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[Bojji]

How dare you? Naoe is a cutie.

You can make a beautiful Asian girl without sexualizing her.

And she liked to draw animals:

Meditation

And her main style was stealth, not brute force:

I guess main character can remain feminine even in game about killing.

Compared to female Rambo from GoY:

 

[Matsuchezz]

willing suspension of disbelief

she is a japanese woman fighting a gazillion men, it may take ppl out since its hard to believe that she can face hundreds of men in combat.

This applies to any action game where the main character is a woman. Even for a man being a one man army is ridiculous.

 

[mckmas8808]

again willing suspension of disbelief

through our history we have lots of men achieving great things, winning against the odds, its easy to believe that a man can do it than a woman.

But you'd consider that weird though, right? I know you keyword here is "willing".

 

[AJUMP23]

I was going to buy Spiderman... But the controversy surrounding it... And the protagonist isn't 100% Peter Parker, but Miles... It made me not buy it...

Is Helldivers good?

I found it a lot of fun for the time I played. But it is a live service game built for the battle passes. But the Gameplay with a good squad is excellent.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

This applies that any action game where the main character is a woman. Even for a man being a one man army is ridiculous.

But it's allowed when it's a man. I mean...John Wick walks inside a building with a hand gun, kills 40 enemies and it's okay.

A trained woman in an action movie does like not even half of that and it's like "a woman would never shoot 3 men and walk freely like this lol"

 

[Sethbacca]

But it's allowed when it's a man. I mean...John Wick walks inside a building with a hand gun, kills 40 enemies and it's okay.

Should see what he can do with a pencil.

A fucking pencil!

 

[Matsuchezz]

hate its just a word, it has no emotional meaning to me, i have no hate towards the fictional character of Atsu, i ll probably buy the game, not day one. What i dont like is the blatantly pandering that companies throws at us nowadays, there is plenty of examples out there of companies blaming on consumer for not liking their progressive game or ideas and thats is what i hate the most, i work my ass off to have to read or listen to someone telling me that i m a misogynist cause i didnt like their protag choice, that i have to accept this and that, ppl never liked this, i dont like this and lots of ppl over here dont like neither.

Like i said, every time they made these kind of statement, in this case belittling Jim over Atsu ll just hurt the franchise, and everytime they try to pander their audience it ll hurt than too and the only way that the consumer can retaliate is on the product.

So, now words have no meaning. That is why we choose words carefully, because they mean something.
And saying that you may buy a game you hate is more baffling to me. Anyways I am off to work.

 

[viveks86]

I don't think having that problem is enought to sustain your base. Mary sues(and Gary Stus) for instances have very little negatives just to say they aren't exactly perfect. I don't think this "issue" of getting lost in the hunt sounds exactly as a negative.



Another "negative" that doesn't sound negative at all. Which part of not caring about wheter dies or not is not a part of being badass? Ever watched the movie Lethal Weapon? Lol



Back to my Lethal weapon movie example. The main character who lost his wife is in constant "self punishing" and in need of therapy. Yet he does badass and funny things, which part of this is not being badass?
So far you had prove me that the character itself have negatives that either doesn't really affect her or have minimal effect on the character.



Are you really trying to compare Kill Bill with this game? Like really?
Kill Bill character is not a strong woman. She is THE woman. She face alot of things not silly things but bad harsh unnaceptable things that make twittards get triggered (like being raped), which made her 3 to 4 times more stronger. She learn HARSH things from her master, who didn't give a shit about her and treat her like a dog because thats how the train is. Honestly really, I don't understand this trend of comparing Kill Bill with this game.



I don't think this dimish the fact she can be a boss bitch though? Lol
-Hey I dunno how to use this weapons
*Trains with a master somewhere
-Now I can use this weapon

I don't even gonna answer the rest of your post because of the woke moronic rethoric. I don't even said that, it's just you trying to win brownie points.

Dude, I'm pointing to you what I'm seeing just based on trailers. You made it seem like I'm assuming too much and I backed it up based on what I know so far. I've already admitted positive bias. What major objective character analysis are you expecting me to present based on trailers? They could have just as easily presented each trailer like she is brutalizing these bosses and present no weakness whatsoever. They are meant to generate hype anyway, right? What did any of the movie trailers present about the protagonist's negatives? I'm well aware that none of that is "good enough" to change your mind. I did it anyway out of good faith. And sorry for bringing up Kill Bill. It's too precious and should not be used as a reference point or source of inspiration for anything ever. I'll put it back on its pedestal now.

