What in the bloody [heck] is a MUD?

Gattsu25

Banned
Which ones are popular and which are good?
Are they worth investing time?


Now on to my usual irritable queries: Seriously, what the fuck is a MUD? MUDs are often mentioned whenever the terms 'hardcore' *ugh* and 'MMO' are combined...

What the hell are they, really? From what I can gather, they are Telnet based online games that (sometimes?) require a fee...and if that really is what they are then what the hell drives someone to pay for a ASCII online game?
 
i can't think of any text based muds (multi-user dungeons) that cost money. but its been a loooong time since i've delved into any.
 
MUD= Multi User Dungeon also Multi User Dimension, mainly RPG combat

MUSH= Multi User Shared Hallucination, mainly social interaction

MUCK= between mud and mush, some combat, some social
 
I can't think of any MUDs that require any fees... anywho, you can find MUDs on just about any subject heh. Star Wars, Star Trek, normal fantasy, etc. The one I generally love playing from time to time is Achaea, it has a really strong community and really complex and intriguing interface.

http://www.achaea.com/main.html
 
MrAngryFace said:
Text Based MUDs > All MMORPGS to come along since.

Imagination beats any graphics card.
couldn't disagree more. the first statement depends on what MMORPG and what MUD you are talking about respectively.

as to the second statement, unfortunately the way you "see" something in your head and the way you visualize something through your eyes is entirely different. Even the crudest graphics will usually beat out the most elaborate descriptions because of this. If this were true then Sierra's (and later on Lucasfilm's) adventure games would have never buried the text adventure in the way that they did.

What MUDs DO have over MMORPGs is their immersion through player involvement. There are less players on an entire MUD than a single server for WoW, but I would almost bet there are more GMs on that MUD than a single server of WoW. This means more unique and interactive content than is usually available in most MMORPGs. And because the interface "can be" free form if you are interacting directly with a GM and the "resulting actions" only limited by the GMs vocabulary, it is DEFINITELY a more interactive game.

Not disagreeing with you that MUDs still have their place (just as console RPGs and pen and paper gaming do), but the graphics angle is the wrong approach to take. I would rather have Nethack level graphics represent the action than a true text adventure style. It is more comforting for the brain to visualize through the eyes than it is through the imagination.
 
MrAngryFace said:
Obviously the book is dead. :p -- Comforting? Or Lazy?
compared to the movies ;)

of course that will be attributed to that people are stupid and want their entertainment dumbed down etc etc...

however the truth is that as movie making technology evolves (see LOTR), the ability to "describe" something in a movie is greatly approaching the limitless ability authors have had in those regards since writing began.

Again I use LOTR as an example. You could have made a decent version of it 20-30 years ago with matte backdrops, elaborate set pieces, etc. But it still would have looked a little "off", and most of the fantasy elements (Balrog, etc) would have looked silly or unrealistic. But now I would argue that LOTR the movie was every bit as lushly "described" as it was in the book. Obviously a lot of that is the director, but a crappy author does crappy descriptions as well.

Anyway, I don't want this to get into book vs film, and I do support MUDs and they are still relevant today despite the number of MMORPGs, but against 99.9% of the readers of this board and arguably 99.9% of the game playing population, arguing text-only as a reason to go to a MUD is like arguing tires falling off as a reason to buy a car.
 
I generally have found that I prefer MUD atmosphere's over graphical MMORPGs. Mainly because I haven't found a single person playing out of character. Since you play the game as yourself and the game sort of builds around that, as opposed to playing an avatar of yourself that you constantly see in third person. Rather, you're the one who creates the images, the personalities, the looks, everything is up to the player really in how they visualize the environment. And it's all your reaction, not a group of polygons you're forced to stare at. It makes it quite hard to jump out of character, when MMORPGs seem to mostly be the exact opposite. I find it very hard to find people role playing at all times, most talk about the outside world and reference the game as well.. a game.

