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UN and NATO to Gaddafi: Operation Odyssey Dawn |OT|

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T

theignoramus

Member
"British sources confirmed that seven Storm Shadow missiles were ready to be fired from a British aircraft, but the strikes had to be curtailed due to crews from CNN, Reuters and other organizations nearby. Officials from Libya's Ministry of Information brought those journalists to the area to show them damage from the initial attack and to effectively use them as human shields"
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how cynical. Did Iraq's Baathist party even do this, using foreign journalists as human shields?
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Manos: The Hans of Fate said:
Man, that British embargo and seizing of Libyan money (that is printed in London) really seemed to be more effective than I would have ever imagined.
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Not only that but this move is soo like Gaddafi. I can perfectly imagine him planning it and carrying it out.
 
Joel Was Right

Joel Was Right

Gold Member
theignoramus said:
how cynical. Did Iraq's Baathist party even do this, using foreign journalists as human shields?
Click to expand...

Truth is, X number of dead journalists from CNN, Reuters etc from a single attack would have caused bigger headlines than X number of dead Libyan civilians. Not suggesting the RAF would have gone ahead with the bombing if the latter were present of course, but I cant imagine the PR disaster if media were being hit themselves. The irony would have political impact.

I'm either being seen as the strongest sceptic here on this thread, or the biggest jackass.
 
G

Godslay

Banned
SoulPlaya said:
That's because they essentially had freedom. In Iraq, you could say whatever you want about anyone (except Saddam). You were free to discuss your the problems with your boss, Islam, neighbors, etc.

Now, you can't talk about anyone really. In 2003, things had gotten to the point that if you didn't say anything about Saddam, you were safe. Now, it's random violence everywhere.
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Thanks for your insight. I hope that it doesn't remain this way forever. I may be overly optimistic but I truly hope that the Iraqi people with once again enjoy freedom combined with stability, that many Americans enjoy.

Reneledarker said:
Depends on the levels of freedom and the economic stability you have, here in Mexico lots of old timers remember whit glory the days of the one party rule of PRI, and they are willing to limit their "freedom" for stability in the country. In some CEPAL (UN economic commission for Latin America) papers they did a survey and a good percentages of people where willing to go back to a form of dictatorship in order to have security and economic stability. In the end it becomes a young vs old argument.
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Interesting. I guess it would also depend on your interpretation of the given dictator.
 
S

SoulPlaya

more money than God
Godslay said:
Thanks for your insight. I hope that it doesn't remain this way forever. I may be overly optimistic but I truly hope that the Iraqi people with once again enjoy freedom combined with stability, that many Americans enjoy.
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Me too man, but this is what "democracy" has brought. So, when people look down on others who aren't willing to die for "democracy", it's unfair to me.
 
M

Manos: The Hans of Fate

Banned
BBC said:
#
2317: Philosopher Bernard-Henri Levy told Newsnight that if there was a "secret agenda of the awful West" to get hold of Libya's oil, "there was a very good way to do it, which was to make a deal with Gaddafi, as they did [for] decades. They had their hands on the oil of Libya through a bad, nasty, ugly deal with Gaddafi."
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Tis true.
 
G

Godslay

Banned
SoulPlaya said:
Me too man, but this is what "democracy" has brought. So, when people look down on others who aren't willing to die for "democracy", it's unfair to me.
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I guess that it is all relative to what someone experiences.
 
W

Wes

venison crêpe
CNNtweet.jpg


News broadcaster infighting!
 
K

KRS7

Member
RustyNails said:
BBC Panorama special on Libya is up on youtube, titled Fighting Gaddafi.

Part 1
Part 2

The links might be taken down soon, so catch it while you can. I'll be on the lookout for fresh links and try to keep the most up to date one in the OP.

Edit: Added the Links to OP under FAQ section.
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Thanks, I have a lot more respect for these rebels. Give them the support they need. Ghadaffi is a murderous thug.
 
K

keuja

Member
HawksEye said:
Seems like Gaddafi is paying his army and mercenaries with fake Libyan currency lol. (Same Serial Numbers + missing Luminescent Protection stamps)
*fake money*
Click to expand...

Source?
 
empty vessel

empty vessel

Member
theignoramus said:
"British sources confirmed that seven Storm Shadow missiles were ready to be fired from a British aircraft, but the strikes had to be curtailed due to crews from CNN, Reuters and other organizations nearby. Officials from Libya's Ministry of Information brought those journalists to the area to show them damage from the initial attack and to effectively use them as human shields"
Click to expand...

how cynical. Did Iraq's Baathist party even do this, using foreign journalists as human shields?
Click to expand...

I have to say that this sounds propagandistic. Are we really supposed to believe that these journalists from major news organizations were somehow unwittingly there. And how does one assert that "Officials from Libya's Ministry of Information brought those journalists to the area ... to effectively use them as human shields." That's a statement about the intent of the Libyan officials that, frankly, is well beyond the knowledge of whatever hack journalist this is.

(And, sure enough, the original source appears to be from Fox News.)

Edit: I see this is already turning into a kerfuffle. And, yes, that word is real and it is awesome.
 
Q

Qwomo

Junior Member
Robertson's verbal smackdown was rather nice, props to him for pointing out Fox's hypocrisy, but it's not like Fox being hypocritical negates the fact that he was used as a human shield, right? I mean, the whole 'human shield' thing came from military sources, didn't it?
 