I'm just saying the evidence so far is at least better than the lazy strawman-ing happening in these threads. Woke this and woke that. And yes that rhetoric (including the comment on strawman-ing now) wasn't meant for you. Just said that in the flow. There is no brownie points to be won and this isn't a competition where anyone needs to win anything. Just conveying a point of view. You are free to disagree and/or challenge it.

 

[Three]

No, they wouldn't. Men and women aren't the same. The odds of a woman going after people and killing them to get revenge are astronomically lower than they are for a man. Women aren't out there competing against and killing other men. Men do this. That's why we roll our eyes at this constant attempt at forcing females into obviously male roles just to prove they're as badass as their male counterparts.

The point wasn't that women are just as likely to be driven by revenge it was that Jin was a noble samurai and this is not out of the ordinary for a character to not meditate on their surroundings and transform their struggle into haiku for a male or female character given the background of the character. As for female revenge stories being "male roles" nobody gave a shit when it was Kill Bill, why do they now? Revenge stories aren't only male roles.

 

[Gaiff]

The point wasn't that women are just as likely to be driven by revenge it was that Jin was a noble samurai and this is not out of the ordinary for a character to not meditate on their surroundings and transform their struggle into haiku for a male or female character given the background of the character. As for female revenge stories being "male roles" nobody gave a shit when it was Kill Bill, why do they now? Revenge stories aren't only male roles.

Nobody gave a shit with Kill Bill because it wasn't as pervasive as it is now with a bunch of franchises clearly targeted at men and led by men having been hijacked by women.

Revenge stories sure as hell ain't just for men, but a woman isn't going to hunt down and fight a bunch of trained killers. It takes male characteristics to carry out something like this and this will inevitably lead to the masculinization of a female character in that role, which is exactly what is going on here. This is an industry-wide phenomenon.

 

[Bojji]

The point wasn't that women are just as likely to be driven by revenge it was that Jin was a noble samurai and this is not out of the ordinary for a character to not meditate on their surroundings and transform their struggle into haiku for a male or female character given the background of the character. As for female revenge stories being "male roles" nobody gave a shit when it was Kill Bill, why do they now? Revenge stories aren't only male roles.

Kill Bill is over the top Tarantino style.

Much more realistic female revenge story:

 

[Loboxxx]

 

[Lokaum D+]

So, now words have no meaning. That is why we choose words carefully, because they mean something.
And saying that you may buy a game you hate it's more baffling to me. Anyways I am off to work.

You guys are too sensitiva, have a good day at work.

Also i dont hate the game, i didnt player, i dont like some chances and the pr pandering.

 

[Tajaz2426]

This reminds me of when we tried to change our PFT and CFT in the Marines to make it down the middle and the women having to do the same amount and the same exercises as the men. Women were scoring higher on the physical tests giving them advantages at promotion boards and for Sergeant and below helping their scores to be higher then mens.

We had the testing phase in Quantico and ended in a week. No woman could wear full battle dress and carry 200 pound drop dead Fred out of the hot zone. The testing stopped in that week and women went back to having their own testing for PFT and CFT.

An example is that men do pull ups or chin ups. A women gets to hang from the pull up bar and their time is a one minute hang with a bend in the elbow for a 100 points, men have to do 20 pull ups to max out. Ammo can lifts are scored differently, the run to contact in your camis bottoms and boots are different, 3 mile run scored different, etc.

Also while instructing MCMAP which is our martial arts line training, a woman in all my 18 years never took down a man, or beat them by submitting them, or knocking them out during training.

That tiny little dwarf woman would be laughed at trying to collect any bounty and kicked around and probably sold into a marriage.

This is getting crazy and if I had a Time Machine I would go back and bitch slap Sigourney weaver for being so damn hot while killing the alien in underwear making women believe that our physiology is in anyway, shape, or form close to each other.

Crazy town.

 

[mckmas8808]

It is an issue because none of these male characters were marketed as "bad ass".

No way you believe this.

