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[SkoomaSuckinSwit]

Ugh, this whole Kinect marketing thing has me disgusted.
This pretty much sums up my view of how the Xbox brand has changed with each release:

 

[tkalamba]

Oh you are talking about ads on websites - yes I know that :-D - few pages earlier I recommended Gostery.
No I am talking about the Xbox one - where all the information can be tied to your xbox live profile effortlessly.

If you are concerned about targeting a profile, MS does not provide that data to users. They use the exact same targeting methods as their online display.

They are still bound by their obligations to the IAB even on Xbox Live. They can not identify a user by name, or gamertag. The most they can do is by sex and age.

Most advertisers see Live as a male dominated platform, so a vast majority of the ads will just blanket cover males 25+55

 

[fallingdove]

Ugh, this whole Kinect marketing thing has me disgusted.
This pretty much sums up my view of how the Xbox brand has changed with each release:

Lol. Perfect.

 

[ironcreed]

Ugh, this whole Kinect marketing thing has me disgusted.
This pretty much sums up my view of how the Xbox brand has changed with each release:

LOL

 

[Teletraan1]

Typo

Don't worry that poster is buying both systems. It just speaks to the quality of those 2 systems that they have to spend their entire time defending one of them.

 

[Tobor]

I'm really pleased that this is finally getting the attention it deserves.

From the beginning, I've been far more concerned by Kinect and it's potential abuses than the disc DRM stuff.

Better late than never.

 

[coolasj19]

How to advertise without pissing people off. Basically, GIVE THEM MONEY. People will opt-in to that shit for $50 a year. Or y'know, if you're going to use your members as advertisement banks, make XBL free. Better yet, give it away for free with the opt-in. Microsoft, be like Google. Because this sleazy scummy we're gonna use technicalities and obscurities shit is getting real old, real fast. 20 Million units tops, fast.

 

[p3tran]

It's based on re-targeting cookies and the like. None of it actually identifies you personally, just the content of the sites and your browsing history. Say you go to the Hyundai site, and build a car, or go to Coca Cola, a cookie will install in your browser, then the ads get targeted to you based on that cookie.

There are a ton of complicated algorithms that determine targeting, but none will ever know who you are. They'll just determine if you are a male, your general age and whatnot based on the sites you visit. If you have a history of going to IGN on Chrome, then GQ, then Askmen, then it's safe to assume that you are a male.

Google specifically specializes in content based targeting. They focus on keywords and whatnot.

well I just read an article that was linked on that iab site, that said that because cookies dont work too great on the smartphones, there are already companies that identify you on your mobile smartphone, ......through your browsing habits(!)


what I believe is that there is so much money in this sector, that rules get bend all the time, and not always when something foul is found is resolved in a righteous manner.
it was like this in the past for other bigmoney-making industries, I dont see even the slightest reason this "rule of thumb" is not in use here too. and everything being all ones and zeroes makes the "bending" multiple times more easy than in the past.

 

[w1ck3dn1nj4]

Kinect’s a treasure trove alright. And the data used to build better marketing profiles won't be limited to the xbone/adbox audience, but will extend to all products falling under MS's “ONE” big happy family Adbone profiles tied to windows and phones? Yup, you can bet they’re rubbing their crotches in anticipation.

 

[tkalamba]

well I just read an article that was linked on that iab site, that said that because cookies dont work too great on the smartphones, there are already companies that identify you on your mobile smartphone, ......through your browsing habits(!)


what I believe is that there is so much money in this sector, that rules get bend all the time, and not always when something foul is found is resolved in a righteous manner.
it was like this in the past for other bigmoney-making industries, I dont see even the slightest reason this "rule of thumb" is not in use here too. and everything being all ones and zeroes makes the "bending" multiple times more easy than in the past.

They target based on habits, which is basically what Google does, but they don't Identify you as a person. They can't. They won't know your name, your profession, or your address. The best they can do is guess based on the sites you go to.

 

[hawk2025]

No answer on the ads API?

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

This advertising bombardment on the XB1 will start bad then get fucking worse. That is a certainty.

Once you're locked into their ecosystem, prepare to be abused.

