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[Deleted member 17706]

That's not what I said. Again I said some precepts of some versions of Buddhism were used to justify and condone horrific acts. Is there something wrong with this?

Something wrong with citing it as an example that is in any way comparable to Islamic terrorism, yes.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Huh? My point is that some precepts of some versions of Buddhism were used to justify horrific actions. Much like what happens with some precepts of some versions of Islam.

Yes and I'm arguing that Japan's aggression had nothing to do with Buddhism, and certainly not in the name of the Buddha - nor was that used to justify their actions.
The two aren't comparable, imo.

 

[Ipsoclipso]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde

احسن يستاهلو ما جاهم
هذا جزاء كل من يتطاول على خير البشر
Good, they deserved what got to them
This punishment for all who insults the best of humanity.

الحمد لله .. دفاعآ عن خير البشر صلى الله عليه وسلم
Thank god.. defense of the best of humanity, peace be upon him

فإننا في الوقت ذاته على يقين بأن كل من يسيء لله أو لدينه أو لنبيه صلى الله عليه وسلم فهو أكبر مجرم ويستحق المحاكمة والعقوبة
At the same time, we are confident that both offend God or religion or the Prophet, peace be upon him is the biggest criminal and worthy of trial and punishment

خبر مفرح ويثلج الصدر ...
الفرنسيون سباقون الى قتل كل صحوة اسلاميه في العالم
وهم من بنى المفاعل النووي لليهود في فلسطين ...
اللهم انهم لايعجزونك فأرنا فيهم عجائب قدرتك
The news cause for joy and gratifying ...
The French are proactive to kill all the Islamic revival in the world
They built a nuclear reactor for Jews in Palestine ...
Oh God, they do not Aadzonk show them the wonders of your ability

http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html

لماذا الهجوم المسلح على هذه الصحيفة شارلي ايبدو الفرنسية الساخرة...
Why armed attack on this newspaper Charlie Hebdo French is satirical...
(-75 downvotes on this comment)

الحرية بالمفهوم الأروبي يجب أن تحوي حرية القتل أنتم تمارسون حرية إهانت مقدسات و حرية القذارة بأنواعها وحرية الحكم على ثقافات كاملة أضيفوا حرية القتل و إعتبروا الهجوم تابع للحرية
European concept of freedom must have freedom of murder. you are exercising freedom of insulting sanctities and filth of all kinds of freedom and the freedom of judgment on a whole cultures. add freedom of murder and considered the attack for freedom
(57 upvotes on this comment)

glad I left this so called religion of peace.

 

[Palette Swap]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eX7oezVO1Bk

It's time to wake the fuck up Europe!

Will you fucking stop milking this tragic event with your fucking bullshit sources to further your religious agenda? Didn't you get enough with your shitty half assed thread that got locked earlier?

People died today. Fuck your opportunism.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

Did you read?

I gave two options

1. Are they following their faith (Islam)
2. Are they distorting their faith (Islam)

No one has a monopoly on the faith but you suggested the radicalists were following Islam thus saying they were doing what Islam says. What do you think the Moderates are doing? Distorting Islam? lol

Can you not just admit that, however fucked up their perception of it might be, they are doing this because of religion? In their head, they are pleasing and avenging a prophet.

 

[Nesotenso]

I am sorry for the journalists that died and the lives that have been destroyed by the stupid actions of some crazies.

But also tired about how these threads tread on the same damn things all the time. I hope the publication continues to operate but I don't think it will make Europe's issues with their muslim populations any better.

edit: A poster above is looking at comments on the internet to gauge the sentiments of millions. smh.

 

[RustyNails]

I don't think more death is the answer. As long as those responsible are locked away from society then that's all that matter. Killing people makes martyrs which can be be used as inspiration for others, and those committing this crime clearly do not fear death so it does not act as a deterrent.

What's the deterrence for the murderers then? They will figure at worst, they will be stuck inside a cell playing videogames for the rest of their lives.

 

[Yellow_Magic]

#NotAllMuslims

 

[Ninja Of Chaos]

Did you read?

