Not really, if you mean the hardware power.
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Sony Reports Q3 FY12 Results - $2 Billion Loss, 6.5 M PS3's Shipped [Shares up 13%]
- Thread starter Parmenides
- Start date
NemesisPrime
Banned
The irony is that Sony has lost the USA in the console race and they procure some of their stuff in dollar while they are doing well in Europe where they deal in yen. So the high yen is hurting them in their popular region.
Every one yen rise against the euro takes a ¥6 billion toll on Sony's operating income.
Every one yen rise against the euro takes a ¥6 billion toll on Sony's operating income.
Its going to depend on how long Nintendo keeps the DS alive. Also if Sony ever announces a $50 PS2.
About how long did they keep the GBA going after the DS came out?
bigtroyjon
Member
The Yen isn't rising, the Euro is dropping. (doesn't change how it affects Sony but it's a key difference since it's an important region for them)
It'd be insane for them to try and release a loss-leader again.
They are! The VITA is SCE's main focus now.
The PS3 business is still on a good way, so they don't have to change anything atm.
Psychotext
Member
Full year vs full year, obviously. Quarterly fluctuations aren't surprising.
Oh yea, that's right.
Thanks for everyone correcting me.
I'm happy so many people are buying both consoles, only for the good of our industry.
themadcowtipper
Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
I'm thinking the poster was talking about ms, since all rumors point to modest tech pushing kinect 2.
What will the fanboys do when all three next gen systems are similar ???
twothunder
Member
Sony lowered its PlayStation 3 hardware sales outlook to 14 million consoles from 15 million.
http://old.news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20120202/tc_nm/us_sony_sales?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
I don't believe the following has been posted yet.
Kaz Hirai details his plan to save Sony:
http://www.theverge.com/2012/2/2/2765928/kaz-hirai-4-point-plan
After Sony's disappointing third-quarter financial report today, soon-to-be President and CEO Kazuo Hirai took the stage to discuss his plans for saving the troubled company. His four-point plan consists of building on Sony's core competencies, getting its TV house in order, figuring out where it can cut costs, and speeding up innovation.
Re-enforcing Sony's core businesses:
Hirai recognized that digital imaging and gaming are Sony's strong suits, and stated that he plans for the company to capitalize on its assets in these areas in order to strengthen its position in the growing mobile market, which will become a big focus for the company after it takes full control of the Sony Ericsson partnership. In addition, the new CEO wants to apply the advances the company has made in digital imaging to the medical industry, hopefully turning it into a future core business. He also wants to leverage Sony's gaming assets by building unique mobile products only Sony can provide.
Pulling together Sony's TV business:
Hirai believes TVs will continue to be at heart of home entertainment, but LCD TVs have been commoditized and Sony can't waste any more time futzing around in this market. Sony divested of S-LCD last year and the new CEO plans to continue on this asset-light approach, being selective about the use of resources, and considering collaborations with other companies in order to reduce costs. At the same time, he believes the company can use its proprietary Crystal LED and OLED technologies to create compelling TV products.
Transforming Sony's business portfolio:
Sony has diverse businesses, which has been good for the company in some ways, but it needs to figure out which of its products are becoming commoditized products without added value so that it can either get rid of them, or make better use of collaboration to reduce costs.
Accelerating Innovation:
Hirai believes Sony is well-positioned to make the medical area a future core business. Sony has a lot of innovations in sensors, signal processing, lenses, and displays, and can create innovative products by applying these to endoscopy, X-Ray diagnostic equipment and ultrasound. The company was reportedly interested in acquiring a 20-30 percent stake in Olympus (although Hirai refused to comment on the proposed deal), which would be a perfect fit given its strengths in both imaging and medical equipment. The soon-to-be CEO also added that Sony needs to strengthen ties between its R&D and business groups, a movement that he is spearheading.
Hirai went on to say that since 2009 he's been focused on producing products befitting of the name Sony "wonderful products" with a focus on creating a compelling user experience. In fact, Kaz came back to the subject of user experience repeatedly, stressing that creating great hardware just isn't enough. Responding to a question about management changes, Hirai also said he wants to focus on the free exchange of ideas, and rather than surround himself with a bunch of yes-men, build an executive management team that will challenge his ideas.
With the state the traditional game industry is in currently it is best to expect modest console upgrades next-gen. Expecting over the top powerful machines sold at a heavy loss like last gen is not that likely.
The gap between WiiU and PS4/Xbox 3 is going to be a lot smaller than many expect.
ertitoagus
Member
Wow....dark ages for Sony...
