ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
Maybe I can help you?
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Total War: Warhammer |OT| WAAAGHcraft 4
- Thread starter PeskyToaster
- Start date
Maybe I can help you?
TheDangerMan
Member
I use underway in the snow and to move through the mountains instead of around them - and be aware the Greenskins will do the same thing to bypass your defenses and hit you at the center if you aren't careful
DavionStriker
Member
So, is it just Grudgebearer who sucks with movement? I mean, he literally can move about 25% of what the orcs can do.
Assuming I buy a key from there or GMG, will I get access to the Chaos Warriors DLC?
bonesmccoy
Banned
Yes, it's available to all purchases/activations until next Tues.
TheDangerMan
Member
My recollection is that in march mode his movement speed is roughly comparable to them. Everyone moves slowly in the mountains, but in the badlands I recall having some chases with them and not being much slower. Maybe I'm remembering wrong, it certainly wasn't 25% for me though when on equal ground
This game pisses me off so much sometimes, like I wish I could take back a move command after I move and find out what I thought would work isn't going to work. Like if I move both of my armies up to the enemy I should be able to attack with both right? nope, can't do that because I'm out of range. Then next turn he attacks one of my armies that are right next to each other, I should be able to reinforce with the other one right? Nope, won't let me do that either. And then after he kills my army and I get to move the survivors away, I don't get to chose where they move to, and he gets to move right up next to them again and kill them again, and then after wards he gets to MOVE AGAIN and now he's out of range of my other army that was literally right next to the one he killed. It's fucking bullshit. and the only way to go back is to load a save which takes for fucking ever because the load times are atrocious.
I really want to like this game, but I just can't get anywhere with the orcs and I feel like it's because the game doesn't explain it's rules and the fucking dwarf dude is rediculous bullshit and can move waaaaay fuckin farther then any dwarf should be able to and he shows up with a full army attack my bases on turn 15.. like wtf am I supposed to do?
edit: I should say the entire 3 or 4 turns before this I saw him coming and positioned my big army in the city he was lookin like he was gonna attack, and made a new army so I'd have two instead of one, and then there were multiple turns in a row where I just couldn't get my both of my armies next to him able to attack without him being able to just retreat, so I chased him around for a little bit and then he went underground and way past the city I was trying to defend to attack a different city and that's when the story above happened.
I really want to like this game, but I just can't get anywhere with the orcs and I feel like it's because the game doesn't explain it's rules and the fucking dwarf dude is rediculous bullshit and can move waaaaay fuckin farther then any dwarf should be able to and he shows up with a full army attack my bases on turn 15.. like wtf am I supposed to do?
edit: I should say the entire 3 or 4 turns before this I saw him coming and positioned my big army in the city he was lookin like he was gonna attack, and made a new army so I'd have two instead of one, and then there were multiple turns in a row where I just couldn't get my both of my armies next to him able to attack without him being able to just retreat, so I chased him around for a little bit and then he went underground and way past the city I was trying to defend to attack a different city and that's when the story above happened.
I survived an Orc waaagh, but it came down to a close fight at my capital. There were 2 waaagh bosses, one level 10 and one level 9 (my 2 leaders were level 7 and level 2). You almost have to treat a waaagh like a force of nature, a tsunami that's going to destroy settlements and armies along its path.
I made an early decision after the Waaagh armies entered my territory to pull my 2 armies back to my capital, sacrificing settlements to prepare my main forces. I reinforced both armies and waited. 3 of my settlements served as speed bumps, slowing down the advance and slightly weakening the orcs. The final battle at the capital consisted of 2 large Greenskin armies vs 1 full stack dwarf army plus a large garrison. It was close going until a unit of my slayers helped kill one of their bosses. I've already destroyed all of the waaagh remnants, and have taken back 1 settlement, closing out 3 revenge grudges in the process. During one of the battles to mop of the remaining waaagh forces, my slayer king killed 550 Greenskins by himself. It was nuts.
My plan tomorrow (after work) is to take back the remaining 2 settlements, and start advancing into Greenskin territory. There are only 2 Greenskin factions left, both in the South.
I forgot to mention that I'm playing on normal...which has been challenging for me.
