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[dano1]

Everybody is entitled to receive a working product the moment he pays for it. He doesn't have to wait for the developer to fix his shit. Get over it.

It was working when he paid for it! And got 50+ hours out of it.

 

[Z3M0G]

And you don't know what you're talking about. I did not "objectively didn't like" it. I didn't know enough about it right away. This game wasn't something you could tell immediately that it was bad. As I said in a previous post, I hadn't really been hyped about it at release. I watched the giant bomb quick look, thought it might be good based on the little footage I saw, and bought it.

Like almost every game these days, even the good ones, they will often be front loaded with content that isn't always the best part of the game. So I played it...played it..and just kept waiting for the good parts...some point in the game that would make me go "oooh, thats cool". But it never comes with NMS. It starts lackluster, and stays lackluster. It even gets worse once you add on the technical issues, but it almost feels like the game itself is just as deceptive as hello games themselves are. It starts you out with the promise that you'll be discovering these interesting places on worlds, and you'll go from planet to planet, and maybe discover new things. What ends up happening is that every fucking planet feels the same, and just is a different color!

Every damn location you find on a surface of the planets have no variation in them, and it isn't apparent up front, so you have to play it for a long time to even realize you've been tricked into thinking this is some massive diverse universe.

Problems with the game aside. I can go on and on about how deceptive the game itself is, but I feel like the reason I expected a refund is this is not what I thought I was paying $60 for. Even without listening to their messaging prior to release, I could say I felt lied to just as a consumer. You expect a certain level of quality from a $60 retail game that is marketed as a finished product. This is not that. They can call it that, but had they been honest about what exactly this game was, no one would have bought it at $60. That's why they lied I think. They wanted to scam people into paying more than it was worth, so they had to promise a $60 game i if they were going to charge that much. They didn't give a game of that quality thought, which is why I would expect a refund.

If Hello games were honest, and said this was an early access game, and priced it at something more in line with it's content, then people would not be in the uproar they are now.

I must give them the benefit of the doubt and not assume that they intentionally wanted to scam anyone. They hoped and dreamed to give a $60 product. They had a deadline. They failed to meet their goals. They didn't know how to handle the situation.

This isn't malicious intent... it is simply incompetence.

 

[Jinfash]

I've been playing the game for ~20 hrs, enjoying it for what it is, but I'm still in the first star system.

I trust Kyoufu, and if he says crashes started occurring more frequently after the system than that worries me. I'm considering making a few jumps already just to test the stability. And if I end up getting crashes as frequent as he did, with continued silence from HG about the stability of the game closer to the galaxy, I'm going to request a refund as well.

This is unacceptable. At least communicate better the roadmap of fixes with possible dates. Is it a week? Two? A month? More? I already gave the $60 upfront based on a promise. Should have paid $20, and got charged a few $ for every patch.

KIDDING!

Maybe.

 

[Kyoufu]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

I didn't pay for 50 hours of playtime. Shit, imagine if Destiny or Elite: Dangerous or whatever did that after 50 hours. You'd be just as upset and entitled to your money back.

 

[Trojan]

You...you don't know what you're talking about.

I think that logic makes a lot of sense for any number of things, what does he not know?

 

[Farewell]

Who the fuck even decides if you got your moneys worth after playing 50 hours? Like wtf, is that a law?

 

[LostDonkey]

OK. This is borderline bullying at this point. The only guy who's come out and said "I've had 50 hours of gameplay and it broke on me so I refunded it" is Kyoufu. Those of you saying "it's sick", "you know who you are" and saying he should feel ashamed, shouldn't IMO post in this thread. He's resorted to leaving the Internet for a while because he feels ashamed at something he WAS ENTITLED to do.

The game crashed CONSTANTLY after 50 hours for him. He deserved the refund. Period.

Without reading up on wtf your talking about makes the situation worse and makes someone feel guilty when they shouldn't feel guilty at all. That is BULLYING.

You may think you're defending a game you love but the game is genuinely broken. I got a refund today after 80 hours played, I enjoyed it, loved it even and had a great time posting in the OT'S but the same happened to me. The game kept on crashing and didn't get better with patches so I exercised my right by law to a refund. These crashes can brick your console btw, it's been reported. If that isn't a case for a refund I don't know what is.

Posts just get brushed off with excuses like "but I'm talking about people who have played 50 hours and refunded because they didn't like it". STOP. Where are these legendary people? Nowhere because you came in here to post about Kyoufu and once your bullying posts fell or were ripped apart you thought you could save face.

The damage is done. You've bullied someone into leaving Gaf so I hope you feel proud.

+1 great post.