Looks like Assassin's Creed Shadows part 2. This would be original in 2023, I still can't believe that we get 2 very similar games just few months apart.

Not to mention all Asians look the same:

I'm joking.

Come on man lol. All Asians don't look a like. You know we can have more than one Asian woman as a main character in a game in the same year.

That's... an interesting perspective. This got me thinking quite a bit. You are making this appeal on GAF, where you are not the little guy. You represent the majority opinion and the mods here (at least the ones who voice their thoughts or ban people) generally seem to be aligned with your perspective. I don't mean that as a complaint or an insult. But just a matter of fact. Everyone has a philosophical and ideological leaning. And no one can truly be neutral in this political climate.

So when you hear an opposing point of view from the "defense squad", it isn't coming from corporate backed shills (as far as I know). And since I'm being (intentionally or otherwise) grouped into this "defense squad", I think I can at least speak for myself. It is not easy to be the minority dissenting voice. I am working against my human instinct to just stay silent and watch things unfold... or lash out. I actually went quiet on GAF for almost a decade for this reason. Way too much hostility and judgment to be worth investing any time on. All the friends I had made here over the years had vanished. At the end, you often get nothing in return. No sense of community because everyone disagrees with you and has judged or prematurely dismissed your viewpoint. It often becomes a circle jerk, where the same group of people like and support each other's posts. There was no sense that anyone wants to reach across the aisle. So then, what is even the point saying anything at all? But then, I had a light bulb moment as I gained confidence in my ability to express and a controversial game called Intergalactic was announced. I tried again, with as much respect and good faith as I possibly can. And you know what? It's been a rewarding experience ever since. I actually feel like I'm building longer term camaraderie with people who may fundamentally disagree with me. Out of just pure love and respect.

But I can empathize with the challenge this poses on the "defense squad" psyche. We have to constantly feel like we would get drowned out by the majority. As a result, we either get too meek and give up or get too aggressive and over-compensate, with the risk of getting banned. As much as I regret the name calling, in all our minds we are "punching up" too. Just like you are punching up to the corporations, we are punching up to you. Of course there are people who will never learn and keep being nasty to one another. But perhaps an attempt to understand this from the opposing viewpoint would lead to less hostility and vicious cycles of mutual disrespect.

This is the type of conversations I like to see more of on GAF.

Oh, please, like if that has any consideration when devs do these kind of stereotype "strong, independent woman, who needs no man, badass bitch, slay kween yaaas!" characters, women in media can't be shown to have emotions one way or another, they're so rock solid emotionless stoic, so strong and brave, without any flaws and have this douche macho-man personality that only worked well in the action movies from the 80s and nowhere else

I'd say MOST main characters in games are like the bolded in general. Men and women. I think devs have gotten better about that over the last 5-10 years though. For every Aloy (Horizon) we get in a game, we get an Elle like in The Last of Us.

We truly have no idea what flaws this woman will have in GOY. We don't know if she'll be a douche macho chick that's emotionless and stoic.

 

[MiguelItUp]

I loved the first game and I'm somewhat excited about this one. I just really hope she's an interesting character, and I feel she will be. I mean, Jin was pretty solid, so I'd expect the same level for her, if not more so.

I've always been a fan of the revenge theme, honestly I don't think I could get enough of it.

I guess my excitement is kind of dulled down because it's a new character rather than a continuation of Jin's story. But I honestly assumed that would be one of the outcomes in a potential sequel.

I'll likely wait and just bite whenever it comes to PC.

 

[Killer8]

Most of these people in this thread are punching up at huge corporations and lampooning design decisions they regard as cynical, trite and increasingly tone deaf. The defense squad on the other side is punching down on ordinary people daring to defy the corporations and throwing down one insult after another as they do so. Is that the moral high ground? I don't think so.

Why punch down on ordinary people who have little power to influence the designs of these games? We live in a free society and a free market - if people don't like a product made by a multi-billion dollar corporation and want to tell the company where to go there's nothing 'wrong' with them, they're just doing what a free market and a free society demands.

You might not share the same opinions as people on Resetera, but you certainly think and talk exactly like them (punch up/down, cultural colonisation - really now?).

What will you be telling us next? That people criticizing corporations are in fact a marginalized community? I think there might even be a hint of intersectionality with all those people who don't like $80 games...

