Support NeoGAF

[Gaiff]

I think the lustre of Sony PC games is wearing off. God of War Ragnorak was released almost two years ago if it would have released a year or maybe 6 months after console guarranteed it would have better PC sales. Releasing two or three years after doesn't necessarily guarantee a success on PC at the time because a lot of people will have probably played it on console.

They still need to fine tune console to pc releases.

I think Sony is trying to have it both ways, but they can't. They spend hundreds of millions marketing their games, if they wait 1-2 years before releasing them to PC, then the marketing and hype train has largely died down. That's why they only do some small promotions and a blog post when major a game is about to hit PC.

Sony has to either be content selling a modest amount of copies on PC or they have to commit by riding the hype train to the day of the PC release.

Then again, those ports cost $1M-3M to produce, so maybe they don't care about only making $20-30M per game. It's still a sizable ROI.

 

[Sooner]

please don't cancel the rumored handheld

There is no handheld to cancel.

 

[SNG32]

If this fucker bring everything on pc day one AFTER i bought a fucking pro i'm gonna be mad as hell.

Why? Would you have bought a PC instead. If not why does it matter.

 

[HogIsland]

I think Sony is trying to have it both ways, but they can't. They spend hundreds of millions marketing their games, if they wait 1-2 years before releasing them to PC, then the marketing and hype train has largely died down. That's why they only do some small promotions and a blog post when major game is about to hit PC.

Sony has to either be content selling a modest amount of copies on PC or they have to commit by riding the hype train to the day of the PC release.

Then again, those ports cost $1M-3M to produce, so maybe they don't care about only making $20-30M per game. It's still a sizable ROI.

Playstation went into the PC port effort with the modest approach, thinking a few games on Steam would drive customers to Playstation. After Helldivers, they see PC games as a "synergy" to grow their first party. Totoki even referred to popularizing the console as a priority "in the past".

 

[GymWolf]

Why? Would you have bought a PC instead. If not why does it matter.

Because i have a pc with a 4080, i only bought a pro to play the 2-3 exclusive sony first party games we get every year (kinda) in their best version, but if they come out on pc day one, the pc version become the best version.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

If this fucker bring everything on pc day one AFTER i bought a fucking pro i'm gonna be mad as hell.

Better load up on those drywall patch kits at Home Depot!

 

[MarkMe2525]

I'm not?

I just don't think it's some massive goldmine opportunity, especially when it risks losing console players who end up "just waiting" for the PC release (or sale), with no kickback for PS+ and a loss of 30% revenue

It isn't as simple as "a loss of 30% revenue", it is potentially acquiring 70% of the revenue, to a customer that may have been out of their reach previously.

PC gaming isn't on a decline, it just didn't grow at the expected rate. Short term fluctuations doesn't change the fact that PC is seeing a long term growth trend. https://www.statista.com/statistics/558491/value-pc-games-market-global/

Global console & PC gaming market value worldwide by format 2026 | Statista

In 2023, the digital console gaming market sales amounted to 32.1 billion U.S.

www.statista.com

 

[yogaflame]

If this fucker bring everything on pc day one AFTER i bought a fucking pro i'm gonna be mad as hell.

1 or 2 years after the release from PS will be okay with me. I also buy multiplatform games but I always prefer exclusives.

 

[R3TRO]

Make everything pc day one.

 

[GymWolf]

Better load up on those drywall patch kits at Home Depot!

I doubt they are gonna bring their single player first party day one on pc, helmet is a moron but not phil tier of moronery.

 

[SNG32]

I doubt they are gonna bring their single player first party day one on pc, helmet is a moron but phil tier of moronery.

I don't think they will do it right away but the release windows will get smaller and smaller. I think once they decide to do day and date a PC launcher will come with it. With the having the Sony account for certain games they are definitely testing the waters of eventually implementing a launcher.

 

[GymWolf]

1 or 2 years after the release from PS will be okay with me. I also buy multiplatform games but I always prefer exclusives.

I'm ok with even 6 months-1 year, i'm not the type of guy that can wait 6 months to play tlou3 or gow egypt.

But day one? Fuck that.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Oh so now Sony wants to focus (even more) on other platforms AFTER Dreams is dead........smh.

