sixteen-bit
Member
Justion Wong is a nobody living off the success of his cousin.
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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT| of 9 Years Urley
- Thread starter enzo_gt
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Parallax Scroll
Banned
There's trolling, and then there's saying stuff that's just plain stupid.
Professor Beef
Banned
You think Justion could take his cousin?
Wait, who? Dementia or Nils? I can't see this plain stupid stuff you're talking about. D:
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Just wondering - do any of you guys think any character might unjustifiably be nerfed?
I have this inkling concern that for some reason capcom japan is going to further nerf Dante, just due to his popularity.
And of course : Online Popularity =/= Competitive functionality
I have this inkling concern that for some reason capcom japan is going to further nerf Dante, just due to his popularity.
And of course : Online Popularity =/= Competitive functionality
I'm already sure Phoenix Wright is gonna get the hammer slammed down. :-(
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Why is that? He hasn't had any tournament presence...and is he a popular character online?
Thanks for the responses on Best Rider (savior of UMvC3), guys. Think I'll stick with the Hellfire assist for now since this team can't really zone.
(your head)
----------------> (joke)
(your head)
D
Deleted member 13876
Unconfirmed Member
Dick Rider > St. Rider > Ghost Rider
SolarPowered
Member
I got a sneak peek at the patch, turns out they removed Iron Man's single jump. The jump was far too good they said, so it had to be removed.
Dante is right now safe from nerfs IMO. Not a big enough online presence, not a big enough tournament presence, not many results in his favor as of yet. Unless it's a change to fix his QS glitch which I don't know if it's still in or not.
I think there are some hints at a Phoenix Wright nerf. Fubar in the SRK comments of the patch news responded to some guy's Phoenix Wright comment. My guess is that they might change his invincible assists. In any case if PW gets nerfed that is completely unjustified.
Sentinel is a candidate simply because he is still popular. Capcom just doesn't seem to like assist characters in this game.
Wesker might get nerfed... I am just afraid he will get some unjustified, over the top nerfs like reducing his health to 800K and removing teleports after gun or some shit.
Firebrand and Nova might be candidates for nerfs on their XF loops although to be honest Capcom doesn't seem too bothered with XF loops.
Strider is a candidate thanks to wall cling glitches. They might have to change something on him and it might end up being a nerf.
Hulk if the option select stream is any indication might get his corner infinite removed which would require nerfs on his Gamma Charge H's or Gamma Wave.
If Zero gets nerfed it wouldn't be unjustified unless it's something extremely drastic like taking out Buster cancel completely.
If Capcom discovered the Vergil lock down technology before hand... they might nerf him prematurely although judging from the already various limiters they have put on the character my guess is that it's how he was intended to be played so he's going to be safe.
Spencer getting Wire grapple fixed wouldn't be unjustified.
I don't foresee anything outside of these changes barring random glitches/bugs. If anyone is going to get nerfed, Wesker is at the top of the list. Capcom listens to a vocal majority and the majority seems to think Wesker is OP. This includes the online community and the people at CU who usually scream the loudest. Most professionals think Wesker is fine but the glasses needed to be fixed/removed to reduce brain dead anchor Wesker play and promote smarter point Wesker play.
JeTmAn81
Member
I have to agree. Also, She-Hulk. Up until recently I would've said Haggar as well, but then I saw Bum play and realized how godlike his new OTG move allows him to be on point. Full combo from any throw for a grappler? Fugheddaboutit.
Professor Beef
Banned
Yup. Besides, people normally can't jump in a suit of iron anyways. Far too unrealistic.
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
That combo Tokido was doing with his sparring partner was pretty stylish. How badly does Hidden Missiles scale combos? Attraction, hidden missiles, hypergrav, looks fun to play around with.
Karsticles
Member
In practice, Wesker has the best command throw in this game.
For a command throw to be good, it must:
1) Lead to big damage.
2) Be in use by a character that finds it easy to be in the command throw position.
3) Have the option of being 1 frame.
