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[Timberwolf25]

PlayStation Portal literally says "remote player" in its name. It could not be clearer. Xbox Rog Ally makes no such distinction. And the people you are calling hypocrites are not saying this device "should play those games natively". Most of us here understand completely what this is: a PC handheld. The discussion is whether consumers will understand what Xbox Rog Ally is and isn't.

https://www.bestbuy.com/product/sony-playstation-portal-remote-player-midnight-black/JXHQ3C2H3K

I mean.....you are saying the same thing reinking and I are saying, but somehow we are hypocrites?

That's typically the case, but throwing Xbox in the name is designed to attract a larger audience.

It can play Xbox games via XCloud just like Playstation Portal can play PS5 games thru console streaming. Both can play games for the it's "brand" system remotely. So why can one use the PS brand and Xbox can't?
To say it's fine for one and not the other is hypocritical.

Does ROG Xbox Ally have to have the word "remote" for it to be better?

 

[Timberwolf25]

Perhaps if Microsoft leaned more into "Xbox PC" branding that would help differentiate it from Xbox consoles. I think Rog Xbox PC would have been a better name

That might've been a better name and probably better to avoid confusion.
Although we don't know what MS future plans are. If it can play OG Xbox, X360 and XB1 (doubtful) through emulation would it be better?
I thought I remember somewhere that they are hiring people again for BC and emulation positions

 

[demigod]

because the Xbox team literally made the OS for it... that's why it has Xbox branding.

also when the leaked Playstation handheld releases, it too won't play all your PS5 games, because each game would need a patch to become compatible.
more than 1100 play anywhere games are cross compatible between the Xbox consoles and the Ally. meaning 1100+ games that are available to buy on Series X and Xbox One, will seamlessly work on the Ally, while it's using a special Windows 11 version made by the Xbox team, launching directly into an Xbox storefront environment.

so it absolutely plays Xbox games... just not all of them... just like the PS4 when it released didn't play all PlayStation games, or how the PS3 stopped playing all PlayStation games after its first revision.
did that make those systems "not a PlayStation"? was the PSP not a PlayStation because it didn't play PS2 games?

Even you are confused about what it is. It's a windows os, not an xbox os.

 

[Topher]

It can play Xbox games via XCloud just like Playstation Portal can play PS5 games thru console streaming. Both can play games for the it's "brand" system remotely. So why can one use the PS brand and Xbox can't?
To say it's fine for one and not the other is hypocritical.

Does ROG Xbox Ally have to have the word "remote" for it to be better?

One is clearer about what it does. No one said one or the other was "better". Bizarre for you to make statements about hypocrisy when you don't understand the basic argument of those you are calling hypocrites.

 

[Timberwolf25]

One is clearer about what it does. No one said one or the other was "better". Bizarre for you to make statements about hypocrisy when you don't understand the basic argument of those you are calling hypocrites.

Not bizarre at all. If you say it's good for one and not the other because one is "clearer", then I don't know what to tell you.
I've never had a problem with the name Playstation Portal at all. And even in this thread, I haven't said it was an issue. It does what it does and you won't find ever saying anything about it.

 

[Topher]

Not bizarre at all. If you say it's good for one and not the other because one is "clearer", then I don't know what to tell you.
I've never had a problem with the name Playstation Portal at all. And even in this thread, I haven't said it was an issue. It does what it does and you won't find ever saying anything about it.

Eh.....I wasn't the one who started this silly warrior debate in the first place my man.

 

[Timberwolf25]

Eh.....I wasn't the one who started this silly warrior debate in the first place my man.

Sorry if it's coming across that way to you, because if it is, that's not my intention at all.
And I didn't start it, I was commenting on people that was saying it shouldn't have "Xbox" on it.

I'll just respectfully agree to disagree at this point.

 

[playbignbox]

But this Rog Ally does run Xbox Studios games. It even runs Sony Studios games lmao

 

[demigod]

But this Rog Ally does run Xbox Studios games. It even runs Sony Studios games lmao

Nice driveby trying to console war. I'm going to let you in on a little secret. All those windows pc handhelds can do the same.