 

[p3tran]

They target based on habits, which is basically what Google does, but they don't Identify you as a person. They can't. They won't know your name, your profession, or your address. The best they can do is guess based on the sites you go to.

actually the article talks about identification, and knowing whether the ad you saw on your mobile resulted in a visit/purchase later on from your desktop. or them being able to serve the "proper" ads on a shared tablet when husband/wife is using it.
it sounds pretty damn intrusive.

http://www.smartbrief.com/10/06/13/can-sophisticated-smartphone-targeting-help-kill-cookies
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/06/t...-phone-users-to-advertisers.html?pagewanted=1

 

[tkalamba]

actually the article talks about identification, and knowing whether the ad you saw on your mobile resulted in a visit/purchase later on from your desktop. or them being able to serve the "proper" ads on a shared tablet when husband/wife is using it.
it sounds pretty damn intrusive.

http://www.smartbrief.com/10/06/13/can-sophisticated-smartphone-targeting-help-kill-cookies
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/06/t...-phone-users-to-advertisers.html?pagewanted=1

I work int he industry, I handle the tracking and analytics of my online campaigns, which include the mobile space. Identification is still anonymous. I will never have a list of names or people. I have conversions, either post impression (they bought something after I saw my ad, or post click, they bought something after clicking the ad)

I will never have names, professions or anything identifying. The closest identification is pure numbers. Hell, even the NYtimes article you posted specifically says Google is using an "anonymous identifier"

 

[methodman]

How to advertise without pissing people off. Basically, GIVE THEM MONEY. People will opt-in to that shit for $50 a year. Or y'know, if you're going to use your members as advertisement banks, make XBL free. Better yet, give it away for free with the opt-in. Microsoft, be like Google. Because this sleazy scummy we're gonna use technicalities and obscurities shit is getting real old, real fast. 20 Million units tops, fast.

If they gave me xbl for free, I'll opt in to this ad shit. But paying for xbl and still having ads = No buy and this is from someone who bought the 360 day 1

 

[Chobel]

I work int he industry, I handle the tracking and analytics of my online campaigns, which include the mobile space. Identification is still anonymous. I will never have a list of names or people. I have conversions, either post impression (they bought something after I saw my ad, or post click, they bought something after clicking the ad)

I will never have names, professions or anything identifying. The closest identification is pure numbers. Hell, even the NYtimes article you posted specifically says Google is using an "anonymous identifier"

What about facebook, google plus where they already have the actual names?

 

[IvorB]

...

 

[p3tran]

I work int he industry, I handle the tracking and analytics of my online campaigns, which include the mobile space. Identification is still anonymous. I will never have a list of names or people. I have conversions, either post impression (they bought something after I saw my ad, or post click, they bought something after clicking the ad)

I will never have names, professions or anything identifying. The closest identification is pure numbers. Hell, even the NYtimes article you posted specifically says Google is using an "anonymous identifier"

yes, I can understand that. you are given that part of the data that is meaningful to you.

 

[JWong]

So this is turning into a big blow up huh? I kinda thought we knew all this already. Man, MS, just can't catch a break.

We know about the ads, but adding production value to ads?

Please use that fucking money on games instead, MS.

 

[IvorB]

What about facebook, google plus where they already have the actual names?

Facebook knows who you are but the data that they provide to third-parties will always be anonymised. So if an advertiser wants to buy some impressions from Facebook they could buy "males, aged 18-20 yadda yadda" but not "John Smith".

 

[tkalamba]

What about facebook, google plus where they already have the actual names?

I still can't target on the names of people.

What I can do is target specific age groups, locations, and keywords.

Stuff like interests and liked pages, location etc.

For Facebook : I can technically also target your workplace, so if you put in your profile you work at McDonalds, I can target that, and all McDonalds employees who listed their jobs can be targeted. I can even go as far as the school you listed in your profile, but I still will never be able to go as far as you specifically unless I know every detail about you and literally put every piece of information about you.

You can play with the ad targeting yourself at https://www.facebook.com/ads/create/

targeting is fully dependent on what information you, the user, willingly makes available on your profile. If you include the information, you are freely giving it out to any advertiser. Every thing except names that is.

It's available to anyone.

