-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
I enjoyed Batman v Superman more than Civil War, who is with me?
- Thread starter TheDanger
- Start date
- Status
Safe isn't necessarily bad. It hit all the points it needed to, enough to drown out most criticisms of minor inconsistencies in plot or characterization. It's a popcorn film that succeeds in being just that, especially for new and younger audiences. Like Guardians of the Galaxy.
Wasn't the original comics that it was loosely based on pretty... deep and complicated? I haven't read them so I might be wrong, no idea how things turned out.
Glass Rebel
Member
no idea what you're trying to say here
L
Lord Virgin
Unconfirmed Member
Thor is the answer to are we alone in the universe. It will never be forgotten.
PadWarrior
Member
Original comic made Tony a villain and is pretty hater by a lot readers. The movie is much better.
Abs shaming.
The general audience would be confused though, who's that character we've never seen before... if you're deep in DC lore you'll be like yup that makes more sense!
If you're the general audience and you didn't get that speech at the end where he said something's coming, I don't think that scene is going to help either. Because both scenes would've come at the ending (that cutscene is where he gets arrested).
benjipwns
Banned
Loki did it.
The original comics resorted to character assassination to force an issue that was so poorly written it needed more retcons to fix the issues it causes. Not unlike BvS. It wasn't deep and complicated: They wanted super heroes to "register" and reveal their identities so that the government could keep tabs.
Civil War comic was awful.
I don't think BvS wast safe either! I also haven't seen that criticism levied against BvS but maybe you have.
But just a few things about Civil War that firmly take it out of this arbitrary "safe" territory
The two biggest stars in the MCU don't end up on the same side
The third act subversion of avoiding a team up against the main villain and avoiding the big blown explosion battle common in CBM finales
Zemo's entire character being a super villain but not a super villain as we've come to expect (yes, I know you don't like him but I also wouldn't call his character safe, even if his motivations feel pedestrian in the golden age of comicbook movies)
The Avengers being fugitives
Rhodey being a goddamn cripple
The third act subversion of avoiding a team up against the main villain and avoiding the big blown explosion battle common in CBM finales
Zemo's entire character being a super villain but not a super villain as we've come to expect (yes, I know you don't like him but I also wouldn't call his character safe, even if his motivations feel pedestrian in the golden age of comicbook movies)
The Avengers being fugitives
Rhodey being a goddamn cripple
There's more but that's a start. Like I said though, I don't think BvS was safe either. It was ballsy as hell, it just didn't stick the landing.
benjipwns
Banned
Huh, I thought the scene went earlier when Lex was dicking around in the ship learning the Krypton lore and then playing with Zod's body. And then the ship was showing him Yuga Khan and mother boxes which it had told him all about.
b&jy77VjiKn$#F
Member
I'm with you.
PadWarrior
Member
Isn't it steppenwolf?
You fears are correct, i too wasnt looking forward to this after too many Cap/Marvel films, it's just as you'd expect. But the odds are smaller.
It's not, its the same shit as Avengers, nothing remotely different to offset the god mode characters without the slightest hint of a real threat. The ending makes the whole struggle pointless.
Right at the beginning you see a SWAT team come in and Yuga Khan disappears while Lex is surrounded by the SWAT team at gun point. He's also standing infront of that giant exploded bubble thing that Doomsday came out of.
Nah, you should know by now I always give you the benefit of the doubt. There are people who call BvS safe though. Some in this very thread. I agree with your points here.
benjipwns
Banned
Huh, I admit I didn't bother to look the scene back up on YouTube before pontificating.
Would have made more sense where I put it lol.
It's probably Darkseid so he doesn't look like Thanos.
roflwaffles
Member
It's a comic book movie versus thread, which makes it a cesspool for hyperbole and ignorance.
I thoroughly enjoyed Civil War and hated BVS, although I wanted to like it. Everytime I would try to make reasons to like BVS, the movie seemed insistent on doing something that would make me hate it, whereas Civil War would have a few sequences that dragged on that made me skeptical of the hype and then totally paid off for me later in the movie.
I give CW an 8.5/10 and BVS a 4.5/10. Both of them tackle the same theme of heroes owning up to mass destruction culminating in a hero on hero brawl, but CW just does this exponentially better in execution.
The battle in BVS doesn't feel earned and is totally not a battle of ideologies, which is essential for a fight like this. Supes is basically blackmailed into fighting Batman and refuses to talk to him after his initial try. Batman is irrationally mad at Supes and creates a disconnect between the audience and the character. The battle itself is serviceable but underwhelming and the dialogue in it is garbage.
In CW's airport battle, the conflict is earned and the movie sets up logical motivations for the characters to behave the way they do. Also the battle is just executed way better.