 

[reinking]

It can play Xbox games via XCloud just like Playstation Portal can play PS5 games thru console streaming. Both can play games for the it's "brand" system remotely. So why can one use the PS brand and Xbox can't?
To say it's fine for one and not the other is hypocritical.

Does ROG Xbox Ally have to have the word "remote" for it to be better?

You seem to be stuck on the fact that the ROG Xbox Ally can stream Xbox games and the Portal can stream PlayStation games and trying to lump them into the same category based on that. The best way I can explain the difference to you is that the PlayStation Portal can only stream PlayStation games. Period. It would not make sense to call it anything else but PlayStation. The ROG Xbox Ally's main function is to play PC games natively and can stream Game Pass just like any other brand of PC. I understand that this is nothing more than a partnership with ASUS but it does make it confusing when early on they included it as part of the Xbox family and were not clear that it would only stream Xbox console games via Game Pass.

 

[Topher]

Sorry if it's coming across that way to you, because if it is, that's not my intention at all.
And I didn't start it, I was commenting on people that was saying it shouldn't have "Xbox" on it.

I'll just respectfully agree to disagree at this point.

That's the thing. We never disagreed about Xbox. I was saying the exact same thing that you were about the Xbox branding possibly being a problem. PlayStation has nothing to do with it.

 

[Timberwolf25]

That's the thing. We never disagreed about Xbox. I was saying the exact same thing that you were about the Xbox branding possibly being a problem. PlayStation has nothing to do with it.

It's a problem, I agree.
My only disagreement was that it had to be able to be played native to be an "Xbox" and was pointing out other cases where that wasn't true. PS was the only other gaming example to come to mind at the time which is why it was the example I used.

In the end, they've already named it and will not likely change at this point. Maybe like Sony, they will make it clear in their ads that it doesn't play natively. Although I won't be getting one, I would like to see it succeed as I'd like to see that interface in more devices. I'm retired and mostly at home now, but when I was working and traveling a lot, a device like this would've been a godsend to me.

 

[Topher]

It's a problem, I agree.

Let's leave it there then

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

It's a problem, I agree.
My only disagreement was that it had to be able to be played native to be an "Xbox" and was pointing out other cases where that wasn't true. PS was the only other gaming example to come to mind at the time which is why it was the example I used.

In the end, they've already named it and will not likely change at this point. Maybe like Sony, they will make it clear in their ads that it doesn't play natively. Although I won't be getting one, I would like to see it succeed as I'd like to see that interface in more devices. I'm retired and mostly at home now, but when I was working and traveling a lot, a device like this would've been a godsend to me.

The name alone would have been okay if their messaging is more clear.

However, i fear the confusion might be intentional. That Xbox want people to buy the product assuming it has functionality it doesn't have. Just like with pcs that were Vista Capable.

 

[demigod]

Some folks are surprised that Xbox Rog Ally really isn't an Xbox

Uninformed buyers will be taking over your job at Best Buy.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

"unpleasant surprise"? Jez Corden said the Xbox Ally was legit! Who is lying here?

 

[Topher]

"The elephant in the room is that of course, as much as these devices are being called Xbox's, they will not natively run your existing console library. For someone in the industry, I understand the why – of course they won't, they're PCs. But for the average gamer that may expect to be able to just pick up a new handheld come October 16th and play everything they own, they're going to be in for an unpleasant surprise."

Is the ROG Xbox Ally Worth a look?

At Gamescom this week, the XboxEra Team descended en masse to the Microsoft Business area to go hands on with the upcoming ROG Xbox Ally and Xbox Ally X.

xboxera.com

 

[Darsxx82]

"The elephant in the room is that of course, as much as these devices are being called Xbox's, they will not natively run your existing console library. For someone in the industry, I understand the why – of course they won't, they're PCs. But for the average gamer that may expect to be able to just pick up a new handheld come October 16th and play everything they own, they're going to be in for an unpleasant surprise."

Is the ROG Xbox Ally Worth a look?