Google, is a bit of a bigger beast, as it ties your Plus account to your Youtube, Chrome browser, android phone and gmail account. They can still only use the information you provided in your account, willingly, but can't target your name. They can go after relevant content. Google is the king of Contextual targeting, an email you are reading has the word videogame in it? You will likely see a video game based ad. They do it all with bots much like their search results.

 

[bigmf]

I knew this thread would be a bone-yard when I read the title.

I'm willing to accept targeted advertising on a home console, the same as I'd accept any of these t-shirts. (Not trying to advertise to you; go have a Pepsi). Don't expect me to pay for it though. You'll have to drop the price drastically for me to be part of your advertising schemes.

 

[BajiRav]

Ugh, this whole Kinect marketing thing has me disgusted.
This pretty much sums up my view of how the Xbox brand has changed with each release:

LOL

 

[TouchMyBox]

Even when Kinect is used in games it can get... a little scary. Consider a F2P game that monitors your mood and, when it notices you are in the right state of mind, it asks you if you want to pay for something. Furthermore, it can manipulate game events to steer you toward purchase decisions. It may even model your personality type to decide on the best way to extract money.

This kind of monetization could be developed into a science with the aid of Kinect data.

What about a game that can detect if you're drunk and then offer you a bunch of microtransactions?

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I followed up with a slightly less vague version of how I'm told it works. It's not nearly as intensive as it sounds.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=85140778&postcount=672


Picture it like this.

Toyota and Microsoft have a deal for nuADs (they actually do... but this is make believe for now).

Toyota is showing a commercial nationwide during American Idol or some huge ass show. American Idol is fine. It's showing the commercial at a specific time.

During that time the Kinect reads your biometric data. It see's what you like in the commercial, what you don't, etc. Say it shows a number of cars and your heart rate and skin color rise when it shows the truck.

The next day when calling to the server for dashboard ads toyota sends out a masterlist with 5 ads (each with a specific car they showed). The biometric data is crunched locally that I am excited by the truck so it calls back to the server to download that ad. It's not sending my biometric data, just what ad to show me. That's the distinction.

Or if the ads are small enough, like a dashboard video, it can easily send all 5. That's not a big file size at all. So then *no* data at all needs to be sent out.


This isn't very much work for the kinect, their servers or the advertisers. And it's a level of focused advertising that people will pay A LOT of money for.


And Albert, I don't really expect you to know who I am, but let's just say things I've posted here in the past, regarding DRM, your E3 lineup and other various things before they were public knowledge that magically became true. This isn't just pie in the sky tinfoil hat shit.

Spoiler

Though i still don't know if I was wrong about League of Legends being a Xbox console exclusive or if you just aren't ready to announce it yet. This has been bugging me since April!

Thanks for the explanation. Few questions...

So the commercial is playing on XBL? I assume the commercial is on a TV...
How would Kinect be able to read my expressions, skin pigmentation changes, etc if it's off?As in off, not just in standby...which is what your example hinges on.
Kinect 2/0 can detect skin pigmentation changes?
What if I don't opt into capturing data as is the case now?

I get that there's some concern over this, but this all depends on their being a very strict set of circumstances and MS maybe changing their ToS at a later date.

 

[Skeff]

What about a game that can detect if you're drunk and then offer you a bunch of microtransactions?

Then we are all doomed, I also imagine a game would be able to check if there are any other players in the room when an XBL account, with user settings of age <13 (parental controls) is playing a game and in turn offer micro transactions etc, this wouldn't be done by microsoft of course but I'm curios if they have anything to prevent this.

 

[QaaQer]

Shit! I been thinking about that book, ever since I read the OP.
Funny it's free enterprise that will bring us the tool that a totalitarian regime would envy.

By breast-feeding us tailored ad campaigns based on our reactions and material status, it could manipulate a large part of our life from what cereals we feed the children to which party we give our vote.

Albert telling us that the data-mining of our life will be optional does not really give me any comfort. Once the console sales have reached a critical mass they can offer Live gold for free if you let them scan your life. And who doesn't want to save a buck? The revenue stream from the ads will likely outperform the live fees by far.

This is some scary shit famousmortimer is telling us about.