I didn't care for either "main villain" but Zemo had a stronger screen presence than Lex. Neither plan really makes that much sense but at Zemo has the benefit of not being this annoyingly erratic character who made you want to punch him in the face everytime he opened his mouth.
it's a meme at this point but people always bring up the lesser MCU movies as a way to "strengthen" their opinion on BvS
Indigo_Plateau
Banned
Heres a list of Bullshit that was in the BvS movie:
-The scene in Africa is stupid beyond belief. Why is Lois alive as a witness? Why does Superman get blamed for the deaths considering he doesn't need to use bullets?
-Lois and Clark bathtub scene. Did the conversation have to take place their?
-When Lex puts a toffee in the Senators mouth. Is this really Lex's attitude?
-The entire Useless Kryptonite chase sequence was embedded in the movie just for a 30 second confrontation between B and S?
-Lex starts killing his assistants now? (Mercy)
-Why would Batman leave his Batarang after stealing the Kryptonite
-Lex's access to the ship via a thin layer of epidermis is laughable.
-Lex's plan to persuade Superman to battle Batman was coincidently just when he kidnapped Martha?
-Superman cant use his X-ray vision to locate Martha?
-Lex gets his design team to associate logos to the justice league members. WUT. Also, unveiling the justice league members through email...in a movie? Really?
-During the Batman v Superman fight, Batman could have used his Kryptonite bullets/ spear to kill superman while he was stunned...but no.
-Lois throwing the spear and then retrieving it (WHAT?). and some how deducing that the spear kills Doomsday. How does she even know this considering she didn't even see Doomsday?
-Why the hell didn't Batman retrieve the spear (maybe using the Bat plane?) instead of luring Doomsday back to the original location?
-Also, as HISHE explained. Superman and Doomsday were in space. Why didn't he just throw that monstrosity into space?
-Lois being the Damsel in distress and Superman saving her.
-Lex being so obsessed with Superman's death he will forgo his own security by unleashing Doomsday in front of himself and Superman.
-Why the hell was the death of Superman even needed considering he is revived? Maybe this alleviates Batmans sadism by applying a no kill rule? Who the hell knows.
-Lastly...DING DING DING DING DING!
Some of the point as I have made could be explained. But most of them are borderline stupid. However, I liked Batmans realisation of both monsters sharing the name Martha.
Overall, I understand why some people like the movie. But calling it the best comic book movie ever made or comparing it to Marvels strongest offerings is foolish.
-The scene in Africa is stupid beyond belief. Why is Lois alive as a witness? Why does Superman get blamed for the deaths considering he doesn't need to use bullets?
-Lois and Clark bathtub scene. Did the conversation have to take place their?
-When Lex puts a toffee in the Senators mouth. Is this really Lex's attitude?
-The entire Useless Kryptonite chase sequence was embedded in the movie just for a 30 second confrontation between B and S?
-Lex starts killing his assistants now? (Mercy)
-Why would Batman leave his Batarang after stealing the Kryptonite
-Lex's access to the ship via a thin layer of epidermis is laughable.
-Lex's plan to persuade Superman to battle Batman was coincidently just when he kidnapped Martha?
-Superman cant use his X-ray vision to locate Martha?
-Lex gets his design team to associate logos to the justice league members. WUT. Also, unveiling the justice league members through email...in a movie? Really?
-During the Batman v Superman fight, Batman could have used his Kryptonite bullets/ spear to kill superman while he was stunned...but no.
-Lois throwing the spear and then retrieving it (WHAT?). and some how deducing that the spear kills Doomsday. How does she even know this considering she didn't even see Doomsday?
-Why the hell didn't Batman retrieve the spear (maybe using the Bat plane?) instead of luring Doomsday back to the original location?
-Also, as HISHE explained. Superman and Doomsday were in space. Why didn't he just throw that monstrosity into space?
-Lois being the Damsel in distress and Superman saving her.
-Lex being so obsessed with Superman's death he will forgo his own security by unleashing Doomsday in front of himself and Superman.
-Why the hell was the death of Superman even needed considering he is revived? Maybe this alleviates Batmans sadism by applying a no kill rule? Who the hell knows.
-Lastly...DING DING DING DING DING!
Some of the point as I have made could be explained. But most of them are borderline stupid. However, I liked Batmans realisation of both monsters sharing the name Martha.
Overall, I understand why some people like the movie. But calling it the best comic book movie ever made or comparing it to Marvels strongest offerings is foolish.
OP, I went into the film blind without having watched any of the trailers, aside from some minor spoilers found in headlines on the film blogs I follow. Otherwise, I'm 100% with you. The film surprised me tons; it metamorphosed the characters, it was charged with a kind of maturity found in early Ridley Scott or David Fincher. The musical crescendo's were ace, the cameos were slick. Never once did the film lose my attention. It was only upon my third viewing where I noticed that the first 90 minutes was perhaps too intricate, and could agree that it was "plodding." But that was because I was sitting with my mother, and she whispered, "where the fuck is the action at?" And on that front, it sure delivered.