 

[HogIsland]

I don't think they will do it right away but the release windows will get smaller and smaller. I think once they decide to do day and date a PC launcher will come with it.

pc launcher from sony is the death of playstation on pc. it'll be even more doomed than the epic games store. steam is pc gaming.

 

[SNG32]

pc launcher from sony is the death of playstation on pc. it'll be even more doomed than the epic games store. steam is pc gaming.

I feel like it depends if you want to play games day and date it might work.

 

[BattleScar]

I'm not?

I just don't think it's some massive goldmine opportunity, especially when it risks losing console players who end up "just waiting" for the PC release (or sale), with no kickback for PS+ and a loss of 30% revenue

There is such a small intersection of people who would play a game on PC vs Console.
PlayStation games being on PC hasn't eroded the performance of the console. And if anything have strong multiplayer IP like Helldivers exist both on PS and PC means the online community is that much more vibrant. Either way Sony gets money.

PC gaming does not have some kind of universal appeal, that would risk cannibalising the console's performance. If it had, then we would see that reflected in the PS5 not selling very well. But that hasn't happened.

 

[Neon Xenon]

I'm not taking anything that Sony heads are saying at face value in regards to their current business.

Show, don't tell.

 

[HogIsland]

I feel like it depends if you want to play games day and date it might work.

Alan Wake 2 Gets Disappointing Financial Update

One of 2023's most well-received games, Alan Wake 2, has some bad news on the finance end, despite achieving notable commercial success.

gamerant.com

• Alan Wake 2, despite strong sales and critical acclaim, has not yet generated a profit since its release.

 

[SNG32]

There is such a small intersection of people who would play a game on PC vs Console.
PlayStation games being on PC hasn't eroded the performance of the console. And if anything have strong multiplayer IP like Helldivers exist both on PS and PC means the online community is that much more vibrant. Either way Sony gets money.

PC gaming does not have some kind of universal appeal, that would risk cannibalising the console's performance. If it had, then we would see that reflected in the PS5 not selling very well. But that hasn't happened.

The majority of games that generate the most revenue are third party games all games that are available day and date on PC. None of this has hurt the console brand at all.

 

[hinch7]

PC gaming sales are on the decline this year and PC ports on PlayStation don't appear to be making a significant sales impact

Not even close. MAAU on Steam is higher than its ever been. People were holding their cash on hardware with older generation processors and GPU's soon to be replaced. With big releases like the 9800X3D, those things are flying off shelves. Next generation GPU's are also coming early next year.

 

[SNG32]

Alan Wake 2 Gets Disappointing Financial Update

One of 2023's most well-received games, Alan Wake 2, has some bad news on the finance end, despite achieving notable commercial success.

gamerant.com

• Alan Wake 2, despite strong sales and critical acclaim, has not yet generated a profit since its release.

Epic is a hated launcher. Having access to established Sony exclusives might change it. If Sony can get amount of sales on a launcher then release it 3- 6 months or a year on steam I don't see what the issue is. If Spider-Man 3 launches day and date on the launcher Sony is definitely getting some downloads on it for the PC players that want to play the game right away.

 

[kaizenkko]

Denying about Sony's relationship with multiplatform releases is just one of the grief stages.

- Someday Sony will be doing day and date releases with PC;
- They will keep pursuing live service games;
- They will cut costs, but not about DEI stuff you all are thinking about;
- First-party output will not increase substantially, instead they will outsourcing even more.

Is not that hard, anyone in this thread should be able to understand. Look at all those CEOs/CFO guys are talking about in the last years.

 

[Edmund]

Hiroki Totoki's name rolls off the tongue so well. It's so fun to say his name.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

If this fucker bring everything on pc day one AFTER i bought a fucking pro i'm gonna be mad as hell.

Eh, Idc, but it would be a retarded business decision.

Just look at Xbox. Lol

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I don't think they will do it right away but the release windows will get smaller and smaller. I think once they decide to do day and date a PC launcher will come with it. With the having the Sony account for certain games they are definitely testing the waters of eventually implementing a launcher.

I'm ok with even 6 months-1 year, i'm not the type of guy that can wait 6 months to play tlou3 or gow egypt.