So, yes, Morrigan has a 1-frame command throw, and it's pretty easy to get it off, but she can only get a Shadow Servant off of it. Wesker gets full combos off of his command throw, and it's not even difficult.
Yes, Thor's Mighty Hurricane is really nasty, but Thor is really slow and has to work to get in, and players generally want to chicken block him because it's hard to pull off his command throw well in the air, and his air throw doesn't lead to anything without an OTG assist, and even that is touchy.
Yes, Nemesis has some of the best command throws in this game, but his fastest command throw is <i>seven</i> frames, which pretty much guarantees you're only going to be using them predictively. His anti-air throws both have a massive 20 frame startup.
Yeah, Wesker's glasses buff was dumb, but that's not the real problem. Watching this last weekend's Bar Fights, we got to watch Viscant command throw his opponent around like a rag doll because Wesker is really fast and has huge priority normals, so you have to respect him up close, and then he gets free command grabs. Unlike Thor, there's no point in chicken blocking him, either. So why does a character have all of the most desirable traits wrapped into one, unblockable move, and is also the best teleporter with some of the best normals in the game?
For a command throw to be good, it must:
1) Lead to big damage.
2) Be in use by a character that finds it easy to be in the command throw position.
3) Have the option of being 1 frame.
So, yes, Morrigan has a 1-frame command throw, and it's pretty easy to get it off, but she can only get a Shadow Servant off of it. Wesker gets full combos off of his command throw, and it's not even difficult.
Yes, Thor's Mighty Hurricane is really nasty, but Thor is really slow and has to work to get in, and players generally want to chicken block him because it's hard to pull off his command throw well in the air, and his air throw doesn't lead to anything without an OTG assist, and even that is touchy.
Yes, Nemesis has some of the best command throws in this game, but his fastest command throw is <i>seven</i> frames, which pretty much guarantees you're only going to be using them predictively. His anti-air throws both have a massive 20 frame startup.
Yeah, Wesker's glasses buff was dumb, but that's not the real problem. Watching this last weekend's Bar Fights, we got to watch Viscant command throw his opponent around like a rag doll because Wesker is really fast and has huge priority normals, so you have to respect him up close, and then he gets free command grabs. Unlike Thor, there's no point in chicken blocking him, either. So why does a character have all of the most desirable traits wrapped into one, unblockable move, and is also the best teleporter with some of the best normals in the game?
SolarPowered
Member
For the lulz bro. It's not like Wesker is the only character with this jack of all trades design. Capcom decided they wanted characters their team could have fun making for fans and they let their imaginations run wild.
Felicia has the best command throw in the game because her range is better than Wesker's. She can also get within that command range fairly easily and has more moves than Wesker to negate advancing guard safely (Wesker has to teleport and that's not safe in most cases).
Chicken blocking isn't advised against Thor, his range on his command throws in the air have improved. You want to always push block Thor or out prioritize him with better normals.
The rest I don't deny. Wesker is a powerful character, his command throw being one of the reasons why he will always be up there.
Chicken blocking isn't advised against Thor, his range on his command throws in the air have improved. You want to always push block Thor or out prioritize him with better normals.
The rest I don't deny. Wesker is a powerful character, his command throw being one of the reasons why he will always be up there.
not sure how Mike "the boss" Ross drops a Sent combo.
Dartastic vs Spindashing fried chicken grudge match stream is tonight for anyone interested in some GAF FG action.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=452880
Starts at 7pm. Link in thread.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=452880
Starts at 7pm. Link in thread.
Everyone should go into training room, pick Spider-Man, and pick Magneto as their opponent. Once you get in game, do a Spider Sting L immediately. Restart and back up if you have to, or just input the DP motion during the restart. You'll know what I'm talking about when you see it...
I swear, I find the weirdest shit in this game.
Basically, Spider Sting's hitbox grows at the very last active frame and hits Magneto despite whiffing the entire first part of the move. It's really weird looking. And more reason for me to call this game "Hitboxes: The Game"
I swear, I find the weirdest shit in this game.
