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[Neoxon]

They may as well not exist and it would not make a difference, The point is Marvel has made plenty of turds.

I don't see 2 turds out of 12 films as plenty (Iron Man 2 & Thor 2). One could argue for Incredible Hulk, but that's debatable.

The worst you can say about their movies is that they are bland and formulaic. They at least understand the source material and cater to their audience. Fox just shits out movies made by committee taht are objectively bad.

And your point about the rights still doesn't make any sense, especially considering the history of Marvel licenses.

This. As the reviews are proving, Fox didn't make this movie because they had an idea. They made it because they wanted to retain the rights.

 

[Siegcram]

That the rights go one way and no one is critical of Marvel movies to the point where they want the rights given to someone else. I understand Marvel owns the rights, but it's petty to want the rights given back if the movie is bad considering Marvel does have bad movies.

The worst you can say about their movies is that they are bland and formulaic. They at least understand the source material and cater to their audience. Fox just shits out movies made by committee that are objectively bad and miss every target audience by a mile.

And your point about the rights still doesn't make any sense, especially considering the history of Marvel licenses.

 

[Kathian]

*psst* - the Fantastic Four are just a bad group of unengaging characters */psst*

Lets be honest - the first films didn't work and the new ones are struggling two. Their super powers are both too basic and too powerful. The Thing is a poor mans hulk and the other characters 'powers' are quite all powerful whilst also too describable.

X Men has a wider range of interesting 'powers' whilst Avengers is more or less STRONG PEOPLE. Not sure Fantastic Four will ever really work, or ever really did.

 

[MDSLKTR]

lol at the imressions, right at your face Fox. Hope this bombs, Fox bankrupts and Disney buys them.

the marvel fanboy logic everyone

 

[Neoxon]

lol at the imressions, right at your face Fox. Hope this bombs, Fox bankrupts and Disney buys them.

That's going too far. Fox is actually doing good everywhere else (X-Men, Apes, etc.).

Spoiler

I know it's sarcasm.

If anything, I'm hoping that Fox just gives the F4 back so they can focus on the X-Men, the one Marvel franchise that they're actually getting their shit together on.

 

[ScreenSplitter]

If anything, I'm hoping that Fox just gives the F4 back so they can focus on the X-Men, the one Marvel franchise that they're actually getting their shit together on.

& the one that would be verging on impossible to implement into the MCU in its current state. I mean, not impossible, but I know lots agree with me when I say X-Men and Avengers never made too much sense in the same universe in the first place.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Then you & I have very different definitions of bad. Allow me to use a fellow GAFer's post as proof of my point.

Thor: 77% (critics score is 63%)
Thor 2: 66% (critics score is 44%)
Iron Man 2: 72% (critics score is 60%)
Iron Man 3: 79% (critics score is 61%)
Captain America: 79% (critics score is 76)
Age of Ultron: 74% (critics score is 72)

Let's look at the great Marvel movies:

Winter Soldier is at 81% (critics)
Guardians of the Galaxy is 85% (critics)


It's at least great to know Captain America: The First Avenger is considered great, though (by RT logic).

The point is no one wants Marvel properties to be given away to some place perceived as more competent. It's a petty move. There's no need for it. Marvel could make a good Fantastic Four movie. Another studio could make a good Thor movie.

The worst you can say about their movies is that they are bland and formulaic. They at least understand the source material and cater to their audience. Fox just shits out movies made by committee that are objectively bad and miss every target audience by a mile.

And your point about the rights still doesn't make any sense, especially considering the history of Marvel licenses.

What's wrong about my points with rights? I just want people to be consistent with their logic. If a movie is bad then say that property should be given to another studio. Marvel shouldn't be the only studio that people want to make movies at.

 

[Neoxon]

& the one that would be verging on impossible to implement into the MCU in its current state. I mean, not impossible, but I know lots agree with me when I say X-Men and Avengers never made too much sense in the same universe in the first place.

Exactly. The X-Men are fine where they are, so long as Fox continues to deliver like they did with DoFP and are looking to do with Deadpool & Apocalypse. The F4 on the other hand........yeah.