But day one? Fuck that.

Spiderman 2 is down to 15 months.

I think It'll come down to 9-12 months. Similar to EA putting all their games on EA Play around 9 months after launch, with those SW shooter games being about 12 months.

Sony has got to a point they dont need to play catch up anymore like at the beginning where games chosen could be 4 years later. Most of their big games are on PC, so now they can focus on multiplatform ports concurrently better. A delayed launch is now a choice, not a necessity.

 

[ExtendEmbraceExtinguish]

Good, shelf the PC initiative and concentrate on adding value to your platform. Plus realocate from San Fran back to Tokyo and remove any DEI personnels and ideologies.

You are welcome.

I 100% agree with this strategy as it will lead to a quick ps ecosystem death.

Pay close attention when Sony top brass & devs have stated; they do not have top tier IPs, dev cost is too much, insomniac wants AA over AAA and Sony's biggest money maker is mtx revenue from gaas titles.

The question is what titles should they make to not drown in their own ecosystem vs other publishers ? 5 years of dev min.

 

[ProtoByte]

No way... isn't PC sales are pretty good? for only porting a game already exists it's a no brainer.

No, they are not. The revenue is a rounding error on PS annuals. Helldivers 2 has/will be the exception that proves the rule.

You're more likely to see games being ported to PC even earlier.

If Sony wants to kill their consoles like Microsoft has managed to do, sure.

Nintendo's games don't cost $200M+ to produce.

And? Do you actually think that PC ports have significantly added anything to that? When it cuts into adoption, do you think it'll add anything at all? It'll actually make things worse. You'll have come away selling the same number of units (or lower, because part of why exclusive games sell is because of exclusivity), with a lower revenue because of the 30% that Steam takes.

I don't see how you could look at that tweet, and come to the conclusion that they are looking to lower their revenue. The console market isn't growing at the speed needed to make up for the rapid growth (in the past 5 years) of PC gaming.

Wrong. The console market has actually grown faster than PC in the last 5 years. Significantly.



You also have to recognize that the growth is not in the same places. PC gamers invented playing the same goddamn game for 5+ or 10-15 years. The revenue and revenue growth is coming less from game sales and more from in-game purchases (wonder why Sony started porting to PC the second they started sniffing around live service shit yet?)

People look at the rankings and concurrent player numbers on Steamcharts, coming away with an overinflated impression of what nominal sales are actually like.

What really gets me about all of these arguments is that we've seen this attempt at Xbox. It hurt things, it did not help. Even more baffling that Sony, with their highly paid analysts, takes on the same nonsensical premises and misinformation that forum users do into their business initiatives. Their lives have been made harder because of these PC ports just by virtue of the fact that they're trying to convince people of the PS5 Pro's worth. And unlike Microsoft (and this is just in theory for them), Sony needs to actually sell hardware and have an outsized platform. If the hardware is eroded, the platform is eroded, the point of being in the games market is eroded, and you can say bye bye to anything their audience currently enjoys.

The PC initiative is business poison, and Sony needs an exorcism.

 

[yogaflame]

I hope there new plan and strategy also includes bring back some of the OG franchise titles, make a sequel or at least remake of all there beloved PS titles of the past like for example; Syphon filter, Alundra, Wild arms, Legend of Dragoon, Legend of Legaia, Ape Escape, Jak and Daxters, Colony wars, Tomba,etc. And for MP players like for example Twisted Metal, Wipe out, Warhawk, Resistance, Killzone, SOCOM, etc. And continue to support game development from other Asian countries like Stellar blade.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It isn't as simple as "a loss of 30% revenue", it is potentially acquiring 70% of the revenue, to a customer that may have been out of their reach previously.

Those consumers can wait then, I don't see why they would do a day and date strategy as it may signal to some console owners to just get a PC instead

It cannibalizes their platform unless they make a PC launcher

 

[HogIsland]

Epic is a hated launcher. Having access to established Sony exclusives might change it. If Sony can get amount of sales on a launcher then release it 3- 6 months or a year on steam I don't see what the issue is. If Spider-Man 3 launches day and date on the launcher Sony is definitely getting some downloads on it for the PC players that want to play the game right away.