I made an early decision after the Waaagh armies entered my territory to pull my 2 armies back to my capital, sacrificing settlements to prepare my main forces. I reinforced both armies and waited. 3 of my settlements served as speed bumps, slowing down the advance and slightly weakening the orcs. The final battle at the capital consisted of 2 large Greenskin armies vs 1 full stack dwarf army plus a large garrison. It was close going until a unit of my slayers helped kill one of their bosses. I've already destroyed all of the waaagh remnants, and have taken back 1 settlement, closing out 3 revenge grudges in the process. During one of the battles to mop of the remaining waaagh forces, my slayer king killed 550 Greenskins by himself. It was nuts.
My plan tomorrow (after work) is to take back the remaining 2 settlements, and start advancing into Greenskin territory. There are only 2 Greenskin factions left, both in the South.
I forgot to mention that I'm playing on normal...which has been challenging for me.
It's the same as Ketch really little things like not being able to take moves back so when I move I'm always one square away from the enemy and the next turn he runs away and I'm 1 turn away again how the hell am I supposed to catch him? Also is there a quick way to see what units are strong to and what units are weak to? In the battles I seem to be having a hard time using my troops to the best of their ability. I use Cavelry from behind but I picked that up from a YouTube video I was watching.
You need to be declaring wars constantly.
I thought they'd disband, not attack me haha.
Slackbladder
Member
I'm definitely having issues with Chaos corruption leading to attrition of my armies in my territory. I mean the Chaos horde are miles away yet the corruption is already spreading everywhere at once? It may be Warhammer lore but it sucks eggs in a Total War game. But I found a mod that delays it for 150 turns. I'd prefer one that gets rid of it altogether.
The AI is going to be better at managing movement points than a human player, so you'll have to get in an agent to slow him down so you can catch him.
In some ways, what units are strong and weak to are more straightforward in this game than in others in the franchise. There are a few main categories: infantry, large, armored, flying, and ranged units. Generally, the units that have anti-large, anti-infantry, and armor piercing traits are best used against cavalry and monstrous units, infantry, and armored units respectively. Flying units should be shot at if possible, and you should always try to attack enemy units in the flank or the rear. It's most effective if you can pin them down from the front with either cheap or tough units.
Cavalry are a special case in that they have a big charge bonus so you should always be charging them into fights, engage briefly, and pull them out to charge again. When you're facing them, you should either take their charge with braced spear or halberd infantry, or charge them with your own cavalry. Letting enemy charge into cheap tarpit units like Zombies and following them up with good anti-large units is also a viable tactic.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Beat Chaos, now to crush the North and Vampire Counts.
PeskyToaster
Member
I love Vampiric Corruption. I have spawned massive rebel armies that are basically covering my borders for me.
Also I was surrounded in a quest battle and I had to sacrifice two units of graveguards and 3 skeletal swordsman as a holding force while I took out the smaller force with the artillery and wizards. The holding force lasted long enough for me to take out the force in the hill. I need a memorial to my undead for the sacrifice.
Also I was surrounded in a quest battle and I had to sacrifice two units of graveguards and 3 skeletal swordsman as a holding force while I took out the smaller force with the artillery and wizards. The holding force lasted long enough for me to take out the force in the hill. I need a memorial to my undead for the sacrifice.
Camp Freddie
Member
I'm having a lot of fun with this game, though chasing wounded armies around the map can be a massive pain.
An enemy hero can essentially solo an unwalled garrison, so I can't just leave them alone.
I'm beginning to think that I really should've got the 10% move range bonus on the Emperor.
In case it's helpful to people with little Total War experience, here is my basic strategy and tips.
Set up a wide battle line, with cheap spearmen at the front/middle.
The aim is to make your line wider than the enemy's.
When you engage, the units on the flanks will be able to envelop the enemy. Enemy units take way more damage and take massive morale penalties from being attacked on multiple sides. Swordsmen are very good for flanking, with their higher attack/charge and lower defence.
Compared to previous Total War games, the shitty basic (Empire) spearmen are not actually shit. In fact, I'm not sure it's worth upgrading them to the shielded spearmen. Their low cost and upkeep makes them incredibly useful compared to previous games' levy/militia spearmen that would rout when a knight so much as farted in their general direction.
Keep the general and some reserve infantry units just behind the line. These are used to bolster morale and plug any gaps to prevent the enemy breaking through the centre. Those cheap spearmen won't hold the line by themselves! Do not commit them too early.
Halberds are a good reserve unit that can be deployed against enemy heavy/hero troops and hold the line.
Put your ranged units just behind the battle line. If the AI is defending, you can bait them into an attack by selecting 'skirmish mode' and moving the ranged units in front of your battle line. Skirmish mode will make them automatically fall back behind your spearmen when the enemy charge them.