 

[Siegcram]

The point is no one wants Marvel properties to be given away to some place perceived as more competent.

Because that place doesn't exist.

 

[jtb]

I think Fox has obviously handled the Fantastic Four franchise horribly, but it seems disingenuous to also ignore the work they've done to revitalize the X-Men franchise. The first Wolverine movie was terrible and the X-Men 3/Superman Returns fiasco was a huge mistake—but, at the same time, they've taken big steps to restoring goodwill in the franchise.

I don't even think Days of Future Past is a good movie, but you could at least tell they desperately wanted to fix a lot of the damage done from X-Men 3. And they asked Singer to come back on board. First Class was a decent effort; more well-intentioned than well-executed, but whatever. The Wolverine is as good as the best of Marvel's solo offerings. It's as good as Iron Man 3 and Winter Soldier (and therefore better than everything else Marvel has ever done).

I'm not sure how much Fox is the problem. They clearly cheaped out with this one, but, at the same time, maybe they were right not to trust Trank with a 200m budget.

 

[Lothars]

They may as well not exist and it would not make a difference, The point is Marvel has made plenty of turds.

That's not true at all, None of the Marvel Movies are turds.

 

[Neoxon]

That's not true at all, None of the Marvel Movies are turds.

You could make an argument for Thor 2 & Iron Man 2. Maybe it's just me being hard on Thor 2, I guess I could watch it again to be sure.

 

[x Power Pad Death Stomp x]

I think that Fox will hold the rights even if this bombs. They let the rights to Daredevil expire and Marvel made that into something successful. They won't make that mistake again.

 

[Fury451]

Boo. Worst use of this .gif ever. Also ironic using a Man of Steel clip to debate the quality of Guardians.

 

[Neoxon]

I think that Fox will hold the rights even if this bombs. They let the rights to Daredevil expire and Marvel made that into something successful. They won't make that mistake again.

The problem here is that Fox is clearly not capable of making something good with the F4, screwing up with every attempt at the franchise. It's the the point to where they can't even salvage them as cameos in the X-Men universe since they'd taint said X-Men franchise (& right when the mutants are on the upswing). Plus nobody's gonna trust Fox with the F4, anymore.

 

[ScreenSplitter]

I think that Fox will hold the rights even if this bombs. They let the rights to Daredevil expire and Marvel made that into something successful. They won't make that mistake again.

So they'll just keep tanking (Tranking?) $100m into it every few years? I don't know, they could do that I guess.

 

[……forgetit]

Boo. Worst use of this .gif ever. Also ironic using a Man of Steel clip to debate the quality of Guardians.

I like Guardians, but I know how saying that goes on Gaf lol.

 

[Neoxon]

So they'll just keep tanking (Tranking?) $100m into it every few years? I don't know, they could do that I guess.

In theory they could, Fox has enough big franchises to tank a few F4 failures if they can retain the rights. But it'd be out of pure spite & the returns would diminish more & more as time progresses.

 

[richiek]

& the one that would be verging on impossible to implement into the MCU in its current state. I mean, not impossible, but I know lots agree with me when I say X-Men and Avengers never made too much sense in the same universe in the first place.

I and alot of other people are more interested in the side characters owned by Fox in the FF deal (Silver Surfer, Doom, Galactus, Kang, etc) being incorporated into the MCU.

 

[Neoxon]

I and alot of other people are more interested in the side characters owned by Fox in the FF deal (Silver Surfer, Doom, Galactus, Kang, etc) being incorporated into the MCU.

Pretty much this, though you forgot to mention Annihilus & Kl'rt/Super-Skrull.

 

[Slayven]

There would be no cloud at Marvel

 

[Fury451]

I like Guardians, but I know how saying that goes on Gaf lol.

Oh...is Guardians not liked here?

I think that Fox will hold the rights even if this bombs. They let the rights to Daredevil expire and Marvel made that into something successful. They won't make that mistake again.

I'm sure you're right about that. They should just cut a deal with Marvel already and potentially make something good that everyone can enjoy, and you get the added benefit of everybody being paid.

