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Stock-Age: Stocks, Options and Dividends oh my!
- Thread starter koam
- Start date
jamesinclair
Banned
^Thank you
Japan is -9% and the day is just starting.
Japan is -9% and the day is just starting.
jamesinclair
Banned
Octobers = low market, historic market crashes
Fridays = low market, historic market crashes
Fridays in October = oh shit
Based on this, I expect the week to end on a lower note
(People who says you cant run a historical analysis on future returns are wrong, octobers are on obvious down point, every damn year)
Fridays = low market, historic market crashes
Fridays in October = oh shit
Based on this, I expect the week to end on a lower note
(People who says you cant run a historical analysis on future returns are wrong, octobers are on obvious down point, every damn year)
I'm still there in at 52. This is going to be for the long haul. I guess everything is these days!gkrykewy said:
The big one I missed was this monday when AAPL opened ~ 116. By the time I had a sip of coffee, it was going back down below my price!
My wild card right now is STJ, suggested by my bro. They produce medical equipment, and for whatever reason, he says they are a good mid-long term investment. They haven;t tanked and that is good enough for me :lol
Yeah I need to start doing this. The thing is with my luck, I cut out at the limit and the stock rockets way past! I'm more afraid of that, than I am missing out on a quick profit.gkrykewy said:
Obviously that depends on your expectations for that stock. I don't expect NTDOY to see farther than 62-65 anytime soon so a limit makes sense. OTOH with AAPL, I expect them to reach their previous value and beyond, so I'd hate to limit it for a short term gain, if that makes any sense.
lil smoke said:
It does make sense, and it's a fine line. For example, I got KILLED (well, relatively) earlier this year by second-guessing myself on my standing stop-loss orders. You know, "oh, this is just a spike down, why would I sell at the bottom *cancels stop-loss orders*" - cost myself hundreds of dollars. I guess I've learned (I hope) to set my targets on either side and to stick to them. If I miss out on some profits, fine, but I've learned that "pigs get slaughtered."
EDIT: For example, in the case of AAPL, there's a chance that if broader market sentiment doesn't improve, they will get killed at their earnings release next week ("sell the news"). I don't expect it would be a long-term blow, since they seem to spike up hard on any positive sentiment (much like Nintendo on the nikkei), but I could see them falling to 65 or so. I would probably set a stop-loss at 88 to protect myself.
ALeperMessiah
Member
gkrykewy said:
There's only one October!
ALeperMessiah
Member
syllogism said:
The government is lobbying the government for less government. Priceless.
Tideas said:
I find www.finance.yahoo.com to be good if you are looking for a site unaffiliated with a brokerage.
gkrykewy said:
No, he was wrong. He said a limit order is only if things go over a certain amount and a stop order is when things go under a certain amount. Neither is the case. The difference is as I said. A limit order is placed immediately and thus the clearing house for the market is trying to fill the order. A stop order is placed only when a certain condition is met.
Here is it officially.
Limit - A limit order indicates the highest price you are willing to pay for a security, or the lowest price you are willing to accept to sell a security. Your order will be executed at your designated price or better. This helps protect your order from sudden volatility, but it also means you will only buy or sell the security if it reaches the price you're seeking. Unless you specify how the limit order should be processed ("All or None," "Do Not Reduce," or "Fill or Kill")], it may be partially filled with fewer shares bought or sold than you requested if the price you specified is met but the full quantity isn't available at that price. A limit order also allows you to specify a time period within which your order remains active-it will seek to completely fill your order at your limit price until the time period ends, after which your order will expire. Keep in mind that trades executed in multiple lots on the same day are charged a single commission but trades partially executed over multiple trading days are subject to commission charges for each trading day.
To summarize: A market order seeks immediate execution at the next available price or prices. A limit order seeks a certain price or better but may not fill if the market never reaches your specified limit price.
Stop market - Choosing Stop market for the order type indicates you want your stop order to become a market order once a specific price has been reached. There is no guarantee that the execution price will be equal to or near the activation price. Stop orders are accepted on most stocks and options.
Stop limit - Choosing stop limit for the order type indicates you want this order to seek an execution at a specific limit price or better once the activation price is reached. Enter an activation price as well as a limit price for these orders. Depending on your strategy, the limit price and activation price may be the same. The order becomes a limit order once the activation price has been reached. Stop limit orders are accepted on stocks, as well as most options.
dionysus said:
Okay, but in simple terms, people use open limit orders to sell at a target threshold above the stock's current price, and stop orders to sell at the market price (or a limit-market price) should it fall to the stop order price level.
