IF you lose money on selling a product then you're selling it for a loss. But silly me.
Is NIntendo currently selling their hardware at a profit? Is Nintendo selling their software at a profit? Is Nintendo making money?
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Report: NX Handheld Dimensions, Layout Info, Lack of Region Lock
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IF you lose money on selling a product then you're selling it for a loss. But silly me.
Is NIntendo currently selling their hardware at a profit? Is Nintendo selling their software at a profit? Is Nintendo making money?
th3sicknness
Member
3D at the time on the smaller screen was a feature ultimately most people turned off because it had a terrible viewing angle and gave people headaches. It wasnt until the 3ds xl and the eye tracking that people realized the 3d was bearable and could be used. The system was made for kids yet there was a disclaimer saying long periods of 3d game play would damage your eyes.
The problem is 3d, second screen, and motion controls all came at the sacrifice of other features on the system. When the fad wore off people just stopped playing the system because it had no legs to stand on. Luckily the 3ds had no competition from the Vita and had a stellar game lineup after its terrible launch. The Wii had some legs and sold well because of the Wii remote but crashed so hard in the last 2 years of its life cycle because it really lacked the titles to keep it going.
Steve Youngblood
Member
What are you talking about? I don't think anybody here is asserting that nVidia is making money necessarily on the Shield product line. What people are questioning is your assertion that they would sell it as a loss leader. I would also like to politely suggest that you make some small effort to try and post in good faith. I get it. Sometimes it's easy to fall into the trap of being rude and/or sarcastic. My own first post to you was kind of sarcastic. We sometimes need a release when we see what we perceive to be questionable argumentation.
But it's getting frustrating when post after post of your's is doing nothing but laughing at what you perceive to be reading when your perception does not seem aligned with what people are actually arguing. Like right now you are laughing at the stupidity of arguments that nobody is actually making.
Skittzo0413
Member
3DS launched with that whole AR games package, and it was heavily marketed as one of the new features. Face raiders, AR cards, etc...
Also scanning QR codes, video chat, making a Mii look like your face... there are certainly utilizations but you're right that it's not a major feature. It's probably worth the little it costs to implement though (in my opinion anyway).
The mic can be easily replaced by a headset sold separately. Plus there is an audio jack.
Yup, that and there are tons of people who would rather play what's easily accessible to them vs seeking out specific hardware for a better experience.
Why do you think awful golf/match 3 games are popular at bars? Most people just play what's convenient and available.
Used to be the only way to play games was to seek out hardware to do it. Now you already have hardware and you just play what's available on it. Mobile directly competes for those people (and often their kids.)
Except i never said they were selling at a loss leader. You said that.
And I would suggest to you that you read posts for the point of the post and not parse a sound bite out of a post.
Steve Youngblood
Member
There's a difference between the following scenarios:
A.) It costs us $250 right now to manufacture each console but we're going to sell it at $225 with the hopes of attracting more customers into our ecosystem and monetize their subsequent transactions.
and
B.) It costs us $225 and we're going to sell it at $250. But given our R&D and marketing costs, if we don't sell X units we're not going to make money on this product line.
These are different strategies. Both can result in the company not making money. But they are different approaches. The latter does not meet the criteria of the product "being sold at a loss."
I'm not arguing that the camera can't be a good add-on, I'm just saying that the support it got in games and software is not really that relevant in the big picture.
Hmmm...
I'm hoping the speculation that the custom chip is more power and heat efficient is true. I really don't think anyone wants a noisy, hot handheld with bad battery life.
720p, fine. I'm not the most observant when it comes to graphics and I thought the expectation had been 540p anyway.
As to launch is ahead of schedule...well I still maintain it is behind and should have hit this holiday if possible
But, this is good news; a lot of speculation was going on that they wouldn't even be able to hit March. I just really hope this launch year is as good as we all are thinking it has to be after this last drought.
As to the camera...I don't really have a horse in that race.
I'm hoping the speculation that the custom chip is more power and heat efficient is true. I really don't think anyone wants a noisy, hot handheld with bad battery life.
720p, fine. I'm not the most observant when it comes to graphics and I thought the expectation had been 540p anyway.
