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[Deadman]

1060 days since massa last won a race. I wonder how long its been since a ferrari driver went that long without winning.

 

[Septimius]

Hmm. And I thought one too many springs to the head was to blame. Seems he lost it before then. Or was the Ferrari slow the prior year? I forget.

 

[Ark]

1060 days since massa last won a race. I wonder when the last time a ferrari driver went that long without winning.

Wow you're right. His last race win was in 2008?

 

[Deadman]

Yeah the last race, brazil 2008.


Also irvine went 1096 days before winning at ferrari, which is lame: i thought it would be much further ago than that.

Ill come back in 37 days.

 

[Dilly]

I can't even imagine the guy winning a race or let alone being on pole, even though I saw him lose the WC in the last turn in 2008.

He really isn't the same driver anymore.

 

[Ark]

I can't even imagine the guy winning a race or let alone being on pole, even though I saw him lose the WC in the last turn in 2008.

He really isn't the same driver anymore.

He was on an upward spiral, he almost lucked into a Championship title, but now it's all hit the shitter.

 

[NihonTiger90]

Wow you're right. His last race win was in 2008?

Well, there was that one time last year ...

 

[Ark]

Well, there was that one time last year ...

In all fairness, Fernando was quicker than him.

 

[Edmond Dantès]

He was on an upward spiral, he almost lucked into a Championship title, but now it's all hit the shitter.

Hasn't been the same since his accident, just makes me fear for Kubica's future in F1 (if he has one).

 

[Ark]

Hasn't been the same since his accident, just makes me fear for Kubica's future in F1 (if he has one).

If Kubica can come back from his incredible crash at Canada in 2007 or 2008, I have hope he'll return to form eventually.

Also, you changed your avatar! :O

 

[Edmond Dantès]

If Kubica can come back from his incredible crash at Canada in 2007 or 2008, I have hope he'll return to form eventually.

Also, you changed your avatar! :O

Edmond needs a rest for now. I suppose David with the head of Goliath by Caravaggio sort of fits The Count of Monte Cristo theme.

 

[Leunam]

Wreck in Canada -> Win the race the next year
Wreck and almost get killed -> Win the championship the next year

This is my reasoning and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Ark]

Wreck in Canada -> Win the race the next year
Wreck and almost get killed -> Win the championship the next year

This is my reasoning and I'm sticking to it.

Just like Hakinnen and Schumacher.

 

[Deadman]

http://en.espnf1.com/renault/motorsport/story/60096.html?CMP=OTC-RSS

The doctor in charge of Robert Kubica's rehabilitation says it is a "certainty" that he will return to Formula One in 2012.

"I would say with certainty that Robert will be a F1 driver in 2012," Ceccarelli told Omnicorse. "I cannot say when he will be ready but it will be between the months of November and January."

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Wreck in Canada -> Win the race the next year
Wreck and almost get killed -> Win the championship the next year

This is my reasoning and I'm sticking to it.

Kimi and Kubica in F1 in 2012 would be perfect.

 

[S. L.]

except that Kubica won't come back, who should he even race for if he miraculously returned? There is an distinctive lack of Kubica name dropping at Renault lately so that ship has sailed i'd think

 

[Chris R]

The problem is Kubica isn't winning anything with Renault if the car next year is anything like this year's car. He needs to be on one of the 4 top teams.

 

[moojito]

There'll be a spare seat at FI once di reta replaces massa at ferrari!

 

[WorriedCitizen]

I highly doubt that Kubica will come back to F1. Maybe we will see him in touring cars/DTM or something.

 

[Ark]

I highly doubt that Kubica will come back to F1. Maybe we will see him in touring cars/DTM or something.

Kubica will be back, there is no doubt about it.

If Kimi can come back, Kubica can come back.

 

[Osiris]

Although I'd hate to see it, I expect Kubica will return to only a test driver position at a top tier team for 2012, or a racing position for a mid tier team.

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Kubica will be back, there is no doubt about it.

If Kimi can come back, Kubica can come back.

I'd pick Mika as a better example of a Finn coming back to F1, especially after his crash.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

I bet Kubica will be a shadow of his old self if he does.

Real shame cos he was getting to be one of my favourite drivers.

 

[S. L.]

Although I'd hate to see it, I expect Kubica will return to only a test driver position at a top tier team for 2012, or a racing position for a mid tier team.

which team should take him?
there is a huge questionmark about his post-crash racing ability and he doesn't bring any major sponsor money either.

