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[Vastag]

To defend them if their plan would ever backfire, that's NATO's obligation by treaty..

You should probably re-read the treaty if you think that's how it works. If a NATO member is the aggressor in a war other members are not obligated to defend it from the consequences of that aggression.

Also:

but as it stands now there is little that stops Turkey from become a member of the EU and tap into their markets as well..

I'm pretty sure that you are only taking a piss and having a laugh with your "analysis".

 

[roytheone]

Their only complications would be greece and their neighbors to the west, but as it stands now there is little that stops Turkey from become a member of the EU and tap into their markets as well.

Except that would literally implode the union? Anti eu feelings are pretty prevalent already, and a huge part of the people in the union are against erdogan. By adding a dictoral erdogan led Turkey to the union, you would just ensure many countries will follow the UK in leaving the eu.

 

[wittengstein]

Don't trust the polls mainly because they record public servants/officials as voting 'yes' while it's obvious most of the bureaucracy will vote 'no',even those with conservative tendencies.The school i'm going to be voting is right across my house and i could say the turnout will probably the highest yet(over %90 is likely).

 

[warthog]

Not much hope for this referendum. And with that, not much hope for the way Turkey is going. It's a sad situation for those Turks that want change and progress. Instead there's going to be hate and oppression.
I hope some day soon this will get turned around again in some way. This maniac spewing hate is really something the world can do without right now. There are enough of those already.

 

[KDR_11k]

To defend them if their plan would ever backfire, that's NATO's obligation by treaty.

Does the defense clause even work if you started a war of aggression and lose it?

 

[Frankfurter]

Does the defense clause even work if you started a war of aggression and lose it?

No it doesn't. Kerensky is obviously clueless.

 

[Jackpot]

Their only complications would be greece and their neighbors to the west, but as it stands now there is little that stops Turkey from become a member of the EU and tap into their markets as well.

Have you even picked up a newspaper since Yeltsin?

 

[Glasshole]

Have you even picked up a newspaper since Yeltsin?

I hear he still reads Yeltsin and thinks it's still a great newspaper.

 

[His Majesty]

It's very sad to see the majority of the Turkish community in the Benelux rally behind Erdogan.

 

[Kerensky]

Have you even picked up a newspaper since Yeltsin?

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

 

[SamVimes]

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

The EU is never gonna unanimously agree on letting a country ruled by a semi-dictator in.

 

[Maledict]

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

You appear to have not actually read the chart you just linked, which shows several areas as regressing over the past year.

Or Edrogan's campaign during this actual referendum where he talks about walking away from Europe.

It is fascinating seeing the effect that the utterly warped Russian state TV has on people.

 

[oti]

You appear to have not actually read the chart you just linked, which shows several areas as regressing over the past year.

Or Edrogan's campaign during this actual referendum where he talks about walking away from Europe.

It is fascinating seeing the effect that the utterly warped Russian state TV has on people.

I wonder if GAF got on the radar for Russian active measures once we became the fifth-biggest attributor to Hillary's campaign site.

 

[orochi91]

Erdogan is a shrewd politician, so I believe he'll win this vote; he's decimated most of the opposing political entities in Turkey.

 

[la_briola]

Casual reminder that Erdogan as President wasn't even allowed to take a public position in this referendum. But who cares about the law anyway.

Friendly reminder that he once was banned from politics for life (?).

 

[Vastag]

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

Yup, I'm sure that after looking at the wikipedia page not even one member of the union is going to block them. Also I'm sure that Erdogan's strategy right now includes a hard push to join the EU.

To be fair, I find your point of view interesting (in a somewhat voyeuristic way). Would you say that other russians share your views on how the EU and NATO work?

 

[Nivash]

I wonder if GAF got on the radar of Russians active measures once we became the fifth-biggest attributor to Hillary's campaign site.

I don't think that's really the case. I'm pretty sure that the posters that are speaking from the alternative worldview pushed by Russia are genuine, they're just proof of how increasingly influential that view is getting.

Erdogan is a shrewd politician, so I believe he'll win this vote; he's decimated most of the opposing political entities in Turkey.

