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UK PoliGAF: General election thread of LibCon Coalitionage

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Chinner

Banned
So with all the polls out, it shows that Clegg gets the victory, with Cameron shortly behind and Brown lagging off in the distance. Still, seeing as the difference between Clegg and Cameron is so little, due to margin of error it's probably best to assume that they're on a equal footing.

The actual polls over the next few days will give us better insight.

In other news, the Clegg smear campaign looks to be coordinated by team Cameron:
http://www.libdemvoice.org/telegrap...ehind-get-clegg-newspaper-campaign-19078.html
 

Linkified

Member
brain_stew said:
No its really not.

Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?
 

wave dial

Completely unable to understand satire
Linkified said:
Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?
Except that example doesn't exist.

And Murdoch does this same exact thing to the US and Australia as well.
 

bishoptl

Banstick Emeritus
Linkified said:
Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?
Instead of wasting our time with what-ifs, let's deal with what is, shall we?
 

Chinner

Banned
Linkified said:
Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?
You do understand that one man owning such a large percentage of the media around the world is a bad thing, right?
 
brain_stew said:
No its really not.

Oh come on. It's not manufacturing consent when the targeted consumers are literally too fucking stupid to viably think for themselves in the first place. He's doing everyone a public service don't you see?
 

Kowak

Banned
having a media empire keeps getting berlusconi elected

i keep voting for him because its cool to have a prime minister who runs a football club and fun to watch Italy from afar
 

defel

Member
Chinner said:
You do understand that one man owning such a large percentage of the media around the world is a bad thing, right?

Of course its a bad thing but there must be some balance. Just because Murdoch owns Sky and The Times it does not mean that every single headline, every single story, every single word has been smeared with the Murdoch brush. Foxnews, Murdoch's crown jewel, is an idealogical news television station but they have plenty of very intelligent commentators making genuine, legitimate political points. (let me make it clear that for the most part I think Fox News is an awful organisation yet they have some very insightful political commentary). SkyNews and the Times are nowhere near as bad as Foxnews but its unfair to tar anything coming out of the Newscorp organisation with the same "oh thats Murdoch its not worth listening to that, its not a credible point of view".
The smear attacks against the LibDems yesterday were needy and pathetic but I think the voting public are intelligent enough to see through it. The most dangerous weapon in Newscorps arsenal is The Sun because its readership are, how can I say it...."less intelligent", "more misinformed" than the rest of the public.
 

industrian

will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
Kowak said:
having a media empire keeps getting berlusconi elected

i keep voting for him because its cool to have a prime minister who runs a football club and fun to watch Italy from afar

That and he's got good hair of course.
 

Ashes

Banned
"Right-wing media bosses invaded the Independent’s offices after the newspaper attacked David Cameron’s backroom deal with US-based mogul Rupert Murdoch..."
Murdoch Jnr, 37, who runs Sky TV and his dad’s right-wing papers The Sun and The Times, accused Kelner of “impugning our family name” and shouted: “you’re a f****** f***wit.”
"They also ranted about online Indie ads which said: “A few people count too much. Rupert Murdoch controls 40% of the Press in Britain. On May 6 he will throw the weight of the country’s two biggest newspapers behind one party.”
independent-268415925.jpg

Read more at the source: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...independent-newspaper-office-115875-22205306/
:lol :lol
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
Poll round-up of the major polling organisations:

Times/Populus – Clegg and Cameron joint winners
Clegg: 36%
Cameron: 36%
Brown: 27%