Achaea is definitely strong in those aspects. The game forces you to role play yet without you ever knowing it. You don't just click some buttons and set up your classes to get going in some job. You have to join a guild of a certain class, then get to know everything about everyone in that guild (they are communities themselves, and everyone role plays from what I've noticed) and the guild itself (these things have such huge backstories it's mind boggling.) Then when you go to become a full fledged member, you have to pass an interview with the guild's higher ups. These question it really really complex. At one point, while joining the Sorcerer's guild I was asked who I would save out one of my country's citizens.. or a guildmate, and I had to go with an honest answer, you really do have the ability to let the character take over you, in a sense. I love that, and I can't do that in MMORPGs because everyone really is an avatar, it's so blatantly obvious. It's hard to really explain, but there's something about your imagination that allows things to feel MUCH more real and thus you become MUCH more immersed than anything a MMORPG can ever feed your computer.

Though I do know some people are capable of getting into MMORPGs like that... I must say I've tried, but it has to be extremely hard when nearly the entire community treats it like a game, rather than a real world. And it's even harder for those people to think otherwise, when the game is presented to them.. as a game. I love MMORPGs, I really do, but I definitely don't get into them emotionally as I would with a text based MUD.
 
I was just taking a scroll down memory lane here, remembering back in the day 11 or so years ago when I used to play MUDs. For back then, they were great. Multiuser gameplay with people all over the world before the internet really caught on. Cutting edge stuff back then.
 
used to play on the mud brad mcquaid played on...

sojourn_web.gif
 
One thing about MUDs, though, that'll ALWAYS give them an edge over MMORPGS: you can ALWAYS be certain that the player base is at LEAST functionally literate.
 
Drinky Crow said:
One thing about MUDs, though, that'll ALWAYS give them an edge over MMORPGS: you can ALWAYS be certain that the player base is at LEAST functionally literate.

Also, with no mouse-driven interface, MUDs kick ass for learning how to touch-type. After a couple years of shit like Hiddenworlds and the original Rivers of Mud, I was a fuckin' demon on the keys.

DFS.
 
WarPig said:
Also, with no mouse-driven interface, MUDs kick ass for learning how to touch-type. After a couple years of shit like Hiddenworlds and the original Rivers of Mud, I was a fuckin' demon on the keys.

DFS.

Ah yes, pioneered by Sierra's early games and honed with MUD's. Win.
 
WarPig said:
Also, with no mouse-driven interface, MUDs kick ass for learning how to touch-type. After a couple years of shit like Hiddenworlds and the original Rivers of Mud, I was a fuckin' demon on the keys.

DFS.

Rivers of Mud.. was that the one on uoregon.edu? That was the one my roommate and I would waste a bunch of time on. Dude ended up almost flunking a term because of his RoM obsession :lol
 
I used to love these things. Almost failed out of art school because of one, years ago (Mystic Adventure if you are wondering)

I've tried a few times to get some kind of Gaming Age presence going on in one. Some of the better ones are quite abandoned (due to players moving on to MMORPGs and whatnot)
so we could pretty much have one all to ourselves :)
 
Dsal said:
Rivers of Mud.. was that the one on uoregon.edu?

None other. The guy who ran it was a wacko, but it was a good MUD for a while. I liked it best in about...fuck, I guess it woulda been like '93, before the main imp slapped all his new shit over the basic MERC DikuMUD shit.

DFS.
 
WarPig said:
None other. The guy who ran it was a wacko, but it was a good MUD for a while. I liked it best in about...fuck, I guess it woulda been like '93, before the main imp slapped all his new shit over the basic MERC DikuMUD shit.

DFS.

Nice. That's about when my roommate and I were on. I remember when the transition to the new stuff happened.

I wonder how many times I had to enter "sac corpse"...

It's just not the same in the modern games when you can't EVISCERATE an enemy with a mace or DECIMATE with a polearm.
 
signet said:
Do you guys role play chicks in MUDs because you like to imagine a female ass more then a males ass? :lol

Funny. No, I played as a lizard man (Kang) in MajorMUD. Still my best gaming experience ever.