At Gamescom this week, the XboxEra Team descended en masse to the Microsoft Business area to go hands on with the upcoming ROG Xbox Ally and Xbox Ally X.

xboxera.com

It's something I don't understand there... Does the "average gamer" refer to a new generation of gamers that expect something like this?

When did a handheld console allow you to natively play the catalog of games purchased on much more powerful home consoles of the same era and brand? In fact, always you had to buy the same game twice separately because handheld consoles have always been independent devices from the home console of the same brand, beyond some compatibility features.

And we're also talking about a very hardcore device. We're talking about extremely rare cases of people who don't know what videogames device they're buying for $900... A 1%? I don't even think people in that 1% will feel remorse when they realize what this device actually offers, whether an Xbox user or not.

 

[Topher]

It's something I don't understand there... Does the "average gamer" refer to a new generation of gamers that expect something like this?

When did a handheld console allow you to natively play the catalog of games purchased on much more powerful home consoles of the same era and brand? In fact, always you had to buy the same game twice separately because handheld consoles have always been independent devices from the home console of the same brand, beyond some compatibility features.

And we're also talking about a very hardcore device. We're talking about extremely rare cases of people who don't know what videogames device they're buying for $900... A 1%? I don't even think people in that 1% will feel remorse when they realize what this device actually offers, whether an Xbox user or not.

Fair points. Maybe the average gamer won't have any expectations and only more informed gamers will be interested. If so then probably not an issue. The point in me posting this is that this isn't something being dreamed up by a few here as much as some would love for that to be the case. Xbox centric outlets are bringing it up.

 

[Punished Miku]

It's something I don't understand there... Does the "average gamer" refer to a new generation of gamers that expect something like this?

When did a handheld console allow you to natively play the catalog of games purchased on much more powerful home consoles of the same era and brand? In fact, always you had to buy the same game twice separately because handheld consoles have always been independent devices from the home console of the same brand, beyond some compatibility features.

And we're also talking about a very hardcore device. We're talking about extremely rare cases of people who don't know what videogames device they're buying for $900... A 1%? I don't even think people in that 1% will feel remorse when they realize what this device actually offers, whether an Xbox user or not.

Pretty much.

 

[Darsxx82]

Fair points. Maybe the average gamer won't have any expectations and only more informed gamers will be interested. If so then probably not an issue. The point in me posting this is that this isn't something being dreamed up by a few here as much as some would love for that to be the case. Xbox centric outlets are bringing it up.

Oh, sure, I understand what you're referring to and the reason for your quote. I was pointing out the paragraph in the article and the part about the "average console user."
Of course, the type of potential Xbox Ally user isn't the "average console user" from the start. And among those potential users, only a small portion might fall into the clear error of "not knowing what they're buying."

That's why I also asked if the new generation has embraced this idea, because it's not something that really exists or has ever existed to generate such a school of thought.

I don't know; I don't think it's something worth discussing, because the number of potential people affected by the XBOX label is totally residual.

 

[Topher]

Oh, sure, I understand what you're referring to and the reason for your quote. I was pointing out the paragraph in the article and the part about the "average console user."
Of course, the type of potential Xbox Ally user isn't the "average console user" from the start. And among those potential users, only a small portion might fall into the clear error of "not knowing what they're buying."

That's why I also asked if the new generation has embraced this idea, because it's not something that really exists or has ever existed to generate such a school of thought.

I don't know; I don't think it's something worth discussing, because the number of potential people affected by the XBOX label is totally residual.

Xbox is breaking some new ground with this console/PC model so there is going to be a lot of speculation about all of it. Probably good that these outlets are making this point so that even the mildly curious "average" person will be informed about what it is. This is the sort of topic that gets some forum/twitter real estate prior to launch and then dwindles after. Expecting the same here.

 

[Kacho]

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Xbox is breaking some new ground with this console/PC model so there is going to be a lot of speculation about all of it. Probably good that these outlets are making this point so that even the mildly curious "average" person will be informed about what it is. This is the sort of topic that gets some forum/twitter real estate prior to launch and then dwindles after. Expecting the same here.