I would just love to see the stable of cosmic Marvel in its full glory more than anything.

 

[……forgetit]

Oh...is Guardians not liked here?



I'm sure you're right about that. They should just cut a deal with Marvel already and potentially make something good that everyone can enjoy, and you get the added benefit of everybody being paid.

I would just love to see the stable of cosmic Marvel in its full glory more than anything.

Nope, it's widely disliked here for reasons.

 

[numble]

In theory they could, Fox has enough big franchises to tank a few F4 failures if they can retain the rights. But it'd be out of pure spite & the returns would diminish more & more as time progresses.

How do you figure? In half a decade, China will be the largest movie market, where fare like Transformers have done well.

 

[Siegcram]

What's wrong about my points with rights? I just want people to be consistent with their logic. If a movie is bad then say that property should be given to another studio. Marvel shouldn't be the only studio that people want to make movies at.

First, this doesn't go for every movie, it goes for comic movies. And there Marvel is far and away the company with the best track-record, both critically and financially. What you're suggesting isn't consistency, it's defiance of reality. Unless you can point me to a studio Marvel rights would have a better place, then by all means.

 

[BronsonLee]

Nope, it's widely disliked here for reasons.

...WHERE?!

 

[……forgetit]

...WHERE?!

Doesn't seem to have an issue in this thread so far, but I remember pretty much every thread that had guardians mentioned is followed by dozens coming in saying how much they hated it.

Once again, I love it, but the vitriol can get ridiculous at times.

 

[Freedom = $1.05]

did someone say that GOTG wasn't liked here? That's crazy talk

now, if youre talking about AoU i can see it. I'm part of the "it's not that good" crowd myself for that movie.

But GOTG is loved here on gaf.

 

[ScreenSplitter]

Doesn't seem to have an issue here, but I remember pretty much every thread that had guardians mentioned is followed by dozens coming in saying how much they hated it.

... I mean we had a thread full of shaming people who thought it would be crap beforehand? I've seen it widely loved here and elsewhere.

 

[……forgetit]

... I mean we had a thread full of shaming people who thought it would be crap beforehand? I've seen it widely loved here and elsewhere.

Eh, I could be imagining it then, or it could be selective reading, either way we're way off topic now.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Nope, it's widely disliked here for reasons.

Guardians is without a doubt the best comic-book movie to come out by DC or Marvel, with the lone exception being the Dark Knight Trilogy.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

It was clearly rushed to production so Fox could retain the rights. Regardless of how you feel about Marvel Studios and the entire rights situation, it's just not the kind of filmmaking practice that should be rewarded.


They clearly do not care about this property. Why support their mishandling of it?

 

[Blader]

Give the rights back to Marvel? Boring.

I've got a better idea: just give all the superhero movies to Ang Lee. That would be fun and worth watching.

Not if his last one was any indication.

 

[Sephzilla]

The Roger Corman Fantastic Four is still the best Fantastic Four movie

 

[……forgetit]

It was clearly rushed to production so Fox could retain the rights. Regardless of how you feel about Marvel Studios and the entire rights situation, it's just not the kind of filmmaking practice that should be rewarded.


They clearly do not care about this property. Why support their mishandling of it?

Sounds familiar......

 

[Shinjica]

It was clearly rushed to production so Fox could retain the rights. Regardless of how you feel about Marvel Studios and the entire rights situation, it's just not the kind of filmmaking practice that should be rewarded.


They clearly do not care about this property. Why support their mishandling of it?

Because people are stupid

 

[Sibersk Esto]

Give the rights back to Marvel? Boring.

I've got a better idea: just give all the superhero movies to Ang Lee. That would be fun and worth watching.

Quite

 

[Abounder]

There would be no cloud at Marvel

I wouldn't be so sure about that after Mandarin and considering Thanos hasn't done much.

That cloud was pretty stupid but I wonder if they made the cloud and a black Human Torch just to spite Marvel's action figures and casting.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

You guys realize that "Fox" isn't a person, right?