Will the sun rise for Sony Again? Who knows.....
Will the sun rise for Sony Again? Who knows.....
bigtroyjon
Member
Sounds like Kaz is talking a good game and is thinking the right way, hopefully he can get results to match his plan.
fabricated backlash
Member
Collective mass suicide in front of a Kutaragi Monument.
I'd have to say that in the TV department I'll never go back to SONY. I had a problem with my SAMSUNG 40" TV, the power to turn on was stuttering. I called customer service, set up a repair date. Guy comes to my house, fixes the problem on a my set that is 4 years out of Warranty... no charge, dude didn't even want a beer. Good luck getting that customer service from Sony.
Are you expecting the gap between Wii U and PS4 to be similar to the 3DS/Vita?
Wonder how long it'll be before they converge the Vita platform with their mobile lines...Suite was a first step, full convergence would be bolder and a potentially very strong differentiator vs 'vanilla Android'.
Course we argued about all this some moons ago...I still think it would be a good idea if it can be technically done.
Look at how Vita is doing in Japan and how it will likely do similiar in the west (especially with the iPad 3 launching literally at almost the exact same time). I'd say that they'd likely not take the same risks again with the console.
They gotta go for profit on day one, especially in the state they are in. A company losing this much money can't realistically release a loss-leader product. Microsoft has the resources to do a loss-leader sort of console (but I doubt they will, at least to the scale that PS3 was when it launched. Everyone in the game industry is tightening their belts.), Sony currently can't take a chance like that.
Of course the one console group left focusing more on core gamers is pissing through money faster than a coked up "celebrity" whore.
I should just go hang myself now and save the trouble of seeing the most depressing generation ever coming up.
I should just go hang myself now and save the trouble of seeing the most depressing generation ever coming up.
I am not 100% serious. Next gen is going to suck hard though
NemesisPrime
Banned
Uhm, known problem with Samsung sets and they are doing their best to make sure it doesn't become a big deal.
I know of at last 3-4 in my circle of friends which had exactly the same problem.
Dude, check the facts regarding the losses of the PS3.
Hardware power doesn't automatically mean - big loss of $$$
See VITA!
Like I already said: the GPU was too expensive, the CPU was too expensive and the Blu-Ray stuff was too expensive.
This will change with the PS4 (see VITA).
They can make a 399$/ PS4 with the strongest hardware for next gen.
Let's wait and see.
The PC is doing fine
Sales were down for non-tablet pc's last year.
For the first time in like a decade I believe.NemesisPrime
Banned
MikeE21286
Member
Hopefully this means they're gonna start making shit that's easy to use for people. While they make great hardware, their OS/UI design is atrocious at best for the majority of people.
themadcowtipper
Smells faintly of rancid stilton.
I expect Sony next Hardware to be profitable from day one. It will already be released later then nexbox, and Wii u. If those machines are similar, why alienate yourself from third parties with vastly different hardware. Third parties will do the bare minium port anyway.
IrishNinja
Member
best idea this whole thread! what a fantastic set in the day.
maaan...good luck with that, kaz. for real, cutting the fat sounds way easier than sorting out that formula.
bigtroyjon
Member
The facts are that it's lost 4+ billion dollars.(probably more since the PS2 was still making making buku bucks while the PS3 was causing the division to bleed money.)
Ouch at the losses. =( I'm not a fan of Kaz as a public speaker, but I really hope he can get the company on the right path. At least it sounds like he has a clear goal in mind, so things sound hopeful.
I'm expecting a PS2 to xbox difference between the Wii-U and the PS4/720 next gen. Though really generalizing power is always wrong =p
Edit:
So only Sony can make the strongest console at $400 but MS or Nintendo can't? lol wat?
I'm expecting a PS2 to xbox difference between the Wii-U and the PS4/720 next gen. Though really generalizing power is always wrong =p
Edit:
So only Sony can make the strongest console at $400 but MS or Nintendo can't? lol wat?
MikeE21286
Member
Year-over-Year quarterly fluctuations are noteworthy though. It's not like I was comparing consecutive quarters :?
The Dutch Slayer
Member
The thing that I have been wondering ever since the ps3 come out and we knew Sony because of the development of the has no more money.
How can you afford to build a ps4/nextgen/whatever name
How can you afford to build a ps4/nextgen/whatever name
I am.
Nintendo and now MS too (if the rumors are correct) are going the casual gaming route.
Sony not as much as they do.
I was talking about the "loss leader" stuff.
A lot of hardware power doesn't automatically mean -> loss leader next gen.
