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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!

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Peltz

Member
Lack of space really...I need to use the spare room for my daughter now that she's getting older, and I think the xrgb route is the way to go.

That was short lived. She must've grown a lot in the last month or so :p

In all seriousness, XRGB mini is a decent alternative but I would try to view one in person before jumping to purchase it. I think it gives off an image that is a bit of a letdown after seeing a high quality broadcast monitor.

That's not the Mini's fault by the way. Pro-grade CRT's simply have ridiculous color accuracy compared to consumer fixed pixel displays. Nothing (not even OLED) really compares with them in my opinion.
 

televator

Member
That was short lived. She must've grown a lot in the last month or so :p

In all seriousness, XRGB mini is a decent alternative but I would try to view one in person before jumping to purchase it. I think it gives off an image that is a bit of a letdown after seeing a high quality broadcast monitor.

That's not the Mini's fault by the way. Pro-grade CRT's simply have ridiculous color accuracy compared to consumer fixed pixel displays. Nothing (not even OLED) really compares with them in my opinion.

Actually, color anomalies are partly, if not entirely, the FM's fault. Plasmas already exceeded pro HDCRT color gamut coordinates.
 

Peltz

Member
Actually, color anomalies are partly, if not entirely, the FM's fault. Plasmas already exceeded pro HDCRT color gamut coordinates.

It appears I stand corrected.

Supposedly (and I know I sound like a broken record talking about the OSSC), the OSSC's color accuracy is better. Scroll down on this page for more on that: https://blz.la/rgb/ossc.html


No way. We need as much info on the OSSC as possible. It's new so the more conversation about it, the better.
 

Bogeypop

Member
naZRKUI.jpg
For lack of a decent camera I figured at least a picture of the serial number would suffice as proof that I have joined the 1Chip club. Might consider getting the RGB Amp Bypass later in the future, but as for more current goals I'm hoping to snag some HD Retrovision SNES component cables when they become available again in August.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
No way. We need as much info on the OSSC as possible. It's new so the more conversation about it, the better.

Well, I still don't have it, because the USPS is apparently incompetent. So... tomorrow? Maybe?

Looks like my RGB cables will be here tomorrow, as well, so I can do the real evaluation then.
 

Grief.exe

Member
For lack of a decent camera I figured at least a picture of the serial number would suffice as proof that I have joined the 1Chip club. Might consider getting the RGB Amp Bypass later in the future, but as for more current goals I'm hoping to snag some HD Retrovision SNES component cables when they become available again in August.

Have you opened up it up to double check?
 

Bogeypop

Member
Have you opened up it up to double check?

Not yet, the seller was nice enough to include security bits, so I can check whenever I want, but I'm a bit worried I'll be dumb enough to damage it somehow. Maybe when I'm feeling a bit more bold I'll open 'er up. The seller even had a picture of the motherboard with the SNS 1CHIP 01 marking, so I'm inclined to believe it's genuine. The picture looks really great on my CRT even with composite cables.

EDIT: Just opened 'er up. Definitely a 1CHIP. Had the SNS 1CHIP 01 marking on the motherboard.
 

Grief.exe

Member
Not yet, the seller was nice enough to include security bits, so I can check whenever I want, but I'm a bit worried I'll be dumb enough to damage it somehow. Maybe when I'm feeling a bit more bold I'll open 'er up. The seller even had a picture of the motherboard with the SNS 1CHIP 01 marking, so I'm inclined to believe it's genuine. The picture looks really great on my CRT even with composite cables.

EDIT: Just opened 'er up. Definitely a 1CHIP. Had the SNS 1CHIP 01 marking on the motherboard.

Nice!
 

New002

Member
Very much a noob here with a framemeister conundrum.

So I've been looking at the profiles from the implantgames youtube videos and I noticed that when I go to adjust the brightness setting there are black bars to the left and right of the image that become a washed out black as I increase the brightness. I tried adjusting the zoom settings based on the profile videos but then I lose quite a bit off the top and bottom of the image, and the image feels squished.