 

[Wickerbasket]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

Who gets to decide what my moneys worth is? Is it fine if companies design their games to stop working after 50 hours so I have to buy a new copy?

Where do you draw the line?

 

[Beefy]

OK. This is borderline bullying at this point. The only guy who's come out and said "I've had 50 hours of gameplay and it broke on me so I refunded it" is Kyoufu. Those of you saying "it's sick", "you know who you are" and saying he should feel ashamed, shouldn't IMO post in this thread. He's resorted to leaving the Internet for a while because he feels ashamed at something he WAS ENTITLED to do.

The game crashed CONSTANTLY after 50 hours for him. He deserved the refund. Period.

Without reading up on wtf your talking about makes the situation worse and makes someone feel guilty when they shouldn't feel guilty at all. That is BULLYING.

You may think you're defending a game you love but the game is genuinely broken. I got a refund today after 80 hours played, I enjoyed it, loved it even and had a great time posting in the OT'S but the same happened to me. The game kept on crashing and didn't get better with patches so I exercised my right by law to a refund. These crashes can brick your console btw, it's been reported. If that isn't a case for a refund I don't know what is.

Posts just get brushed off with excuses like "but I'm talking about people who have played 50 hours and refunded because they didn't like it". STOP. Where are these legendary people? Nowhere because you came in here to post about Kyoufu and once your bullying posts fell or were ripped apart you thought you could save face.

The damage is done. You've bullied someone into leaving Gaf so I hope you feel proud.

Damn Kyoufu left gaf?

 

[spidye]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

I am sorry to say this but this is really not for you to decide.

 

[LostDonkey]

Who the fuck even decides if you got your moneys worth after playing 50 hour playing time? Like wtf, is that a law?

Not only that but this is a game that was advertised as an infinite universe, you could walk around planets for years, etc etc. 50 hours is enough to do all that? Really?

 

[cyberheater]

I didn't pay for 50 hours of playtime. Shit, imagine if Destiny or Elite: Dangerous or whatever did that after 50 hours. You'd be just as upset and entitled to your money back.

Yes. I agree with you.

 

[samn]

What makes this pile-on even worse is that he didn't force or co-erce Sony into giving him the refund. They were perfectly capable of saying no. He made a polite request and they granted it.

 

[Violence Jack]

People still think this is about the time/enjoyment a game has provided...

That doesn't matter if after some arbitrary amount of hours (which depend on how fast you explore) your game starts crashing left and right and effectively prevents you from progressing and enjoying the rest of the content you paid for.

I was just about to post something like this. If I'm enjoying a game so much that I put 50 hours into it, but it starts crashing so often to the point that I can no longer progress any further, then I damn sure would get a refund if offered. It would be different if HG said that they are working on a patch to fix the issue, but I don't think they've said a word about that.

 

[BahamutPT]

It's not, but playing 50 hours of something to get to that point is. Get a refund at 5 hours, 50 just means you wanted to have your cake and eat it too.

Or it means the game was completely playable until then and after some point something in the game code snapped and it became an unplayable, broken mess...

Ever hear of this thing called a patch? Maybe instead of calling refund customer support you call game customer support and help everyone!!!

Ever heard of this thing called QA which is a developer/publisher process of making sure the game is actually playable in its entirety? You know... something people are actually paid for as a career?

And patches were the saviours of Skyrim on PS3, right? Even with the amount of users contributing to fix it it still remained a mess.

Why should a user wait for an hypothetical patch that may never come or fix their problems? And if a patch actually never comes how long would it be acceptable to wait until a user demands a refund?
Why should the benefit of the doubt be given to companies who don't communicate with their users?
Why should a player support a game that becomes broken after a while and on top of that have to debug and register all problems?

Maybe instead of putting that onus on players, you should start demanding better from companies. Why is this one of the few industries where we should accept a product having defects at launch to be the norm?

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

I'm reading this now, and I may be crazy, but I don't think having a game crash on you all the time after a certain point is him getting his moneys worth. i don't believe that was ever a part of the deal.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

And...blocked.

 

[Venom Fox]

Damn Kyoufu left gaf?

He's back now. It took me quite a while to write that and I think he's listened to us telling him not to.

 

[Skyzard]

Crashes are bad and you'd hope people submit reports and you also hope they get addressed but that's up to the individual really if they want to wait or take that gamble.

The people I feel bad for is all those kids grinding away through the game to get to the center.

 

[Kyoufu]

Damn Kyoufu left gaf?

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

 

[MattyG]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

Yeah, you know what they say, "You pays your money, you takes your choice."