Cavalry should go way out on the flanks. Hang back until the enemy is fully engaged then move around to the rear to either kill their ranged units or charge the rear of the enemy battle line. I often use a cheap spear unit to defend the cavalry, since the AI will often try to send its own spears to attack them.
I never directly charge the enemy head-to-head with cavalry if I can avoid it.
Reiksguard are really good at knocking enemies over, especially unmounted enemy heroes. After knocking people down, I usually run away and prepare another charge. This can sort of 'stun-lock' an enemy unit.
Ranged cavalry can be arseholes. The best counter is your own ranged-infantry. If I see enemy ranged cavalry, I always divert my own ranged units to deal with them. Don't waste time chasing pistoleers with your heavy cavalry.
Use your own ranged cavalry as harassers, but keep them away from enemy ranged infantry. This can require quite a lot of micromanagement, so I often don't bother using them. They are theoretically a perfect counter to enemy flying units, but I've not really experienced this yet.
Use cheap spearmen to intercept the enemy heroes/cavalry/monsters/elite stuff if you can. Their job is to take one for the team and buy some time for your heavy units to countercharge/flank.
Watch where the enemy lord is. Killing him causes a massive morale penalty and can quickly cause the enemy to rout. Likewise, be careful about over-committing your Lord.
Wizards are great, but it can be hard to get them into position (e.g. you can't shoot a fireball through your own units!). As always, a unit of shitty spearmen as a bodyguard works very well.
This is just a general 'default' battle plan. It is by no means the best solution for all situations, but "most of the time it works most of the time". Do not expect your battles to be neat and organised like a battle map on a History Channel documentary. After a couple of minutes, your neat battle line will probably look like a 3-year-old's attempt to write their name. Your job is to deal with it as best you can.
Wow, this turned out to be a long post:
TL;DR - Use a fuckton of shitty spearmen to pin the enemy down. Then hit them with everything else, preferably from the side or rear. Almost all problems can be 'solved' by using some shitty spearmen as a meat-shield.
An enemy hero can essentially solo an unwalled garrison, so I can't just leave them alone.
I'm beginning to think that I really should've got the 10% move range bonus on the Emperor.
In case it's helpful to people with little Total War experience, here is my basic strategy and tips.
Set up a wide battle line, with cheap spearmen at the front/middle.
The aim is to make your line wider than the enemy's.
When you engage, the units on the flanks will be able to envelop the enemy. Enemy units take way more damage and take massive morale penalties from being attacked on multiple sides. Swordsmen are very good for flanking, with their higher attack/charge and lower defence.
Compared to previous Total War games, the shitty basic (Empire) spearmen are not actually shit. In fact, I'm not sure it's worth upgrading them to the shielded spearmen. Their low cost and upkeep makes them incredibly useful compared to previous games' levy/militia spearmen that would rout when a knight so much as farted in their general direction.
Keep the general and some reserve infantry units just behind the line. These are used to bolster morale and plug any gaps to prevent the enemy breaking through the centre. Those cheap spearmen won't hold the line by themselves! Do not commit them too early.
Halberds are a good reserve unit that can be deployed against enemy heavy/hero troops and hold the line.
Put your ranged units just behind the battle line. If the AI is defending, you can bait them into an attack by selecting 'skirmish mode' and moving the ranged units in front of your battle line. Skirmish mode will make them automatically fall back behind your spearmen when the enemy charge them.
Cavalry should go way out on the flanks. Hang back until the enemy is fully engaged then move around to the rear to either kill their ranged units or charge the rear of the enemy battle line. I often use a cheap spear unit to defend the cavalry, since the AI will often try to send its own spears to attack them.
I never directly charge the enemy head-to-head with cavalry if I can avoid it.
Reiksguard are really good at knocking enemies over, especially unmounted enemy heroes. After knocking people down, I usually run away and prepare another charge. This can sort of 'stun-lock' an enemy unit.
Ranged cavalry can be arseholes. The best counter is your own ranged-infantry. If I see enemy ranged cavalry, I always divert my own ranged units to deal with them. Don't waste time chasing pistoleers with your heavy cavalry.
Use your own ranged cavalry as harassers, but keep them away from enemy ranged infantry. This can require quite a lot of micromanagement, so I often don't bother using them. They are theoretically a perfect counter to enemy flying units, but I've not really experienced this yet.
