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[Nova Bovington]

Probably the reason I'm never going to be too deeply routed into gaming as a whole. Someone is always going to be complaining about something, while we have books and movies of all different types. (Sexual, non-sexual, violent, non-violent, ect) It seems that having a sexy game, will spell disaster for you.

It coming to the point, where the reason that games can't be considered art, isn't on the creators, but rather the consumers of games being too immature to respect different taste.

I mean, fifty shades of gray and twilight are horrible books. But I never really seen anyone called shit or names for enjoying them. Even when people are ripping them apart, they usually just try to keep it too the book.

IDK, those Twilight Moms got it pretty hard, but I guess that's what you get for getting a huge portrait of Edward Cullen tattoed on your back when you're over 40.

I personally read all of the twilight books and will make fun of anyone for enjoying them, but 50 Shades is just porn. I can't fault you for reading porn. I read porn. If you do it in public that's kinda fucked up, of course.

I can and will fault you for thinking abusive relationships like the one portrayed in 50 Shades are hot, something to strive for and what BDSM is actually like and I will also fault you for enjoying LITERAL TWILIGHT FAN-FICTION.

 

[AngryCanadian]

Gamergate is just a bunch of assholes being assholes that became a big dicks vs. assholes situation, and not even the sex kind. Just the sad kind.

You just made me want to rewatch Team America again

 

[Mr.Towel]

It coming to the point, where the reason that games can't be considered art, isn't on the creators, but rather the consumers of games being too immature to respect different taste.

On the flip side, games can't be considered art until people understand that criticism and reflection are a standard part of art appreciation.

I mean, fifty shades of gray and twilight are horrible books. But I never really seen anyone called shit or names for enjoying them. Even when people are ripping them apart, they usually just try to keep it too the book.

I see that all the time. There's a very elitist attitude around those books and a lot of people aren't afraid to show their dead aim for the people who read them.

 

[croten]

I personally read all of the twilight books and will make fun of anyone for enjoying them, but 50 Shades is just porn. I can't fault you for reading porn. I read porn. If you do it in public that's kinda fucked up, of course.

Well, it's bad porn. There is more reasons to not like it than "it's just porn".

 

[Xiraiya]

I mean, fifty shades of gray and twilight are horrible books. But I never really seen anyone called shit or names for enjoying them. Even when people are ripping them apart, they usually just try to keep it too the book.

Haha oh boy how have you not?, I mean yeah Twilight is kind of dumb to hate people for liking, because while there are things I don't like, I've never read the books (Which a lot of people say are actually good) so I can't judge.

However, 50 Shades Of Gray is one of the worst kinds of ignorant writing, so people who read that and think "this is legit, I love it" are well, they'll get judged for being stupid.

 

[360pages]

Seriously? I have and frequently too.

I haven't, though I assumed it's mostly on sites filled with teenagers. Then again, the fact that despite how...um, something Fifty Shades of Gray is, it got published, put out and sold well. I mean despite it being a shitty book, for something like that to be published and make it so far actually felt...weirdly nice. I never read it, but the fact so many people can except it and say...(Whatever, I don't have to read it,) Really shows the maturity of such things. Even when a movie like that comes out, either you watch it or don't and no big fanfare is made.

Something like that is made with a game and a huge hassle is made every single time.

I never actually read fifty shades of grey though...

 

[IDKAboutThat]

Probably the reason I'm never going to be too deeply routed into gaming as a whole. Someone is always going to be complaining about something, while we have books and movies of all different types. (Sexual, non-sexual, violent, non-violent, ect) It seems that having a sexy game, will spell disaster for you.

It coming to the point, where the reason that games can't be considered art, isn't on the creators, but rather the consumers of games being too immature to respect different taste.

I mean, fifty shades of gray and twilight are horrible books. But I never really seen anyone called shit or names for enjoying them. Even when people are ripping them apart, they usually just try to keep it too the book.

Bullshit, they can't. Video games are as art as movies

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

I personally read all of the twilight books and will make fun of anyone for enjoying them, but 50 Shades is just porn. I can't fault you for reading porn. I read porn. If you do it in public that's kinda fucked up, of course.

I read fifty shades of grey. As an erotic author, I can say that that is not a very well written book.

 

[DoktorEvil]

A lot of surface and lame published shit gets pushed out and sold gangbusters, regardless of the idiots who bought it.

Twilight and 50 shades are tame versions of shit we've read and heard before, but capitalizing on trends, like a Mr. Max Brooks has done, is what publishing is about, at least in NYC.

 

[360pages]

Bullshit, they can't. Video games are as art as movies

They can, but the people who consume them won't let them, the reason why games are often so looked down on is the community. The gaming community is simply shit compared to something like movies and what not.