Sony is worse at software than Epic, and would be more hated. Take a look at their PC remote play client. That's the quality you're gonna get from a Playstation PC launcher. I'm pretty confident they're not going to do this, in favor of an in-game Playstation overlay. But damn, I can't tell you what a disaster it would be.

 

[SNG32]

No, they are not. The revenue is a rounding error on PS annuals. Helldivers 2 has/will be the exception that proves the rule.


If Sony wants to kill their consoles like Microsoft has managed to do, sure.



And? Do you actually think that PC ports have significantly added anything to that? When it cuts into adoption, do you think it'll add anything at all? It'll actually make things worse. You'll have come away selling the same number of units (or lower, because part of why exclusive games sell is because of exclusivity), with a lower revenue because of the 30% that Steam takes.


Wrong. The console market has actually grown faster than PC in the last 5 years. Significantly.



You also have to recognize that the growth is not in the same places. PC gamers invented playing the same goddamn game for 5+ or 10-15 years. The revenue and revenue growth is coming less from game sales and more from in-game purchases (wonder why Sony started porting to PC the second they started sniffing around live service shit yet?)

People look at the rankings and concurrent player numbers on Steamcharts, coming away with an overinflated impression of what nominal sales are actually like.

What really gets me about all of these arguments is that we've seen this attempt at Xbox. It hurt things, it did not help. Even more baffling that Sony, with their highly paid analysts, takes on the same nonsensical premises and misinformation that forum users do into their business initiatives. Their lives have been made harder because of these PC ports just by virtue of the fact that they're trying to convince people of the PS5 Pro's worth. And unlike Microsoft (and this is just in theory for them), Sony needs to actually sell hardware and have an outsized platform. If the hardware is eroded, the platform is eroded, the point of being in the games market is eroded, and you can say bye bye to anything their audience currently enjoys.

The PC initiative is business poison, and Sony needs an exorcism.

There's a lot of things that hurt XBox then just releasing there games PC. Sony and Microsoft aren't in the same situation. I think Gamepass has done more damage than them releasing games on PC. Also a lot of there first party titles have been lacklustre plus it was always a weaker brand then PlayStation. The only reason they got lucky with the 360 is because of the obsurd price of PS3.

 

[pasterpl]

Helldivers 2 was an exception; the rest of the PC ports have failed miserably.

Now think what was different with helldivers 2 vs other ports of 12+ months old games.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Sony is worse at software than Epic, and would be more hated. Take a look at their PC remote play client. That's the quality you're gonna get from a Playstation PC launcher. I'm pretty confident they're not going to do this, in favor of an in-game Playstation overlay. But damn, I can't tell you what a disaster it would be.

Their PS5 OS is great, their PC clients isn't representative of what they are capable of

Nobody is complaining about the PS store interface

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Now thing what was different with helldivers 2 vs other ports of 12+ months old games.

Online multiplayer/live service?

 

[TerribleAtThisGame]

Stop being cunts and re-prioritize Returnal and Housemarque. Bought the studio and let them make their crazy passion project hoping for a Souls style breakout hit and when it didn't sell 5mil copies instantly, they dropped any enthusiasm for them like a hot potato.

No shit the brandnew, weirdo IP needed a sequel to solidify itself, much like From did with Dark Souls. Maybe it'll still happen in some way but there must be a reason they say nothing about HM anymore and the director left.

 

[mayham2199]

Last year they said 2-3 years.

Sony boss says we're gonna be waiting 'two or three years' before PlayStation games hit PC

Jim Ryan was asked about PS5 exclusives during an interview with Famitsu.

www.pcgamer.com

That clearly has changed. Even Spider-Man 2 was just over 1 year. Horizon Lego's is day and date on Switch and PC. All Bungie games are day and date on Xbox and PC. That window is clearly shrinking.

If you read the article that's not what it says. They specifically say that Ryan wont give a firm time frame but that discussions he's had with PS fans they seem to ok with 2-3 years. Then at the bottom of the article they link to Hulst saying October of last year (2022) that it would be at least 1 year.

