Kennedy has just arrived back in the US Senate for a vote at 4:00 pm on Medicare.

The man is going through chemo right now and flew in for this vote. I wonder how the media will cover McCain skipping out.

Probably by not covering it at all.

 

[reilo]

I think it's because of the expectations Obama has been setting. He's extremely good with rhetoric, and because of the power of the imagery, because he's young, good looking, and half black people want to perceive him as more than he is. Look at all the comparisons he draws to JFK. Now, I can't say I think all that much of JFK on policy, but I certainly recognize he's a powerful figure in the psyche of the US, particularly on the left side of the spectrum. Any time you start drawing comparisons of that nature, fairly or not it raises expectations on all sides, and when you don't quite meet them on a litany of issues you're going to disappoint and even anger a bunch of people. The more Obama is hyped the more he's going to make people upset if he can't live up to the billing his supporters give him.

Funny thing is, Obama's entire campaign has been about empowering the people and that the citizens of this country lead the way to change. He wants to give the populace the power to make themselves better and not rely on the entire government.

Many people fail to realize that and just instantly jumped on Obama's back and expect him to do everything. That's not what his message is about.

Giving the government back to the people and providing opportunities for an individual to rise on their own merits is what drew me to Obama, not the asinine belief that Obama would make everything magically work. He can't do it on his own, and it's up to us to make this country better for ourselves and future generations.

Holy shit. He actually came.


The man is going through chemo right now and flew in for this vote. I wonder how the media will cover McCain skipping out.

Probably by not covering it at all.

Why are you questioning McCain's patriotism and civil service records [or rather, lack thereof]?

Speaking of McCain, for someone that touts his entire campaign on experience and "being there" and "doing things rather than talking about them", he sure as fuck hasn't managed to show up, has he?

That's the biggest crime right now. The media and people covering McCain as experienced and being a "been there, done that" candidate, when in reality, he hasn't managed to even show up to a lot of crucial votes.

 

[Kitschkraft]

I'm really perplexed how one man manages to piss off his own race, any opposing race, people on his side of politics, people on opposite side of politics, and every motherfucker inbetween!

Oh please, Jesse Jackson (And since they are usually tied together, Al Sharpton as well) is hardly hated in the black community. His approval rating among blacks is probably higher then congress at this point....

Everytime he says something, people try and paint him as so radical and out of touch with blacks. The truth is that Obama is not doing himself any favors in the black community when he talks about progression in the community, and focuses strictly on missing fathers (Although he may bring up other issues, this is what his fathers day address was pushed as in the media). Is he hurting his black support? I highly doubt it, but he's certainly not the "ideal leader", and Jackson is correct that he has came off as condescending before, at least in the eyes of many.

Regardless, this actually will go to help Obama. As long as he doesn't appease to Jackson on this issue he can only gain white support by being seen as in contrast to Jesse Jackson. And as stated, he's not going to lose any black support regardless.

 

[bob_arctor]

I think the government responsibility was implied, but the entire point of Obama's speech was that the best way to succeed is to bring yourself up and not rely on others [ie the government] to completely and utterly bring you out of whatever undesirable situation you are in.

I think that holds true no matter what race or heritage you are.

Yes and I agree. I also think Jesse would agree (hopefully). His issue was that Obama didn't mention the government's moral/personal obligation enough. Keep in mind I am basically guessing from that small quote posted above and I never heard Obama's speech.