 

[viveks86]

And she liked to draw animals:

Meditation

And her main style was stealth, not brute force:

I guess main character can remain feminine even in game about killing.

Compared to female Rambo from GoY:

Oh Bojji, my dear. Even your posts on characters are like the graphics comparison threads. Take the best of one side and the worst of the other. At least try to give the one you don't like a fair shake? I'm with you on the rambo trailer being utter garbage and fodder for kids that would go "whoaaaawweeeywhoaaaa". But that's not remotely the only thing she can do. She probably can't even do that at proper difficulty settings on a regular playthrough. There will be delicate, feminine things she does too. You would still not accept her as a waifu, but that's ok. I have room to spare

 

[viveks86]

Kill Bill is over the top Tarantino style.

Much more realistic female revenge story:

Never heard of this. Adding to watch list.

 

[Bojji]

Oh Bojji, my dear. Even your posts on characters are like the graphics comparison threads. Take the best of one side and the worst of the other. At least try to give the one you don't like a fair shake? I'm with you on the rambo trailer being utter garbage and fodder for kids that would go "whoaaaawweeeywhoaaaa". But that's not remotely the only thing she can do. She probably can't even do that at proper difficulty settings on a regular playthrough. There will be delicate, feminine things she does too. You would still not accept her as a waifu, but that's ok. I have room to spare

AC Shadows is not some groundbreaking game, that's for sure (it's very solid 8/10). But I think they did Naoe character quite right, so far I see nothing like this in GoY.

I'm still interested in this game despite all the stuff I'm criticizing. There will be some beautiful vistas to see and locations to explore, even with PS4 tech quality they have some great artists. I really liked GoT so I doubt this game will be much worse overall.

Never heard of this. Adding to watch list.

Years ago I watched mr. vengeance and original Oldboy (one of the best movies ever IMO), this one is third in the trilogy (they are not connected by story).

 

[Sethbacca]

Never heard of this. Adding to watch list.

I haven't watched Sympathy for Mr Vengeance or Lady Vengeance yet, but they're on my to do list. I found out relatively recently they're part of a thematically linked trilogy with Oldboy. Supposed to be really good shit.

The Vengeance Trilogy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Saint Boot Gaming]

With every new bit of detail that comes out about this my reaction becomes this more and more:

 

[GymWolf]

This reminds me of when we tried to change our PFT and CFT in the Marines to make it down the middle and the women having to do the same amount and the same exercises as the men. Women were scoring higher on the physical tests giving them advantages at promotion boards and for Sergeant and below helping their scores to be higher then mens.

We had the testing phase in Quantico and ended in a week. No woman could wear full battle dress and carry 200 pound drop dead Fred out of the hot zone. The testing stopped in that week and women went back to having their own testing for PFT and CFT.

An example is that men do pull ups or chin ups. A women gets to hang from the pull up bar and their time is a one minute hang with a bend in the elbow for a 100 points, men have to do 20 pull ups to max out. Ammo can lifts are scored differently, the run to contact in your camis bottoms and boots are different, 3 mile run scored different, etc.

Also while instructing MCMAP which is our martial arts line training, a woman in all my 18 years never took down a man, or beat them by submitting them, or knocking them out during training.

That tiny little dwarf woman would be laughed at trying to collect any bounty and kicked around and probably sold into a marriage.

This is getting crazy and if I had a Time Machine I would go back and bitch slap Sigourney weaver for being so damn hot while killing the alien in underwear making women believe that our physiology is in anyway, shape, or form close to each other.

Crazy town.

Sigourney never had a melee combat with the alien, she used guns and a freakin robot suit that she had previous experience with, 2 big equalizers.

If only female protagonists today were written with the same smartness.

She only survive multiple times in 3 and 4 because the xenomorphs think it's their momma or some shit.

Out of all the absurd female heroes, she was the one written with more intelligence.

 

[viveks86]

I haven't watched Sympathy for Mr Vengeance or Lady Vengeance yet, but they're on my to do list. I found out relatively recently they're part of a thematically linked trilogy with Oldboy. Supposed to be really good shit.

The Vengeance Trilogy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yeah I had no idea. Had seen oldboy and loved every bit of it. Had no clue there was a trilogy

 

[Tajaz2426]

Sigourney never had a melee combat with the alien, she used guns and a freakin robot suit that she had previous experience with, 2 big equalizers.