Bungie negotiated that in their purchase agreement so I don't even count that. Plus all they make is GAAS games so they would all be day 1 on PC anyways. Lego I'll give you that one even if we can clearly see that situation is very different than the norm.

 

[Kvally]

I guess I will just get Wolverine and Ghost of Yotei on Xbox. Thanks Herman.

 

[HogIsland]

Spiderman 2 is down to 15 months.

I think It'll come down to 9-12 months. Similar to EA putting all their games on EA Play around 9 months after launch, with those SW shooter games being about 12 months.

Sony has got to a point they dont need to play catch up anymore like at the beginning where games chosen could be 4 years later. Most of their big games are on PC, so now they can focus on multiplatform ports concurrently better. A delayed launch is now a choice, not a necessity.

Getting to concurrent PC development is the way to go, and then they may as well do day and date.

There will be examples in the next 18 months where Sony re-lives the Helldivers 2 experience with a successful day and date launch. Whether it's Death Stranding 2 or Marathon or something else. Sony's gonna be looking at that cushion of 40%+ additional launch sales and wishing they had it for every game.

 

[Bojji]

If this fucker bring everything on pc day one AFTER i bought a fucking pro i'm gonna be mad as hell.

 

[GymWolf]

Dude has a really punchable face, ngl

 

[EN250]

That's where I was going; Lego Horizon is similar to Astro Bot in regard to being a smaller budget, light-hearted project that didn't take several years to make.
If you want Sony to make more stuff like Astro Bot, expect a lot of stuff that won't probably click with you.
In defense of Lego Horizon, it's not made by the same devs of the other Lego games and I've seen some claiming that it was fresh enough in comparison to those. We will see, though.

You added another reason idgaf about that game, a third party dev who has no connection and the quality to be expected from a Sony Studio

And Astro is pure nostalgia driven beautiful lil game, so you're kind of right, the novelty could wear off pretty quick if they do more sequels

But idk, it works and can work again with the features it has incorporated and well, it's not like Sony can bring back a franchise from the vault of forgotten games from previous gens

 

[mayham2199]

Alan Wake 2 Gets Disappointing Financial Update

One of 2023's most well-received games, Alan Wake 2, has some bad news on the finance end, despite achieving notable commercial success.

gamerant.com

• Alan Wake 2, despite strong sales and critical acclaim, has not yet generated a profit since its release.

What were the sales because it didn't even chart in Circana when it was released if I remember correctly.

 

[ExtendEmbraceExtinguish]

Eh, Idc, but it would be a retarded business decision.

Just look at Xbox. Lol

it's not unless Sony can pump out 2-3 AAA games per year to cull its competitors on psx ecosystem vs other pubs. These games will have to be psx only to attract pc/other devices owners and compete in desired genres.

 

[Sanepar]

Put all focus on sp games and pc strategy. That is it and fuck off the fanboys.

 

[pasterpl]

Online multiplayer/live service?

Bingo + day 1 release on PC. This, with a good game = lots of sales and revenue and potentially huge profits. They have not tested this approach - day 1 on PC and PS5 for SP game yet, do they don't know, but they need a good game to see proper results.

 

[SNG32]

Bingo + day 1 release on PC. This, with a good game = lots of sales and revenue and potentially huge profits. They have not tested this approach - day 1 on PC and PS5 for SP game yet, do they don't know, but they need a good game to see proper results.

The closest they have seen was Wukong which didn't they help with the development?

 

[ProtoByte]

There's a lot of things that hurt XBox then just releasing there games PC. Sony and Microsoft aren't in the same situation.

They very well could be if Sony isn't careful.

I think Gamepass has done more damage than them releasing games on PC.

The PC porting was supposed to help sales before Gamepass came along. If anything, it sped up the hemorrhaging.

Whether it's a direct or indirect effect, I'm convinced that PC ports of 1st party games comes from the same TV TV TV/Netflix of Games/Expand to lower common denominators mindset that has sunk Xbox.

Also a lot of there first party titles have been lacklustre plus it was always a weaker brand then PlayStation. The only reason they got lucky with the 360 is because of the obsurd price of PS3.

The pace and quality control of their titles got worse when they started porting to PC.

