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Square Enix Shares Tumble by Most in 13 Years on Weak Outlook

Shares of Square Enix Holdings Co. tumbled 16% in their biggest decline in 13 years after its president said sales of recent big-budget games disappointed and that it would take years for a recent reorganization to bear fruit.

www.bloomberg.com

Shares of Square Enix Holdings Co. tumbled 16% in their biggest decline in 13 years after its president said sales of recent big-budget games disappointed and that it would take years for a recent reorganization to bear fruit.

Sales of Final Fantasy VII Rebirth, Final Fantasy XVI and Foamstars — all released exclusively for Sony Group Corp.’s PlayStation in the previous fiscal year — fell short of the Japanese game publisher’s expectations in both revenue and profit, Takashi Kiryu told analysts the previous day. The company now expects to earn an operating income of ¥40 billion this year, widely missing the average of analyst estimates of ¥57 billion. Its sales and dividend outlook also fell short of expectations.

 

[Švejk]

Well, Rebirth is technically an unfinished story, and FF16 was sort of ass, so yeah.

 

[feynoob]

Investing on those nfts comeback to bite them now.

 

[Dirk Benedict]

Excuses in this thread are going to be glorious. Multiplat releases from here on out. Probably after the final part of FFVIIR releases.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

embarassing company.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Excuses in this thread are going to be glorious. Multiplat releases from here on out. Probably after the final part of FFVIIR releases.

you are welcome dummy

 

[dorkimoe]

It’s funny cuz with how much this forum can’t get off FF’s nuts you’d think it would sell better.

 

[semiconscious]

a formerly visionary developer that no longer has any vision. but, hey, thanks for all them good times...

 

[BiohazardX95]

Foamstars is a piece of trash, I don't know how they expected that Game to sell, I guess it was on plus on day 1 for the same reason.

As for FF, it isn't that popular as it used to be, FFXIII and XV sold much more but also hurt the series reputation, too Many people saying those are Bad games. I think FFVII Rebirth and FFXVI sold pretty well despite that. Not much Will change if they decide to make FF multiplatform again, we saw how FFVII crisis core sold almost nothing on switch and Xbox.

 

[ULTROS!]

I dunno but this is a Takashi Mochizuki article so there’s gonna be a lot of bias. I prefer stuff that isn’t by him or people referencing him.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Isn’t this a standard reply by S-E to every single one of their games over the last 10 years? Their projections are completely delusional and not based on reality.
Releasing your flagship franchise on one console only, with PC versions delayed by quite a bit? You hate money?

Not to mention it looks like they don’t even know what they want FF games to be anymore.

 

[Little Chicken]

you are welcome dummy

Different management, different economic climate, and not the company's largest IP.

Those IP no longer belong to SE btw.

 

[Fabieter]

Do we have another source than takashi for this?

His articles and tweets are always short of my expectations.

 

[Chukhopops]

Thinking of all the people who argued both games were huge successes over the past 7-8 months.

 

[Ozriel]

Foamstars is a piece of trash, I don't know how they expected that Game to sell, I guess it was on plus on day 1 for the same reason.

As for FF, it isn't that popular as it used to be, FFXIII and XV sold much more but also hurt the series reputation, too Many people saying those are Bad games.

The ‘FFXV hurt the series reputation’ talk has always been nonsense pulled out of the hat to try to explain sales decline after an - in hindsight - unwise exclusivity strategy.

I think FFVII Rebirth and FFXVI sold pretty well despite that.

CEO seems to believe otherwise. Ditto the stock market.

Not much Will change if they decide to make FF multiplatform again, we saw how FFVII crisis core sold almost nothing on switch and Xbox.

Xbox, perhaps.
Switch 2? Very likely transformative impact on sales in Japan at the very least.

Isn’t this a standard reply by S-E to every single one of their games over the last 10 years? Their projections are completely delusional and not based on reality.

They were quite delighted with FFXV sales.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Different management, different economic climate, and not the company's largest IP.

Those IP no longer belong to SE btw.

 

[SlimySnake]

Both games are flawed as fuck. Both games are bloated as fuck. Both games are barely even RPGs with little to no role playing whatsoever. At least FF7 Rebirth lets you play with different characters each with their own unique playstyles, FF16 was rigid as fuck. But both games are basically action adventure games now.

I understand they cant go back to turn based combat, but they can do a lot more than simply copy ubisoft world design. Especially where there is skyrim and witcher 3 out there with a fantastic blueprint of how to do open world RPGs. Let me actually explore and stumble into quests. Let me hunt for gear and schematics. Let me choose how side quests play out. Make the rest of the game as linear as you want, but at least let me role play the side quests.

Sony first party exclusives like Spiderman 2, Ragnorak and even Horizon seem to be doing well. Multiplatform sales cut for these games is like 20% xbox and 15% PC. they will get the 15% from PC, but the 20% extra they would get from xbox is not going to make a big difference. They need to make better RPGs. Period.

 

[Vblad88]

Ok, so maybe they will scrap FF 7R-3 and move on. To be honest from the beginning of 2nd game it felt as if it was lacking FF quality. It got hooks for sure, but in the end it was racing the approaching AAA bubble burst we have today.