As to launch is ahead of schedule...well I still maintain it is behind and should have hit this holiday if possible
But, this is good news; a lot of speculation was going on that they wouldn't even be able to hit March. I just really hope this launch year is as good as we all are thinking it has to be after this last drought.As to the camera...I don't really have a horse in that race.
LegendofLex
Member
A pretty simple rule to follow when it comes to entertainment: All of it is competing over the same blocks of time in your life.
Whether you choose to read a book, watch live TV, watch something over a streaming service, go outside, hang out at a bar, play video games, consume something on your phone - it's all a matter of "what do I want to spend my leisure time doing right now?"
Video games have two jobs: to engage you through satisfying gameplay, sure; but also to engage you more effectively than other forms of entertainment do.
When people choose to play games on their phone vs. play games on a dedicated gaming system, it's a matter of whether they see the experiences they get on the dedicated gaming platform as worth the hassle it takes to play them (learning how to use the controller, paying the money for the device/game, etc.). Sure, maybe they don't have an established need for tight controls, but only people who already play games with controllers have this need.
th3sicknness
Member
Nvidia doesnt need to show off the quality of their silicone lol.. they have the entire GPU market on PC demonstrating that (roughly 70% of it).
If I had to predict the launch price - 249.99 with a pack in game, along with a surprisingly robust software launch line up.
As far as software prices - given the the NX is supposed to mimic mobile and console game experiences - there will probably be a tiered system of pricing for games from 60 dollars for large console type games (like Zelda), down to very cheap digital only titles like BoxBoy.
It would be interesting to see if they push any kind of subscription service for their software as well.
As far as software prices - given the the NX is supposed to mimic mobile and console game experiences - there will probably be a tiered system of pricing for games from 60 dollars for large console type games (like Zelda), down to very cheap digital only titles like BoxBoy.
It would be interesting to see if they push any kind of subscription service for their software as well.
"being sold at a loss" is a general statement.
Steve Youngblood
Member
This is stupidly frustrating.
It may have been unintentional on your part because you are unfamiliar with the terminology, but "selling at a loss" is synonymous with a product being a "loss leader."
chrisPjelly
Member
What "rumour announcement" did I miss?
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/at+a+loss
Wikipedia said:
I don't understand what are you arguing now and I'm not sure you do either.
LegendofLex
Member
Technically, whether a product sells at a loss is independent of whether it selling at a loss is intended to drive greater profit in the long run through other goods and services.
But I think it's dumb if anyone thinks Nvidia intended to sell Shield at a loss without recouping those losses some other way.
No that's not the case. But I'm in a videogame forum. I'm not being that formal.
But are they in the NX package or are they sold separately? This is the question.
Please be formal, we can handle it.
Yeah, but when it is portable that means it doesn't have a camera or a mic. Presumably, people want the same functionality as camera on 3DS, which this runs against.
LegendofLex
Member
But are they in the NX package or are they sold separately? This is the question.
Other questions:
1) Is the camera practical for on-the-go use? (i.e. is it small enough to be attached to the portable, but not so small as to be easily lost?)
2) Is the mic a headset of some kind?
TheBaldEmperor
Member
Uh what? The actual definition is completely appropriate for this discussion. Even on a gaming forum.
Leona Lewis
Banned
They're inside the controllers.But are they in the NX package or are they sold separately? This is the question.
Skittzo0413
Member
Right, it's been speculated that it could be on the dock sorta like Kinect, but that would remove a lot of AR possibilities with the handheld which is what I think is worth the extra ~$1 per unit (if that number is accurate).
What controller?
dampflokfreund
Banned
Guys, I have a name for NX.
What do you think about...
NintenGO? There are a couple of reasons to name the console like that!
NintenGO - There's no play like it
What do you think about...
NintenGO? There are a couple of reasons to name the console like that!
NintenGO - There's no play like it
LegendofLex
Member
The detachable thing that isn't actually the "portable device."
Dont forget possoble FF III/6 remake.
When it's attached it's "portable", come on. I don't think Emily is trolling that much.
Discomurf
Member
*************
Originally Posted by tr1p1ex
The point would be to establish a brand. And to show off the capability of their silicon.
And just because products are on the market and being sold doesn't mean they make money.
***************
"loss leader" is a conclusion you could pull from my statement. IT isn't the statement.