I gave two options

1. Are they following their faith (Islam)
2. Are they distorting their faith (Islam)

No one has a monopoly on the faith but you suggested the radicalists were following Islam thus saying they were doing what Islam says. What do you think the Moderates are doing? Distorting Islam? lol

I love how you are stuck in binary mode over this.

They are both following their faith. Not different versions of the faith or whatever. They are both following the exact same faith.

 

[Forsete]

Thank god for the ignore list.

 

[You Are Viewtiful]

I only know like 4 of those. >_< Is the guy beside Jesus for real?

 

[xbhaskarx]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde


http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html

glad I left this so called religion of peace.

Religion of Peace, indeed...

 

[Maninthemirror]

Can you not just admit that, however fucked up their perception of it might be, they are doing this because of religion? In their head, they are pleasing and avenging a prophet.

Wait you want me to admit that my faith tells them to do this? I have said again previously, why blame Apple as a fruit due to a bunch of rotten Apples

 

[magash]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde





http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html



glad I left this so called religion of peace.

I take it you flunked statistics

 

[Sojgat]

Just woke up to this terrible news on the radio.

The killers are despicable cowards. My thoughts are with the families of the victims. I don't know what else to say.

 

[Raiden]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eX7oezVO1Bk

It's time to wake the fuck up Europe!

The only thing that is missing is some dramatic music.

 

[Corronchilejano]

What's the deterrence for the murderers then? They will figure at worst, they will be stuck inside a cell playing videogames for the rest of their lives.

If what you say is true, there would be no murders where capital punishment exists. That is not the case.

 

[Cyd0nia]

I only know like 4 of those. >_< Is the guy beside Jesus for real?

Probably because one of them is Joseph Smith and another is Seaman, who I assume you're talking about. He's a bit like Aquaman, but his name rhymes with semen - to much amusement.

 

[Majine]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.


glad I left this so called religion of peace.

I hope for your sanity sake, that you are not regularly looking for enlightenment in internet comment sections.

 

[Foffy]

I only know like 4 of those. >_< Is the guy beside Jesus for real?

Which one? To the left or to the right?

 

[TheUntamedLegend]

I only know like 4 of those. >_< Is the guy beside Jesus for real?

You don't know Seaman?

 

[GalacticSushiman]

It's easy for me though to valiantly claim things like that. I am not French, I don't live there, I don't know these people, I have barely had contact with any Muslims. I cannot imagine how the French must feel, let alone what the families and friends of the victims are going through.

It's important to remember that in the heat of the moment, people often say or write or do things they would not have done with some (emotional/geographical/temporal) distance.

Well, I am French, I was raised watching Cabu's drawings on TV in the 80s (he was the drawer for a famous TV show for kids at that time), and I love Wolinsky work for dozens of years. I have to admit I don't live in France anymore, but I just spent 2 weeks in Paris with my family, so one could say I am 'emotionally involved'.

That does not mean I am asking for 'Europe to wake up against Islamist' or for the 'return of the guillotine', as others did in this thread.

Hence my frustration.

 

[Zarovitch]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde





http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html



glad I left this so called religion of peace.

Disgusting

 

[petran79]

Germany is still in denial about its past, it takes time for wounds to heal.

edit: I'm talking about censorship of WW II related stuff

the only thing they're in denial is their economic policy in Europe

 

[marrec]

Religion of Peace, indeed...

Shall I give the counter-example of comments from any Fox News article? Lets stop taking examples of the worst of a culture and pretend they represent the entire culture.

 

[Real Hero]

I only know like 4 of those. >_< Is the guy beside Jesus for real?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1NT4tYQjT4

 

[FZZ]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde





http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html



glad I left this so called religion of peace.

You realize those are the equivalent to reading comments on Yahoo or Youtube in terms of being bigoted and disgusting?

Anonymity makes Muslims assholes too. Fuck those guys for not condemning the murder but seriously you're going to denounce the whole religion from internet comments and what I assume is just your own personal experience.