Guardian/ICM – Clegg won
Clegg: 33%
Cameron: 29%
Brown: 29%

ITV/ComRes – Clegg won
Clegg: 33%
Brown: 30%
Cameron: 30%

Angus Reid – Clegg won
Clegg: 35%
Cameron: 33%
Brown: 23%

YouGov – Cameron won
Cameron: 36%
Clegg: 32%
Brown: 29%

-

Average:
Clegg: 33.8%
Cameron: 32.8%
Brown: 27.6%
 

Acheteedo

Member
Ashes1396 said:
"Right-wing media bosses invaded the Independent’s offices after the newspaper attacked David Cameron’s backroom deal with US-based mogul Rupert Murdoch..."
Murdoch Jnr, 37, who runs Sky TV and his dad’s right-wing papers The Sun and The Times, accused Kelner of “impugning our family name” and shouted: “you’re a f****** f***wit.”
"They also ranted about online Indie ads which said: “A few people count too much. Rupert Murdoch controls 40% of the Press in Britain. On May 6 he will throw the weight of the country’s two biggest newspapers behind one party.”
independent-268415925.jpg

Read more at the source: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...independent-newspaper-office-115875-22205306/
:lol :lol

"Rupert Murdoch, 79, agreed to support Mr Cameron last September on the condition he dismantles parts of the BBC and scraps TV watchdog Ofcom if he reaches No10."

The fuck? Did this really happen??
 
Acheteedo said:
"Rupert Murdoch, 79, agreed to support Mr Cameron last September on the condition he dismantles parts of the BBC and scraps TV watchdog Ofcom if he reaches No10."

The fuck? Did this really happen??

Its not the first source to report it. Wouldn't surprise me at all if its real.

Edit: Thought you were referring to the row, as for the BBC bit, it'd hardly be setting a precedent.
 

Kowak

Banned
Acheteedo said:
"Rupert Murdoch, 79, agreed to support Mr Cameron last September on the condition he dismantles parts of the BBC and scraps TV watchdog Ofcom if he reaches No10."

The fuck? Did this really happen??

Well vote for him and see if those events happen. I am sure he would likely keep a promise to Murdoch then he would voters.
 

Acheteedo

Member
Then again, the mirror are also claiming this:

"David Cameron was on the ropes last night after he again trailed in third in the party leaders’ debate.

Early polls indicated that Mr Clegg won the debate, with Mr Brown close behind. The PM set the tone for a confident performance when he said: “I am the man who can take Britain forward.” "
 
Acheteedo said:
Then again, the mirror are also claiming this:

"David Cameron was on the ropes last night after he again trailed in third in the party leaders’ debate.

Early polls indicated that Mr Clegg won the debate, with Mr Brown close behind. The PM set the tone for a confident performance when he said: “I am the man who can take Britain forward.” "

Well there's nothing false with that statement. He was close behind in all polls, doesn't mean that he was 2nd though despite implying it. All three party leaders polled quite closely.
 

Acheteedo

Member
brain_stew said:
Well there's nothing false with that statement. He was close behind in all polls, doesn't mean that he was 2nd though despite implying it. All three party leaders polled quite closely.

They specifically state that Cameron was in third, which wasn't the case in ANY polls. Brown was third or tied third for every one.
 

Ashes

Banned
Whilst the bias claims are true, the poll the Mirror is reffering to does exist. The article above doesn't really refer to debates I think.
@dark machines: Where is that from? :lol :lol :lol awesome even if it isn't true.
 

Kowak

Banned
Dark Machine said:
BREAKING NEWS!

CAMERON DEBATE PLAN FOUND IN BACK OF BRISTOL CAB!

sometimes people try too hard, but this isnt one of them

great work

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
 
I'll give a shiny penny to whoever guesses which tabloid newspaper has this on their main page?

suncunts.jpg


Note regarding the shiny penny: offer will not be honoured.
 

Ashes

Banned
I'll rule myself out. Out of fairness for others.
The Sun. Obviously. The other red top tabloid is a die hard Labour supporter
 
God damn, fuck Rupert Murdoch. Adam Boulton chipping in with "you're on the front of the telegraph today, Mr Clegg" was completely unwarranted, partisan and broke from the structure of debates that previously kept them reasonably civil and engaging. Sky SHOULD NOT be trusted with these debates next time around.

If Cameron DOES dismantle part of the BBC and abolish OFCOM - Murdoch will have less competition and less to stop his lies - Sky News will become a full blown Fox News propagandizing nightmare before we know it.