DXB-KNIGHT
Member
Yokai Watch Bone and Flesh?Won't be the first time i'm thinking at loud randomly in those threads but hey that's how i have fun i guess
While we're speaking of local multi with detachable controller, we always think about one screen (and all rumors mention just one screen so my idea is probably 99% wrong but anyway)
What about..
That's the kind of thing past Nintendo would have loooooved. The power of the NX would eventually let it handle 2 screen entirely, and both player wouldn't see the other one (imagine the incredible possibilities), and all that with motion control etc..
And it's probably not impossible to budget with low quality 720 screens.
At least THAT would surprise people!
Yes when you describe a loss leader strategy to a T I'm going to assume you're saying they were following a loss leader strategy. How else could you have possibly meant that?
It looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a dock but I never said it was a duck!
Why do people feel the need to keep arguing with a person that has no interest in a fair intelectual discussion. The past pages are littered with replies to a guy (or girl) that has been in my ignore list since he or she first set foot in a Neogaf thread due to clear trolling. I don't get it.
About the camera and mic, it makes no sense what so ever to not include it. They cost pennies. It's not like they need to put in a 16MP 1.8 lens in there. An average 2MP front camera with half decent light sensitivity will do fine. Not including it would be stupid, with social apps, with Mii maker, AR games... why not look further into the smartphone applications? Faceswap etc... This is a part of the hardware that will cost you nothing to include, but could cost you big if you do NOT include it.
About the camera and mic, it makes no sense what so ever to not include it. They cost pennies. It's not like they need to put in a 16MP 1.8 lens in there. An average 2MP front camera with half decent light sensitivity will do fine. Not including it would be stupid, with social apps, with Mii maker, AR games... why not look further into the smartphone applications? Faceswap etc... This is a part of the hardware that will cost you nothing to include, but could cost you big if you do NOT include it.
Skittzo0413
Member
Preach man. I totally agree with all of that. I don't know if Emily's report is based on a devkit or protoype or what, but I fully expect a camera and mic to be part of a final handheld unit. I just see no good reason whatsoever not to include it.
Or Mario Sports NX.
It doesn't seem to be a report based just on the devkit. I guess we'll see.
Maybe you're right, maybe they need to get the price down by any means necessary.
That's so unrelatable though. You're not going to be playing that in an airport or in a coffee shop. You'll be playing motion control games in a room (whether your house or a party or whatever) and that room will probably have a TV.
It's not only about keeping the prices down, the accessories have usually a pretty hefty margin.
Refreshment.01
Member
Then why didn't you made the focus of your post about the increased complexity to comunicate the concept to a main stream audience? Or costs? It seems you were stablishing a disyunctive between wirelessly video and the possibility of increased performance when docked. "This or that". Maybe your brain was thinking something and your hands typing other?
Well picturing 250 for the device. To have a Wifi enabled dock, chipsets with all in onse solutions like a processor, wifi, ethernet and USB go for less than 10. And at the least the base has USB ports according to rumors so that would be absorbed in the price.
But yes, what will prevent this from happening is all about costs and not mcuh else. A supposedly cutting edge mobile chipset won't come of cheap after all.
Indeed. Functionally, this is the most complicated concept to explain to the general public of any Nintendo device, even harder than the Wii U.
However, the issue some times is not about the difficulty of explaining the concept but offering a product that interest people enough to care to know about it. Wii U failed not only because it was hard to understand but it was hard for the public to care about it in the first place, specially when Nintendo's own handheld device was servicing the Nintendo base well enough. The Wii U was perceived as redundant.
In the end, it will be the games that' ll do all the explaining needed. This time around key software will be available at launch and will arrive with a more consistent flow through out the system's life. Nintendo unified development pipeline and all it's resources focused on one device will make it possible.
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On to other matters: Is the new rumor about the NX not having a camera?
A camera most be included in some fashion. If not on the handheld per se the camera will be in a sensor bar or the dock separated from the device. i can't visualize how Nintendo would package the device without a camera or some sort of image sensor. i just cant...
Trying again
I never can seem to find an interview confirming this but I'm fairly certain I read at one point that they have felt 60 fps is unnecessary for a console Zelda.
The rumor is that the camera/mic aren't built inside of the portable system.
Not that the NX won't come with a camera/mic (maybe a separate accessory?)
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