Use cheap spearmen to intercept the enemy heroes/cavalry/monsters/elite stuff if you can. Their job is to take one for the team and buy some time for your heavy units to countercharge/flank.
Watch where the enemy lord is. Killing him causes a massive morale penalty and can quickly cause the enemy to rout. Likewise, be careful about over-committing your Lord.
Wizards are great, but it can be hard to get them into position (e.g. you can't shoot a fireball through your own units!). As always, a unit of shitty spearmen as a bodyguard works very well.
This is just a general 'default' battle plan. It is by no means the best solution for all situations, but "most of the time it works most of the time". Do not expect your battles to be neat and organised like a battle map on a History Channel documentary. After a couple of minutes, your neat battle line will probably look like a 3-year-old's attempt to write their name. Your job is to deal with it as best you can.
Wow, this turned out to be a long post:
TL;DR - Use a fuckton of shitty spearmen to pin the enemy down. Then hit them with everything else, preferably from the side or rear. Almost all problems can be 'solved' by using some shitty spearmen as a meat-shield.
PeskyToaster
Member
Missile cavalry. Ugh. No wonder it was such a pain in the ass for most of human history. I just say fuck you here's some giant flying monster.
Ordinaryundone
Member
Since you seem really knowledgeable I've got a question; as the Empire when should I be upgrading to Handgunners over Crossbows? Are they a straight upgrade or do the line of sight and friendly fire risks necessitate having some of both? I've got some of both in my army (started with Franz) and the bows usually put up better numbers, but that might just be reflectivr of the quality of infantry I'm fighting right now.
Also, as you said, Empire Spearmen are surprisingly good given their cost and upkeep. What about swordsmen? Currently they make up the bulk of my army (and do decently) but are they just a stop gap towards greatswords/halberds or do they have a place too?
Handgunners aren't a strict upgrade to Crossbowmen. The latter deal more damage and have a longer range. The main advantage of Handgunners is that they have Armor Piercing, so they're better against enemies like Chaos Warriors and Knights, but probably worse early in the game.
The main advantage of the Spearmen is that they're cheap. By themselves, they're rubbish, but they can stick around long enough to pin down enemy units for something more threatening to hit with a rear charge. Swordsmen are more expensive so they're not as good at the role. You'll probably want something harder hitting instead.
bonesmccoy
Banned
I found heavy units were mandatory for fighting the Chaos armies. The cheap spearmen were getting smashed to pieces by their heavy units.
Rygar 8 Bit
Jaguar 64-bit
shogun 2 is amazing
Aztechnology
Member
Medieval II is by far my favourite outside of this one. If you want to shake it up a bit you could try Empire or Napoleanic as they're much more ranged/cavalry focused.
Shogun 2 was also very cool, interesting units. I never played the expansion though.
Really it just depends on what era you're interested in.
Lashley
Why does he wear the mask!?
Definitely interested in Shogun.
Which ones have the best mods?
Aztechnology
Member
Medieval II did IMO. Third Age (Middle Earth Mod) is I think the best to this day.
Jibbajabbawockky
Member
Shogun 2 is great, as is the expansion, Fall of the Samurai. Probably the most well rounded modern TW game. Attila is pretty great too. Personally, I enjoy almost all of them even the ones that people consider lesser entries like Empire or Rome 2. If you're a sucker for history or historical battles you can probably find something to enjoy in most of the TW games.
rome 2
PeskyToaster
Member
Despite some rocky launches in a couple games each one is a really quality title at this point with tons of mods as well. Honestly, just pick the time period you find most interesting. I personally love Empire. It's the only one with (nearly) the entire world as the map.
I will uphold the honor of Empire until the last of my breath is spent. It's an amazing game. There's something so cool about watching your organized regiments march down the field, smoke and cannon-fire everywhere and the drums and little flute players playing their hearts out. What a crazy time.
"Oh cool horses/spiders/whateverthefuckelse. Here have some bats."
Goldfishking
Member
Finished my dwarf campaign, so that's empire and dwarfs done. Might try either VC or chaos next.
Also some of the lands you have to take in the dwarf campaign is stupid. Why would i care about the mountains in the nordland?
Also some of the lands you have to take in the dwarf campaign is stupid. Why would i care about the mountains in the nordland?
Rygar 8 Bit
Jaguar 64-bit
medieval 2 has a really cool warhammer mod lol if you want to go full circle
An easy way to know if a certain unit can beat another unit in combat is pressing (and holding) space with 1 unit selected. Above the enemy you will see a triangular icon which can be green or red. Green means that your unit will win as long as it's 1 on 1.