It shouldn't be the media's job to explain what the hardware does. The Xbox marketing is suppose to do that.

 

[Topher]

It shouldn't be the media's job to explain what the hardware does. The Xbox marketing is suppose to do that.

Disagree. Marketing is often incomplete or misleading. Media's job is to sift through the bullshit and inform their reader/viewer of the facts. In this case, Sarah Bond specifically said Xbox Rog Ally would only be able to stream Xbox console games. Media should definitely reiterate that in the previews/reviews.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

Disagree. Marketing is often incomplete or misleading. Media's job is to sift through the bullshit and inform their reader/viewer of the facts. In this case, Sarah Bond specifically said Xbox Rog Ally would only be able to stream Xbox console games. Media should definitely reiterate that in the previews/reviews.

Marketing being misleading is to the detriment of the product itself. People are justified to get mad at any product that misrepresents what it does. The media might try to inform the population of this problem, but that doesn't change the fact that the problem exists. If the marketing has issues that is on the people who paid for the marketing.

 

[SomeNorseGuy]

Legion Go and MSI Claw confirmed to get the same Xbox upgrades as the ROG Xbox Ally

Article:

Legion Go S and MSI Claw 8 AI+ confirmed for 'Xbox on handhelds' support
Over on the official 'Xbox on handhelds' page, you can read all about the upgrades coming to the ROG Ally handhelds. This includes features such as the Xbox full screen experience, the aggregated library, and Xbox's Play Anywhere feature. The full screen experience delivers a console-inspired UI, much like what we already see on the Steam Deck.

Source: Xbox

Lenovo's Legion Go S doesn't feature the latest flagship Z2 Extreme chip featured in the ROG Xbox Ally X or the upcoming Legion Go 2, but there is a model available with the cut-down Z2 Go instead. The MSI Claw 8 AI+ is powered by older Intel Lunar Lake hardware, but it still holds its own versus the competition and has proven to be comparable to the Z2 Extreme.

Source: https://www.pcguide.com/news/legion-go-and-msi-claw-confirmed-to-get-the-same-xbox-upgrades-as-the-rog-xbox-ally/

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

I have zero interest in being a beta tester that requires a $600-$900 buy-in for hardware that may not be popular and permanent. Not sure how well these will do.

 

[Pop]

OMG it changes everything

 

[Gambit2483]

@ $900+

 

[Diseased Yak]

Wonder what the timing for the rollout of the changes is for the ROG Ally X and such, I'm looking forward to seeing how they do, even though I spend most of my gaming time on mine booted into Linux instead of Windows 11.

 

[demigod]

Honestly, i don't think it'll beat the current msi intel and z2extreme chips by much fps wise.

 

[Kacho]

Honestly, i don't think it'll beat the current msi intel and z2extreme chips by much fps wise.

It's all negligible. Unless you're really hard pressed for a PC handheld just wait for next gen in a couple years.

 

[Ozriel]

"unpleasant surprise"? Jez Corden said the Xbox Ally was legit! Who is lying here?

Jez Corden told you that the Xbox Ally was going to play your Xbox One library?

You're working overtime on this

 

[hououinkyouma00]

Disagree. Marketing is often incomplete or misleading. Media's job is to sift through the bullshit and inform their reader/viewer of the facts. In this case, Sarah Bond specifically said Xbox Rog Ally would only be able to stream Xbox console games. Media should definitely reiterate that in the previews/reviews.

I don't fully disagree but I think people overestimate how many potential buyers would be watching these videos even as a niche device.

I work with somebody (I work for one of the biggest tech companies in the world so not just random people not into technology) that was super excited about this because he thought it was essentially his Xbox in a handheld. I had to tell him all the ins and outs which ultimately made him change his mind. He only saw the announcements and the fact it's called an Xbox.

I think more people then we would think as people that regularly post on an enthusiast gaming forum don't really understand what it is but are still interested in

It very much is marketing's job to accurately market their product.