Am I missing something super simple here? :(

Thanks in advance!
 

Rich!

Member
That was short lived. She must've grown a lot in the last month or so :p

In all seriousness, XRGB mini is a decent alternative but I would try to view one in person before jumping to purchase it. I think it gives off an image that is a bit of a letdown after seeing a high quality broadcast monitor.

That's not the Mini's fault by the way. Pro-grade CRT's simply have ridiculous color accuracy compared to consumer fixed pixel displays. Nothing (not even OLED) really compares with them in my opinion.

I used to own an xrgb...I loved it. I know exactly what to expect

I took this photo via it back in the day:

tmp_4215-fb_img_1469006j9t.jpg
 

Mega

Banned
Lack of space really...I need to use the spare room for my daughter now that she's getting older, and I think the xrgb route is the way to go.

Keep a 13" PVM in a corner. If you're okay with S-Video, the JVC TM-A13SU is incredibly compact and has significantly shorter depth than even the PVMs. It takes up hardly any space.
 

Rich!

Member
Keep a 13" PVM in a corner. If you're okay with S-Video, the JVC TM-A13SU is incredibly compact and has significantly shorter depth than even the PVMs. It takes up hardly any space.

There was a 14" RGB Sony PVM on ebay earlier near me that I was watching that sold for £20. So maybe that is an option, yeah.

The other option is just putting the JVC into storage for now.
 

ShowDog

Member
So I've been on the lookout for a new CRT and I came across this:

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/ele/5661490111.html

It's a Sony WEGA KV-32HS500. Has anyone here had experience with one of these (or any 4:3 HD CRT for that matter)? I'm currently on the fence about it, and I'm not too torn up about not being able to use light guns with it.

You'd be better off with any old ass Trinitron in decent shape, as long as it had an s-video port. Don't bother with the HD sets. They don't excel in anything and are full of compromises. I've owned 3 and really only liked one of them, but the SD sets are still better for gaming.

Look for the Trinitron set that looks similar to the one you posted minus the front Memory Stick slot. It'll most likely be a KV-##FV300 or 310 which is the last and possibly best SD CRT Sony made. Although I'd still not sold on flat fronts. I'm looking for a FV300 to evaluate more closely.
 
Very much a noob here with a framemeister conundrum.

So I've been looking at the profiles from the implantgames youtube videos and I noticed that when I go to adjust the brightness setting there are black bars to the left and right of the image that become a washed out black as I increase the brightness. I tried adjusting the zoom settings based on the profile videos but then I lose quite a bit off the top and bottom of the image, and the image feels squished.

Am I missing something super simple here? :(

Thanks in advance!

Have you calibrated your tv set for that input yet?

You don't need to pay someone to do it, you can do it using something special bluray discs like Digital Video Essentials, there's also a Disney bluray disc for it. I think quite a few LucasFilms movies actually have some basic calibration stuff on their discs as well.

It sounds to me like you're just raising the brightness too much, or the brightness/contrast setting on your tv is set too high.
 

Ruprit

Member
Very much a noob here with a framemeister conundrum.

So I've been looking at the profiles from the implantgames youtube videos and I noticed that when I go to adjust the brightness setting there are black bars to the left and right of the image that become a washed out black as I increase the brightness. I tried adjusting the zoom settings based on the profile videos but then I lose quite a bit off the top and bottom of the image, and the image feels squished.

Am I missing something super simple here? :(

Thanks in advance!

I think the black bars on either side of the screen are adjusted using a combination of brightness and A/D Level. I had the same issue with my MVS where the boarders were too bright and I was getting black crush. Fortunately, an MVS has a simple built-in color calibration tool to help. If you are able the 240p Test Suite could help.
 