 

[Seventy70]

It's also funny how when businesses do shitty things like take advantage of what's available to them it's "just business", but when someone genuinely has a reason for getting a refund or using the system to their advantage, suddenly it's "what a theif! That poor business."

 

[Meffer]

Ever hear of this thing called a patch? Maybe instead of calling refund customer support you call game customer support and help everyone!!!

Or maybe he rather have a refund. His choice doesn't hurt or effect you.

 

[Tony Iron Man Stark]

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

You're fine.

Sony decided to refund you. They sided with you. Enjoy your Sunday the best you can.

 

[RawNuts]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

How much for just one hour?

 

[Asmodai48]

This guy is such a fucking coward. Blocking people who are just asking a question (non aggressively)

 

[LostDonkey]

Patches sure worked for Just Cause 3 didn't they. Why do we have this pro patch culture all of a sudden as if everything can be fixed by them.

 

[Venom Fox]

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

You shouldn't have to defend yourself. You did the right thing and there's HUNDREDS of people agreeing including me.

Don't let people get you down over things they're too ignorant to want to understand.

 

[Narag]

Shahid's the wrong kind of zealot here and reading back through his feed concerning NMS, way too invested in its success. I imagine due to how his own was intertwined with it at the time when he still worked for Sony.

I'm wary of him as a dev now given his stance on this. I'd hate to see his reaction if a project he directly worked on faced a similar issue because he's not handling this well now.

 

[Z3M0G]

I've played for less than 10 hours.

I had only one crash but it made me lose my ship when I wasn't sure I wanted to trade for a new one.

So far the game has been fun, but I know what is to come and not sure if I should press on because of that.

I am considering seeking a refund. Am I wrong to do so?

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

You don't own anyone anything, and that includes developers that push out seemingly busted games.

 

[SolidChamp]

OK. This is borderline bullying at this point. The only guy who's come out and said "I've had 50 hours of gameplay and it broke on me so I refunded it" is Kyoufu. Those of you saying "it's sick", "you know who you are" and saying he should feel ashamed, shouldn't IMO post in this thread. He's resorted to leaving the Internet for a while because he feels ashamed at something he WAS ENTITLED to do.

The game crashed CONSTANTLY after 50 hours for him. He deserved the refund. Period.

Without reading up on wtf your talking about makes the situation worse and makes someone feel guilty when they shouldn't feel guilty at all. That is BULLYING.

You may think you're defending a game you love but the game is genuinely broken. I got a refund today after 80 hours played, I enjoyed it, loved it even and had a great time posting in the OT'S but the same happened to me. The game kept on crashing and didn't get better with patches so I exercised my right by law to a refund. These crashes can brick your console btw, it's been reported. If that isn't a case for a refund I don't know what is.

Posts just get brushed off with excuses like "but I'm talking about people who have played 50 hours and refunded because they didn't like it". STOP. Where are these legendary people? Nowhere because you came in here to post about Kyoufu and once your bullying posts fell or were ripped apart you thought you could save face.

The damage is done. You've bullied someone into leaving Gaf so I hope you feel proud.

Oh I'm fucking out now. This thread is a shitshow beyond reproach. When the people accusing others of not reading can't even be bothered to read and understand the context of a post themselves...yeah, it's time to bail.

 

[hamchan]

Thank you. I just really despise what Murray and his company pulled here - He came out as an Indie developer, committed fraud and gave us all a bad name.

Any developer out there should be disgusted by the practices Murray used here and I hope that he doesn't end up as the shining example for other shady developers who promise the sky and then deliver something that's everything but without EVER informing their potential customers. I really hope nobody sees this as a 'Well, it worked for No Man's Sky, so we can probably pull the same stunt and get rich!".

Murray probably made a good 20-30m USD already on No Man's Sky and you could argue that he got that level of 'success' by basically just being a lying, shady Snake-Oil Salesman. And the moment the game was released and they made bank, they went into hiding and refused to answer any of their customers concerns... So yes, I'm glad that people who feel fucked over by Murray and his crew get their money back.

Thank you and you're right. It hurts all the other developers too to have someone just lie and deceive the gaming audience. There's a trust between the consumer and developer there that gets damaged every time it happens.

Btw, Ori and the Blind Forest is an awesome game and I wish you all the success in the world.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Huh. Playstation must be getting slammed with requests. I didn't even get a wait time.

I'm getting a "we are currently experiencing a high volume and wait times. For up to date.... bla bla bla. Thanks for your patience".

 

[Ibuki]

What makes this pile-on even worse is that he didn't force or co-erce Sony into giving him the refund. They were perfectly capable of saying no. He made a polite request and they granted it.

He lives in the UK so they have an obligation to refund digital products.