Big Brother is the most potent and indelible symbol of mass mind control. Orwell died before the full blossoming of the military industrial complex and the corporate capture of government, so he was unable to create a symbol for that. Big Brother is such a potent symbol, it has a tendency to fool people into believing that manipulation and mind control is the sole purview of governments.

The lack of an equivalent symbol for corporate capture makes it impossible to raise awareness of non-governmental totalitarianism in bumper-sticker sized arguments. And unfortunately, the only way to reach a large audience is with bite sized chunks of thought and mass symbols.

We really need a Big CEO character, or in the case of China, Big CEO Brother.

Slightly OT, but anyone interested in accountability and transparency should visit transparancy international.

 

[Lamptramp]

This really is a horrible little story.

Kotaku's headline regarding this story that MS "Brags to advertisers" about what they can sell them from their users, while a little sensationalist is actually how it sounds to me when reading the text.

Of course thats an over the top generalisation but it quite effectively reflects my feelings about how MS plans to treat me as a customer, an asset they can milk. A higher price from the start, the vast majority of the services being locked behind more money and on top of that the expectation that I can expect that the premium service will be riddled with advertising too.

Even before discussing a potential breach of privacy the whole situation is disquieting.

Whats irritating is that it seems to be yet another thing to put into the list of "features" to the Xbox One which sounds very sinister to which they do not seem to have a clear response to allay customers fears. I'm disappointed that MS does not seem to have thought about what the audiences reactions would be about such "features", and that once again they don't quite understand why people are upset/concerned.

I also get that user data is freely given and used in existing technology but (especially in recent months) its rise has given greater concern to people about exactly what data is taken and how its used. I would have expected any company bringing such a device into peoples home and around a focal communal device (such as the TV) to fully expect a backlash and/or concerns.

An interesting OT note regarding privacy was I recall a radio 4 show about data last week where a chap from Microsoft (not the Xbox division) noted that while beneficial for consumers and companies alike smart electricity meters can be "horrible from a privacy PoV, as people could know when you watch TV, when you eat, when you drink & your sleep patterns", I'm paraphrasing there but the gist is the same. That guy got it, even when there is a tangible benefit to the customer even such a small amount of data as what your electricity meter is doing, can be thought of as an invasion of privacy.

[edit] The show was "The Bottom line" episode Big data, & Dave Coplin from MS search, 03-October. Interesting show, of course it shows that parts of MS are only too aware of privacy issues and the concerns people have, which is positive. Though I'm sure I don't want any part of a console where the main selling point appears to be there for advertisers first and me second.

[stuff]

While I loathe your industry its interesting to read an insider talking about it so cheers matey!

 

[tkalamba]

While I loathe your industry its interesting to read an insider talking about it so cheers matey!

Sometimes many of us within the industry loathe it too..

But it pays my bills, so I can't really complain.

 

[JaggedSac]

Digital Advertising specifically, all online media and the like, I'm technically responsible for stuff like all the annoying preroll on Youtube or banners, and I hate them as much as everyone else, but they are effective and have a massive reach.

I have plenty of data, unfortunately, most of it would end up identifying where I work and my clients so I can't actually provide it, but I can tell you that most of our most successful campaigns were all engaging and interactive. Most of the awards in the industry are won with ads like these believe it or not.

Yes, you can't identify people, all metrics gathered are all anonymous, they can only hold basic information.

They can only determine a general area, usually the most basic would be at the City level, but this is rarely provided. Usually limited to state or province level. They can also only determine your age, and sex, and never your race. Facebook is one of the only platforms that provide most of that data, and it's because through creating a profile, a user will willingly identify themselves and provide all that data. The only targeting that wouldn't be available is by name.

There are a crap ton of rules based around re-targeting, demographic profile and whatnot. They are also getting much more strict, and stuff like Ad Choices is becoming the standard for all advertisers in the digital space. http://www.youradchoices.com/

Basically, with ad choices, you should start to see a little logo at the top right of a banner ad, and it will allow you to determine what you can see with ads and whatnot.