Edit: This thread is actually taking a turn for the worse, people are beginning to just focus on having a semantic argument of the situation and I assume it will soon devolve in vitriolic comments towards certain posters who have differing opinions. Final comments are just that it is a tragedy what happened in France just like how it is whenever any terrorist attacks happen.

Why has this got so much more attention than the Pakistan school thing?
didnt 200 or so people die in that?

"Certain groups of people are more important to others. Certain lives hold more values than others." That is the view of many in the world we live in sadly.

 

[blu]

Then maybe you should read the thread carefully again, too. You might understand why it is necessary to call out the racism.

While I agree with your reasons for concern for muslims after such evens, I also find it logical that such acts could be at the very least discouraged if actual believers publicly expressed their condemnation. I know I'd be doing this if I was religious and somebody in my faith did a monstrous act claiming they did it for my faith. I would have responded with a big fat 'fuck you' to them, and I would have made sure it resonated.

 

[Nesotenso]

Religion of Peace, indeed...

surprised you didn't go all copy-paste.

 

[Kill Your Masters]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.





glad I left this so called religion of peace.

Dont ever read youtube comments then as it will be hard for you to leave this planet.

 

[Atilac]

This thread got real ugly with bigotry

 

[The Lamonster]

I looked to arabic news websites commenters to see what they think on this tragedy.

Text is translated from google.

http://sabq.org/ohvgde





http://www.echoroukonline.com/ara/articles/228906.html



glad I left this so called religion of peace.

Is this for real? Mainstream Muslims are condoning this?

 

[thelatestmodel]

Wait you want me to admit that my faith tells them to do this? I have said again previously, why blame Apple as a fruit due to a bunch of rotten Apples

Not your faith, their faith. Their faith made them do this.

 

[kneePat]

What's the deterrence for the murderers then? They will figure at worst, they will be stuck inside a cell playing videogames for the rest of their lives.

Any effective deterrence would come before they murder.

 

[Lemaitre]

Make your day? Ok....

Lol at the level of vitriol all throughout this thread.

Personally, I am deeply angered by the deaths of all twelve individuals who were killed today. Not only their deaths, but the fact that whoever killed these people did so to stall free speech and expression. To me that is unacceptable, and I think a lot of us in the West and in Western countries have to ask ourselves what will we do to protect our freedom of expression no matter the costs.

And a lot of that means directing our pent up anger and emotions into something constructive. Advocating for the end of religion, for other extremists views (deportation of foreigners, etc) isn't going to get us anywhere, and more people have to let themselves cool off before jumping to baseless conclusions of where we go from here.

 

[Bedlam]

Speaking as a Muslim, these murderer cowards drawing breath while innocent French victims are lying dead in their own pool of blood is not fair. I think it's very fair to seek death penalty for these murderous crimes. Look at how Anders Breivik is living. Dude has Playstation 2 in his cell, and is currently requesting to upgrade it Playstation 3. He is sitting in his "cell" playing videogames as a punishment for killing 70 school kids. Do we want that?

Yes. Because we're civilized, we are better than these lunatics (/this lunatic) and because we would not gain anything from revenge.

 

[Resident_UA]

I actually agree with him for once. I disagree with his views on Islam in general, but this should be easy test for a moderate to pass.

 

[Mysterious]

Myanmar, Sri Lanka, India, Palestine are just modern day examples. Religion drips with blood because majority of the people around the world are religious so its an excuse for them. As the world is becoming more and more non-religious, you see the so called religious attacks in groups but non-religious evil and attacks still persist and will. its human nature, not religion which needs a course correction

Uh, India was Muslims vs Hindus thing. Sri Lanka had nothing to do with Buddhism. Jews are not fighting Palestine in the name of Yahweh.

 

[dosh]

It's easy for me though to valiantly claim things like that. I am not French, I don't live there, I don't know these people, I have barely had contact with any Muslims. I cannot imagine how the French must feel, let alone what the families and friends of the victims are going through.

It's important to remember that in the heat of the moment, people often say or write or do things they would not have done with some (emotional/geographical/temporal) distance.