So I've been on the lookout for a new CRT and I came across this:

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/ele/5661490111.html

It's a Sony WEGA KV-32HS500. Has anyone here had experience with one of these (or any 4:3 HD CRT for that matter)? I'm currently on the fence about it, and I'm not too torn up about not being able to use light guns with it.

Your mileage may vary with HD CRTs. Both of the ones I owned had observable input lag and geometry issues, although the picture quality otherwise was immaculate for gen 6/7. Not ideal at all for 240p content though. If you play a lot of gen 6/7 and can put up with a bit of input lag, then an HD CRT would be a good fit for you.
 

MrNelson

Banned
You'd be better off with any old ass Trinitron in decent shape, as long as it had an s-video port. Don't bother with the HD sets. They don't excel in anything and are full of compromises. I've owned 3 and really only liked one of them, but the SD sets are still better for gaming.

Look for the Trinitron set that looks similar to the one you posted minus the front Memory Stick slot. It'll most likely be a KV-##FV300 or 310 which is the last and possibly best SD CRT Sony made. Although I'd still not sold on flat fronts. I'm looking for a FV300 to evaluate more closely.

Your mileage may vary with HD CRTs. Both of the ones I owned had observable input lag and geometry issues, although the picture quality otherwise was immaculate for gen 6/7. Not ideal at all for 240p content though. If you play a lot of gen 6/7 and can put up with a bit of input lag, then an HD CRT would be a good fit for you.
Thanks guys, I guess I'll hold off for now and try searching some thrift shops this weekend. I mainly plan on using it for 6th gen and older. Right now I'm running a Dynex DX-R20TR, and while it does the job fine, I'm looking for a larger screen (preferably 27-32") as well as something with S-video and dedicated component inputs so I don't have to sacrifice using one of the composite's audio jacks.

On another matter, has anyone here got their hands on those HD Retrovision SNES or Genesis cables yet? I'm curious as to how they perform.
 
Thanks guys, I guess I'll hold off for now and try searching some thrift shops this weekend. I mainly plan on using it for 6th gen and older. Right now I'm running a Dynex DX-R20TR, and while it does the job fine, I'm looking for a larger screen (preferably 27-32") as well as something with S-video and dedicated component inputs so I don't have to sacrifice using one of the composite's audio jacks.

On another matter, has anyone here got their hands on those HD Retrovision SNES or Genesis cables yet? I'm curious as to how they perform.

I have both sets of cables, and they work wonderfully.

I grew up playing these consoles using RF or composite cables, and the difference with component is mind-blowing. The clarity is so much better. I have to get a little used to the color differences, but the component cables look so much more natural (albeit slightly subdued). The composite cable produces an image with, I think, over-saturation, color bleeding, blurriness, etc.

Very happy with my purchases.
 

Khaz

Member
On another matter, has anyone here got their hands on those HD Retrovision SNES or Genesis cables yet? I'm curious as to how they perform.

They give you flawless RGB.

You may want to use a separate encoder if you plan on having several consoles, the cables logistics may be easier that way. But for a single console setup it's definitely the right choice.
 

MrNelson

Banned
I have both sets of cables, and they work wonderfully.

I grew up playing these consoles using RF or composite cables, and the difference with component is mind-blowing. The clarity is so much better. I have to get a little used to the color differences, but the component cables look so much more natural (albeit slightly subdued). The composite cable produces an image with, I think, over-saturation, color bleeding, blurriness, etc.

Very happy with my purchases.

That's great to hear. Up until I got my Wii in 2007, every console I owned was hooked up through RF (The TV I had at home until then was made in '88 and had no A/V jacks). I didn't even get a TV with composite jacks in my room until 2009, so this will be a welcome upgrade. I just wish they weren't so expensive so I could get both at once.
They give you flawless RGB.

You may want to use a separate encoder if you plan on having several consoles, the cables logistics may be easier that way. But for a single console setup it's definitely the right choice.
These will be going in a CRT, so that shouldn't be an issue, right?
 

stewy

Member
Been looking for a PVM monitor but had no luck. I came across a free 27" Sony WEGA on Kijiji the other day. I'm gonna grab it. Better than nothing.
 