 

[NihonTiger90]

If Kubica comes back, I don't know if he goes to Ferrari where he will be stuck as Fernando's #2 whether he likes it or not.

The only other team that could take him that's top-tier would be Mercedes if Schumi retires. But I think they Merc may go after Sutil before Bob.

Plus, I don't know if Ferrari is going to be spooked given that Felipe hasn't been the same driver since Hungaroring.

 

[WorriedCitizen]

Kubica will be back, there is no doubt about it.

I just don't see it possible. There must be at least some sort of nerve damage, stiffness or missing muscle in his hand/arm after such a severe accident. Seeing how much buttons drivers have to use these days all with absolute precision and speed i just don't think it's realistic.

He could still be succesfull in touring cars or similar just like Nannini.

 

[mocoworm]

Kubica is a resilient guy. Remember that 200mph crash he had where there was nothing left of the car and his feet were dangling out of the front of the smashed up remains? He continued to be a great driver.

Don't write him off just yet.

 

[Ark]

If Kubica comes back, I don't know if he goes to Ferrari where he will be stuck as Fernando's #2 whether he likes it or not.

The only other team that could take him that's top-tier would be Mercedes if Schumi retires. But I think they Merc may go after Sutil before Bob.

I'm gunna go out on a whim and say that Kubica at Ferrari could only be a good thing.

Gotta remember that Fernando and Kubica are very good friends. If anything, Kubica playing 'number two' to Fernando is only going to enhance his recovery speed. Also, Ferrari might actually have a chance at winning a WCC with someone other than Massa.

 

[RomanticHeroX]

Kubica is a resilient guy. Remember that 200mph crash he had where there was nothing left of the car and his feet were dangling out of the front of the smashed up remains? He continued to be a great driver.

Don't write him off just yet.

That crash looked spectacular because the car did its job of flying the hell apart while keeping the survival cell unharmed. He suffered a very, very minor injury from it, which is a massive difference from his rallying crash. You can't point to that accident and say that he jumped back from it because, at least physically, it was a very minor accident. I think Kubica will get a chance to show what affect it's had, either through testing or a stint in a race seat, but the Ferrari talk is absolutely unreasonable. There's no way he'll be sitting in a top seat any time soon.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Kubica is a resilient guy. Remember that 200mph crash he had where there was nothing left of the car and his feet were dangling out of the front of the smashed up remains? He continued to be a great driver.

Don't write him off just yet.

Yeah but he got serious injuries from this crash. Big difference.

Edit: Bah, beaten. Too busy posting in the BF3 thread >_>

 

[Ark]

That crash looked spectacular because the car did its job of flying the hell apart while keeping the survival cell unharmed. He suffered a very, very minor injury from it, which is a massive difference from his rallying crash. You can't point to that accident and say that he jumped back from it because, at least physically, it was a very minor accident. I think Kubica will get a chance to show what affect it's had, either through testing or a stint in a race seat, but the Ferrari talk is absolutely unreasonable. There's no way he'll be sitting in a top seat any time soon.

Ferrari paying off their only WC since Schumacher for Fernando was absolutely unreasonable, but it happened.

I draw parallels between Kubica's crash and Perez's crash this year. They both noticeably suffered from their respective crashes and returned back to form in due time.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Perez was back in his car two races later. Kubica has been in serious operations and out of commission for months and months.

They're hardly comparable.

 

[Ark]

Perez was back in his car two races later. Kubica has been in serious operations and out of commission for months and months.

They're hardly comparable.

I was comparing Kubica's Canada crash, not his rallying incident.

 

[Osiris]

which team should take him?
there is a huge questionmark about his post-crash racing ability and he doesn't bring any major sponsor money either.

Williams. They need to take a punt to change their current form, couldn't attract another top tier driver and as far as I'm aware, Maldonado's sponsorship from PDVSA was for his debut season only. I also think it's highly likely 2011 could be Barrichellos last with Williams, possibly his last in F1.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Oh.

I knew that.

Hey, look over there.

 

[Ark]

Oh.

I knew that.

Hey, look over there.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone that would compare Perez's crash with almost having your hand entire severed

 

[S. L.]