I'm pretty sure that a majority of French (myself included) would be appalled to hear anybody so much as talk about bringing the death penalty back, even angrily and in the wake of such a tragedy.

Spoiler

(at least, I hope they would be appalled, because they should be)

 

[Azih]

Something wrong with citing it as an example that is in any way comparable to Islamic terrorism, yes.

What's the difference?

 

[Maninthemirror]

I love how you are stuck in binary mode over this.

They are both following their faith. Not different versions of the faith or whatever. They are both following the exact same faith.

Seems you are not thinking logically. The same faith telling the majority not to commit evil acts and the same faith telling the minority to commit evil acts? so you are ignoring the view of the majority and giving the minority view equal leverage? how does that work?

When its proven to the radicalists that Islam says otherwise and they still commit atrocities, why would you, as a rational person, give ANY weight to what the radicalists think? The only viable reason I can come up with that people give weight to radicalists is because it makes their argument relevant.

 

[Mr.Swag]

Why has this got so much more attention than the Pakistan school thing?
didnt 200 or so people die in that?

 

[kmax]

Thank God that despite tragedies like these, there are still sensible people who can distinguish and not let themselves surrender to bigotry.

 

[Jackpot]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eX7oezVO1Bk

It's time to wake the fuck up Europe!

Hey it's the guy, who posted a bigoted rant as news and then bailed from his own thread!

 

[Maninthemirror]

Why has this got so much more attention than the Pakistan school thing?
didnt 200 or so people die in that?

141. but that thread was largely ignored tragicaly

 

[Madness]

Damn, the video of the policeman being gunned down is brutal. Fuck.

 

[Brakke]

Why has this got so much more attention than the Pakistan school thing?
didnt 200 or so people die in that?

What is your metric for this?

 

[marrec]

Why has this got so much more attention than the Pakistan school thing?
didnt 200 or so people die in that?

The Pakistani school massacre garnered a flurry of attention from the west and has continued to dominate political attention in Pakistan proper. It's not so unreasonable to believe that something that happened in Pakistan had been given more attention in Pakistani culture than western culture. :-/

 

[thelatestmodel]

I actually agree with him for once. I disagree with his views on Islam in general, but this should be easy test for a moderate to pass.

No reasonable person could possibly disagree with that tweet. You can't say to people that they can't make fun of something.

 

[xbhaskarx]

surprised you didn't go all copy-paste.

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...

but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" (Translation is from the Noble Quran) The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did). The use of the word "persecution" by some Muslim translators is thus disingenuous (the actual Muslim words for persecution - "idtihad" - and oppression - a variation of "z-l-m" - do not appear in the verse). The actual Arabic comes from "fitna" which can mean disbelief, or the disorder that results from unbelief or temptation. Taken as a whole, the context makes clear that violence is being authorized until "religion is for Allah" - ie. unbelievers desist in their unbelief.



Quran (2:244) - "Then fight in the cause of Allah, and know that Allah Heareth and knoweth all things."



Quran (2:216) - "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not." Not only does this verse establish that violence can be virtuous, but it also contradicts the myth that fighting is intended only in self-defense, since the audience was obviously not under attack at the time. From the Hadith, we know that this verse was narrated at a time that Muhammad was actually trying to motivate his people into raiding merchant caravans for loot.



Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."



Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority". This speaks directly of polytheists, yet it also includes Christians, since they believe in the Trinity (ie. what Muhammad incorrectly believed to be 'joining companions to Allah').



Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." The martyrs of Islam are unlike the early Christians, who were led meekly to the slaughter. These Muslims are killed in battle as they attempt to inflict death and destruction for the cause of Allah. This is the theological basis for today's suicide bombers.



Quran (4:76) - "Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…"



Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."



Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-" This passage criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes. It also demolishes the modern myth that "Jihad" doesn't mean holy war in the Quran, but rather a spiritual struggle. Not only is the Arabic word used in this passage, but it is clearly not referring to anything spiritual, since the physically disabled are given exemption. (The Hadith reveals the context of the passage to be in response to a blind man's protest that he is unable to engage in Jihad and this is reflected in other translations of the verse).



Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..." Is pursuing an injured and retreating enemy really an act of self-defense?



Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"



Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them" No reasonable person would interpret this to mean a spiritual struggle.



Quran (8:15) - "O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey's end."



Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah" Some translations interpret "fitna" as "persecution", but the traditional understanding of this word is not supported by the historical context (See notes for 2:193). The Meccans were simply refusing Muhammad access to their city during Haj. Other Muslims were allowed to travel there - just not as an armed group, since Muhammad had declared war on Mecca prior to his eviction. The Meccans were also acting in defense of their religion, since it was Muhammad's intention to destroy their idols and establish Islam by force (which he later did). Hence the critical part of this verse is to fight until "religion is only for Allah", meaning that the true justification of violence was the unbelief of the opposition. According to the Sira (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 324) Muhammad further explains that "Allah must have no rivals."



Quran (8:57) - "If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember."



Quran (8:67) - "It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land..."



Quran (8:59-60) - "And let not those who disbelieve suppose that they can outstrip (Allah's Purpose). Lo! they cannot escape. Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy."



Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..."



Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence is to convert to Islam (prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religion's Five Pillars). This popular claim that the Quran only inspires violence within the context of self-defense is seriously challenged by this passage as well, since the Muslims to whom it was written were obviously not under attack. Had they been, then there would have been no waiting period (earlier verses make it a duty for Muslims to fight in self-defense, even during the sacred months). The historical context is Mecca after the idolaters were subjugated by Muhammad and posed no threat. Once the Muslims had the power, they violently evicted those unbelievers who would not convert.



Quran (9:14) - "Fight against them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and disgrace them and give you victory over them and heal the breasts of a believing people." Humiliating and hurting non-believers not only has the blessing of Allah, but it is ordered as a means of carrying out his punishment and even "healing" the hearts of Muslims.



Quran (9:20) - "Those who believe, and have left their homes and striven with their wealth and their lives in Allah's way are of much greater worth in Allah's sight. These are they who are triumphant." The Arabic word interpreted as "striving" in this verse is the same root as "Jihad". The context is obviously holy war.



Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued." "People of the Book" refers to Christians and Jews. According to this verse, they are to be violently subjugated, with the sole justification being their religious status. This was one of the final "revelations" from Allah and it set in motion the tenacious military expansion, in which Muhammad's companions managed to conquer two-thirds of the Christian world in the next 100 years. Islam is intended to dominate all other people and faiths.


Quran (9:30) - "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"



Quran (9:38-39) - "O ye who believe! what is the matter with you, that, when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling heavily to the earth? Do ye prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the Hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place." This is a warning to those who refuse to fight, that they will be punished with Hell.



Quran (9:41) - "Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! That is best for you if ye but knew." See also the verse that follows (9:42) - "If there had been immediate gain (in sight), and the journey easy, they would (all) without doubt have followed thee, but the distance was long, (and weighed) on them" This contradicts the myth that Muslims are to fight only in self-defense, since the wording implies that battle will be waged a long distance from home (in another country and on Christian soil, in this case, according to the historians).


Quran (9:73) - "O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination." Dehumanizing those who reject Islam, by reminding Muslims that unbelievers are merely firewood for Hell, makes it easier to justify slaughter. It also explains why today's devout Muslims have little regard for those outside the faith.



Quran (9:88) - "But the Messenger, and those who believe with him, strive and fight with their wealth and their persons: for them are (all) good things: and it is they who will prosper."


Quran (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme." How does the Quran define a true believer?



Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."



Quran (17:16) - "And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction." Note that the crime is moral transgression, and the punishment is "utter destruction." (Before ordering the 9/11 attacks, Osama bin Laden first issued Americans an invitation to Islam).



