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Whoever at Sony thinks it's a good idea to have mundane and boring sections in their games needs to get fired

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
I think you kind of missed the point of those sections. The entire point was to give you that feeling of being stuck doing a job and the boring home life and him yearning for adventure again in his loft. Its a pretty short section in the grand scheme of things and was actually interesting in letting you live out his now mundane life and knowing why he betrayed Elena for that life again.
Oh, I did? The chapter being named "A Normal Life" wasn't enough of a clue? Drake shooting a toy gun after reminiscing about his old adventures wasn't blatant enough?

It was obvious within the first 30 seconds, but in good ol' patronizing fashion, those people think their players are idiots and have to beat them over the head with it in case it wasn't clear enough.

As you said though, it was short enough. That awful stealth chapter with kid Drake and Sam later on drags on for far too long though.
 
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MiguelItUp

Member
Forced walking and talking segments can be REALLY bad, especially when done poorly, and I feel like so many are. I understand wanting to make your game "immersive" and "movie-like", but you should remember it's a game, and the flow and overall feel matters more than anything else.
 

Crunchbox

Neo Member
Undiagnosed ADHD?

Maybe stick to fortnite
Yep i feel a lot of gamers have this in todays society. The only games in my opinion that do these sections right is sony because they actualy have good characters, actors, story, music, etc. the only small section sony went a little long in all the games i played of theirs was rangnarock atreus riding that thing with the girl part. That was the only part that went a little long and was a little slow. When i play non sony games like monster hunter wilds those are the ones that just arent that good because non sony studios really lack big time on a lot of things but id never complain because i dont have the need to be doing something 24/7 adhd smart phone tik tok, style addictions kids have today. They cant play something with substance or listen to long form content.
 
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Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Yep i feel a lot of gamers have this in todays society. The only games in my opinion that do these sections right is sony because they actualy have good characters, actors, story, music, etc. the only small section sony went a little long in all the games i played of theirs was rangnarock atreus riding that thing with the girl part. That was the only part that went a little long and was a little slow. When i play non sony games like monster hunter wilds those are the ones that just arent that good because non sony studios really lack big time on a lot of things but id never complain because i dont have the need to be doing something 24/7 adhd smart phone tik tok, style addictions kids have today. They cant play something with substance or listen to long form content.
The irony of that post is that long drawn out sections are an hallmark of modern games and the Tik Tok generation. Older games have none of that.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
These are absolutely tiny fractions of games that have several hours of varied and fun gameplay. I think it helps ground characters where they aren’t always adventuring, killing, shooting or solving puzzles. The boring down time elevates the exciting moments. But yeah, they should definitely have ways to speed through them for the second playthrough at least, if not the first. And of course, there is a lot of room for better writing. Like Ellie carrying the baby around, enjoying the views and herding sheep was phenomenal compared to the examples in the OP.
It's not a tiny fraction. There is a LOT of that in Spiderman 2.

-cleaning up the house
-spray painting as Hailey
-the Coney Island section
-All the Brooklyn Vision missions (gay homecoming, etc.)
-walk through school with Harry
-walk through the EMF
-walk through the museum as Miles
-walk through the hunter base as a waiter

It's like 30% of the missions are this stuff. They could have cut out at least a few of these and it would have helped the pacing and flow of the game a lot. This isn't even getting into the shitty stealth sections like the abandoned zoo.
 
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Shaki12345

Member
It's probably not one person but a group of idiots who feel that people actually enjoy those sections. You remember them, absolutely sleep-inducing parts such as the diving section in Uncharted 4 or the one where you're in the house and have to fetch dinner for Elena after Drake exposes his midlife crisis.

I decided to give Spider-Man 2 another shot. I figured maybe it gets better later on. In comes the part where I have to meet up with MJ at Peter's house. I'm forced into doing house chores like picking up trash I need to throw away while they reminisce about stuff I don't care about. It goes on and on and on. Next, I have to go upstairs and find some hidey-hole behind a frame on Peter's wall. This excruciating section finally ends after a bit more vapid dialogue. Fine, I'm ready to play as Spider-Man again. Nope. Enter Harry and he has me bike with him to their old school to find a USB thumb drive. I'm forced into a terrible "stealth" section where all I do is avoid some stupid security guard. It once again drags on and I have to repeat the exercise several times. Is it done? Nope. I gotta shoot hoops with Harry in the gymnasium.

