Nice! Those also sound like worthwhile investments.
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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
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Nice! Those also sound like worthwhile investments.
Been enjoying my Atari 2600 that arrived over the past couple days; it looks pretty good despite not being in RGB! I really love the wood grain finish. Any others on here who have gotten the RGB mod done? Cheers.
I have a s-video modded jr. Looks quite good. Not gonna bother with rgb though, the board and cables will cost around $100.00, and s-video looks plenty good for atari 2600.
This is on a Commodore 1702 through s-video:
None of the IR remote apps had an aspect button that worked with my TV in the time we had to try it. Oh well, it was a good idea. On the plus side a friend hooked up his raspberry pi 3 and it looked amazing at 720p and handles the scaling itself, negating the need for an aspect fix for the time being. Maybe I'll just stick with a pi or other 16:9 compatible sources on the plasma if I can ever get the sound working on my pi 2, and keep the actual retro consoles hooked up across the garage on the CRT sets.
I was able to fix the horizontal positioning of the PVM-14M6U thanks to the manual PanopticBlue uploaded and both SNES and Saturn looked ridiculous through RGB. It basically neutered my desire for an FV300, which I could pick up for about $20 a short drive away. But since I already have a pretty good consumer CRT I think I'll pass and hold out for a larger PVM.
I'll have to post some pictures of the garage setup once I get everything permanently hooked up. Just waiting on a few more cables.
geniusbits
Member
I'm not sure CRT computer monitors display correctly or even take 240p. First of all, you would want to get SCART cables for your RGB consoles, connect them into a SCART switch, and use a SCART to BNC adapter to plug into the monitor. Or SCART to the 25 pin VGA style input. To get it to accept the signal you might need to upscale to 480p, the OSSC that just came out, or the XRGB3 can do that.
You could look at the scan range of your monitor, if it doesn't go down to 15khz then it probably can't take 240p directly.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
I think my OSSC should be here tomorrow, as well.
All I can play on it right now is the Dreamcast, but that should be good enough to get a sense for how capable it is. Crazy Taxi, Border Down, and Bangai-O should be a decent test suite.
Edit: And I just spent a buttload of money on cables
I suspect it's worth it to buy quality stuff, but it's definitely the least thrilling thing to spend money on.
All I can play on it right now is the Dreamcast, but that should be good enough to get a sense for how capable it is. Crazy Taxi, Border Down, and Bangai-O should be a decent test suite.
Edit: And I just spent a buttload of money on cables
I suspect it's worth it to buy quality stuff, but it's definitely the least thrilling thing to spend money on.
Beer Monkey
Member
Has anybody installed an Atari 7800 s-video mod? I haven't touched an iron in about 20 years and used to mod consoles, but I've never done anything this involved. Trying to talk myself into it.
I just tried the Genesis with RGB... Mother of God. I can't explain why exactly but it's even better than SNES and Saturn. Unfortunately I think I'm out of easy RGB additions. Next is an NES s-vid/RGB mod, a Genesis S-vid mod and research how I can most cost effectively go from RGB to component on a 480i set.
It's because it's noticeably better than Genesis on composite. Genesis had some of the worst composite displays out of the big systems.
RGB on a stock SNES is softer in general than RGB from a MD.
DarkConfidant
Member
So I got my PVM in the mail.
My SCART cable doesnt come for another day, but I decided to see if Component and BNC connectors would work.
Turns out it doesnt.
Or, from my limited A/V knowledge, theres no sync(?).
The picture continuous runs vertically up the screen, and is a scrambled mess, though you can see the color there.
This is when I put the component cable from the PS2 into the 3 R/G/B slots.
Maybe I just did something wrong, because composite worked just fine using the BNC.
The PVM also didnt come with a remote (which the ebay seller didnt specify), so Im not sure if theres some awesome menu Im missing out on. Maybe its too old to have a remote?
It was a Sony pvm1271q, for those who dont remember.
Regardless, my SCART cables should be here either tomorrow or Wednesday. I guess I can wait. I just wanted to see if component would be fine.
My SCART cable doesnt come for another day, but I decided to see if Component and BNC connectors would work.
Turns out it doesnt.
Or, from my limited A/V knowledge, theres no sync(?).
The picture continuous runs vertically up the screen, and is a scrambled mess, though you can see the color there.
This is when I put the component cable from the PS2 into the 3 R/G/B slots.
Maybe I just did something wrong, because composite worked just fine using the BNC.
The PVM also didnt come with a remote (which the ebay seller didnt specify), so Im not sure if theres some awesome menu Im missing out on. Maybe its too old to have a remote?
It was a Sony pvm1271q, for those who dont remember.
Regardless, my SCART cables should be here either tomorrow or Wednesday. I guess I can wait. I just wanted to see if component would be fine.
There's usually a menu setting to select between component and RGB as it interprets the signals differently even though it uses the same inputs.
Edit: Just did a little googling for you and someone in this link says that monitor doesn't do YUV, so that might be the problem.
DarkConfidant
Member
Yeah I figured it was the TV.
It was cool that the picture still came in partially, though, if I put one of the 3 cords into the Sync In port.
Anyway, I tried out composite, just to make sure the screen works, and it looks amazing. Even for composite, the scan lines are so clear, the colors are so nice, the black levels deep, and the motion is so smooth.
Can't wait to go full SCART later tonight. I just have 2 inputs currently, so the SCART-in just kinda sits on top of the box, where I can easily switch the PS2 and SFC SCART-out cables.
This is exciting.
I'll take hi res photos when I can tonight.Genesis outputs one of the cleanest images, if not the absolute cleanest image, of any standard def console.