 

[Topher]

I don't fully disagree but I think people overestimate how many potential buyers would be watching these videos even as a niche device.

I work with somebody (I work for one of the biggest tech companies in the world so not just random people not into technology) that was super excited about this because he thought it was essentially his Xbox in a handheld. I had to tell him all the ins and outs which ultimately made him change his mind. He only saw the announcements and the fact it's called an Xbox.

I think more people then we would think as people that regularly post on an enthusiast gaming forum don't really understand what it is but are still interested in

It very much is marketing's job to accurately market their product.

I agree, but from what I've seen marketers very rarely do that, especially when it comes to tech. I'm not saying that isn't the job of marketing. It absolutely is. But far too often we have to rely on media to fill in the blanks and perhaps that is the point D DeltaPolarBear was making. But I still maintain it is important for independent third parties to give these products a once over and verify everything is as advertised.

 

[SomeNorseGuy]

Seems the preview experience was buggy.

 

[bender]

Let's leave it there then

 

[Tobimacoss]

You seem to be stuck on the fact that the ROG Xbox Ally can stream Xbox games and the Portal can stream PlayStation games and trying to lump them into the same category based on that. The best way I can explain the difference to you is that the PlayStation Portal can only stream PlayStation games. Period. It would not make sense to call it anything else but PlayStation. The ROG Xbox Ally's main function is to play PC games natively and can stream Game Pass just like any other brand of PC. I understand that this is nothing more than a partnership with ASUS but it does make it confusing when early on they included it as part of the Xbox family and were not clear that it would only stream Xbox console games via Game Pass.

It's an Xbox PC device, it plays Xbox PC games, aka GDK created Xbox ecosystem games natively. It can also gives licenses to Xbox Console games that are play anywhere to play natively. It can also stream Xbox Console games aka GDKX created Xbox ecosystem games, in various ways, xCloud or Remote Play.

They can use the branding because it's also the first and only device at launch with the Xbox Full Screen Experience.

 

[Ashamam]

Seems the preview experience was buggy.

This thing is not an advisable buy imho.

Firstly its a bridge product, which means its resale will be questionable when the actual intended experience shows up in new hardware. Secondly it sounds like its not going to be a particularly great 'Xbox' experience. (even assuming bugs ironed out, although those bugs have the potential to make the release experience pretty poor)

If you are in the market for a Windows handheld and have no expectations past that then the ergonomics is probably reason to consider it over other options in the market. On balance though I think though the supporting hardware/software for Windows handhelds just isn't there yet and you would be better waiting a few years. A portal type device for streaming is the better solution right now.

 

[Topher]

It's an Xbox PC device, it plays Xbox PC games, aka GDK created Xbox ecosystem games natively. It can also gives licenses to Xbox Console games that are play anywhere to play natively. It can also stream Xbox Console games aka GDKX created Xbox ecosystem games, in various ways, xCloud or Remote Play.

And? The first Rog Ally can do all of that.

They can use the branding because it's also the first and only device at launch with the Xbox Full Screen Experience.

It doesn't need that to be able to use the "branding". All it takes is a marketing deal. Sucks Windows customers have to wait for that "full screen experience" though.

 

[Fake]

4:31

 

[kevboard]

Seems the preview experience was buggy.

it's a PC after all.

but I had similar and/or worse bugs than those they mentioned on Steam OS as well. some of the recent titles I tried to play completely glitched out the side bars for example, so I had to do weird workarounds like manually opening the keyboard to temporarily make the side bad work again, and to let me close the game.

PC handhelds will never feel fully polished, because of the very unpredictable nature of PC games, especially the ones that are older than say 10 years.

 

[Tobimacoss]

And? The first Rog Ally can do all of that.



It doesn't need that to be able to use the "branding". All it takes is a marketing deal. Sucks Windows customers have to wait for that "full screen experience" though.

It doesn't need that to be able to use the branding but that's one way this handheld is distinct from the others. Besides, I think the Xbox branding is meant to apply for future Xbox BC and FC devices. Basically, I can see ALL AMD powered windows handhelds get the Xbox branding.