As for the debate, someone else summed it up best on the BBC website:

Brown: Everything will be terrible unless you vote for me!

Cameron: Everything will be terrible if you vote for Nick!

Nick: This is what I'm going to do to make things better....


Cameron, like his shit-rag Tory friends in fleet street, was in full-on smear mode. Getting on his high horse about leaflets had nothing to do with foreign policy and home affairs. It was clearly scripted into his performance to try and smear Labour as relying on dirty politics, something which the electorate would no-doubt easily believe. He tried to paint everything Gordon Brown said about him as 'fear-politics' and scaremongering -- all the while, scaremongering himself over the prospect of a hung parliament and what a vote for Nick Clegg would mean. In that sense, Cameron was absolutely terrible, but I fear he was much more nuanced this time and will have reached a lot of people.

Brown performed very well when talking about the war in Afghanistan, and talking about the kinds of social reform that Labour are interested in. I would have thought the war would be a weak point for Labour, but Brown just clearly knows what he's talking about more than the other two on that particular subject. One thing I think it was right for Nick Clegg to get in on his opening speech though was that we should not have went to war with Iraq. That was clever... his party was the only party opposed, its something that many people still feel strongly about, and the opening speeches have been getting lots of replay on the news.

Lib Dems are still favourite to win Bath, so I'm still voting for Lib Dems. I hope voters in marginal Lib-Dem/Tory seats do the same! The people want either a hung parliament or a surprise victory for the underdog -- the promise of something exciting and new... not more of the same. I hope thats what we get.
 
Mama Robotnik said:
I'll give a shiny penny to whoever guesses which tabloid newspaper has this on their main page?

suncunts.jpg


Note regarding the shiny penny: offer will not be honoured.

Oh jolly gosh, could it be... The Sun.
 
Linkified said:
Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?

I don't understand. Are you trying to say Murdoch is a pro Tory business man? He may well be. I'm not sure and to be honest it's not really relevant or important. Let's not forget the Sun backed Tony Blair in '97 and by all accounts Rebekah Wade had a tough time persuading him not to back Brown (which I gather is the reason for her slightly unhinged behaviour)

No, I don't loathe Murdoch because he's conservative (if he even is). It's rather because he's a shameless, lying, manipulative sack of shit whose only real concern is the expansion of hiis own empire. His support is for sale. Thatcher bought it, Blair bought it and now Cameron's buying it.

So you can think that Murdoch and his media outlets hold similar ideological views to yourself, but you're wrong. The instant those views become a liability, as soon as their political stance stands in the way of his financial interests, he'll abandon them.

So no, it wouldn't change my opinion of him or his papers if they were pro Lib Dem (it would change how I felt about the Lib Dems though). As far as his personal politics, you'd first have to convince me that he actually has any principles. Let's not forget (or if you didn't know, let me tell you) that Murdoch used to be opposed to totalitarianism until the Chinese government banned ownership of satellite dishes. Then he suddenly developed an affinity for totalitarian regimes. He also realised that the BBC didn't necessarily need to be broadcast into China. So yeah, he loves free speech too. Right up to the point that it actually costs him anything.
 

Omikaru

Member
Linkified said:
Right this isn't just for you put let say a pro liberal democrat billionaire had there very own media empire and were being pro Lib Dem, would you still feel the same way as with Murdoch?
Stop arguing on conjecture and things which aren't fact. We can use what-if politics as much as we want, but saying it isn't going to make it true, and I don't see what you're trying to argue here.

The fact is that the Conservative Party has a shamelessly biased rightwing press empire backing it, using dirty smears and tricks -- which in turn are briefed to them by the party -- to have their own way. If the Liberal Democrats had such an arm which acted in the way the rightwing press did yesterday, a lot of the integrity that they claim to have would be decimated. They'd be just like David Cameron.

As for the debates, I've had a night to stew on them and really think about it. The impression I got in the end was that all three of them were ignoring each other and just spewing the party line. It didn't help that many of the questions were the same as last week. Also, there were a number of hypocrisies that all three made at one point or another, which neither of the other two siezed on.