D.Lo
Member
I think it's just the low colour palette. Every low colour palette console 'pops' more when run via RGB (see also RGB modded NES, PC Engine, Master System) because by their nature they use brighter, less subdued colours, and so have high contrast.
SNES, Saturn etc - they have much much larger colour palettes and so designers most often chose broader palettes, which means a lower contrast picture.
The Mega Drive games on Saturn look completely identical to the Mega Drive ones, for example.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Wow, retro_console_accessories works quick. I bought 3 cables with the coax pro cabling upgrade yesterday morning, and they've already been shipped out.
geniusbits
Member
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
Anyone else live in an area with apparently nobody selling pro monitors? I check eBay and Craigslist every other week and always come up with the same results.
blast processed
Member
Yeah, Genesis looks amazing. I just got my Saturn Scart in the mail today & I'm curious to see how it looks setting my expectations low. Still waiting for my SNES cable.
dont
this is how saturn looks on my HDTV without an XRGB (simply plugged directly into the rgb scart socket at the back)
looks great, and that's even without any kind of upscaler before stretching it to fill a 55" TV. Will look stunning via an xrgb
to be honest, if my LG HDTV had better internal upscaling for its RGB scart input, I wouldn't even need an xrgb.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
The Saturn looks fucking immaculate over RGB. It was the first system I got to use RGB with, and to me, it still looks better than anything else has over RGB. I sincerely doubt anyone could be disappointed by it.
digita1alchemy
Member
I just got an email that there are a new batch of OSSC units available for those who pre-ordered. I don't really have the cash for it right now, so I am trying to sell my PVM-20M4U to cover it. Listed it on craigslist for $250, but if there are any interested posters in the Raleigh, NC area, you can have it for $200. The image quality is great, PM me if interested and I can provide plenty of pics.
This is what I use, works great.
blast processed
Member
Glad to see someone else upgrading to the coax cables. I noticed a slight improvement in picture quality with no more stability issues via the framemeister. What was huge for me was the elimination of any static hiss from the audio. I'm using an OSSC now with audio pass-through to my DAC and hear zero static when it's quiet. That alone was worth the cost for me.
blast processed
Member
Seriously, it's a YouTube video away from going really expensive.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Good to hear, considering I'll be using the exact same coax upgraded cable -> OSSC setup. The audio is the biggest concern for me, so if the coax upgrade is the solution, then I'm glad I did it. Even if it means I dropped $40 on a damn cable.
But hey, I've got a good sound setup, and I want my games to sound pristine when I run them through.
I ended up trying them out as a last resort to solving the ridiculous audio buzz from my consolized MVS. As much as I like scart, it's extremely sensitive to cable shielding.
Anyhow, I hope you enjoy the OSSC, it's breathed new life into retro games for me. The Framemeister is(was) great but I always found myself tweaking and fighting with it more than actually playing games. I've decided to play through Castlevania: SOTN for the PS1 for my first OSSC game as I've only played the xbox 360 version. 240p via the OSSC is incredible. Also, it helps that the device is essentially plug-and-play.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
The plug-and-play aspect of it is maybe the most appealing part. I never felt like the XRGB (well, the 3, which is what I had) was a particularly good device -- it just happened to be the only reasonable option there was for old-school gaming. But as you said, there was way too much fiddling with it involved, and the overall experience just never felt quite right. I'm optimistic that the OSSC will finally remedy that.
Anyway, the box should finally get here tomorrow, and it looks like my fancy new cables will be here on Thursday... so it's almost time. Finally.
nogoodnamesleft
Banned
I look forward to 100% unbiased OSSC vs XRGBMINI comparisons.
Right now, these two links are probably your best bet. My Life in Gaming is also working on a review.
http://retrogaming.hazard-city.de/ossc.html
https://www.videogameperfection.com/2016/07/08/source-converter-verdict/
Videogameperfection handles the distribution of the OSSC, but I found his review comprehensive and honest.
I think the most important aspect of the OSSC is that it's being constantly improved upon via firmware updates, unlike the Framemeister.
nogoodnamesleft
Banned
Where would be the best bet to buy an OSSC or to be placed in a waiting list?
The FM does get updates for improvements though. The real difference is that updates on the OSSC can fundamentally change the way it operates to a certain limit due to the nature of FPGA hardware.
You're right. I've just found it frustrating both in the length of time between XRGB updates and the lack of addressing longstanding issues. Though, from what I understand, issues like uneven 1080p scanlines and UI responsiveness are due to the Framemeister's design.
You're not alone on that island, man.
D.Lo
Member
Uneven 1080p non-scanlines is an inherent feature of 1080p, which is not an interger multiple of 240. And if at 960p with borders, non-scanlines will be too thin since they will be only be every 4th line.
D.Lo
Member
PAL Gamecube can do 480p fine.
The reason people get the idea that SCART can't handle 480p is because generally it's true, from the monitor side. Almost no monitors with Scart inputs support 480p over them.
Just like for any analogue signal, cable construction is very important. Component cables are less prone to such cheap failure as they tend to be RCA cables cobbled together, and RCA are coax cables. For some reason Scart makers nowadays do their cables with simple wires, and of course it can lead to disaster. If you look at branded cables designed in the 90s (generic male male Scart), you will notice how thick and sturdy they are, as all their 21 wires are coax.
Yep, that's the one I'm considering. Having trouble pulling the trigger though. I've got to pace myself, I'll probably end up buying it in a month or so.
blast processed
Member
That's the one I used when going from my model 2 genesis, to component. Worked really well. Remember you need to get the audio out as well.
Edit: Like this one
I don't need these anymore, so if you want them I'll sell them both cheap. You'll just need a scart cable. PM me if you want them.
Why are you selling it? Found something better?
Lack of space really...I need to use the spare room for my daughter now that she's getting older, and I think the xrgb route is the way to go.
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