 

[RecursiveFault]

I haven't, though I assumed it's mostly on sites filled with teenagers. Then again, the fact that despite how...um, something Fifty Shades of Gray is, it got published, put out and sold well. I mean despite it being a shitty book, for something like that to be published and make it so far actually felt...weirdly nice. I never read it, but the fact so many people can except it and say...(Whatever, I don't have to read it,) Really shows the maturity of such things. Even when a movie like that comes out, either you watch it or don't and no big fanfare is made.

Something like that is made with a game and a huge hassle is made every single time.

I never actually read fifty shades of grey though...

Oh there's absolutely no maturity over it. People flipped their shit despite the popularity.

Games have a vocal minority, but there's idiots everywhere.

Bullshit, they can't. Video games are as art as movies

Might wanna read his point there.

 

[croten]

I read fifty shades of grey. As an erotic author, I can say that that is not a very well written book.

I had an argument with a girl I knew who thought real porn was boring and preferred 50 shades instead.

 

[DoktorEvil]

I had an argument with a girl I knew who thought real porn was boring and preferred 50 shades instead.

She watches too much porn then?

I can't fathom women who want the type of abusive relationship that book portrays.

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

I had an argument with a girl I knew who thought real porn was boring and preferred 50 shades instead.

I can see why a girl would say that. Women are the largest demographic for erotic literature for a reason.

Have you ever read a thing intended for men? It's just "Yo, den he stuck his dick inside 'N' dat shit was wet as hell bro!"

 

[IDKAboutThat]

I read fifty shades of grey. As an erotic author, I can say that that is not a very well written book.

If one reads Fifty Shades as though one is not supposed to have one's fingers in and around their genitals as they read, they deserve to be laughed at. It's like watching a porno and analyzing Barbara the Sex Viking as a serious character.

 

[Beloved]

I had an argument with a girl I knew who thought real porn was boring and preferred 50 shades instead.

Implying there is even a difference between "Real porn" and 50 Shades.

They both are missing a few crucial details about basic human anatomy (women's anatomy specifically), they both give completely unrealistic expectations of what actual sex is even like, and they both have terrible terrible dialogue.

 

[Glitchesarecool]

I read fifty shades of grey. As an erotic author, I can say that that is not a very well written book.

Added to the "List of professions I thought I'd never run into."

 

[joe2187]

watergategate

Mitchell and webb is the best.

Evil Vicar and Evil Waiter are the best

 

[Mr.Towel]

They can, but the people who consume them won't let them, the reason why games are often so looked down on is the community. The gaming community is simply shit compared to something like movies and what not.

I'm curious to hear what you mean here. Can you elaborate a bit? I mean, there's been some narly shit with big budget movies lately, but nothing really reaching gamergate levels

 

[RecursiveFault]

I can see why a girl would say that. Women are the largest demographic for erotic literature for a reason.

Have you ever read a thing intended for men? It's just "Yo, den he stuck his dick inside 'N' dat shit was wet as hell bro!"

Yeah, but that's not necessarily true. Girls want things in written format because it better conveys emotions, since that's what they seem to prefer.

I feel like you could get better Erotica from the internet, but I think fifty shades was just an outlet and way for a lot of girls to act like it was ok to read and talk about.

Games are a relatively new form of entertainment media, when compared to movies and books. You could say that gaming as a whole "grew up too fast" and it became heavily monetized by corporate greed before it even had a chance to fully bloom creatively.

It doesn't help that modern gaming tends to take most of its cues from movies, which gives naysayers the opportunity to look down upon gaming as a whole.

I still think games are art, but the problem with a lot of people is that they tend to ignore the aspects of games that are unique to the medium. Gameplay- balance, engagement, control, feedback... these things blend together to create a visual and mechanical treat for those who can appreciate it.

You summed it up better than I could myself.

 

[GuardianE]

Games are a relatively new form of entertainment media, when compared to movies and books. You could say that gaming as a whole "grew up too fast" and it became heavily monetized by corporate greed before it even had a chance to fully bloom creatively.

It doesn't help that modern gaming tends to take most of its cues from movies, which gives naysayers the opportunity to look down upon gaming as a whole.

I still think games are art, but the problem with a lot of people is that they tend to ignore the aspects of games that are unique to the medium. Gameplay- balance, engagement, control, feedback... these things blend together to create a visual and mechanical treat for those who can appreciate it.

 

[360pages]

Well those books are written by women. And from what I can tell it's mostly the female demographic that enjoys them. Even though I think Twilight is shit and never read Fifty shades. The fact that the latter exist where usually those kinds of books are pushed in the background due to content is interesting.

 

[Jman014]

So this should make Liam happy for Smash on Wii U if it's true.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=134744953&postcount=1

 

[IDKAboutThat]

They can, but the people who consume them won't let them, the reason why games are often so looked down on is the community. The gaming community is simply shit compared to something like movies and what not.