If only female protagonists today were written with the same smartness.

She only survive multiple times in 3 and 4 because the xenomorphs think it's their momma or some shit.

Out of all the absurd female heroes, she was the one written with more intelligence.

I agree, was commenting more on the societal impact it had on people believing men and women are the same in a joking manner.

However, you are absolutely correct. First two were great flicks, after that I didn't enjoy the writing.

 

[GymWolf]

Oh Bojji, my dear. Even your posts on characters are like the graphics comparison threads. Take the best of one side and the worst of the other. At least try to give the one you don't like a fair shake? I'm with you on the rambo trailer being utter garbage and fodder for kids that would go "whoaaaawweeeywhoaaaa". But that's not remotely the only thing she can do. She probably can't even do that at proper difficulty settings on a regular playthrough. There will be delicate, feminine things she does too. You would still not accept her as a waifu, but that's ok. I have room to spare

I fucked everyone's ass with naoe on hard and the rambo approach, not as mindlessly easy as with yosuke, but super doable if yo had some spacial awareness.

 

[Senua]

Yeah I had no idea. Had seen oldboy and loved every bit of it. Had no clue there was a trilogy

Wow lucky you, you're in for a treat

 

[Dazraell]

I fucked everyone's ass with naoe

 

[Saint Boot Gaming]

Is metroid woke cause samus aran is a strong and independent woman that kills hundreds of alien lifeforms like it's nothing? Is tomb raider woke cause lara croft can kill men twice her size?

No to Metroid because Samus is an enhanced woman even outside of her suit thanks to Chozo DNA/blood and I think Metroid DNA now as well? Lara? it's a mixture. Early Lara was cocky enough to have fun doing what she does and was elegant and athletic with graceful flips, dives, climbing animations. Older Lara was intelligent and beautiful at the time, not the psychopath daddy issues kind of/sort of lesbian Lara we have now who isn't even allowed to call herself a Tomb Raider thanks to those writers from that survivor reboot games and Netflix stuff I read about.

 

[GymWolf]

I agree, was commenting more on the societal impact it had on people believing men and women are the same in a joking manner.

However, you are absolutely correct. First two were great flicks, after that I didn't enjoy the writing.

I sincerely doubt alien is the cause of the woke mind virus that changed female protagonists in action movies.

Xena the warrior princess and cinthia rothrock flicks were 10x times more absurd and i honestly think even them didn't changed much in people minds, this is a modern thing, don't look at the past for an explanation, it was not an organic development, it was a sudden one.

 

[GymWolf]

What can i say, her chained blade had a long wood handle...

 

[Bojji]

 

[viveks86]

I fucked everyone's ass with naoe on hard and the rambo approach, not as mindlessly easy as with yosuke, but super doable if yo had some spacial awareness.

I see! Seems more and more likely I'll never get around to it. Still on Horizon Forbidden West. Next Indy DLC, then Silent Hill f and Yotei before getting back to my ridiculous backlog with Silksong on the side. Naoe and I will never cross paths, it seems

I sincerely doubt alien is the cause of the woke mind virus that changed female protagonists in action movies.

Xena the warrior princess and cinthia rothrock flicks were 10x times more absurd and i honestly think even them didn't changed much in people minds, this is a modern thing, don't look at the past for an explanation, it was not an organic development, it was a sudden one.

No you. You don't seem to understand. Women should not have had the right to vote!!! It all started more than a hundred years ago. The fucking feminists...

 

[Fake]

Remember your mother is a woman too.

What is a woman?

 

[Tajaz2426]

I sincerely doubt alien is the cause of the woke mind virus that changed female protagonists in action movies.

Xena the warrior princess and cinthia rothrock flicks were 10x times more absurd and i honestly think even them didn't changed much in people minds, this is a modern thing, don't look at the past for an explanation, it was not an organic development, it was a sudden one.

It has become uncontrollable in the modern time but has been pushed for decades. Movies used have a hold on societal fabric and could push a lot of their agendas.