Karsticles
Member
Range matters less when you have one of the best dashes in the game. It's much, much harder for Felicia to get in than Wesker, and you know that. I can still chip Felicia from 100 to 0, because she simply has no teleport. The only thing she can do is cower in the corner like a kitten. Wesker just laughs at my zoning attempts. I always have to rush him, and he doesn't even need to think about how to beat mine.
I'm not saying that you should jump up-back over and over, but if Thor is next to me, you bet your ass I'll be jumping up-back instead of staying on the ground like a fool if he has frame advantage.
I think he shouldn't have it at all.
Other than the glasses and random cross ups, Wesker is fine...BUT, I think he's fucking broken with a command throw. Karsticles is right. The motherfucker is easily the best grappler in the game. And one of the best zoners. And one of the best rush down characters. With above average health. I say ax the command throw or absolutely no combo off of it.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
Yipes is the best. Pretty funny clip.
Perhaps no Marvel tonight.
AE 2012 is here so we all going in.
http://www.twitch.tv/kadeybaybe#
Some spots left. EMP Hiro is in the lobby actually.
AE 2012 is here so we all going in.
http://www.twitch.tv/kadeybaybe#
Some spots left. EMP Hiro is in the lobby actually.
Felicia's dash is good and now you are just talking about a particular match up. Felicia can get in against a majority of characters by just using air Delta Kick or Cat Spike or Rolling Buckler or whatever. Besides I was strictly talking about strength of command grab. if you want to bring match ups, Felicia might lose to Dorm but she wins against Wesker because she by passes his gun shenanigans and Wesker can't do shit about her approaches. Hence that's a battle where her superior command throw will win out.
It's like saying Magneto has the best normals out of the tri-dashing cast when that's not true... Iron Man's are better. But since they are attached to a faster/better character, no one disputes it. I am just giving credit where it's due... if Wesker/Felicia where equal characters except for their command throws Felicia would obviously have the better command throw.
My opinion on 1 frame command throws is that they lead into some genuine bull shit in the game. Like buffered punishments or negating XFC completely or in Wesker's case he can actually punish you for attempting to punish his launcher. They shouldn't be on any character and should be capped at 4-5 frames minimum. That way if you know a command throw is coming you can actually jump out of it. No one is using it but Wesker's karas are so scary that he can literally frame trap you trying to jump out of the way to avoid the command throw and you get clipped instead because you jumped within the 4 frame jump window but he got you with a button or throw within that time frame. It was happening at NEC quite a bit even though the Wesker players weren't even going for command throws (it was the scare of the command throw that got people clipped).
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
The only zoning that consistently gives Felicia trouble is the type that comes from the opposite upper corner of the screen (e.g. Trish). Coincidentally, this is also the same type of situation that Viscant thinks Wesker can't do anything about either.
Also I am bored of Wesker talk in this thread.
My final contribution to Wesker discussion is that his normals are much better than most people think (practically speaking they are like a short sword). I was trying out some Vergil footsies against Wesker and two of Vergil's BEST normals (st.L and cr.L) Wesker can beat them easily. St.L is beat by a well placed cr.M and cr.L is "crushed" by st.H at proper spacing. Of course neither of these buttons are "sword" normals from Vergil but they are his best poking tools because any other poke leads you too wide off for whiff punishment.
My final contribution to Wesker discussion is that his normals are much better than most people think (practically speaking they are like a short sword). I was trying out some Vergil footsies against Wesker and two of Vergil's BEST normals (st.L and cr.L) Wesker can beat them easily. St.L is beat by a well placed cr.M and cr.L is "crushed" by st.H at proper spacing. Of course neither of these buttons are "sword" normals from Vergil but they are his best poking tools because any other poke leads you too wide off for whiff punishment.
"God's Beard!"
Member
Yeah, I literally made up everything on the fly for that team. I was sitting at the loading screen, thinking "ok, Firebrand is gonna be in the air, delta kick ground bounces airborne opponents LETS GO". Then I saw the ground bounce land like 3 character distances away and I was like HMM. I also tried the dhc to web throw just to see if it worked, and it was like magic against firebrand. But then I realized I had no idea how to follow it up. And I never practiced with Spiderman so I was just like CANCEL WEB MOVES YEEHAW. I don't play Sentinel so I pretty much just copied the things I saw on streams like fly/unfly command grab against incoming characters I learned back in vanilla from Marn vs Jago.