Might wanna read his point there.

I understood what he meant, I had an issue with his phrasing, not his sentiment. And I do agree with him. It's the same way that Hollywood has recently been making so many reboots and sequels, cause it sells.

I had an argument with a girl I knew who thought real porn was boring and preferred 50 shades instead.

I agree with the sentiment, 50 Shades' shitty writing keeping me from agreeing with the letter. I much prefer stuff written for girls, because I personally like a little bit of romance and setup before the fucking. Makes it hotter and more satisfying.

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

Added to the "List of professions I thought I'd never run into."

Oh, you're new, yeah, you probably missed my talks about my writings. Yeah, I write erotic fiction and plan to finally self publish in the new year.

My first one is about lesbians in a near future world where men are useless from disease and the only remaining sport that has complete integration into every aspect of the world, including government, is Professional Wrestling.

Factoid: The president of the united states is determined in a 30 woman over the top rope battle royal.

 

[DoktorEvil]

Implying there is even a difference between "Real porn" and 50 Shades.

They both are missing a few crucial details about basic human anatomy (women's anatomy specifically), they both give completely unrealistic expectations of what actual sex is even like, and they both have terrible terrible dialogue.

If someone wanted Erotica of that nature, there's better written stuff on the Internet.

I guess to get published and wealthy, you have to hustle hard and give up any artistic freedom/liberties.

 

[Nova Bovington]

I can see why a girl would say that. Women are the largest demographic for erotic literature for a reason.

Have you ever read a thing intended for men? It's just "Yo, den he stuck his dick inside 'N' dat shit was wet as hell bro!"

People who are actually into BDSM got angry at 50 Shades because they felt it wrongfully portrayed them and rightly so. The relationship in that book is just straight up abuse of a woman, enacted by a sociopath and it isn't some clever commentary on the thin line between abuse and extreme kinks either. It took all of the problems that were present in Twilight (it did start off as fanfiction, after all) and amplified them to an extreme.

Like I said, I will openly judge anyone who enjoys that book and not positively either.

 

[360pages]

I'm curious to hear what you mean here. Can you elaborate a bit? I mean, there's been some narly shit with big budget movies lately, but nothing really reaching gamergate levels

Kind of what you just said. People can be snarly and Movie critics can be harsher, but I don't think something like this would ever start in different mediums that games did. This is mostly due to games being closer to internet culture then books or movies. (Which isn't a good thing)

Gamers have a tendency to call everything shit, when was the last time you heard someone call a Japanese movie, too Japanese? Yeah, it's stupid, but it's a complaint that I hear the most about games.

How can anyone from the outside looking in see games as an art form. When the majority of people discussing it, can't take criticism, opinion and different types of entertainment.

 

[joe2187]

So christie sims true identity has been revealed it was Aaron all along and his Dinosaur stand.

 

[Glitchesarecool]

My first one is about lesbians in a near future world where men are useless from disease and the only remaining sport that has complete integration into every aspect of the world, including government, is Professional Wrestling.

Factoid: The president of the united states is determined in a 30 woman over the top rope battle royal.

So it's a Matt-focused story is what you're saying.

 

[IDKAboutThat]

Oh, you're new, yeah, you probably missed my talks about my writings. Yeah, I write erotic fiction and plan to finally self publish in the new year.

My first one is about lesbians in a near future world where men are useless from disease and the only remaining sport that has complete integration into every aspect of the world, including government, is Professional Wrestling.

Factoid: The president of the united states is determined in a 30 woman over the top rope battle royal.

cue the vince reaction gif

 

[DoktorEvil]

So it's a Matt-focused story is what you're saying.

Those are the best kinds of stories.

All that's missing is a huge flag of America somewhere in there.

 

[IDKAboutThat]

The accumulated filth of all their incompetence and indifference has foamed up about their waists and now all these developers look up and shout "Buy our game!"... and I'll whisper... "No."

Agi be like

Those are the best kinds of stories.

All that's missing is a huge flag of America somewhere in there.

That should be all the president wears. Just Ryuko Episode 19 it.

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

So christie sims true identity has been revealed it was Aaron all along and his Dinosaur stand.

If only I could reach the majesty of "Ravaged by the Raptor."

So it's a Matt-focused story is what you're saying.

Our overlapping tastes in these regards are one of the things that attracted me to TBFP in the first place.

 

[Nova Bovington]

Games are a relatively new form of entertainment media, when compared to movies and books. You could say that gaming as a whole "grew up too fast" and it became heavily monetized by corporate greed before it even had a chance to fully bloom creatively.

It doesn't help that modern gaming tends to take most of its cues from movies, which gives naysayers the opportunity to look down upon gaming as a whole.