I joined the Corps in Aught 01 before 9/11, even then non grunts that were female in MCT thought they could do our 20 mile patrols or humps in SOI with full battle gear, full packs,plate carriers that can get up to right under 200 pounds if you were carrying AT4s, mortar plates, mortar tubes, mortars, dragon systems, M240 pieces, a 249 Saw with full rounds l, etc.

It's been around for a while but has most certainly exploded recently. Just my thoughts though.

 

[CosmicComet]

Zero interest in this.

They are definitely gonna go out of their way to dunk on Jin's legacy and make sure we all know know that this busted face girl boss ronin is double the swordsman he ever was.

If aliens only consumed Hollywood fiction as a means of learning about humans they would get the wrongful impression that men are 20% bigger on average than women but only half as strong, half as fast and half as intelligent lol.

 

[ReasonBeing]

Who called anyone sluts or cucks here? You're the one who went about chuds and resorted to personal attacks.

This is your m.o. and it's so blatant. You act a certain trollish way and then accuse people of doing it.

DELETED* I quoted a bunch of posts calling people cucks. Probably not a good move on my part to call random people out.

 

[Lokaum D+]

@ecosse lawer showed up, be aware folks.

 

[Tajaz2426]

I see! Seems more and more likely I'll never get around to it. Still on Horizon Forbidden West. Next Indy DLC, then Silent Hill f and Yotei before getting back to my ridiculous backlog with Silksong on the side. Naoe and I will never cross paths, it seems



No you. You don't seem to understand. Women should not have had the right to vote!!! It all started more than a hundred years ago. The fucking feminists...

This has nothing to do with voting or feminists. It has to do with morons that believe men and women's physiology is the same, which isn't even remotely true.

Take yourself to JSTOR where all medical journals, studies, testing, etc is kept and read some studies about what happens at puberty between male and females, the bone density changes, quick twitch muscles developed, pecks developed, oxygen flow through muscles, etc.

I got embarrassed reading that from an adult.

No need to go to extremes, people can have debates and conversations.

 

[TerribleAtThisGame]

I cracked this thread open earlier and saw Selene from Returnal thrown into a slew of supposed "boss bitch" characters and was triggered as fuck. I forgot which post it was but that was absurd. I spent 150+ hours with that game and took it so far as to have the game's director comment on my theories, that is not whatsoever what the game is about. Furthermore, that character and voice acting is one of the best, and most nuanced, in gaming for my money. It's the kind of interesting characterization Naughty Dog think they're making.

 

[Lambogenie]

Erika Ishii Erika GIF - Erika Ishii Erika Ishii - Discover & Share GIFs

Click to view the GIF

tenor.com

 

[Tajaz2426]

I cracked this thread open earlier and saw Selene from Returnal thrown into a slew of supposed "boss bitch" characters and was triggered as fuck. I forgot which post it was but that was absurd. I spent 150+ hours with that game and took it so far as to have the game's director comment on my theories, that is not whatsoever what the game is about. Furthermore, that character and voice acting is one of the best, and most nuanced, in gaming for my money. It's the kind of interesting characterization Naughty Dog think they're making.

Great game, never played a game like it before and it pushed me to my limits.

 

[viveks86]

This has nothing to do with voting or feminists. It has to do with morons that believe men and women's physiology is the same, which isn't even remotely true.

Take yourself to JSTOR where all medical journals, studies, testing, etc is kept and read some studies about what happens at puberty between male and females, the bone density changes, quick twitch muscles developed, pecks developed, oxygen flow through muscles, etc.

I got embarrassed reading that from an adult.

No need to go to extremes, people can have debates and conversations.

Can't disagree with any of that. I was just saying it tongue in cheek

 

[Gonzito]

 

[Hudo]

Comparing this game to a movie like Kill Bill is the level of stupidity I wasn't expecting from this conversation.
That movie is a masterpiece.

This. And Kill Bill is also a movie that does strong female characters (the main character and the antagonists) right because the writers weren't tryharding/brute-forcing them to be "boss bitches". I do hope that Yotei will achieve the same, but the marketing so far has been pretty shit.

One of my favorite movie scence of all time is actually from Kill Bill vol. 1:

 

[vpance]

The defense squad on the other side is punching down on ordinary people daring to defy the corporations and throwing down one insult after another as they do so. Is that the moral high ground? I don't think so.

The rise of the consoomer is concerning. Accepting objectively worse quality products, dragging down the standard for everyone.

