Well, I agree that the impact in this case is absolutely trivial, which is why I'm in favor of a de minimis exception.
Edit: spelling hard.
Why a gay law professor is trying to shut down women-only Wonder Woman screenings.
- Thread starter torre_avenue
- Start date
Well, I agree that the impact in this case is absolutely trivial, which is why I'm in favor of a de minimis exception.
Edit: spelling hard.
Gotdatmoney
Member
I mean it's discrimination, but its so motherfucking irrelevant that it bugs me men have to be so fucking childish about it. Women's only showing of a movie is so harmless you know the men complaining about it are just the ass hats that wanna cause issues to assert their dominance or w/e the fuck they think they're doing.
Frozenprince
Banned
One incident of "sexism by women", national outrage, news story, media narrative.
Wage Gap, implicit employment discrimination, everyday sexism.
Nada. Zilch. Zippo.
Wage Gap, implicit employment discrimination, everyday sexism.
Nada. Zilch. Zippo.
excelsiorlef
Member
Yep.
The tickets for these showings were publicly on sale for anyone. They are not allowed to disallow men from purchasing or using said tickets. If they wanted to avoid local public accommodation laws by making it a private event the distribution of tickets would have to be by invite or some other non public facing sale. This lawyer will almost certainly win the case and they will have to change the language.
Wage gap is in the news all the time... it's how we know about the phrase "wage gap."
https://www.google.com/search?q=wag...d=chrome&ie=UTF-8#q=wage+gap&safe=off&tbm=nws
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
If there were a "men's only" showing I would find it equally disturbing. Publically approved gender discrimination is not a precedent that ought to be encouraged.
hammysaurusrex
Member
Gay man puts being a man first, news at 11.
And I bet you there's a large overlap between the men complaining about this screening as on the same level of Jim Crow-era discrimination and the men who think the wage gap is overblown or non-existent.
I'd agree with you there.
T
Transhuman
Unconfirmed Member
Speaking out against discrimination. What an asshole.
Being against banning women from gay bars. What an asshole.
LinkAndEpona
Banned
There are other bakeries too.
Gotdatmoney
Member
This is the most dishonest framing ever.
You say it's discrimination, but you say nobody should care because this particular instance feels harmless and irrelevant. Who are you to decide what's harmless or irrelevant? Why not just follow the law?
In this instance, I'd agree the discrimination is harmless and irrelevant. I think most reasonable observers would feel similarly. It sounds like a nice thing that will make some deserving people feel good without causing any real harm.
But we don't use a bunch of random observers' gut intuitions to decide when to tolerate discrimination. We follow laws. Because next time those observers' gut intuitions might be wrong, and some genuinely harmful discrimination might get a pass because we've set as the bar whether observers feel comfortable instead of respecting the opinions of those who say they feel affected.
I'm guess I'm surprised at how angry and insulting people in this thread have gotten. This board constantly asks for open-mindedness and understanding when it relates to an issue we support. But as soon as we disagree with a given issue, we jump all over the opposition without any real attempt to be considerate of others' perspectives.
CherryIcee
Member
Another bakery within the same bakery?
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Can we stop with the fucking bakery comparison? It's not banning men from watching a movie, it's a ONE TIME screening.
Jesus christ.
Jesus christ.
Poltergust
Member
There are other bakeries within a bakery?
Men living in a country where a bunch of old geezers gathered in a room, and decided on the future health (or lack there of) of the women in their country, are now trying to convince us to care that a few showings of a female led superhero film are going to be women only. Cry me a fucking river.
LinkAndEpona
Banned
Seeing the movie in a different theater room vs telling the bakery it's for a hetero wedding.
Sure they're different situations, but, both solutions require little energy however they are still discrimination that affects the emotions nonetheless.
It doesn't reflect well on society to allow one act of discrimination but not the other.
I have to wonder how much work this gay man has down to make LGBTQ spaces more inclusive and less racist. But still, we have things like Black gay pride because that segment of the community along with other PoC are ostracized by the community at large.
This is such a wasted effort and reeks of the same attitude a lot of straight men have. A minority or marginalized demographic gets one table scrap and this is the result.
I feel like people forget, even those marginalized on an axis that people want to feel safe and secure while viewing something. That clubs and 'safe spaces' have value and it's not segregation or will lead to systemic disenfranchisement.
But hey, maybe this lawyer will write a piece on gay racism and lead lectures to other white community members to be more inclusive!!
This is such a wasted effort and reeks of the same attitude a lot of straight men have. A minority or marginalized demographic gets one table scrap and this is the result.
I feel like people forget, even those marginalized on an axis that people want to feel safe and secure while viewing something. That clubs and 'safe spaces' have value and it's not segregation or will lead to systemic disenfranchisement.
But hey, maybe this lawyer will write a piece on gay racism and lead lectures to other white community members to be more inclusive!!
What did he mean by this?
Member
Gotta love when they add the [marginalized group] descriptor in there as if it prevents them from being a dipshit
Poltergust
Member
You don't have a separate ticket counter for each theater. Anyone can still see the movie at the exact same time this is going on.
Any man whose emotions are affected by one theater in one city in one state doing one screening of one movie that's ladies only is either lying or after something. There is no way in hell I believe any of the people railing against this are anything but disingenuous about it. It's nonsensical. There are definitely agendas in play here, but none of them are on the part of Alamo Drafthouse or the women who want to see a movie as a group.
Men can see the movie in the exact same building on the same night with other women who do not choose to attend the women only screening. There's no discrimination happening here by any real world or reasonable definition of the word.
LinkAndEpona
Banned
Sure, just in seperate rooms.