There's a lot to unpack from the film, and there's promise in the franchise. Can't wait for SS, Wondy, and Justice League.
*brofist*
Neither BvS or Civil War should be described as "safe." I can see why someone would call both of them boring but that's a much more subjective judgement.
Good to know. I've heard people talking about it a lot, usually in a positive light so I just figured. Was
On More/Brand New Day
If the movie was working with bad source material, I can understand why they went the route they did. The government oversight stuff sorta backseats during the second half.
BadAss2961
Member
OT has jumped the shark with these threads.
That, and what they did to Tony to make him pretty much the villain. Stuff like making clones of heroes, just in general being a super asshole to justify the "event" for Marvel.
It was awful. Spidey took an awful hit because of that fiasco. :/
The original Civil War comics were a goddamn mess of utterly botched characterization and stupid plotting.
TheSlySoul
Member
I am glad I was not the only one that noticed it, but the reason for the fight was actually a good one unlike BvS.
I would not call BvS safe though, just dull.
BvS's weak link for me was the reason Batman and Superman fought. That really sucked when they had already set up a much better one.
I enjoyed more than all the mcu movies except winter soldier ( Haven't seen civil war yet.)
It got way more shit than it deserved, but that is my opinion, I'd pay money to browse GAF in a reality where BvS got decent reviews, I wonder how many people think for themselves.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Insulting people who disagree with you will get you far here.
Let me count the ways.
You are aware this is not actually a response, right?
Of all the BvS threads you've been in I'm surprised you seem to think talking like that leads to anything. How many people on either side of the argument about BvS have insulted the other? How many of those people received some sort of penalty/punishment?
I feel like the issue is not people liking the movie, but pretending the movie is without flaws. You mentioned some issues and that they dont bother you, and thats fine. It would be more problematic if you went on a rant on how people are making up flaws in the movie.
it's a justifiably glib and funny response considering so many people have repeatedly answered this very question multiple times in the thread
apparently yes, but I did not really insult anyone, certainly not directly, even though I was. I'm just wondering how much impact reviews have on the concensus.
Well take a look at the poll at least I'm not the only "insert insult" on GAF.
Boombloxer
Member
This. It's not close nor even worthy of discussion, CW is the superior film in every way, except maybe music.
BadAss2961
Member
Definitely with you on this one. The conversation would be totally different.
You are aware that posting a picture of a cartoon rabbit reading a love letter to his cartoon human wife written crudely on Marvin Acme's will, itself written in ACME Disappearing-Reappearing ink and deeming the ownership of Toon Town return to the Toons that inhabit it in the case of his death which in this case happened at the hands of Judge Doom who is actually an evil Toon and killed Eddie Valiant's brother with a piano and a cartoon shoe with a barrel of Dip may possibly indicate that my post was not intended as an in-depth response and more of a jape?
you're not exactly seen as a paragon of objective analysis when you praise a Snyder movie while you're posting with a watchmen avatar, buddy
Captin Quacker
Member
The fact that your willing to do this just for reviews is cray
My biggest problem with BvS was the animosity between Batman and Superman. I know this was probably because of poor editing (I've read that there were scenes removes that would have made this at least somewhat clearer), but to me it ended up relying more on "Superman is a walking nuke and Batman donkey punches bad guys and carves dickbutt into their faces". Which honestly isn't terrible as plot motivations go, but it just seemed so forced in the actual moments.
It reminded me of the disdain between Chris and Jake in RE6. Chris hates Jake for being Wesker's son and Jake hates Chris for killing Wesker... even though Jake remarks that he only ever knew his father as a deadbeat who left him and his mom to fend for themselves. And then he learns that Wesker was a complete global saturation psychopath and yet still he wanted to end Chris.
Like, we the long-time fans know why they may not like each other. Same with Bats and Supes. But the media doesn't necessarily do enough to convince us of it. Or maybe it did, but lost in translation et al.
It reminded me of the disdain between Chris and Jake in RE6. Chris hates Jake for being Wesker's son and Jake hates Chris for killing Wesker... even though Jake remarks that he only ever knew his father as a deadbeat who left him and his mom to fend for themselves. And then he learns that Wesker was a complete global saturation psychopath and yet still he wanted to end Chris.
Like, we the long-time fans know why they may not like each other. Same with Bats and Supes. But the media doesn't necessarily do enough to convince us of it. Or maybe it did, but lost in translation et al.
"Wake up sheeple"?
Joke answer that these polls always have. Dark World was notoriously bad.
That being said, I voted for it since it was still better than BvS.
Well I didn't say how much
- Status