Got fed up, turned that shit off. I probably spent 30 minutes between cutscenes, picking up trash, and listening to characters rambling.

Why do they keep doing this? It's not just Spider-Man either. In God of War Ragnarok, you're often forced into long walking sections and the first two hours of the game move at a glacial pace. The Atreus sections in Asgard, the dreaded Ironwood, and more. Why am I in Asgard and listening to Odin going on about his daily routine? Am I not playing God of War? In TLOU Part I, same shit at the start of the game. You walk with Tess and almost nothing happens for the first hour. You just go from place to place listening to boring shit. Just put this in a cutscene I can skip. It's like someone realized gamers hate long cutscenes, so what's their solution? Make them interactive! Except it's the same thing but worse because you cannot just skip them. You have to relive them every time. You push the stick to walk at a snail's pace. Instead of Drake just opening the fridge himself to get the food, you have to do it and actually look at what's inside and pick this up yourself. Why interrupt me shooting and fighting to do that?

They really need to stop this.

On the plus side, I finished Astro Bot which has none of that nonsense and is a million times better.
It doesn't have to be action all the time. Character building and world building is very important. If you want action, go play CoD.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
It doesn't have to be action all the time. Character building and world building is very important. If you want action, go play CoD.
Iron Man Eye Roll GIF
 

Shaki12345

Member
Yeah, taking out the trash is so much more fun.
It is, for just a bit. There's world building in that part. But I understand most people are wired to MTV style editing and pacing. Playing games with smartphone in their hand. Sad situation.

If you want to swing the whole damn time or fight than do that.
 

viveks86

Member
It's not a tiny fraction. There is a LOT of that in Spiderman 2.

-cleaning up the house
-spray painting as Hailey
-the Coney Island section
-All the Brooklyn Vision missions (gay homecoming, etc.)
-walk through school with Harry
-walk through the EMF
-walk through the museum as Miles
-walk through the hunter base as a waiter

It's like 30% of the missions are this stuff. They could have cut out at least a few of these and it would have helped the pacing and flow of the game a lot. This isn't even getting into the shitty stealth sections like the abandoned zoo.
I see. Haven’t played part 2 yet. Looks like it’s worse than I imagined :messenger_grinning_sweat:
 

Humdinger

Gold Member
I need variety in pacing, and part of that means slowing down. I find games that just stack one action mission on top of the next boring and tiresome. Shooters do this a lot, but so do other games. Granted, "boredom" is a subjective thing, and other people love this constant-action style. I find constant action boring, though. It's like listening to a singer who has no range, who can only sing in one key. I prefer a mixed pace, where fast alternates with slow, action with reflection/dialog, outer with inner.

However, the slower parts should be worthwhile; they should be interesting and engaging on their own. What OP is complaining about, if I understand correctly, is slow moments that are just dull and mundane. I agree with that. If you're going to make a slow sequence, make it interesting - something introspective, some quality dialog between characters, some world exposition.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
I need variety in pacing, and part of that means slowing down. I find games that just stack one action mission on top of the next boring and tiresome. Shooters do this a lot, but so do other games. Granted, "boredom" is a subjective thing, and other people love this constant-action style. I find constant action boring, though. It's like listening to a singer who has no range, who can only sing in one key. I prefer a mixed pace, where fast alternates with slow, action with reflection/dialog, outer with inner.

However, the slower parts should be worthwhile; they should be interesting and engaging on their own. What OP is complaining about, if I understand correctly, is slow moments that are just dull and mundane. I agree with that. If you're going to make a slow sequence, make it interesting - something introspective, some quality dialog between characters, some world exposition.
Exactly. Those slower parts don’t have to be boring. Some of the best quests in The Witcher 3 such as the Bloody Baron questline or A Tower Full of Mice barely involve you drawing your sword out to fight. You investigate and look for clues to figure out what happened and the lore and story are built within those.

There’s no action or fighting, but those are still great quests. Taking out the trash or beer from the fridge isn’t.
 
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Shaki12345

Member
Exactly. Those slower parts don’t have to be boring. Some of the best quests in The Witcher 3 such as the Bloody Baron questline or A Tower Full of Mice barely involve you drawing your sword out to fight. You investigate and look for clues to figure out what happened and the lore and story is built within those.