That's great to hear. Up until I got my Wii in 2007, every console I owned was hooked up through RF (The TV I had at home until then was made in '88 and had no A/V jacks). I didn't even get a TV with composite jacks in my room until 2009, so this will be a welcome upgrade. I just wish they weren't so expensive so I could get both at once.

Just FYI. The first batch of cables sold out in a matter of minutes. So, you may want to consider biting the bullet and getting both. Who knows if these guys will ever put up the money to make another batch.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Wonderful. The morons at USPS decided that the quickest way to deliver a package from Kent, WA to Seattle was to send it to San Francisco first. They really need to begin mandating at least a 6th grade education for their employees. Washington rednecks at their best.

So no OSSC today. Just a lot of salt. With a little luck, I won't have to wait until Monday.
 
Been looking for a PVM monitor but had no luck. I came across a free 27" Sony WEGA on Kijiji the other day. I'm gonna grab it. Better than nothing.

I don't think you'll be disappointed. They're great TVs. Most have s-video and some have component. No matter what you're getting a totally lag free play experience.
 
Am I the only one who forgets to turn the xrgb off? There should be a setting to power off after 5 minutes when there is no input detected. If hooking the wrong scart didn't burn it out, forgetting to shut it off certainly will.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Am I the only one who forgets to turn the xrgb off? There should be a setting to power off after 5 minutes when there is no input detected. If hooking the wrong scart didn't burn it out, forgetting to shut it off certainly will.

I wonder if that's how my XRGB-3 died... I didn't really get that much use out of it, but it crapped out anyway. I did have a few instances where I probably left it on for a long time, but it seems kinda absurd for it to not be able to stand up to that.
 

arit

Member
It appears I stand corrected.




No way. We need as much info on the OSSC as possible. It's new so the more conversation about it, the better.

Well it does do mvs rather well
The scanlines are serviceable
And you can even rotate them
With the moire if almost looks like a picture taken from a crt (nope)
Doesn't do Midway Wolf Unit hardware though (who would have thunk?), or to be more precise, my monitor doesn't.

As expected(and not pictured) 480i does not look that good, at least not coming from an HNG64 (I have yet to remember you can switch between 240p/480i like one can do with the System 12 boards).

A sweet little board.
 
Wonderful. The morons at USPS decided that the quickest way to deliver a package from Kent, WA to Seattle was to send it to San Francisco first. They really need to begin mandating at least a 6th grade education for their employees. Washington rednecks at their best.

So no OSSC today. Just a lot of salt. With a little luck, I won't have to wait until Monday.

I just had a similar experience with ordering the SCART cables from the ebay vendor that you guys all suggest.

I live in Detroit, and the package arrived in Detroit the night before the expected delivery date (Tuesday). This has always meant that it'll be on my doorstep next morning (the advantage of living in a big city next to a major post office).

USPS, in all of their great wisdom, did not include it with the mail they delivered to me that day. The tracking did not update until the night, and they had shipped my SCART cables from Detroit (the city of destination) to a small suburb outside Detroit.
The following day it was shipped back to Detroit, and on Thursday today, it is finally out for delivery.

I was going to post pics, but never got my SCART cables. :( USPS can be really incompetent at times.
 
Found a free download of the manual if you'd like to get more familiarized with it.
http://elektrotanya.com/sony_pvm1271q.pdf/download.html

For some reason that link isn't working for me anymore. I get message from the site that's in a language I can't understand (german maybe?).

Do you remember offhand if this TV has a menu in it, or if it's supposed to come with a remote? Mine doesn't have a remote, and I'd like to adjust geometry and other video stuff eventually.

It was the PVM1271Q. I tried googling and got junk results.
 

Rich!