With how much Erdogan is invested in the vote, I'm worried that it's not going to be fair. I've already read accounts from the Turkish opposition that they're worried that the entire referendum is actually a ploy to single them out to future repression. That, alone, could result in severe voter intimidation.

 

[Kerensky]

The statement about walking away from europe is linked to the narrative that the EU needs Turkey more than the other way around, which is open for debate.
The reason he is saying this more has something to do with the way the (middle) east sees a leader.

Whereas in the west a leader should be considered compassionate and educated. Old Soviet countries and middle eastern ones prefer a person who is clever, and (more importantly) strong. If Erdogan doesn't look strong he'll loose his grip on the party and the people.
For this reason he's compelled to make statements like "Merkel is weak, i've got her under control" or "Putin is a coward he would never answer us downing his jet with violence!".

It's because he needs to sound in control of the situation!

 

[paradise_circus]

Yup, I'm sure that after looking at the wikipedia page not even one member of the union is going to block them. Also I'm sure that Erdogan's strategy right now includes a hard push to join the EU.

To be fair, I find your point of view interesting (in a somewhat voyeuristic way). Would you say that other russians share your views on how the EU and NATO work?

Many many turks have no idea what the separation of powers is or what fascism really is. Hence they don't actually know how what the EU or NATO is. At least that's my impression. I also blame this on the political parties before the AKP. To teach you how one single man build a country and raising him to a godlike person and also calling him the father of all turks is bullshit. They lived lived rather democratically only in the periods of the AKP and Erdogan is going ape shit now.

 

[KDR_11k]

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

Sorry... One moment... Gotta stop laughing...

There's a list of requirements that Turkey would need to meet (human rights, democracy, press freedom, etc). They're going backwards on that. So far that they couldn't even get the visa deal.

 

[ClosingADoor]

There is little doubt that negotiations *are* progressing, sooner or later the EU cannot keep ignoring them when they have a strong influence in the mass immigration deals. This and their citizens have established political blocs in their member states.

Even if they would meet the requirements to join, which they don't and won't for a long time, every EU member has a veto and it is political suicide to let Turkey join for the foreseeable future. It's not happening and all talk about it is just aimed to cause fear and distrust in the EU.

 

[Vastag]

I would really like to know how the turkish gaf members see this referendum, how do you think that the result is going to affect you?

 

[The Albatross]

Good luck Turkish GAF.

American Turkish friends of mine who can still vote in Turkish elections are doing so in Boston, voting against Erdogan.

 

[Harmen]

Good luck Turkey, I hope you don't vote for one step closer to a dictatorship, because I'd say historic precedent gives of a clear signal that does not work out well for a nation.

 

[sechsterangriff]

Good luck Turkish GAF! These are indeed dark times

 

[warthog]

It's very sad to see the majority of the Turkish community in the Benelux rally behind Erdogan.

This is worrisome if true.

 

[Funyarinpa]

I would really like to know how the turkish gaf members see this referendum, how do you think that the result is going to affect you?

If (when) the Yes vote wins, we're going to stray even farther from democracy. Radicalisation and Islamism will take hold, Atatürk's values and secularism will be lost in religious and ultranationalist fervor.

 

[Kerensky]

This is worrisome if true.

This is sadly true, it's often the 2nd and 3rd generation turkish/benelux people that hold the most fanatical devotion to him, parties like DENK are a logical consequence.

 

[E-phonk]

For what it's worth, i saw a few turkish friends (in Belgium) linking to articles that argument against voting yes.

I do think they are often less vocal about it out of fear of repercussions when they want to visit turkey in the near future.

Also, some turkish protestsongs fit in a thread like this no?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJYRbqASlkM

 

[His Majesty]

This is worrisome if true.

http://vkplusmobilebackend.persgroe...bd6-bc0b-4802-8d16-eff4ffeba3a3.1492345804964

Poll carried out by Ipsos for the Dutch paper 'de Volkskrant' after the diplomatic hostilities between The Netherlands and Turkey last month.

63% of Turkish Dutch citizens mostly agree or agree completely with Erdogan's politics.