There’s no action or fighting, but those are great. Taking out the trash or beer from the fridge isn’t.
For a lot of people they are fun. They aren't for you. That's all there's to it.
 

Shaki12345

Member
No, you didn’t. At best you can say it didn’t bother you, but you’re not fooling anyone claiming you had fun doing that.
Lol mate. You don't decide what I like. I said earlier that the game's pacing is there for a reason and within that context I like the slow trash can mission. I want to feel like Peter and Peter, like all of us, has to take out the trash sometimes.
 

Shaki12345

Member
Not me. Are you saying there is absolutely 0 merit to this claim and no room for improvement?
There is room for improvement, but everyone can have their own opinion and taste. This game has the objective to make you feel like Peter. Like all of us, Peter has to take out the trash sometimes. It makes the big action set pieces feel more earned.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
There is room for improvement, but everyone can have their own opinion and taste. This game has the objective to make you feel like Peter. Like all of us, Peter has to take out the trash sometimes. It makes the big action set pieces feel more earned.
So boring the player to make the action more "earned" is a good thing? I don’t even.

Next, you’ll tell me you eat out of the trash can to make real food taste better.
 

Shaki12345

Member
So boring the player to make the action more "earned" is a good thing? I don’t even.

Next, you’ll tell me you eat out of the trash can to make real food taste better.
Everyone can have their own taste and opinion. We can't like everything the same mate.
 

Zacfoldor

Member
I get it but nobody does this worse than Square Enix in rebirth. Every story section if a filler made trudge from beginning to end. The rest of the game is pretty amazing but they find ways to arbitrarily slow your pacing and all the little pauses add up. Sucks. No more filler, ever.
 
I see. Haven’t played part 2 yet. Looks like it’s worse than I imagined :messenger_grinning_sweat:

It's pretty bad. I really enjoyed SM1 and SM:MM, but SM2 is really, really, REALLY stuffed with long boring sections of walking and talking, uninteresting side quests, and braindead QTEs. It's so bad that I think I'm done buying Sony first party games for a long time.

Unless it involves Returnal, Gravity Rush, Bloodborne, Demons Souls, or Astrobot.
 
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Pandawan

Member
I decided to give Spider-Man 2 another shot. I figured maybe it gets better later on. In comes the part where I have to meet up with MJ at Peter's house. I'm forced into doing house chores like picking up trash I need to throw away while they reminisce about stuff I don't care about. It goes on and on and on.

More than this senction i hated section at the Coney Island Park
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
I like how you chose Sony games especially despite this issue not being exclusive to them.

Its clever farming posts from highly acclaimed +90 games. I commend you
Their games have competent gameplay and those sections take away from the fun. I could have said RDR2, but the entire game is boring, so the walking sections don’t feel out of place or break the pacing.
 
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Slow boring sections are why I stopped playing the GoW 2018 after like five hours or so. I’ve tried to get back into it like two more times and can’t. It’s the same design Gears and Uncharted made popular in the PS360 gen and I hate it. If the entire game is like that and it’s just that type of game, ok. If it’s lore or story building, ok. But 99% of the time it isn’t, it’s artistic nonsense.

It’s less common nowadays.
 

Fake

Member
I fucking hate when this happens in God of War.

This is so fucking boring. Almost drop my dualshock when this happens.

The problem is the dialogue is so cring and boring that make those sections annoying.

Witcher 3 have a bunch of dialogue, but is well write, so is doesn't gets bored in the end.
 
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Sethbacca

Member
Stories aren't just go go go all the time. You need periods of exposition and lulls in the action to make the high parts hit harder. That's just basic storytelling. Honestly, I just don't get the ADHD addled need to be pressing buttons 500 times a second or the declaration is that the game is HURR DURR WALKING SIMULATOR. Maybe games with a heavy narrative story focus just aren't for you? I imagine a lot of people who feel this way just don't do a lot of reading or something.
 
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diffusionx

Gold Member
Stories aren't just go go go all the time. You need periods of exposition and lulls in the action to make the high parts hit harder. Honestly, I just don't get the ADHD addled need to be pressing buttons 500 times a second or the declaration is that the game is HURR DURR WALKING SIMULATOR. Maybe games with a heavy narrative story focus just aren't for you? I imagine a lot of people who feel this way just don't do a lot of reading or something.
As I pointed out it's a good 20-30% of the total content in the game. When you already have as much downtime as you need in terms of exploring the city and collecting spiders or whatever.