Lashley
Why does he wear the mask!?
And sold.
Yeah, I'm interested in Attila too
Screw it, I'm buying them all
PeskyToaster
Member
If you don't mind waiting, there have been Total War humble bundles. I think last time Attila was the 'beat the average' game but you could get every other game for like a dollar or a penny. Steam sale is also coming up so they will probably be on sale then.
Lord Phol
Member
I've never been able to get into a Total War game. Well the only one I tried was Shogun 2 and that ended in disaster. Having watched a few videos of lionheartx10s playing this got me really interested though. If I'm willing to give it some time do you think I would be able to get into this? Comparing it to Shogun 2 it looks a bit easier to get for beginners, is that correct? I think it's combination of this being warhammer related and the UI being much easier to read that makes me interested.
I figured out that I can embed heroes into my armies to reduce the odds of my lords getting assassinated by enemy heroes. They're counter-agents when embedded, I believe, in addition to providing their applicable hero bonuses.
I don't fully understand the deployment function for heroes though. Does deploying a hero in that settlement area deny enemy heroes from performing their hero actions?
I don't fully understand the deployment function for heroes though. Does deploying a hero in that settlement area deny enemy heroes from performing their hero actions?
GwyndolinCinder
Member
I'm a massive shogun 2 fan, but i'm having trouble getting into this, but its probably just because of OW.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Is Empire still broken? Either way, Napoleon is a slimmed down version of that and is a total blast with one caveat: You really need to enjoy that period to enjoy the game. I know that sounds like something that'd apply to each of the series, but the combat in Empire/Napoleon is quite streamlined due to the historical tech compared to the others. Some might find it boring - personally I loved 'living' out my childhood Horatio Hornblower/Sharpe stories.
Above all the others I'd recommend Shogun 2. Medieval 2 was awesome, but it's ten years old now and last time I played it (a couple years ago) it was really showing its age. Shogun 2 has a great blend of melee, ranged (sneaky bomb throwers were my ace in the hole) and cav.
LP, I'd say TWW is the most beginner friendly.
Above all the others I'd recommend Shogun 2. Medieval 2 was awesome, but it's ten years old now and last time I played it (a couple years ago) it was really showing its age. Shogun 2 has a great blend of melee, ranged (sneaky bomb throwers were my ace in the hole) and cav.
LP, I'd say TWW is the most beginner friendly.
PeskyToaster
Member
If you hold your mouse over the deploy button it will tell you what they do. Each one is different. Usually the effect is just inverted depending on if you deploy in a friendly vs an unfriendly area. Some agents increase income, decrease hero action %, alter the winds of magic, etc.
It's taking me a little longer than normal to get into this one, but that mostly has to do with all of the changes compared to previous TW games.
I will say that my fav is still Rome 2. I flat out hated Atilla because I do not like that time period in history.
Shogun 2 is a close second, but after uniting about half a Japan and have the rest of the factions turn against you every time, that got a little old for me fast. TWW is taking some getting used to, but this is quickly becoming one of my favorite titles so far. I suspect the expansions will only make it better as time progresses.
I will say that my fav is still Rome 2. I flat out hated Atilla because I do not like that time period in history.
Shogun 2 is a close second, but after uniting about half a Japan and have the rest of the factions turn against you every time, that got a little old for me fast. TWW is taking some getting used to, but this is quickly becoming one of my favorite titles so far. I suspect the expansions will only make it better as time progresses.
Cool, thanks. I need to make more use of my heroes.
Lashley
Why does he wear the mask!?
Aye, they're in wishlist. Waiting on a sale.
PeskyToaster
Member
I found if you like the historical period and the aesthetic, you'll love the game. If you don't, you won't be into it. I don't know much about Japanese history and I don't have a passion for it so it's probably my least played but I love ancient Rome, the Middle Ages, and the Early Modern/Imperial Age Empire takes place in so I have hundreds of hours in each of those. That's why my advice is if you enjoy the core gameplay of Total War then just pick the most intriguing time period for you. Though some do feel their age at this point. I would just play Rome II over Rome I if you're new to the series.
Goldfishking
Member
Just started a greenskin campaign and wow are they powerful. With waaghs and replenishment you just have so much momentum.
Only problem is public order (obedience) in settlements I take. Any advice to deal with this?
Only problem is public order (obedience) in settlements I take. Any advice to deal with this?