It's based on re-targeting cookies and the like. None of it actually identifies you personally, just the content of the sites and your browsing history. Say you go to the Hyundai site, and build a car, or go to Coca Cola, a cookie will install in your browser, then the ads get targeted to you based on that cookie.

There are a ton of complicated algorithms that determine targeting, but none will ever know who you are. They'll just determine if you are a male, your general age and whatnot based on the sites you visit. If you have a history of going to IGN on Chrome, then GQ, then Askmen, then it's safe to assume that you are a male.

Google specifically specializes in content based targeting. They focus on keywords and whatnot.

If you are concerned about targeting a profile, MS does not provide that data to users. They use the exact same targeting methods as their online display.

They are still bound by their obligations to the IAB even on Xbox Live. They can not identify a user by name, or gamertag. The most they can do is by sex and age.

Most advertisers see Live as a male dominated platform, so a vast majority of the ads will just blanket cover males 25+55

Great stuff, thanks for popping into the thread.

 

[QaaQer]

It's based on re-targeting cookies and the like. None of it actually identifies you personally, just the content of the sites and your browsing history. Say you go to the Hyundai site, and build a car, or go to Coca Cola, a cookie will install in your browser, then the ads get targeted to you based on that cookie.

There are a ton of complicated algorithms that determine targeting, but none will ever know who you are. They'll just determine if you are a male, your general age and whatnot based on the sites you visit. If you have a history of going to IGN on Chrome, then GQ, then Askmen, then it's safe to assume that you are a male.

Google specifically specializes in content based targeting. They focus on keywords and whatnot.

who does google think you are?

Another interesting note is that Google filters and prioritizes your search results based on who they think you are, so when you Google something you will get different results than when I Google the exact same thing.

finally, one of the Google founders said that his goal is to make the algorithm so accurate and personalized that a 17 year old could type in "Which college should I attend" and Google would give him the correct answer. Google as the oracle of Delphi.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Explains why they wanted the Kincet to be mandatory.

 

[SwiftDeath]

who does google think you are?

Another interesting note is that Google filters and prioritizes your search results based on who they think you are, so when you Google something you will get different results than when I Google the exact same thing.

finally, one of the Google founders said that his goal is to make the algorithm so accurate and personalized that a 17 year old could type in "Which college should I attend" and Google would give him the correct answer. Google as the oracle of Delphi.

Wow that's fairly telling

Although it's nice to know google thinks I'm older than I am, speak dutch which I do not, and for ads from google is not convinced of my gender

 

[Chobel]

I still can't target on the names of people.

What I can do is target specific age groups, locations, and keywords.

Stuff like interests and liked pages, location etc.

For Facebook : I can technically also target your workplace, so if you put in your profile you work at McDonalds, I can target that, and all McDonalds employees who listed their jobs can be targeted. I can even go as far as the school you listed in your profile, but I still will never be able to go as far as you specifically unless I know every detail about you and literally put every piece of information about you.

You can play with the ad targeting yourself at https://www.facebook.com/ads/create/

targeting is fully dependent on what information you, the user, willingly makes available on your profile. If you include the information, you are freely giving it out to any advertiser. Every thing except names that is.

It's available to anyone.

Google, is a bit of a bigger beast, as it ties your Plus account to your Youtube, Chrome browser, android phone and gmail account. They can still only use the information you provided in your account, willingly, but can't target your name. They can go after relevant content. Google is the king of Contextual targeting, an email you are reading has the word videogame in it? You will likely see a video game based ad. They do it all with bots much like their search results.

Thank you for all your answers.

I have another one: can you (as advertiser) identify a consumer indirectly by identifying products he use like an Xbox One? Like targeting ads to one Xbox One console precisely which in this case is like one person/family.

 

[painful fart]

who does google think you are?

Another interesting note is that Google filters and prioritizes your search results based on who they think you are, so when you Google something you will get different results than when I Google the exact same thing.

finally, one of the Google founders said that his goal is to make the algorithm so accurate and personalized that a 17 year old could type in "Which college should I attend" and Google would give him the correct answer. Google as the oracle of Delphi.

Yes, that shit sucks your soul out. Now Microsoft wants to take it to the next level:

"We are trying to bridge some of the world between online and offline," Mehdi said."