D

Dreams-Visions

Member
fhtagn said:
Robertson's verbal smackdown was rather nice, props to him for pointing out Fox's hypocrisy, but it's not like Fox being hypocritical negates the fact that he was used as a human shield, right? I mean, the whole 'human shield' thing came from military sources, didn't it?
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they were not used as human shields. in fact, the Gaddafi government made a concerted effort to get them to safety.
 
empty vessel

empty vessel

Member
fhtagn said:
Robertson's verbal smackdown was rather nice, props to him for pointing out Fox's hypocrisy, but it's not like Fox being hypocritical negates the fact that he was used as a human shield, right? I mean, the whole 'human shield' thing came from military sources, didn't it?
Click to expand...

No, the fact that missiles that were preparing to be fired were not fired due to the presence of journalists at the target sites was confirmed by military sources. The whole "human shield" business was pure jingoistic propaganda.
 
P

params7

Banned
Watch out for Gaddafi coming out of this as some kind of a hero against the Crusaders.
Not my sentiments, but I just came from a Pakistani forum.
 
M

Manos: The Hans of Fate

Banned
params7 said:
Watch out for Gaddafi coming out of this as some kind of a hero against the Crusaders.
Not my sentiments, but I just came from a Pakistani forum.
Click to expand...

I assume that forum also has some massive headache inducing conspiratorial crap...if not then Pakistan forum I am disappointed in you.
 
K

KRS7

Member
params7 said:
Watch out for Gaddafi coming out of this as some kind of a hero against the Crusaders.
Not my sentiments, but I just came from a Pakistani forum.
Click to expand...

If the Muslim world hails Gaddafi as a hero in any sense whatsoever I will lose all respect for them. Gaddafi is fucking evil.
 
L

Lost Fragment

Obsessed with 4chan
Pakistan's the same country where people who campaign against blasphemy laws get murdered in cold blood and the people cheer. If the same sentiment spreads throughout the entirety of the Muslim world then that's one thing. But if it's just Pakistan and the other parts of the world where radicalism is relatively common, then it's hard to give a fuck what they think.
 
P

PistolGrip

sex vacation in Guam
params7 said:
Watch out for Gaddafi coming out of this as some kind of a hero against the Crusaders.
Not my sentiments, but I just came from a Pakistani forum.
Click to expand...
Then Muslims have no hope.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
PistolGrip said:
Then Muslims have no hope.
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Don't talk about one and half billion people as if they're one entity. Just like every other community, they also have their share of nutjobs, conspiracy loonies, moderates as well as liberals. You don't see millions of Muslims marching heroically in the streets in face of certain doom from their autocratic governments? You don't see them marching defiantly in the face of terror, standing up to tyrants, overthrowing them with nothing but will and hope? You don't see hundreds if not thousands of Muslims giving up their lives in order to live freely? Bunch of idiots in a Pakistani forum say retarded crap and everybody loses their shit. Pakistanis don't like bombs being dropped into their country by USA from aerial drones, and obviously they won't like bombs dropping in other countries as well. They're wired to be skeptical of the west. Just last week, 11 innocent people died from drone attacks in Pakistan. Don't blame them if they find western military endeavors slightly biased.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Disturbing account of the four freed NYT reporters who were captured by Col. Gaddafi's forces:

The journalists are Anthony Shadid, The Times’s Beirut bureau chief, who has won two Pulitzer Prizes for international reporting; two photographers, Tyler Hicks and Lynsey Addario, who have extensive experience in war zones; and a reporter and videographer, Stephen Farrell, who in 2009 was captured by the Taliban in Afghanistan and was rescued by British commandos.

The four had been covering fighting near Ajdabiya last Tuesday when they decided that the battle had grown too dangerous for them to continue safely. Their driver, however, inadvertently drove into a checkpoint manned by forces loyal to Colonel Qaddafi. By the time they knew they were in trouble, it was too late.

...

“I heard in Arabic, ‘Shoot them,’ ” Mr. Shadid said. “And we all thought it was over.”

Then another soldier spoke up. “One of the others said: ‘No, they’re American. We can’t shoot them,’ ” Mr. Hicks said.

The soldiers grabbed whatever they could get their hands on to tie up their prisoners: wire, an electrical cord from a home appliance, a scarf. One removed Ms. Addario’s shoes, pulled out the laces and used them to bind her ankles. Then one punched her in the face and laughed.

“Then I started crying,” she recalled. “And he was laughing more.” One man grabbed her breasts, the beginning of a pattern of disturbing behavior she would experience from her captors over the next 48 hours.

“There was a lot of groping,” she said. “Every man who came in contact with us basically felt every inch of my body short of what was under my clothes.”

Their captors held them in Ajdabiya until the fighting with the rebels died down. Soldiers put the four in a vehicle and drove them out of the city around 2 a.m. One threatened to decapitate Mr. Hicks. Another stroked Ms. Addario’s head and told her repeatedly she was going to die.

“He was caressing my head in this sick way, this tender way, saying: ‘You’re going to die tonight. You’re going to die tonight,’ ” she said.
Click to expand...
 
W

Wes

venison crêpe
"The Telegraph's Rob Crilly is reporting that a crashed US aircraft has been found in a field in Libya. He says he believes a mechanical failure brought it down last night.

The Telegraph says the plane is an F-15E Eagle – like this one. Rob Crilly tweeted that the crew are believed to be safe."
 
R

raphier

Banned
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