Meanwhile in Belgium 68% of Flemish Turks voted for AKP back in november 2015.

http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20170313_02778810

 

[DJKhaled]

I'm just so confused how turkey went from a great example of a secular modern Muslim majority country to what's happening now. What caused this?

 

[ClosingADoor]

http://vkplusmobilebackend.persgroe...bd6-bc0b-4802-8d16-eff4ffeba3a3.1492345804964

Poll carried out by Ipsos for the Dutch paper 'de Volkskrant' after the diplomatic hostilities between The Netherlands and Turkey last month.

63% of Turkish Dutch citizens mostly agree or agree completely with Erdogan's politics.

Easier to agree when you only see the propaganda and don't have to live under it I guess. Hope the Turks in Turkey manage to get rid of Erdogan sooner rather then later.

 

[Diancecht]

Just smashed my vote. I live in one of the elite neighborhoods so the turnouts are usually a bit low compared to the poorer neighborhoods but there were A LOT of people where I was voting. I hope we can get the result we deserve. Voting ends in 2 hours, we'll probably see the final results around 10PM (8PM CET).

 

[dakun]

seeing quite a few videos of voter fraud that look pretty convincing. All Yes votes.

 

[Stereogatari]

seeing quite a few videos of voter fraud that look pretty convincing. All Yes votes.

No video of them going in the ballot boxes though. Just could be shit stirring videos.

 

[Soph]

Good luck Turkey, you'll need it.

Vote Yok!

 

[Pomerlaw]

You get offered a choice to being fucked or not and you choose yes.

Just sad really.

 

[dakun]

No video of them going in the ballot boxes though. Just could be shit stirring videos.

that's true

 

[Stinkles]

Just smashed my vote. I live in one of the elite neighborhoods so the turnouts are usually a bit low compared to the poorer neighborhoods but there were A LOT of people where I was voting. I hope we can get the result we deserve. Voting ends in 2 hours, we'll probably see the final results around 10PM (8PM CET).

Good luck.

 

[Kiraly]

It's very sad to see the majority of the Turkish community in the Benelux rally behind Erdogan.

That is what propaganda and fake patriotism for a country they have never truly known does to you.

 

[Funyarinpa]

Ballots are closed. We're now in the tallying phase. 21.8% of votes have been counted so far but no other statistics yet.

By the way, some legal body whose name I can't translate apparently claims that the ballots won't be voided even if they don't have the government-approved stamp on them. Which means that unless definitively proven otherwise, you can just add non-approved ballots into the mix. What the actual fuck. (CNN Turk is my source)

 

[Funyarinpa]

Most of the 25 percent of votes opened so far are from the Eastern, rural and Pro-Erdogan parts of the country.

First starts are in and its in favor of Yes at 63.2%/36.8%

But apparently there's very little tallied from most big cities (I think they just said that Istanbul is around 1 percent)

 

[dakun]

Ballots are closed. We're now in the tallying phase. 21.8% of votes have been counted so far but no other statistics yet.

By the way, some legal body whose name I can't translate apparently claims that the ballots won't be voided even if they don't have the government-approved stamp on them. Which means that unless definitively proven otherwise, you can just add non-approved ballots into the mix. What the actual fuck. (CNN Turk is my source)

apparently some voting observers weren't allowed into the voting stations. Multiple reports.

This is shaping up to be exactly what i expected.

 

[Funyarinpa]

29 percent open/ 62.2 favoring Yes

 

[Stinkles]

apparently some voting observers weren't allowed into the voting stations. Multiple reports.

This is shaping up to be exactly what i expected.

"those reports are just from shit-stirrers"

"Gulenists spreading falsehoods"

 

[HaloRose]

If Erdogan has won the people of turkey won't realise what they've done to late anyway good luck.

 

[Facism]

This is going to end up as Yes and we'll all suffer for it.

 

[Acorn]

"those reports are just from shit-stirrers"

"Gulenists spreading falsehoods"

"Very fake news"

 

[Funyarinpa]

34 percent open, 60.8 favoring Yes

 

[kess]

Istanbul voting yes with 10% in is not a good sign.