Putting aside that you fully admitted that your framing of the two is complete rubbish, no one is being discriminated against due to the existence of ta Wonder Woman woman-only showing. You can still see the movie in the theater where said showing is taking place, just not during that specific showing. You're not banned or barred from seeing the movie and, more to the point, not barred from seeing it due to your sexual orientation.
chicken_pasta
Banned
To be fair, I think the way the initial publicity and Facebook responses were terribly handled and left the Alamo Drafthouse extremely vulnerable to people like him, who have the legal knowledge to screw them over for the heck of it.
A better language would've not only protected them from this, but I'm pretty sure it would've also conveyed the message (and enraged the people it originally enraged).
A better language would've not only protected them from this, but I'm pretty sure it would've also conveyed the message (and enraged the people it originally enraged).
ok then go see the movie in a different theater or even at the same theater at a different time
Separate but equal
2017 is a hell of a year
Again, the bakery conflations are dumb because the bakery in question refused all service on the basis of the customer's sexual orientation, and then they doxxed the couple.
This isn't the same thing as what the Alamo is doing and men of all persuasions should stop using it as a counter example.
This isn't the same thing as what the Alamo is doing and men of all persuasions should stop using it as a counter example.
LinkAndEpona
Banned
So now we're resorting to sexist fallacies, men should always be strong willed and not be bothered by what you think are small issues.
Can someone explain to me, why there is the need for women-only screenings of Wonder Woman? Why not women-only restaurants? Or women-only pavements? Does it make discrimination against women in any way better to give them something totally meaningless back?
"See, you earn only 80% of what that dickhead in the next office gets, but at least you can watch Wonder Women without any men in the room. You wouldn't see them as soon as the film starts, but whatever".
Why don't we just bring segregation back, but now based on gender instead of race.
I'm a gay man btw. In case you want to call me misogynistic now. Go ahead!
"See, you earn only 80% of what that dickhead in the next office gets, but at least you can watch Wonder Women without any men in the room. You wouldn't see them as soon as the film starts, but whatever".
Why don't we just bring segregation back, but now based on gender instead of race.
I'm a gay man btw. In case you want to call me misogynistic now. Go ahead!
Two showings at the fucking Ritz location at that
Do you think the ladies only theater room has better accommodations or is in some way taking away men's dignity simply through exclusion?
Because you realize that was the practical problem with separate but equal, right?
Gotdatmoney
Member
I'm the person that knows a ladies night or a women's only gym day is not a big fucking deal. No long lasting damage has never come from these things, we all know it. This is the stupidest framing ever, we all know this is not a big deal, playing contrarian here doesn't make people look like they are really concerned about civil liberties, it just makes you look like an ass arguing for the sake of arguing.
The laws were not designed to protect men from women only showings of Wonder Women. They were designed to protect marginalized groups from damaging discriminatory practices. The fact that we are now pretending like this situation is truly the laws aim is so disingenuous. That's why I can call this harmless and still say it's discriminatory. But I'm not gonna put on the cape and pretend this is about "ethics" and not a bunch of annoying man babies throwing a tantrum.
The perspectives of the people trying to stop this showing are beyond dumb. I am open minded when the actual issue is deserving of nuance. This is not one of those issues.
Jesus Christ. One are historically marginalized groups, the others aren't. Women and the LGBTQ community have been and still are marginalized; men and Heterosexuals are not.
I don't think anyone actually unironically using "separate but equal" with a women's movie showing actually knows what "separate but equal" actually entailed.
A women-only screening for one night of a movie is not discrimination.
The two aren't mutually exclusive, not calling you misogynistic btw so don't get it twisted!
Well, we have to take men's feelings into account so I would presume there is some basis in the comparison between the Alamo and decades of codified white supremacy. *sighs*
Not to mention while also having showings that aren't women only.
Future Foundation
Member
It will never cease to amaze me how certain topics will just end in people showing their ass.
LinkAndEpona
Banned
Indeed, imagine if this was an amusemwmt park. You have to ride different rides than your friends, not because of rider capacity, but because of your gender. How much fun would that be?
Sure this situation was for a small venue, but who is not to say it's a start of something that would occur commonly?
Nobody needs to see a specific screening at all. A company saw a chance to do a fun gimmick and make some money. It's in a tiny theater. People who don't actually care pretended to care and THAT is what pissed me off. The disingenuous whining for the sake of it.
They do "tough guy cinema" once a month. They do gay events. People got mad over the wording of a silly thing that will literally not negatively effect anyone.
If that bakery told the gay couple that they couldn't make their cake on Wednesday, but could do it Thursday or any day after that, then it would be a good comparison.
Poltergust
Member
And...? An Alamo theater is an Alamo theater. And how does this relate to your bakery point at all?
You wouldn't even know that anything happened as you purchase your ticket unless you specifically looked it up because it's the exact same experience no matter which room you go to.
Like every other stupid comparison, this is also one fucking stupid one was well. You and your friends can all go on the same goddamn ride.
chicken_pasta
Banned
Pretty sure not.
Poltergust
Member
What are you talking about? The theater isn't separating groups at all.
Gotdatmoney
Member
There is no slippery slope here.
One of these is a refusal of all service because the owners are making a discriminatory call based on a hatred of gay people. The other is a women's only showing of a movie meant to celebrate and empower women. It is not permanent. It also doesn't result in a situation in which men are being denied the opportunity to watch the movie. It doesn't deny men the ability to watch the movie with women. And it doesn't deny them the ability to watch the movie in that location.
Again, entirely dishonest framing.
lol
not even that
the bakery said that for one time there would be a different pickup area like 10 feet away