Williams. They need to take a punt to change their current form, couldn't attract another top tier driver and as far as I'm aware, Maldonado's sponsorship from PDVSA was for his debut season only. I also think it's highly likely 2011 could be Barrichellos last with Williams, possibly his last in F1.

you missed the news?
Kimi to Williams seems very likely

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone that would compare Perez's crash with almost having your hand entire severed

That's why I thought it was so stupid, haha.

 

[Osiris]

you missed the news?
Kimi to Williams seems very likely

Nope, didn't miss it, Kimi/Kubi at Williams for 2012, Maldonado to Sauber, Barrichello to Goodwood Festival of Speed, with the rest of the racing relics, you heard it here first.

 

[S. L.]

Nope, didn't miss it, Kimi/Kubi at Williams for 2012, Maldonado to Sauber, Barrichello to Goodwood Festival of Speed, with the rest of the racing relics, you heard it here first.

Why would Sauber take Maldonado? Peter Sauber is fairly picky with his drivers and Koba/Perez are set for 2012 - unless Perez moves to Ferrari for Massa i don't see how that could work out.
Williams would probably rather take a "fresh" paydriver to go with Kimi and ditch Maldonado completely.

 

[Burai]

I can't even imagine the guy winning a race or let alone being on pole, even though I saw him lose the WC in the last turn in 2008.

He really isn't the same driver anymore.

I wouldn't say that. Massa was fortunate against Raikkonen because Kimi wasn't much of a team player. As such, Felipe was able to pull the team around him and push for developments to the car that suited him, even though Kimi was the better driver.

Raikkonen just wasn't what Ferrari needed to lead the team and Massa used that to his advantage.

But Alonso is the complete package and can do all of that and be ridiculously fast at the same time. As such, Massa is finding it hard as development is being pushed toward Fernando's driving style.

Massa is not really any worse than he was before. The focus is just on the other side of the garage now.

 

[Osiris]

Why would Sauber take Maldonado? Peter Sauber is fairly picky with his drivers and Koba/Perez are set for 2012 - unless Perez moves to Ferrari for Massa i don't see how that could work out.
Williams would probably rather take a "fresh" paydriver to go with Kimi and ditch Maldonado completely.

That works too, If I'm honest I can't see Maldonado with a drive in 2012 without the good sponsorship needed to be a pay drive. so if he has a drive at all I see it far down the grid, if at all, and I don't think he's shown enough rookie promise to get the kind of sponsorship he's going to need.

Of course it's all academic until we see just what Kubica is capable of in December/January, he was a rising star and really starting to shine before his crash so I can't see him without any drive at all unless the crash has utterly "Massa'd" him

 

[S. L.]

Massa gets way too much hate around here, he is a decent driver.

 

[Omiee]

I can't even imagine the guy winning a race or let alone being on pole, even though I saw him lose the WC in the last turn in 2008.

He really isn't the same driver anymore.

If that car was quick enough to get on pole or win a race, alonso would do it. No way massa has a chance at ever winning a race. Unless the first 5 drivers get in the same accident.
even than di resta, shumi and rosber would make it difficult on him.

 

[Psychotext]

Massa gets way too much hate around here, he is a decent driver.

Decent isn't good enough for F1.

 

[Edmond Dantès]

Decent isn't good enough for F1.

Indeed.

A quarter of the drivers on the F1 grid need to move on and let younger blood and non-payer drivers thrive.

 

[S. L.]

Decent isn't good enough for F1.

clearly it is, as he drives for Ferrari. Also skill wise he should be in the top half of the current driver field.

 

[Shaneus]

clearly it is, as he drives for Ferrari. Also skill wise he should be in the top half of the current driver field.

I couldn't do it off the top of my head, but I honestly feel that if I had to, I could name 12 drivers currently in the field that would be better than Massa... at least, in my opinion anyway.

Probably wrong and it'd be mostly subjective, but it would be close.

 

[S. L.]

I couldn't do it off the top of my head, but I honestly feel that if I had to, I could name 12 drivers currently in the field that would be better than Massa... at least, in my opinion anyway.

Probably wrong and it'd be mostly subjective, but it would be close.

i did it in my head, but the other way round - as in worse drivers, it is close and probably up for debate but that's how i think it is

 

[Somtaaw]

Williams would probably rather take a "fresh" paydriver to go with Kimi and ditch Maldonado completely.

what other fresh paydriver can bring 36 millon to the team?