Pacing in Spiderman 2 is totally FUCKED.
 

Sethbacca

Member
As I pointed out it's a good 20-30% of the total content in the game. When you already have as much downtime as you need in terms of exploring the city and collecting spiders or whatever.

Pacing in Spiderman 2 is totally FUCKED.
Realistically though if you just stick to the base storyline and skip the side missions it's pretty straightforward. You have the choice of whether you wanna do most of the stuff that most people complain about.
 

viveks86

Member
There is room for improvement, but everyone can have their own opinion and taste. This game has the objective to make you feel like Peter. Like all of us, Peter has to take out the trash sometimes. It makes the big action set pieces feel more earned.
I get that. I was defending the concept too. But I haven’t played spiderman part 2. So if someone says there is way too much of it, I have to consider it. Certainly don’t think there was too much in ND games and whatever they did, grounded the story and added a layer of depth to characters.

Taking out the trash could also be made interesting if they chose to. Otherwise, where do you draw the line? Peter needs to take a dump too. Drink water, scrub the dishes, laundry, brush his teeth, take a shower, moisturize his skin etc. we do all this in real life already. There has to be more creative input to it to hold the players’ attention and be worth doing. It has to be “Peter had to take out the trash and… he discovered something”. If they did that, then I have no complaints. Otherwise it’s all just lazy filler
 

Shaki12345

Member
I get that. I was defending the concept too. But I haven’t played spiderman part 2. So if someone says there is way too much of it, I have to consider it. Certainly don’t think there was too much in ND games and whatever they did, grounded the story and added a layer of depth to characters.

Taking out the trash could also be made interesting if they chose to. Otherwise, where do you draw the line? Peter needs to take a dump too. Drink water, scrub the dishes, laundry, brush his teeth, take a shower, moisturize his skin etc. we do all this in real life already. There has to be more creative input to it to hold the players’ attention and be worth doing. It has to be “Peter had to take out the trash and… he discovered something”. If they did that, then I have no complaints. Otherwise it’s all just lazy filler
It's just some dude's opinion. Play the game and judge for yourself. It's all subjective anyway.
 

Ebrietas

Member
Agreed. I quit Horizon after 30 minutes because of this and endless tutorials. Most AAA games are like this now. Devs are too afraid to let you just play the game. They are designed like tightly controlled theme park rides.

It’s actually shocking how little “game” there is in UC4 compared to 1-3, which were already criticized as “movie-games” in that gen.
 
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diffusionx

Gold Member
Realistically though if you just stick to the base storyline and skip the side missions it's pretty straightforward. You have the choice of whether you wanna do most of the stuff that most people complain about.
No, a huge chunk of main missions are this.

I don't know why people keep trying to shill for this game. It's ok, but heavily flawed and a major misstep.
 

Sethbacca

Member
No, a huge chunk of main missions are this.

I don't know why people keep trying to shill for this game. It's ok, but heavily flawed and a major misstep.
I'll admit the pacing could have been better, it really was a bit longer than it needed to be. I don't think it's the colossal problem that people are making it out to be either though.
 

Represent.

Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Finding another way around a door to pad your games length 50 times a game isn't my idea of intelligent game design.

Let me fucking shoot through it, I have a grenade, a shotgun and a chainsaw.

Slow walking sections, that are vital to the story >>>> that SHIT
 
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GymWolf

Member
silly shit like that should be made into a cutscene for the sake of everyone's sanity. Or at least able to be skipped in the second playthrough.


yeah but people play through good games twice
Lmao, majority of people don't even complete games once, there is a reason why when we read a completition rate of 50% for a game we think it's an incredible result.

Gaf really oversell how many people replay games.
 
Go play Doom Eternal.

The game is pure fun from beginning to end.

Most games are fucking boring.

Useless dialogue.

Forced walking.

Pointless open world travel.
Even Doom Eternal has "downtime", but it's more like walking through areas without combat. If it was purely shootingtcombat for 20 hours straight, it would get boring. Or maybe boring isn't the best word. "Tiring".
 
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