Quran (18:65-81) - This parable lays the theological groundwork for honor killings, in which a family member is murdered because they brought shame to the family, either through apostasy or perceived moral indiscretion. The story (which is not found in any Jewish or Christian source) tells of Moses encountering a man with "special knowledge" who does things which don't seem to make sense on the surface, but are then justified according to later explanation. One such action is to murder a youth for no apparent reason (74). However, the wise man later explains that it was feared that the boy would "grieve" his parents by "disobedience and ingratitude." He was killed so that Allah could provide them a 'better' son. (Note: This is one reason why honor killing is sanctioned by Sharia. Reliance of the Traveler (Umdat al-Saliq) says that punishment for murder is not applicable when a parent or grandparent kills their offspring (o.1.1-2).)



Quran (21:44) - "We gave the good things of this life to these men and their fathers until the period grew long for them; See they not that We gradually reduce the land (in their control) from its outlying borders? Is it then they who will win?"



Quran (25:52) - "Therefore listen not to the Unbelievers, but strive against them with the utmost strenuousness..." "Strive against" is Jihad - obviously not in the personal context. It's also significant to point out that this is a Meccan verse.



Quran (33:60-62) - "If the hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and the alarmists in the city do not cease, We verily shall urge thee on against them, then they will be your neighbors in it but a little while. Accursed, they will be seized wherever found and slain with a (fierce) slaughter." This passage sanctions the slaughter (rendered "merciless" and "horrible murder" in other translations) against three groups: Hypocrites (Muslims who refuse to "fight in the way of Allah" (3:167) and hence don't act as Muslims should), those with "diseased hearts" (which include Jews and Christians 5:51-52), and "alarmists" or "agitators who include those who merely speak out against Islam, according to Muhammad's biographers. It is worth noting that the victims are to be sought out by Muslims, which is what today's terrorists do. If this passage is meant merely to apply to the city of Medina, then it is unclear why it is included in Allah's eternal word to Muslim generations.



Quran (47:3-4) - "Those who disbelieve follow falsehood, while those who believe follow the truth from their Lord... So, when you meet (in fight Jihad in Allah's Cause), those who disbelieve smite at their necks till when you have killed and wounded many of them, then bind a bond firmly (on them, i.e. take them as captives)... If it had been Allah's Will, He Himself could certainly have punished them (without you). But (He lets you fight), in order to test you, some with others. But those who are killed in the Way of Allah, He will never let their deeds be lost." Those who reject Allah are to be killed in Jihad. The wounded are to be held captive for ransom. The only reason Allah doesn't do the dirty work himself is to to test the faithfulness of Muslims. Those who kill pass the test.



Quran (47:35) - "Be not weary and faint-hearted, crying for peace, when ye should be uppermost (Shakir: "have the upper hand") for Allah is with you,"



Quran (48:17) - "There is no blame for the blind, nor is there blame for the lame, nor is there blame for the sick (that they go not forth to war). And whoso obeyeth Allah and His messenger, He will make him enter Gardens underneath which rivers flow; and whoso turneth back, him will He punish with a painful doom." Contemporary apologists sometimes claim that Jihad means 'spiritual struggle.' Is so, then why are the blind, lame and sick exempted? This verse also says that those who do not fight will suffer torment in hell.



Quran (48:29) - "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves" Islam is not about treating everyone equally. There are two very distinct standards that are applied based on religious status. Also the word used for 'hard' or 'ruthless' in this verse shares the same root as the word translated as 'painful' or severe' in verse 16.



Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way" Religion of Peace, indeed! The verse explicitly refers to "battle array" meaning that it is speaking of physical conflict. This is followed by (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist." (See next verse, below). Infidels who resist Islamic rule are to be fought.



Quran (61:10-12) - "O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a commerce that will save you from a painful torment. That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad ), and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwelling in Gardens of 'Adn - Eternity ['Adn (Edn) Paradise], that is indeed the great success." This verse refers to physical battle in order to make Islam victorious over other religions (see above). It uses the Arabic word, Jihad.



Quran (66:9) - "O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end." The root word of "Jihad" is used again here. The context is clearly holy war, and the scope of violence is broadened to include "hypocrites" - those who call themselves Muslims but do not act as such.

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