I still think games are art, but the problem with a lot of people is that they tend to ignore the aspects of games that are unique to the medium. Gameplay- balance, engagement, control, feedback... these things blend together to create a visual and mechanical treat for those who can appreciate it.

Hear, hear!

Well those books are written by women. And from what I can tell it's mostly the female demographic that enjoys them. Even though I think Twilight is shit and never read Fifty shades. The fact that the latter exist where usually those kinds of books are pushed in the background due to content is interesting.

50 Shades is written by a man.

Oh, you're new, yeah, you probably missed my talks about my writings. Yeah, I write erotic fiction and plan to finally self publish in the new year.

My first one is about lesbians in a near future world where men are useless from disease and the only remaining sport that has complete integration into every aspect of the world, including government, is Professional Wrestling.

Factoid: The president of the united states is determined in a 30 woman over the top rope battle royal.

10/10 would read! Idk if you're into comics but have you read Y: The Last Man? It's a similar but more serious approach to what you just described and a really good read overall.

 

[IDKAboutThat]

50 Shades is written by a man.

This man, specifically.

So no

 

[DoktorEvil]

Hear, hear!

50 Shades is written by a man.

10/10 would read! Idk if you're into comics but have you read Y: The Last Man? It's a similar but more serious approach to what you just described and a really good read overall.

By a man?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._L._James

Erika Leonard James is a woman.

 

[YesManKablam]

Maragi, and other EU frienders, rejoice!
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=914134

 

[Nova Bovington]

This man, specifically.

So no

By a man?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._L._James

Erika Leonard James is a woman.

Well fuck me then, I thought it was. Sorry.

 

[DoktorEvil]

Please put this in the white people dancing topic on OT!

I'm sick of looking at terrible dancing on that page.

 

[IDKAboutThat]

Well fuck me then, I thought it was. Sorry.

No apologies. Only self-improvement.

 

[Mr.Towel]

Kind of what you just said. People can be snarly and Movie critics can be harsher, but I don't think something like this would ever start in different mediums that games did. This is mostly due to games being closer to internet culture then books or movies. (Which isn't a good thing)

Gamers have a tendency to call everything shit, when was the last time you heard someone call a Japanese movie, too Japanese? Yeah, it's stupid, but it's a complaint that I hear the most about games.

Agreed, but I do think there are idiots in every medium (ie the guy on my facebook complaining that the new Fantastic Four movie is going to ruin his childhood by making Johnny Storm black), but this gamergate has seemed to bring the worst people to the front.

50 Shades is written by a man.

It's not tho
Edit: beat to it

 

[Nova Bovington]

No apologies. Only self-improvement.

Let's!

 

[DoktorEvil]

Well fuck me then, I thought it was. Sorry.

You can still be upset at its drivel though.

Stephanie Meyer and EL James' writing does more damage to young and impressionable women than anything Bayonetta or SK could do in video games.

One knows exactly what it's doing, the other blurs the line between reality and fiction.

 

[Aaron-Lagann]

10/10 would read! Idk if you're into comics but have you read Y: The Last Man? It's a similar but more serious approach to what you just described and a really good read overall.

I hate American comics art style, but I've read some and I've read a bit of Y the Last Man, which was part of the inspiration for this story. AKA I completely ripped it off and took out the male character.

And hey, are you saying wrestling lesbians isn't serious? This is hard drama, man, super serious shit.

Spoiler

Obviously not.

 

[Okingjrr]

The accumulated filth of all their incompetence and indifference has foamed up about their waists and now all these developers look up and shout "Buy our game!"... and I look down and whisper... "No."

As always, your responses continue to sting.

Not entirely correct. I want it to fail.
In Europe, I mean.

I mean, aside from the die hard fans who waited for each update, who's gonna care?

 

[YesManKablam]

Please put this in the white people dancing topic on OT!

I'm sick of looking at terrible dancing on that page.

I can't decide if White People dancing is the worst thing, or the best thing....

 

[Glitchesarecool]

And hey, are you saying wrestling lesbians isn't serious? This is hard drama, man, super serious shit.

Spoiler

Obviously not.

Honestly if those romanced by a T-Rex stories can get onto Amazon, I'm sure a well written story regardless of premise will do well.

 

[IDKAboutThat]

Not entirely correct. I want it to fail.

"This pathetic attempt to win back a market you forsook so long ago will not go unpunished. You will be ground to dust by the anger and the hatred of a million Atlus fans long abandoned, and then, when you finally feel your soul leaving your body, we will ignore you. And we will forget. But we will not forgive. No, even in death, we will not forgive."

 

[Okingjrr]

I can't decide if White People dancing is the worst thing, or the best thing....

It's definitely a thing