Member
luckily, with my house being a new build that I oversaw, I was able to dictate exactly what was in the TV area - 12 wall sockets behind where the entertainment unit is and a video cable passthrough and wall power socket behind where the TV is mounted (no visible cables! yay!)

I also made sure there was a master power on/off switch in the wall so that I can turn everything on that area off with one switch. Bear in mind UK wall sockets all have on/off switches by law, but I can't reach most of the 12 behind my entertainment unit

either way, it gives me peace of mind when I have so much shit plugged in that I can just turn off before going out/when not using it all
 

dubc35

Member
For some reason that link isn't working for me anymore. I get message from the site that's in a language I can't understand (german maybe?).

Do you remember offhand if this TV has a menu in it, or if it's supposed to come with a remote? Mine doesn't have a remote, and I'd like to adjust geometry and other video stuff eventually.

It was the PVM1271Q. I tried googling and got junk results.

Hmm, the link still works for me. I can't access dropbox, Google Drive, etc at work so I can't rehost it right now, sorry. I can probably later though. I'm not sure on the menu. most PVM's I have seen for sale do not include a remote but I'm still pretty new to the PVM/BVM scene.
 

Mega

Banned
Wonderful. The morons at USPS decided that the quickest way to deliver a package from Kent, WA to Seattle was to send it to San Francisco first. They really need to begin mandating at least a 6th grade education for their employees. Washington rednecks at their best.

So no OSSC today. Just a lot of salt. With a little luck, I won't have to wait until Monday.

I had that happen a couple of times. Once it was even more irritating because they sent a package to a USPS office across the city and it stayed there for a week for no clear reason. I lost it when my Duo-R from Japan went missing for a couple of days on a truck and they tried blaming it on poor labeling on Doujindance's part, made me run back and forth with empty promises I could get it "later", etc. It finally turned up and it was packaged flawlessly.

In the middle of that, I called the USPS number to complain about recent fuckups, my local post office leaving their phone permanently off the hook on purpose to avoid answering calls (a Yelp reviewer even mentions this), and the grumpy old asshole mailman who I CAUGHT on multiple occasions fake ringing my doorbell and leaving Missed Delivery notices. The rep on the line became irate with me because I was badmouthing the beloved company she and her husband, a retired mailman, had spent years working for, and she didn't wanna hear that a mailman in my area was consciously doing an awful job. Yeah, fuck my totally valid complaints... your pride and blind loyalty to a soulless government agency is more important.

UPS is another one that will neither bring up a heavy package and will also destroy it in transit. They damaged almost every CRT I got with them as the delivery service.

Fed Ex is the best. I got a new 15" JVC CRT yesterday and it arrived intact, placed on my front door on the 4th floor. The box hardly had a scratch on it.
 
Just FYI. The first batch of cables sold out in a matter of minutes. So, you may want to consider biting the bullet and getting both. Who knows if these guys will ever put up the money to make another batch.

I do believe I've heard them say they are doing another order. I think right now it's just a slow process since they need to make the profits from one batch to order the next.
 
I had that happen a couple of times. Once it was even more irritating because they sent a package to a USPS office across the city and it stayed there for a week for no clear reason. I lost it when my Duo-R from Japan went missing for a couple of days on a truck and they tried blaming it on poor labeling on Doujindance's part, made me run back and forth with empty promises I could get it "later", etc. It finally turned up and it was packaged flawlessly.

In the middle of that, I called the USPS number to complain about recent fuckups, my local post office leaving their phone permanently off the hook on purpose to avoid answering calls (a Yelp reviewer even mentions this), and the grumpy old asshole mailman who I CAUGHT on multiple occasions fake ringing my doorbell and leaving Missed Delivery notices. The rep on the line became irate with me because I was badmouthing the beloved company she and her husband, a retired mailman, had spent years working for, and she didn't wanna hear that a mailman in my area was consciously doing an awful job. Yeah, fuck my totally valid complaints... your pride and blind loyalty to a soulless government agency is more important.