"That's a little bit of a holy grail in terms of how you understand the consumer in that 360 degrees of their life. We have a pretty unique position at Microsoft because of what we do with digital, as well as more and more with television because of Xbox. It's early days, but we're starting to put that together in more of a unifying way, and hopefully at some point we can start to offer that to advertisers broadly"


You can hardly get more explicit. They want to place that salesman in your home. Sittning there on your TV studying your clothing style listening to your language, perpetually monitoring your pulse and face expression analyzing what to pitch to you, registering your reaction and deciding the next move. Indeed this must be the "Holy grail".

Lots of interesting posts in this thread, really great learning stuff from people in the business.

 

[Mr. Waffle]

Two problems I see.

Even though they may not be able to target you specifically by name they can target anything you have in site of the camera. Beer companies would love to know what you are drinking during football games. If it is their brand, they can show other products they make, or play an add that helps boost the loyalty you have towards their brand. If they see you are partaking of another brand they can bombard you with ads for their alternative to what you are drinking. Same could be done for any product... fast food, electronics, furniture, clothing, etc. They could also base adds off of the general mass of the person, or persons watching the TV. If the person/s are large play adds for sweets, fast food, etc. If they are small hit them with health foods, sports drinks,etc. Same could be done for race, and don't forget ad agencies don't disregard kids.

This is where the second problem comes in... The tech savvy among us will be diligent in turning off this type of thing during set up. A unknowing parent, or the general impatient consumer will spam through the set-up taking all of the default settings. You know full well that MS will make this a default setting that you will have to select to turn off. Joe Public has just signed their child up to be observed, and studied for product placement.

Having a camera, and mic pointed right at you not only during gaming, but also during cable TV, and or anything else you do in-front of your TV is a huge game changer, and the leg up on Google that MS has been trying for for years. This is a lot different than anything any other product has done since Facebook and twitter. If you think Joe Public will be smart about this then you haven't been paying attention to social media.

If this succeeds plan on seeing every TV, and cable box having mandatory camera's & mics built in... and not just on the ultra expensive products this will be rolled out on budget items very quickly.

I'm proud of my tinfoil hat, and won't buy the X one.

 

[Jotaka]

And remember the Kinnect can be really helpful to NuAD even without sending any data to MS server. How?

If kinnect collect the data and just store the data in the local HD (encrypted of course) MS can still send a bunch of ads and let your local xbox one decide for itself what is the best ad for the target audience and the algorithm can easly be update in the next firmware. And not a single bit about you is send to MS in the whole process

 

["D"]

Ugh, Microsoft. I just don't know what to say about you right now...rather, I have TOO much to say but not enough vulgar expressions.

 

[bishoptl]

No sarcasm intended but you are most likely correct. When we speak of MS, as large a grand, multinational corporation as they are and taken into context (NSA, PRISM, etc) perhaps this is far greater....certainly involving the very Govt. Agencies you mention. Oddly........I do find it......well, on the borderline of tasteless that the console will be released on the 50th anniversary of JFK's death...which is absolutely ironic considering that issue in and of itself is another very relevant issue where the peoples trust was betrayed but, in a sense, I digress.

are you fucking kidding me

 

[Shosai]

Yes, that shit sucks your soul out. Now Microsoft wants to take it to the next level:

"We are trying to bridge some of the world between online and offline," Mehdi said."

"That's a little bit of a holy grail in terms of how you understand the consumer in that 360 degrees of their life. We have a pretty unique position at Microsoft because of what we do with digital, as well as more and more with television because of Xbox. It's early days, but we're starting to put that together in more of a unifying way, and hopefully at some point we can start to offer that to advertisers broadly"


You can hardly get more explicit. They want to place that salesman in your home. Sittning there on your TV studying your clothing style listening to your language, perpetually monitoring your pulse and face expression analyzing what to pitch to you, registering your reaction and deciding the next move. Indeed this must be the "Holy grail".

Lots of interesting posts in this thread, really great learning stuff from people in the business.

It's not so much them "listening" as you going out of your way to put all that information in a packet and mailing it to them, with the instruction to disseminate the information to anyone who asks.

 

[tkalamba]

Thank you for all your answers.