It is going to get even worse with Part 3… why bother ?

 

[MagiusNecros]

They've invested too much with FFVII-2 so I imagine they will commit to Part 3. Afterwards though I have no idea.

 

[Tomeru]

Different management, different economic climate, and not the company's largest IP.

Those IP no longer belong to SE btw.

Dirk Benedict did say excuses will be glorious.

 

[Alan Silvestro]

Time for Microsoft to buy Square Enix...

 

[Ozriel]

Avengers underwhelmed in terms of quality, and we now know from the Insomniac leak that Marvel charges an arm and leg for licenses.

Their most recent Final Fantasy hit the quality bar and were critically lauded games.

There’s a difference.

 

[Touch fuzZy. get BizZay]

huge bummer to think that rebirth can be so full of goodies and sell so poorly

 

[cireza]

Sales of Final Fantasy VII Rebirth, Final Fantasy XVI and Foamstars — all released exclusively for Sony Group Corp.’s PlayStation in the previous fiscal year — fell short

Please save us Phil-san, we are in deepo shito.

Note : this is a joke post.

 

[Mr Moose]

Before I check, is it a Takashi thread?

 

[Fabieter]

Before I check, is it a Takashi thread?

It is

 

[sncvsrtoip]

(...)Both games are barely even RPGs with little to no role playing whatsoever. At least FF7 Rebirth lets you play with different characters each with their own unique playstyles, FF16 was rigid as fuck. But both games are basically action adventure games now.
(...)Especially where there is skyrim and witcher 3 out there with a fantastic blueprint of how to do open world RPGs.

And what role you could play in Witcher 3 ? ;d I was also rigid as f but in same time was great rpg, playing role is imo not important in cRPG.

 

[ZehDon]

Well, yeah. They killed their FFVII remake trilogy after the first part was revealed to be a sequel, FFXVI wasn't given that much of a push by the one platform it was on, and literally no one asked for Foamstars. Square still out here being Square.

 

[intheinbetween]

Well, yeah. They killed their FFVII remake trilogy after the first part was revealed to be a sequel, FFXVI wasn't given that much of a push by the one platform it was on, and literally no one asked for Foamstars. Square still out here being Square.

They just made business exclusively with/for Sony, that's their fault after all. Square Enix should be looking to Capcom, SEGA and Bandai Namco to understand how to make the company profitable.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

They just made business exclusively with/for Sony, that's their fault after all. Square Enix should be looking to Capcom, SEGA and Bandai Namco to understand how to make the company profitable.

Which has nothing to do with Sony exclusivity deals. It's a big fallacy to link the two when the explanation is that Square has become "more Western" and hence not too hot in the Japanese market, it's pretty obvious that is the problem.

 

[intheinbetween]

Which has nothing to do with Sony exclusivity deals. It's a big fallacy to link the two when the explanation is that Square has become "more Western" and hence not too hot in the Japanese market, it's pretty obvious that is the problem.

I beg to disagree with that, SE has invested a lot of money on several titles that are PS exclusives: FF VII Remake 1, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Foamstars and FF VII Rebirth, none of those titles are western-centric. Part of the problem is most of them had AAA budgets while the ROI has been below expectations.

The industry can't afford AAA productions such as FF VII Remake, FF XVI or even Forspoken for exclusive deals, they are leaving too much money off the table by not releasing on other platforms.

 

[Black_Stride]

The added cost to have the PC versions of Final Fantasy ready for simul release could made up the difference.

Foamstars?......................

But seriously Foamstars should have been a full multiplat

 

[Mister Wolf]

Next time don't stagger the PC ports.

 

[Fabieter]

I beg to disagree with that, SE has invested a lot of money on several titles that are PS exclusives: FF VII Remake 1, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Foamstars and FF VII Rebirth, none of those titles are western-centric. Part of the problem is most of them had AAA budgets while the ROI has been below expectations.

The industry can't afford AAA productions such as FF VII Remake, FF XVI or even Forspoken for exclusive deals, they are leaving too much money off the table by not releasing on other platforms.

Forspoken wasn't exclusive and it was clearly inspired alot by western media. The writers were western people after all.

 

[Fabieter]

The added cost to have the PC versions of Final Fantasy ready for simul release could made up the difference.

Foamstars?......................

But seriously Foamstars should have been a full multiplat

People hated on foamstars so much that I don't believe anything would have made a difference.

 

[Black_Stride]

And what role you could play in Witcher 3 ? ;d I was also rigid as f but in same time was great rpg, playing role is imo not important in cRPG.

Your Geralt build thus playstyle and mine will be very very different by the time we are in Novigrad let alone approaching end game......the choices I've made through the game won't be the same as yours, picking up someone else's save can be very jarring assuming you haven't done like 10 playthroughs and already know why x is y in this play.

FFXVI the level of variety in playstyles is alot more limited and if you called FFXVI an action adventure game you would probably have alot of people agreeing with you

 

[Black_Stride]

People hated on foamstars so much that I don't believe anything would have made a difference.