I wasn't worried about firebrand when I used my main team, it's online so I knew it wouldn't play smoothly but he's not a big deal for my guys. I was more worried about Dormammu since even though I play him, I'm not used to fighting against him. I just kept thinking FAST MOVES HE HAS STARTUP LETS DO THIS. I tried to EMD into Gravity Squeeze a couple times but I messed up. Strider is impossible to play in lag. I'm trying to input to many things.
Karsticles
Member
Wesker and Felicia would both have access to their command throws, so it would depend on who could establish priority first. Wesker's normals rock Felicia's, still.
I don't look at moves in a vacuum, because people don't use moves in a vacuum. It's pointless to look at "just the command throw", and not the whole character attached to it.
I'm cool with some command throws being 1 frame. Morrigan and Hsien-ko both don't get combos off of theirs, and they have to work damn hard to make those command throws happen, so I think that's less of a big deal. Of course, I would totally trade longer startup for real combos off of Morrigan's command throw, haha.
I summon the power...
Vergil's L attacks are really annoying, because they have much larger hitboxes than the animation suggests. I constantly get hit by that stuff and go "really?" Wesker's c.M is probably one of the best normals in the game, no doubt.
I know that "trying to input too many things" feeling. I get it a lot with Morrigan. HEY GAME, DON'T YOU KNOW I'M DOING SHIT OVER HERE?!
ihearthawthats
Banned
i think it's important to note that a lot of these moves leave you at frame advantage on block. it's good for setting up frame traps/throws.
on the topic of frame traps, i think chris g has some of the best.
"God's Beard!"
Member
When it comes to normals, one thing that bothers me is that even though people wavedash a lot to get in, I don't see as many people dash with their normals when they play footsies. I like to plink dash with s on wesker and the damn thing reaches like half screen. The guide says to do it with strider because he retains momentum better than most characters, but his hitboxes actually don't, which is weird. It gives the effect like his sword is shorter when he dashes.
edit: I don't know about anybody else, but with the higher emphasis on flight and zoning, and the lower damage, but this game feels a lot more like Marvel 2 to me. Maybe it's just because of Sentinel's new flight.
edit: I don't know about anybody else, but with the higher emphasis on flight and zoning, and the lower damage, but this game feels a lot more like Marvel 2 to me. Maybe it's just because of Sentinel's new flight.
A Pretty Panda
fuckin' called it, man
They should make Thor's Mighty Thunder similar to Magneto's Shockwave. Or at least just not shit on block.
It's because Vergil's wave dash is godly which greatly extend the range on his already great normals. Vergil is like Wesker with a sword when it comes to footsies. And his jabs aren't even his sword normals... Wesker can't do shit about st.H (neither can most characters and everyone pretty much respects that move.. until Vergil whiffs it). If Vergil's normals moved him forward he would over take Iron Fist as the footsie character of the game.
Also everyone should be tuning into the Chicken grudge match that is linked above. I am going to be trolling on stream chat (or at least trying to.. I am not good at trolling at all).
"God's Beard!"
Member
I remember when I spent like 3 hours figuring out how to bait Dante's sword normals and punish with Viper's dash S xx seismo. Then everybody started using Stinger.
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
It boggles my mind that it doesn't function the exact same way shockwave does.
Karsticles
Member
Thor's Mighty Thunder and Morrigan's Shadow Servant are like two characters trying reeaaally hard to be as good as Magneto.
I know Shadow Servant is good.
crimsonspider89
Banned
Just make Thor's Mighty Thunder do insane damage. Like 20k per pillar.
Sounds good.
Sounds good.
StriKeVillain
Banned
I saw this posted by MrPavy last week. I laughed so hard at the end, lol.
Ahgahahahahaha favorited, thanks
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