I'm still supporting Clegg because I know where my politics firmly stand, and his views are most in line to bring about the change I want. But if I was a floating voter I'd have got nothing from last night's atrocious debate.

Sky were atrocious (and should be penalised in future elections for their conduct last night), as were the candidates. David Cameron just copied the presentation aspects of Clegg's performance last week, whilst spinning nonsense and PR from his mouth, Brown was just plain useless and has proven he is incapable of running the country (as if the last three years weren't enough proof of that) and Clegg, obviously rattled by yesterday's smears, talked too fast, skipped points too quickly (he should've attacked the smears head on when they were brought up) and sounded like a parrot due to the lines of questioning being the same as last week. He should've prepared a different, if similar, answer to the same questions instead of repeating last week's slogans. At the very least he could've brought up that the question was asked last week before answering, as when he did in one instance, his samey answer had more vigour and conviction, rather than looking like mere propaganda repeated in a commercial.

Thankfully only four million people saw that shambolic debate last night.
 

iapetus

Scary Euro Man
Intriguing:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...that-showed-support-for-lib-dems-1951940.html

YouGov also found that if people thought Mr Clegg's party had a significant chance of winning the election, it would win 49 per cent of the votes, with the Tories winning 25 per cent and Labour just 19 per cent. One in four people Labour and one in six Tory supporters say they would switch to the Liberal Democrats in these circumstances.

On a uniform swing across Britain, that would give the Liberal Democrats 548 MPs, Labour 41 and the Tories 25.
 
Omikaru said:
Why is there even a camera trained on his notes? Is that another dodgy Sky News thing?:lol

Given there was nothing behind the PM but a TV-set I'd say yes.

Sky should be completely ruled out of participating in this in future. Its ridiculous!
 

Omikaru

Member
radioheadrule83 said:
Given there was nothing behind the PM but a TV-set I'd say yes.

Sky should be completely ruled out of participating in this in future. Its ridiculous!
In fairness, it was Sky News that got the debates going in the first place. They probably thought it'd bury Gordon for good. Instead, it's become the catalyst for "Cleggmania", effectively replacing an easy target for the Tories with a much harder one.

But yes, after yesterday's shambolic performance by Sky, I'd be surprised if Labour or the LibDems agree to let them host a debate again.

Marina Hyde (an exceptional writer, if I do say so myself) of the Guardian has written quite a funny piece about the spin room that Sky created.
 

NekoFever

Member
Mr Griffin wraps up by saying the BNP does not need the media any more and that they can communicate with the public via their website. He departs with St George, while Mr Darby says they will conduct interviews for TV shortly.
:lol
 
It's really kind of scary how the Fox News way media approach can spread across the rest of the world, because the owner of it is so rich and powerful he simply buys himself into the markets and changes the rules and landscape. I simply do not have enough faith in humanity to rest assured that blatant lies, slandering and manipulation won't work. Even if they only reach the 30% stupidest an craziest people in a country, it's enough the completely change politics and society. Uuuuh!

The moment his News Corp empire sets foot on European continental ground, I'm going to freak out.
(He already is in Italy :-| )
 

Empty

Member
Omikaru said:
Marina Hyde (an exceptional writer, if I do say so myself) of the Guardian has written quite a funny piece about the spin room that Sky created.

She's great, but that piece is above and beyond even her high standard. Lines like "Behold, the cream of Britain's arseoisie", and "It was like watching the live abortion of democracy" had me rolling.
 

iapetus

Scary Euro Man
painey said:
Nick Griffin being led out by St George :lol :lol :lol

Was it a historically accurate St George? (You know, dark-skinned Roman soldier of Middle Eastern extraction, never paid taxes in England - exactly the sort of person Griffin wants out of the country...)
 

Ventron

Member
wave dial said:
Except that example doesn't exist.

And Murdoch does this same exact thing to the US and Australia as well.

Careful on this one. All the Murdoch press gave humungous front-page endorsements to our left-wing Labor party (yes, we spell it that way) at the last federal election.
 
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