So this device is designed to set the stage for that. It's an appetizer before the main course.

 

[Kacho]

PC handhelds will never feel fully polished, because of the very unpredictable nature of PC games, especially the ones that are older than say 10 years.

The sad truth unfortunately. When everything works there's nothing better. But those random little issues are infuriating.

In docked play on the Deck, the framerate in Nordic Ashes would tank for no reason. If I play undocked, no issue.

Play a random shoot 'em up and you get one of those configuration pop-ups. So you have to fiddle with that to eliminate it.

There's always gonna be a little something that you don't need to deal with on a proper gaming device.

 

[Ashamam]

but I had similar and/or worse bugs than those they mentioned on Steam OS as well. some of the recent titles I tried to play completely glitched out the side bars for example, so I had to do weird workarounds like manually opening the keyboard to temporarily make the side bad work again, and to let me close the game.

But Windows is the reference platform. It should be better than SteamOS in compatibility and stability.

 

[kevboard]

But Windows is the reference platform. It should be better than SteamOS in compatibility and stability.

well, given that there are tons of different Windows versions, different APIs etc. it's not really much different. in fact, I almost bet it's simpler to get stuff run more uniformly on SteamOS as everything goes through the same translation layer, so DX9 games don't actually run using DX9, but Vulkan... DX10 games? run through vulkan... DX11? 12?... all Vulkan.

 

[reinking]

It's an Xbox PC device, it plays Xbox PC games, aka GDK created Xbox ecosystem games natively. It can also gives licenses to Xbox Console games that are play anywhere to play natively. It can also stream Xbox Console games aka GDKX created Xbox ecosystem games, in various ways, xCloud or Remote Play.

They can use the branding because it's also the first and only device at launch with the Xbox Full Screen Experience.

It is a Windows PC device created by a partnership between ASUS and Xbox. It plays the exact same games as any of the non-Xbox branded Windows handheld devices do. The only difference is this one launches into big picture mode which comes to all of the others next year. Nobody says they can't use Xbox branding, that is what partnerships are for. However, it does not make it any less confusing to a lot of people that do not follow this stuff.

 

[SomeNorseGuy]

This thing is not an advisable buy imho.

Firstly its a bridge product, which means its resale will be questionable when the actual intended experience shows up in new hardware. Secondly it sounds like its not going to be a particularly great 'Xbox' experience. (even assuming bugs ironed out, although those bugs have the potential to make the release experience pretty poor)

If you are in the market for a Windows handheld and have no expectations past that then the ergonomics is probably reason to consider it over other options in the market. On balance though I think though the supporting hardware/software for Windows handhelds just isn't there yet and you would be better waiting a few years. A portal type device for streaming is the better solution right now.

Yeah, if I were to get one of these I'd probably wait until the experience has matured enough to deliver on all their ideas and long term goals. If I had money to burn I'd get this for the ergonomics and battery, but I'd 100% put SteamOS on it for the foreseeable future.

Still, I hope for MS sake that they're all hands on deck to clean up and optimize the big screen experience.

it's a PC after all.

but I had similar and/or worse bugs than those they mentioned on Steam OS as well. some of the recent titles I tried to play completely glitched out the side bars for example, so I had to do weird workarounds like manually opening the keyboard to temporarily make the side bad work again, and to let me close the game.

PC handhelds will never feel fully polished, because of the very unpredictable nature of PC games, especially the ones that are older than say 10 years.

Yeah, we'll be hard pressed to get the hassle-free experience a console gets, where games are specifically made/ported to that system.

If we're lucky they'll get most if the glaring bugs squashed by release and that they keep on improving it and listen to feedback.

As the DF guys touched upon, there are some expectations of quality of experience attached to the Xbox name. So I hope they put their best foot foreward come October.

In the end, nothing would please me more then getting more choices when it comes to lean gaming OS's.

 

[Kacho]

The DF guys make it sound pretty meh. Doom running in the 50s. Expedition 33 running in the high 20s.

Maybe after couple years of OS improvements and better hardware these things will be more appealing.