I have another one: can you (as advertiser) identify a consumer indirectly by identifying products he use like an Xbox One? Like targeting ads to one Xbox One console precisely which in this case is like one person/family.

The amount of data that would require would make it insanely difficult to do and entirely pointless. Likely impossible as well. Microsoft's own targeting doesn't even get detailed enough to allow that to happen.

The goal for an advertiser is not to go after any one individual, they don't care who you are or what you do on your own. Their goal is to get the highest reach they can (number of people) in their target demographic. Their ads usually hit a wide range of users, and hope for the best. They want their message seen. They only care what consumers as a group are doing, and what any one individual are doing.

 

[semiconscious]

"We are trying to bridge some of the world between online and offline," Mehdi said."

"That's a little bit of a holy grail in terms of how you understand the consumer in that 360 degrees of their life. We have a pretty unique position at Microsoft because of what we do with digital, as well as more and more with television because of Xbox. It's early days, but we're starting to put that together in more of a unifying way, and hopefully at some point we can start to offer that to advertisers broadly"


You can hardly get more explicit. They want to place that salesman in your home. Sittning there on your TV studying your clothing style listening to your language, perpetually monitoring your pulse and face expression analyzing what to pitch to you, registering your reaction and deciding the next move. Indeed this must be the "Holy grail"...

yep. can't really remember anyone ever talking about a 'holy grail' who wasn't actively involved in attempting with all their might to arrange for getting their hands on it ...


penello & co. should just pass on gaf. trying to please/appease everyone is never gonna get ms anywhere other than looking even worse... not to mention, according to mehdi, they've already got their target audience in the bag, anyway:

"In a broader set of community, people don't pay attention to a lot of the details," said Mehdi. "We've seen it in the research, we've seen it in a lot of the data points..."

 

[SwiftDeath]

The amount of data that would require would make it insanely difficult to do and entirely pointless. Likely impossible as well. Microsoft's own targeting doesn't even get detailed enough to allow that to happen.

The goal for an advertiser is not to go after any one individual, they don't care who you are or what you do on your own. Their goal is to get the highest reach they can (number of people) in their target demographic. Their ads usually hit a wide range of users, and hope for the best. They want their message seen. They only care what consumers as a group are doing, and what any one individual are doing.

Curious though

I thought there was a push in advertising to get ever more specific?

Eventually to evolve past the target demographics?

Wouldn't an ad be worth more to the seller of a good if they can tell how likely phil is to buy their product?

Isn't that where the industry is going?

Not every male 18-25 is going to be interested in your product but maybe new target groups based on individuals tastes are

 

[DrFurbs]

The XBone is the biggest fucking piece of trash I've seen in my entire life. I am disgusted.

How anybody could find this console is appealing is blowing my mind.

I agree with you 100%.

 

[Barzul]

who does google think you are?

Another interesting note is that Google filters and prioritizes your search results based on who they think you are, so when you Google something you will get different results than when I Google the exact same thing.

finally, one of the Google founders said that his goal is to make the algorithm so accurate and personalized that a 17 year old could type in "Which college should I attend" and Google would give him the correct answer. Google as the oracle of Delphi.

Shockingly accurate.

 

[DukeTogo1300]

Passive ads that disregard my presence are easy enough to deal with passively. Active ads have an engaging property about them that makes me feel uncomfortable, much like those hounds at the entrance of the local mall begging me to try their lotion samples.

I know this is just tech, but the concept is really crossing a line that encourages me to unplug from it all.

 

[Coxy]

edit: explained via pm

 

[Alchemy]

So everything is as expected, and I can continue ignoring the Xbone until a Kinectless SKU comes out. Thanks for saving me money Microsoft.

 

[megalowho]

The slow march from the original blades dashboard to the current ad soaked 360 UI and where marketing plans to take things from here has been a big reason why I've slowly moved away from Microsoft over the years, despite being head over heels for the box closer to launch. Not everyone will end their Gold subscription and naturally gravitate towards other options at once, but a palpable zest for turning user data into dollars as our privacy gets increasingly compromised from all ends is rather distasteful and I prefer to have as little to do with it as possible.

 

[Freki]

removed for privacy reasons...