In other words, I don't pretend to be an expert, but ArtG's short answer was generally accurate and probably more helpful than your nuanced one.
Tideas said:
Last is the last executed trade price. You are better off looking at the bid and ask price column for selling and buying respectively.
Edit. Options spreads on b/a depend on volume. There are many contracts that have no volume day to day, especially options with long expirations or very close expirations. Always check volume and spread when options trading. You can get huge spreads of $.50or spreads of less than a penny.
Working the bid/ask for options is part art and part science. While there isn't any apparent liquidity in most options, behind the scenes it's quite a different story. There are hundreds of institutions out there running computer models trying to take advantage of mispriced options. The use various models, such as Black Scholes, GARCH, or internal proprietary models.
So, let's take a real world example. Dell computers. Jan 12.50 call. Right now it's traded 57 contracts. That's not a whole lot considering its one of the biggest companies in the world, right? Currently there are 272 contracts bid at 2.15 and 15 ask at 2.23. Not a lot there, either. So, we can learn one thing from this. Someone on either side is willing to take a theoretically incorrect price for Dell. There's some small player (i.e. you or I!) out there willing to let 15 contracts go at 2.23. I know from experience that if this player wasn't in the way, then we would see maybe 2,000 bid vs 1,900 ask. Why? Because those are the arbs working behind the scenes. That's the tricky thing about trading options: because of the constant hum of computers searching for arbitrage opportunities, you're NEVER going to get the theoretically correct price. In other words, in order to actually buy or sell you're going to have to pay up or accept less than the correct value. Believe me, you're not going to beat a thousand of the world's most sophisticated PhDs with their fancy computers.
NEVER EVER EVER EVER put in a market order for options. Why? Well, because as explained above, if you accept the bid or ask then you're letting someone cash in on an arbitrage opportunity at your expense. And given the wide spread it's going to cost you big time. So, what you have to do is thread the needle. I mean, all us traders here are not arbitrageurs. We're trading based on where we think the direction of the stock is going. So, with Dell, if I wanted to buy now then I may put in a bid at 2.18 and see what happens. Once I do that it goes up on the Level II. Someone can see that and choose to hit it. I don't mind paying up say .10 more than the current bid because I know if the stock goes up 3% tomorrow then I'm looking at a 20% profit.
So, let's take a real world example. Dell computers. Jan 12.50 call. Right now it's traded 57 contracts. That's not a whole lot considering its one of the biggest companies in the world, right? Currently there are 272 contracts bid at 2.15 and 15 ask at 2.23. Not a lot there, either. So, we can learn one thing from this. Someone on either side is willing to take a theoretically incorrect price for Dell. There's some small player (i.e. you or I!) out there willing to let 15 contracts go at 2.23. I know from experience that if this player wasn't in the way, then we would see maybe 2,000 bid vs 1,900 ask. Why? Because those are the arbs working behind the scenes. That's the tricky thing about trading options: because of the constant hum of computers searching for arbitrage opportunities, you're NEVER going to get the theoretically correct price. In other words, in order to actually buy or sell you're going to have to pay up or accept less than the correct value. Believe me, you're not going to beat a thousand of the world's most sophisticated PhDs with their fancy computers.
NEVER EVER EVER EVER put in a market order for options. Why? Well, because as explained above, if you accept the bid or ask then you're letting someone cash in on an arbitrage opportunity at your expense. And given the wide spread it's going to cost you big time. So, what you have to do is thread the needle. I mean, all us traders here are not arbitrageurs. We're trading based on where we think the direction of the stock is going. So, with Dell, if I wanted to buy now then I may put in a bid at 2.18 and see what happens. Once I do that it goes up on the Level II. Someone can see that and choose to hit it. I don't mind paying up say .10 more than the current bid because I know if the stock goes up 3% tomorrow then I'm looking at a 20% profit.
RumblingRosco
Member
ArtG said:
Holding strong with ~30 minutes left. I'm just waiting for the last minute sell-offs.
Cheesemeister
Member
GOOG is up over 10 in the final minutes. Sell the rumor, buy the fact?
gkrykewy said:
Don't know if it'll be high enough at this stage of the game to coax me out of my November MO $20 calls.
Though, I'm not sure if I want to get of the option until the stock is above $20, which I firmly believe it will be at some point. (Especially given the volatility of the market.)
Just wish Zecco could have gotten my cash transfer into my account today so I could have taken advantage of the sweet prices those $20 MO calls were going for.