-rp
 
wow, this thread was not in vain. Recently began messing with Achaea and already put too much time into just the tutorial. The world this game takes place in and the detail put into describing everything gives the game a more 'real' feeling than most video games, IMO

I've been stuck for the past 20 minutes just reading up on all the info the various classes and guilds offer up...and even with my brief experiences...this game's learning and skill system is much better and in-depth than I expected

my only fear (and it is a big one) is that I *will* forget 80% of all these commands :b

much thanks to DarthWufei :D You are right about this game having a CRAZY amount of backstory, too :b
 
I was addicted to a MUD while in college, Shadowdale MUD, based off of Forgotten Realms and a mish mash of other D&D worlds and existing mythology. Thera are so many out there...
 
Played 3 years on AddictMUD myself. And the touch typing comment 100% true. Drinky can attest, I type sorta fast ;) Nothing like buffering against lag in the middle of a big fight haha.
 
You type insanely fast.

I imped Green Hell MUD for about two years; really improved my socket programming and C skills. In fact, I could probably directly link my current job to my MUD coding activities, and my abusive personality to the players I had to deal with.
 
bitwise said:
i can't think of any text based muds (multi-user dungeons) that cost money. but its been a loooong time since i've delved into any.

I paid $10-30 a month for a few years in a text-based MUD called DragonRealms from late 96 to early 99 and then a stint again from mid 99 to early 2000 when I took a break from EQ since Warriors blew so much. The game is still up and running though and still costs that much -- there was a premium subscription that was like 80 bucks a month or something too.

And yes, MUDs are hardcore. Boat rides took upwards of 3 hours in DR and you would sometimes have to spend 5-6 total waiting and then riding. You're a MMO newbie if you didnt start with MUDs -- that's a fact!
 
It's like a chat room where everyone is a character and there is some theme. It's like a text-based adventure game online with people.
 
Meier said:
I paid $10-30 a month for a few years in a text-based MUD called DragonRealms from late 96 to early 99 and then a stint again from mid 99 to early 2000 when I took a break from EQ since Warriors blew so much. The game is still up and running though and still costs that much -- there was a premium subscription that was like 80 bucks a month or something too.

And yes, MUDs are hardcore. Boat rides took upwards of 3 hours in DR and you would sometimes have to spend 5-6 total waiting and then riding. You're a MMO newbie if you didnt start with MUDs -- that's a fact!

That's the GemStone offshoot, right? I remember that from my friend's AOL days. Gemstone was the first MUD we ever tried. He used to actually skip school to play.
 
Ristamar said:
That's the GemStone offshoot, right? I remember that from my friend's AOL days. Gemstone was the first MUD we ever tried. He used to actually skip school to play.

Yep -- I guess there's a GemStone IV now or something.. pretty sure I got an email from them about it awhile ago trying to get me to sign up for it and get a discount or something.. Simutronics had a graphical MMO in development that everyone was looking forward to but it had its development shutdown after EQ took off and became so huge. I guess they figured it couldnt compete or something.
 
Gattsu25 said:
wow, this thread was not in vain. Recently began messing with Achaea and already put too much time into just the tutorial. The world this game takes place in and the detail put into describing everything gives the game a more 'real' feeling than most video games, IMO

I've been stuck for the past 20 minutes just reading up on all the info the various classes and guilds offer up...and even with my brief experiences...this game's learning and skill system is much better and in-depth than I expected

my only fear (and it is a big one) is that I *will* forget 80% of all these commands :b

much thanks to DarthWufei :D You are right about this game having a CRAZY amount of backstory, too :b
:lol No problem. It's really an amazing experience from a gamer's standpoint, I still get lightheaded over the huge amount of content in the game. I mean, there's politics going on for things like Ministers of War, Development, or Cultural Affairs. Actual players as well, and you're actually voting on who to elect and what laws to go into effect. I mean it's just really really indepth and intricate in design, very realistic, yet not, but completely believable.