 

[EN250]

I'd say MOST main characters in games are like the bolded in general. Men and women. I think devs have gotten better about that over the last 5-10 years though. For every Aloy (Horizon) we get in a game, we get an Elle like in The Last of Us.

We truly have no idea what flaws this woman will have in GOY. We don't know if she'll be a douche macho chick that's emotionless and stoic.

If it's from the first game, sure you're right, now Ellie from the 2nd game, ufff...

Yeah we don't have any idea and people are overreacting with this, but if it wasn't for the devs explicitly setting the tone for the discussion, there would be no problem, what was the point on comparing Jin doing poems and shit as part of his pastime to Mrs stronk woman, not doing any of that cuz that's some weak shit brah, she's tough, she woulnd't waste time on that crap, she'd be slicing and dicing like a real macho-man woman of that time would

 

[Lokaum D+]

This. And Kill Bill is also a movie that does strong female characters (the main character and the antagonists) right because the writers weren't tryharding/brute-forcing them to be "boss bitches". I do hope that Yotei will achieve the same, but the marketing so far has been pretty shit.

One of my favorite movie scence of all time is actually from Kill Bill vol. 1:

if Kill Bill was a 2025 movie she would forge the weapon herself after pushing him to the side cause all his swords are mediocre at best.

 

[Hudo]

if kill bill was a 2025 movie she would forge the weapon herself after pushing him to the side cause all his swords are mediocre at best.

The scary thing is that I think you are 100% spot on...

 

[mckmas8808]

I cracked this thread open earlier and saw Selene from Returnal thrown into a slew of supposed "boss bitch" characters and was triggered as fuck. I forgot which post it was but that was absurd. I spent 150+ hours with that game and took it so far as to have the game's director comment on my theories, that is not whatsoever what the game is about. Furthermore, that character and voice acting is one of the best, and most nuanced, in gaming for my money. It's the kind of interesting characterization Naughty Dog think they're making.

The world is going into a bad place, where nuance and thinking for yourself is old school. These people these days just speak with emotions and mainly do group think now.

If it's from the first game, sure you're right, now Ellie from the 2nd game, ufff...

Yeah we don't have any idea and people are overreacting with this, but if it wasn't for the devs explicitly setting the tone for the discussion, there would be no problem, what was the point on comparing Jin doing poems and shit as part of his pastime to Mrs stronk woman, not doing any of that cuz that's some weak shit brah, she's tough, she woulnd't waste time on that crap, she'd be slicing and dicing like a real macho-man woman of that time would

I'm not sure why, but I think people have the wrong idea with what the devs are saying. Maybe the OP is trash for this misunderstanding. This is what the devs were saying when comparing Jin to Atsu.

Atsu is no samurai. The lead character in Ghost of Yōtei is a wandering sellsword from a lowly family. Atsu adopts the mantle of an onryō, a revenge spirit from Japanese folklore. By embracing this legend, she becomes a figure of fear to her enemies. While the resulting game is similar to Tsushima – in Ghost of Yōtei you also travel across a romanticised open-world recreation of feudal Japan on horseback, carving up your enemies with precise strokes of your katana – the shift from high-class samurai to vagrant sellsword shows itself in unexpected ways.
Atsu is no samurai. The lead character in Ghost of Yōtei is a wandering sellsword from a lowly family.

"She has a different life than Jin, and we want to bring that out through interactivity," Fox says. That means removing Ghost of Tsushima's contemplative moments, such as those during which Jin would meditate on his surroundings and transform his struggle into haiku. "Jin was a scholarly samurai; he would pause to reflect and take in the beauty of nature. Atsu is not that person." Those moments softened the rough edges of Tsushima, a mellowing that Sucker Punch doesn't want to apply to the feral world of Yōtei. Atsu doesn't write poems; she collects bounties as she hunts down the warriors that stalk Hokkaido

I'm confused as to how the men here on GAF seem to think Jin writing poems makes him a silly weak bitch-made pussy dude. Jin came from a wealthy family that believed in honor and respecting all your enemies. Yet he kicked all that out the door when his people were murdered by the Mongrels.

Whereas Atsu is from a poor family and she wasn't raised with the same levels of honor and respect growing up like Jin.