You may have noticed the lesser polish and increased glitchiness of PS' first party titles. And they haven't even started day one releases! The Insomniac leak indicated that the delayed PC release of Wolverine is holding up (and most likely compromising) that game.

Now thing what was different with helldivers 2 vs other ports of 12+ months old games.

Live service multiplayer. It's Planetside 2 in 2024. If you had suggested that Uncharted 3 should be out on PC because of Planetside back in 2012, you'd have been laughed out of PS offices.

 

[BattleScar]

No, they are not. The revenue is a rounding error on PS annuals. Helldivers 2 has/will be the exception that proves the rule.


If Sony wants to kill their consoles like Microsoft has managed to do, sure.

Microsoft killed their console by not making any games that anyone wants to play, mismanaging the games people did want to play, and then spending too much money on M&A.
PC is not the factor at play. In fact, you've proven that PC isn't the factor.

And? Do you actually think that PC ports have significantly added anything to that? When it cuts into adoption, do you think it'll add anything at all? It'll actually make things worse. You'll have come away selling the same number of units (or lower, because part of why exclusive games sell is because of exclusivity), with a lower revenue because of the 30% that Steam takes.

Please provide me with the stats on how many console sales were lost because a game released on PC?

Wrong. The console market has actually grown faster than PC in the last 5 years. Significantly.



You also have to recognize that the growth is not in the same places. PC gamers invented playing the same goddamn game for 5+ or 10-15 years. The revenue and revenue growth is coming less from game sales and more from in-game purchases (wonder why Sony started porting to PC the second they started sniffing around live service shit yet?)

People look at the rankings and concurrent player numbers on Steamcharts, coming away with an overinflated impression of what nominal sales are actually like.

What really gets me about all of these arguments is that we've seen this attempt at Xbox. It hurt things, it did not help. Even more baffling that Sony, with their highly paid analysts, takes on the same nonsensical premises and misinformation that forum users do into their business initiatives. Their lives have been made harder because of these PC ports just by virtue of the fact that they're trying to convince people of the PS5 Pro's worth. And unlike Microsoft (and this is just in theory for them), Sony needs to actually sell hardware and have an outsized platform. If the hardware is eroded, the platform is eroded, the point of being in the games market is eroded, and you can say bye bye to anything their audience currently enjoys.

The PC initiative is business poison, and Sony needs an exorcism.

If the PC initiative is a business poison, why is the PlayStation brand continuing strongly?
I don't understand? Surely if PlayStation games on PC was a bad idea, that would be reflected in poor console sales?

 

[Gaiff]

No, they are not. The revenue is a rounding error on PS annuals. Helldivers 2 has/will be the exception that proves the rule.


If Sony wants to kill their consoles like Microsoft has managed to do, sure.



And? Do you actually think that PC ports have significantly added anything to that? When it cuts into adoption, do you think it'll add anything at all? It'll actually make things worse. You'll have come away selling the same number of units (or lower, because part of why exclusive games sell is because of exclusivity), with a lower revenue because of the 30% that Steam takes.


Wrong. The console market has actually grown faster than PC in the last 5 years. Significantly.



You also have to recognize that the growth is not in the same places. PC gamers invented playing the same goddamn game for 5+ or 10-15 years. The revenue and revenue growth is coming less from game sales and more from in-game purchases (wonder why Sony started porting to PC the second they started sniffing around live service shit yet?)

People look at the rankings and concurrent player numbers on Steamcharts, coming away with an overinflated impression of what nominal sales are actually like.

What really gets me about all of these arguments is that we've seen this attempt at Xbox. It hurt things, it did not help. Even more baffling that Sony, with their highly paid analysts, takes on the same nonsensical premises and misinformation that forum users do into their business initiatives. Their lives have been made harder because of these PC ports just by virtue of the fact that they're trying to convince people of the PS5 Pro's worth. And unlike Microsoft (and this is just in theory for them), Sony needs to actually sell hardware and have an outsized platform. If the hardware is eroded, the platform is eroded, the point of being in the games market is eroded, and you can say bye bye to anything their audience currently enjoys.

The PC initiative is business poison, and Sony needs an exorcism.

 

[Badlucktroll]

i bet marathon is really makin them sweat