I think it could have found enough of an audience on PS5, Switch, SeriesS and PC to justify its reason for existing....cross play would have been such a boon for it.
But yeah it's wishful thinking.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

And what role you could play in Witcher 3 ? ;d I was also rigid as f but in same time was great rpg, playing role is imo not important in cRPG.

You could make a case that a strong point of the Witcher franchise is RPing as Geralt - you know his character from the books before even the games were made. So on one hand it limits you a bit, on the other you can RP as finally someone else than the usual persona you play.

I was thinking of making a separate thread about it but IMO Fallout 4 lost a lot on not making the RP experience stronger due to the choice of the MC:

1. Fallout 4: generic schmuck, get frozen, get unfrozen, looks for his/her kid.
2. Fallout: NV: courier (so someone living already in that timeline) gets shot in the head, survives, wakes up, gets pissed to hunt the MFers that did that

 

[Bring Back Scalebound]

I can understand the shock about FF 7 Rebirth not selling a trillion dollars, but not 16.

It's trying out completely new things (For the series). New tone (Derivative of Game of Thrones, but again, FOR THE SERIES), and gameplay style that just took what FF games have been building up to in recent years, and took it to its logical conclusion, is just a straight up action game.

That's not going to go well with its core audience, and it didn't, for a lot of them.
As much as I love what FF 16 was going for from the very beginning, I knew it wasn't going to sell a billion copies, for a Final Fantasy game.

Not to mention that it is a flawed game. Quite flawed.

Also, don't go back to the PS1 days, and the games might sell better. Actually release your games on multiple platforms, AT RELEASE. At the very least PC and PlayStation.

 

[T4keD0wN]

Seems like theyve reached the point of where most of final fantasy fans are in retirement homes or gone and they havent managed to make enough new ones. Dragon quest is not popular enough in the west to save them, their attempts at new series havent went exactly well and after getting rid of eidos and crystal dynamics i unfortunately dont see a way out of this situation for them.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

I beg to disagree with that, SE has invested a lot of money on several titles that are PS exclusives: FF VII Remake 1, Final Fantasy XVI, Forspoken, Foamstars and FF VII Rebirth, none of those titles are western-centric. Part of the problem is most of them had AAA budgets while the ROI has been below expectations.

The industry can't afford AAA productions such as FF VII Remake, FF XVI or even Forspoken for exclusive deals, they are leaving too much money off the table by not releasing on other platforms.

Forspoken was rewritten and had the involvement of Sweet Baby.

As the other poster mentioned, FF16 is basically Game of Thrones, another Western show.

Foamstars was a failure from its inception

Only FF7 tries something true to its roots, but FF has lost identity over the years, unlike Zelda, and now is paying the price. Besides, to the mainstream Asian audiences, the current-age equivalent to Final Fantasy is Genshin Impact. The FF7 remake saga looks very different.

These games have sold well, but SE expectations aren't realistic. In the new market, FF isn't among the top sellers.

 

[Furball]

16 : bad
7 Rebirth :Mid
Foamstar : Dumpster Fire

Hardly surprise , the brand is losing power slowly . Square itself is the problem .

 

[Loomy]

Excuses in this thread are going to be glorious. Multiplat releases from here on out. Probably after the final part of FFVIIR releases.

I don't know if spending money on developing for the 73 Xbox One's out there is going to increase outlook. Having said that, there's no reason there's no day 1 PC versions of those games.

 

[Fabieter]

Your Geralt build thus playstyle and mine will be very very different by the time we are in Novigrad let alone approaching end game......the choices I've made through the game won't be the same as yours, picking up someone else's save can be very jarring assuming you haven't done like 10 playthroughs and already know why x is y in this play.

FFXVI the level of variety in playstyles is alot more limited and if you called FFXVI an action adventure game you would probably have alot of people agreeing with you

W3 is obviously more rpg than ff 16 but damn I really hated the gameplay and the limited combat in w3 soo much and I played it three times which is rare for these big games so yea the rest of the game is good enough to justify that.

 

[Gaiff]

Knowing SE, they probably saw the numbers Elden Ring and BG3 did and expected similar results.

 

[GymWolf]

Time to remilk ff9 with a super necessary 10 games partition.

 

[Black_Stride]

Knowing SE, they probably saw the numbers Elden Ring and BG3 did and expected similar results.

We only made 40 billion Yen......we wanted 57 because obviously.


I can see why they sold Eidos and Crystal.....their expectations are outta whack.

Now hopefully Eidos and Crystal can find a good home if not become independent.......surely those two could band together and rustle up 300 - 400000 thousand dollars to be free of Embracer.
I would have said someone buy them but it's not looking like a good deal being bought by any of the corpos.

How did Square look at Shadow and Rise of the Tomb Raider and not pat the studios on the back?
5 million first year 10 million lifetime should never be seen as a failure.

 

[Shifty1897]

Final Fantasy is a cursed franchise. It means too many different things to different people at this point.

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

I love how people are building sand castles on notoriously bad reporting when Square's own financials said this:

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Excuses in this thread are going to be glorious. Multiplat releases from here on out. Probably after the final part of FFVIIR releases.

To Switch and pc for sure. Releasing on xbox would be a waste of resources.