The PS3 was a loss leader because of some too expensive parts, which could have been avoided (if they have used their brains and more time).
?
They maybe could, but they won't as you can hear from certain rumors (and some interviews from Nintendo).
btw. their next system will be released 1 year before PS4 and Xbox 3. So you know what that means.
Tylahedras
Banned
Can't believe it's still not 199$
ZombieSupaStar
Member
I feel the same way but when looking at the LTD for PS1 -> PS2 -> PS3
Then I'd say their customer service is doing their job very well... which is the point of my post. I'm not even going to try to list the past 20 years of Sony's customer service solutions...
By not making it a huge powerhouse and selling it at a profit ala Nintendo's style of console releases. It's really their only option. Sony can't afford to sell something at a loss now.
We have no idea what route Sony is going with the PS4.
bigtroyjon
Member
Not really, maybe they shipped more or less in a previous quarter to get that YOY spike or drop.
Need to look at 9-12 month periods when dealing with shipment figures that can be manipulated by the supply chain.
Well we know they can't go the route they did with PS3 and make it extremely powerful and sell it at a loss. They don't have the resources to release a product like that anymore.
MikeE21286
Member
Good pont.
Not sure there's any evidence that occurred, probably more a factor of dicsounted holiday pricing/bundles increasing demand.
We don't have the numbers though, so it's hard to tell.
Psychotext
Member
Thing is, it's all barely comparable anyway. For instance, think of the smackdown the 360 would have put on the PS3 if they'd have been willing to blow $4bn (basically what it's cost Sony to sell 62m PS3s) on price cuts, games and marketing.
It's still largely irrelevant. It's like looking at the one unburnt part of a house that's been razed to the ground. It doesn't really tell you much about the overall situation.
If you've got the big picture you might as well look at it. Quarterly differences aren't really useful for much beyond what you said... specific short term factors increasing demand (and potentially taking sales away from other quarters). Plus like bigtroyjon said, we've obviously seen Microsoft and Sony over ship in specific quarters to hit targets in the past... and in Microsoft's case, in the not so distant past.
The Dutch Slayer
Member
But that is not how Sony works, they want to be the HIGH end tech guy, even if its not good for them selfs.
And besides you think they really going to release a ps4 with the "power" of the WiiU to safe cost?
Sho_Nuff82
Member
All of the games announced for Wii U currently are core games.
Pikmin
Zelda
Darksiders
Battlefield
Ninja Gaiden
Mario
Ghost Recon
Assassin's Creed
Dragon Quest
phosphor112
Banned
Out of curiosity, what have their losses looked like the past several years?
I know!
Doesn't change the fact that the Wii U will be the most casual gaming friendly system as it seems. (I haven't said that the Wii U won't have a lot of "hardcore games")
And the first one in the business/in next game (over 1 year = weaker hardware)
"The most powerful route" if you pay attention to the last rumor(s) and if you look at the VITA.
I think its pretty clear to me. Sony already have the hardware just need to assemble it, no need to do a lot of research.
- CPU: they already have the Cell, putting more cores will do it.
- Media Storage: Blu-Ray
- RAM: Just put more
- GPU: The only problem I think
- Software: Easy part
Para bailar La Bomba
Banned
By carrying the loss forward and offsetting it against future tax bills.
MikeE21286
Member
I wish there was a P+L of the specific divisions as opposed to the overall numbers.
I'd really like to see what Sony is looking like in it's "gaming/entertainment" division (or whatever section of the company the Playstation falls within) over the last several quarters/years. That would probably give us an of where they're going next gen to some degree.
No, they want to make money. They can't operate as the high end loss-leader company. If they do they will go under, they are barely surviving as is.
They can't repeat the PS3, but they can afford to launch a powerful combination of components designed off the back of the r&d of other companies (rather than their own), at a modest loss, in the expectation that software sales would quickly generate an overall profit on each owner. It's what the first two Playstations did, it's exactly what they seem to have done with Vita and I'd expect the same with a PS4. The problem with PS3 wasn't that it was a loss-leader; it was that the loss one each unit was so substantial starting out that it would be nigh on impossible to recover over the lifecycle of those users, and that it additionally incurred massive r&d cost that would be harder again to recover.
As for this...
Err...we do? Sony can't sustain losses like these indefinitely, obviously, but their liquidity situation is OK as far as being able to afford to develop and release big new products (~$10bn in cash, +~$10bn in secured credit lines that they haven't yet tapped). They'll want to develop new products in as cost-effective and smart a way as possible, but they ought to be wanting to do that regardless of whether they're making a lot of money or not.