Haha, anyways, have fun. I just checked to see if my character is intact. I'm still in my guild despite my absence heh. Anywho, have fun and all. :P It may seem somewhat overwhelming at first, but once you really get into and join guilds where you can ask for help and whatnot.. it gets quite fun and addicting. My most memorable moment was when I learned my first spell as a Sorcerer from my mentor., it was nothing special merely stoneskin, but the entire sequence of being taught is pretty cool when you first read it and I'm sure it's quite different for each class. That and the interview I had to take to join my guild, I can't believe I even got through it, quite a different experience than what I'm normally used to in online RPGs.

Nonetheless have fun. :lol If you ever run into Byrrk, one of my characters, feel free to say hello and all.
 
Can't really play it now due to the school's firewall but what I played yesterday was great...again, the atmosphere is absurd

I eventually became a Runewarden in the city of Cyrene named Arilius. If anyone plays this game and sees my character, be sure to send a tell :D

In retrospect, I've meant to make this thread since the very first time I heard the term MUD (a whiles ago) but never did...better late than never :D
 
novery said:
Funny. No, I played as a lizard man (Kang) in MajorMUD. Still my best gaming experience ever.


-rp

Holy crap. I played MajorMUD for 3 years or something. I could never have remembered the race was named Kang though! Although, I do remember they were immune to poison.. hah. I remember having little scripts that would circle an area getting exp for you.. hah, until your piece of crap modem disconnected that is.
 
I don't see how a mud is a hardcore version of a MMORPG. Muds are simply the predecessors of graphical muds which precede MMORPGs (the fancy term that some nitwit thought up, instead of simply keeping the term mud).
 
I'm not saying that they are hadore versions of MMOs or at least, that was not my intention

Just that whenever people discuss MMOs and the term 'hardcore' is brought up, at least one mention of a MUD usually follows

also: WTF Achaea??? I registered my character last night to avoid the purge and you STILL deleted him? BULLSHIT ;_;
 
Ah, the venerable MUD... Mortal Realms™ was my first experience with true addiction. One year of that "game" plus a new girlfriend equalled me flunking out of college. I think it took three years for my GPA to recover. :D

I'm convinced that MMORPGs in most forms are The Devil incarnate. Time-wasting, mind-flaying, job-killing, home-wrecking levelling treadmills that steal your time from real games!

Don't start down this path if you haven't before. No good can come of it!
 
hmm...I'm having some trouble getting a working MUD client...what do you guys use? (and don't say telnet :b)

zMUD trial is giving me problems...works fine until ~five minutes pass and I get flooded with 50 error messages
 
Gattsu25 said:
hmm...I'm having some trouble getting a working MUD client...what do you guys use? (and don't say telnet :b)

I used one called Tintin, but that ran on Unix. And it was in 1994 or so.

DFS.
 
Golem said:
used to play on the mud brad mcquaid played on...

http://ochen.raidgroup.net/pics/mmo/sojourn_web.gif

Woah! I used to play Sojourn all the time, I switched over to Duris once it split. Had a few high level chars, but I can't remember now if they were on Sojourn or Duris...

Kilmoril was a high level druid and Teflar was my thief. I was part of the Rowan Circle among other "high profile" guilds and I even started my own with some friend, The Obsidian Sphere. Hehe, ahhh, good times in my dorky youth.
 
Teflar said:
Hehe, ahhh, good times in my dorky youth.

Dorky youth? Lucky that you've outgrown it. Some of us are still sitting at our computers, rabidly following game news to the second and posting MUD recollections on a gaming forum. :D
 
Inumaru said:
Dorky youth? Lucky that you've outgrown it. Some of us are still sitting at our computers, rabidly following game news to the second and posting MUD recollections on a gaming forum.

Well, duh. That was my dorky youth. Now I am a dorky adult :) Subtle difference: I can buy my own games now! Woo!!
 
Wow, this is a freaky coincidence... My co-worker asked me the other day if I was into MUDs at all, and I was like "what the heck is a MUD?"
 
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