Because you talk about him like he's an actual guy.

The people who mishandled the movie are many, and the reasons for it are various.

 

[NastyBook]

sounds spectacular:

https://twitter.com/FB_BMB/status/628681852052721664


https://twitter.com/FB_BMB/status/628681035451076608


https://twitter.com/FB_BMB/status/628703183649570816

LOL @ the first one.
Speechless at the second one.
SMH at the last one. Not surprised by that one at all.

 

[Anth0ny]

Maybe they'll do a Spidey deal where Marvel gets to make a F4 movie/use the characters in their films, but Fox still "owns" the characters and has "final say".

Of course, part of the deal would allow Marvel to use Hugh Jackman's Wolverine in Avengers 3 just before he retires from playing the character.

 

[……forgetit]

I wouldn't be so sure about that after Mandarin and considering Thanos hasn't done much.

That cloud was pretty stupid but I wonder if they made the cloud and a black Human Torch just to spite Marvel's action figures and casting.

Thanks has mainly been build up, but hopefully we'll see him through out phase 3. Mandarin was....strange honestly.

 

[Garlador]

I wouldn't be so sure about that after Mandarin and considering Thanos hasn't done much.

That cloud was pretty stupid but I wonder if they made the cloud and a black Human Torch just to spite Marvel's action figures and casting.

It's already established the real Mandarin is out there and the joker from Iron Man 3 was just exploiting the name.

Honestly, I still think the villain in Iron Man 3 was their version of Fin Fang Foom. Dragon imagery galore and breathes fire?

 

[dan2026]

I can't believe people are

a) defending this turd

and

b) Not wanting the rights to go back to the original owners who have a track record of treating them well

 

[Sephzilla]

Maybe they'll do a Spidey deal where Marvel gets to make a F4 movie/use the characters in their films, but Fox still "owns" the characters and has "final say".

Of course, part of the deal would allow Marvel to use Hugh Jackman's Wolverine in Avengers 3 just before he retires from playing the character.

I honestly think Jackman would change his mind on being done playing Wolverine if Marvel and Fox cut a deal that let him be in Avengers. He'd probably be all like "welp, I'm good for a few more movies"

 

[jmood88]

I wouldn't be so sure about that after Mandarin and considering Thanos hasn't done much.

That cloud was pretty stupid but I wonder if they made the cloud and a black Human Torch just to spite Marvel's action figures and casting.

Mandarin is a ridiculous racist caricature so changing him into a joke character (which they later sorta retconned) isn't the same as changing Galactus into a cloud because the people in charge weren't sure how people would handle the actual Galactus character.

 

[jtb]

You joke about Hulk (and it is a flawed film) but it is a fucking travesty that the "failure" of Ang Lee's Hulk means we will never again see a superhero film directed by a great director. I don't know how one can claim to love the genre and want to see good superhero films and also see that as a good thing.

I have not been on board for this reboot, ever, at any point in its production cycle... Still, I think that a lot of the criticism of Fox is misguided. Trank is the most inspired directorial hire for a superhero film in a long time. It's a gamble. That's what studios should be doing. Apparently, it was a bad bet—and it's a damn shame that the lesson we all take out from this is that studios should further homogenize the genre and take even fewer risks.

 

[Bulzeeb]

I wouldn't be so sure about that after Mandarin and considering Thanos hasn't done much.

That cloud was pretty stupid but I wonder if they made the cloud and a black Human Torch just to spite Marvel's action figures and casting.

wasn't part of the problem that Marvel doesn't have rights over the movie merchandise unlike the sony deal?

 

[richiek]

First look at Doom in action:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzko5iNo5wM

Remember when people were saying that this would be fixed in postproduction? LOL

 

[Sephzilla]

You joke about Hulk (and it is a flawed film) but it is a fucking travesty that the "failure" of Ang Lee's Hulk means we will never again see a superhero film directed by a great director. I don't know how you can claim to love the genre and want to see good superhero films and also see that as a good thing.

All three of the Chris Nolan Batman movies came out after Ang Lee's Hulk