 

[Meffer]

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

You're totally fine, man. You wanted a refund and your reason is fine.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

The problem I have is do I wait and believe Hello will fix/patch/add stuff, hoping the entire product pulls a 'DriveClub'-like turn around or just return it?

I'm not as violently angry at Murray and Co like some are here, but my patience is running thin.

I'm also getting hit with crashes a lot and it's sucking away the enjoyment I have with this game.
PS4 physical copy from Amazon, so I don't even know if I can return it. Might be SOL anyway. :/

 

[gwarm01]

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

Don't listen to them. I don't know why so many people go out of their way to justify being taken advantage of by commercial entities. They advertised a game that you could play for the rest of your life and never complete, then delivered a game that stopped working after a week of playing it. People calling you a thief must lack serious perspective in life.

 

[Deaf Spacker]

I wonder if this will be picked up by the BBC etc?

 

[SomTervo]

there's catharsis in complaining and sharing about a bad experience and being lied to by unscrupulous people. don't turn it against me.

Idk, there's a difference between catharsis and callousness. I'm glad you have good vibes about the vindication but the "they'll just add paid DLC" statement just sounds like indulgent bitterness.

Ironically they said updates would only be charged for if they had financial challenges... Which seems much more likely today than a few weeks ago!

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I'm conflicted. I agree you should get a refund because the game is fundamentally broken but on the other had you've had 50 hours of play time on the clock. You've had your moneys worth.

How are you able to tell him how much his money is worth?

No because for some reason I feel like I have to defend myself. I don't even know why.

But I really want to just step away because to me, being refunded for a broken product is a no-brainer and it boggles my mind that I'm being called a thief for doing this.

dunno why but a lot of people omneogaf can be very corporate defensive instead of consumer oriented. It's just weird considering the majority are consumers.

 

[Wickerbasket]

Even if the game wasn't crashing, if it takes someone 50 hours to find out that the game wasn't as advertised, then they should still get their money back.

That's the drawback to lying about what you're selling.

 

[Jobbs]

Idk, there's a difference between catharsis and callousness. I'm glad you have good vibes about the vindication but the "they'll just add paid DLC" statement just sounds like indulgent bitterness.

Ironically they said updates would only be charged for if they had financial challenges... Which seems much more likely today than a few weeks ago!

It is absolutely indulgent bitterness. That's accurate. I'm bitter I paid $60 based on hype and promises and got something that in no way resembled what I was sold on. Not even close. It's not the same game. The "game" is missing.

The silver lining is I'm getting enjoyment out of the shit show.

You can't really call it schadenfreude because HG has profited immensely from the hype and preorders and day one sales.

 

[LostDonkey]

Just out of curiosity Does Steam support now work on Sundays?

I see people reaching PS support today but I've had no reply back from a ticket I raised yesterday (Sat) in the UK. It's currently 16:08 Sunday.

 

[NightShift]

I put probably 10 hours into the game in the first week and dropped it due to consistent crashes. I don't know whenever I should refund the game though. I do feel ripped off and I don't want to support the shitty practices Hello Games used to sell the game but I did enjoy it when I could. I doubt Sony would accept my request anyway.

 

[joshlpaige]

I have had a string of bad crashes and a loss of items due to clipping through planet surfaces. The rep on the PSN Live Chat said, "You've played 5%, so you may not get a refund."

I guess I'll keep trying?

 

[heliosRAzi]

I don't care if your car catches on fire after 50,000 miles, you had your fun with it.

 

[Tony Iron Man Stark]

I have had a string of bad crashes and a loss of items due to clipping through planet surfaces. The rep on the PSN Live Chat said, "You've played 5%, so you may not get a refund."

I guess I'll keep trying?

Talk to another agent in PSN Live Chat and don't come back until you get your $60 back.

 

[The Hamburglar]

Game was falsely advertised, director told continuous lies and had technical issues. People are fully entitled to a refund, I don't see why people are being attacked for getting a refund on a product as described above.

Are people trying to justify their own purchase and time sank into this game?

 

[Venom Fox]

Oh I'm fucking out now. This thread is a shitshow beyond reproach. When the people accusing others of not reading can't even be bothered to read and understand the context of a post themselves...yeah, it's time to bail.

I read your posts. Every one directed at a certain member. Even though you tried to hide that fact. Your clarification didn't make sense when there are no others here who have been refunded after playing 50 hours. I understand you were trying to say people will jump on the bandwagon and I agree. I really do but those imaginary people who have played for 50 hours and were refunded because they didn't like it, who you were seemingly mad at don't exist until we see them.

Edit: I'm highly off topic now and I don't want to risk being banned so I am also out of this conversation.