UPS is another one that will neither bring up a heavy package and will also destroy it in transit. They damaged almost every CRT I got with them as the delivery service.

Fed Ex is the best. I got a new 15" JVC CRT yesterday and it arrived intact, placed on my front door on the 4th floor. The box hardly had a scratch on it.

It's the exact opposite here. I don't really have any issues with UPS or USPS, FedEx on the other hand. Those fuckers can all go to hell. Almost anything that gets shipped to me by FedEx first has to go to someone else, as in they deliver it to the wrong fucking place. Sometimes people end up bringing it to our place. Sometimes they must keep the shit.

Though one time I ordered a game from NewEgg shipped FedEx, that said it delivered it, and it wasn't. Waited the time NewEgg makes you wait, they send out a new one through USPS it comes, and then another few weeks after that my neighbor shows up saying ohh yeah this got delivered to us by mistake. Like a solid 6 - 8 weeks later he brings it over.

The worst experience I had with FedEx was like 10 years or so back when I was ordering Motherboard, CPU, Case combos like pre-assembled where I just needed to add ram and hard drives. They would only ship FedEx, and it says it gets getting delivered on a certain day so I take off from work to be home when it shows up. It was like 1200 - 1400 bucks worth of computer.

So I'm watching the tracking all day says its on the truck to be delivered. 1pm on the truck, 2pm on the truck, etc etc and then I refresh it just after 5pm and it says it was delivered 3 minutes ago, and the name that it says was the signature is no name I recognize. The door bell never rang so what the fuck, I go downstairs no package anywhere. So I immediately call FedEx, they get the driver on the phone. They tell me he says he must have delivered it to the wrong house and he'll go back when he can fit it in, in the next few days to get it back. I'm like uhhh no he needs to back and get it now, they put me on hold, and tell me well the drivers shift is over so he's going home, and I'm like bullshit. The guy on the phone is like he'll just get it in the next few days don't worry. I ask them, and if the person claims it wasn't delivered to them and they don't give it back will you pay me the money for the items in the package........silence for a few minutes and then well no ofcourse not, you'd have to call the police then.......

I calmly but in that I am so angry I am going to slowly but carefully pronounce every word so you understand explain to this fuck I don't care if his shift is over he fucked up and to get the package now and if not I wanted his supervisor's supervisor. Which got a hold on, and then ok fine he'll pick it up and bring it to you now.

Dude was super pissed when he came to the door but fucking aye man, do your job right and don't have ass it.
 

Mega

Banned
I guess reliability varies from city or region to the next. USPS has been good lately but I think the old guy finally retired or moved on since I haven't seen him around. He was awful and was perhaps entirely to blame for a lot of the home delivery fuckups.

I had something like your experience happen with UPS and a new air conditioner delivery. I caught a USP guy on the street who told me he knew the guy who was supposed to have delivered it and that he would find him, take the AC off his hands, and get it to me personally. I didn't believe him and proceeded to call UPS on the phone to track down the original driver... but then the USP guy on the street actually kept his word and came through! Even brought it up to my door. Amazing customer service in that instance!
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
I got my RGB cables from retro_console_accessories. These things are pretty damn heavy-duty. I dunno if it's cuz I got the coax upgrade or what, but they aren't fooling around.

So now they'll just have to sit there until the OSSC arrives :-/
 

Peagles

Member
For some reason that link isn't working for me anymore. I get message from the site that's in a language I can't understand (german maybe?).

Do you remember offhand if this TV has a menu in it, or if it's supposed to come with a remote? Mine doesn't have a remote, and I'd like to adjust geometry and other video stuff eventually.

It was the PVM1271Q. I tried googling and got junk results.

I have a pdf, I'll upload it tonight for you.
 

KC-Slater

Member
Just pulled the trigger on an OSSC. Gonna give it a whirl on my plasma with my Dreamcast, Naomi, Saturn and Mega Drive.

I'll post impressions/screens at some point.
 
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