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AMERICAN HORROR STORY: Coven |OT| When witches don't fight, we burn....

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H

Hilbert

Deep into his 30th decade
spuckthew said:
I haven't read any spoilers, but seeing peoples' response to the finale of Coven is a little off-putting. I have Murder House and Asylum on Blu-ray and, although the former was so-so and pretty decent in places, I really enjoyed Asylum...I just fell in love with it. Obviously I'll watch it at some point, but how does Coven actually rate against Asylum (or even Murder House)? I just don't want to go into it assuming it will be better but then come away from it with my expectations thoroughly curbed.
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I really didn't care for Asylum. In fact I probably hated it. I started out hating coven even more, but then it won me over.

Overall I liked coven more than asylum I guess.
 
B

BertramCooper

Banned
In spite of all of its craziness, Asylum had an extremely strong triumvirate of well-developed central characters - Jude, Lana, and Kit - that kept everything grounded. Their intersecting storylines created a compelling emotional core that kept the season from spinning out of control.

Coven had nothing similar.
 
K

kirblar

Member
BertramCooper said:
In spite of all of its craziness, Asylum had an extremely strong triumvirate of well-developed central characters - Jude, Lana, and Kit - that kept everything grounded. Their intersecting storylines created a compelling emotional core that kept the season from spinning out of control.

Coven had nothing similar.
Click to expand...
Bingo. The ending was amazing.
 
Monocle

Monocle

Member
I'm sure people will call total bullshit here, but, his hyperbole aside, I find myself agreeing with Price Peterson's defense of this season's dream logic in his photo recap of the finale. I liked how Coven threw out conventional storytelling in favor of a wild grab bag of entertaining non sequiturs. People can call this season shit if they want, but that won't change the fact that I'll remember the bizarre and delightful Myrtle Snow long after I've forgotten about "better" shows than AHS.

This thread's criticism of Coven is really overblown. Genuinely bad shows have no impact and leave no impression. They take themselves too seriously or not seriously enough and leave nothing to the imagination, killing all drama and intrigue. They abuse their viewers' suspension of disbelief through incompetent craft in writing, production, and performance. Coven is better than that. Every episode kept me engaged in the moment, the production design was well conceived and effective, and so many members of the cast brought unexpected and interesting qualities to their characters with inspired performances that were more than the sum of their quirks. I think people are looking for the wrong things in this show if they have no reservations about trashing the whole season.
 
C

CapNBritain

Member
I don't know so many people here hate on Murder House. I loved it so much more than the other 2 seasons (although Asylum's ending is amazing and a better ending than Murder House's). I've noticed at AHS has a very schizophrenic editing style/story-telling style, where people and plots points jump rapidly back and forth with no real sense of pacing and continuity. You never know how much time has passed or who is dealing with what issues. Crazy stuff just kind of happens. In Murder House that kind of fit the fever dream of losing your mind in a haunted house. It also sort of worked for Asylum, except for the fact that the inmates could basically teleport all around the asylum whenever they wanted to really took me out of the show. For coven, things just happened so randomly that I had trouble feeling connected to the story or the characters.

I mean, why are they at the school? Do they take classes? How the hell did they learn how to cast spells from books? Is book magic different from death-vagina magic? These were all things I needed to know to be able to enjoy Coven. And while the last two season was full of horror, this season was just a terrible attempt at witchy politics. It was a YA witch version of harry potter without the scope, and the addition of a little blood (with the exception of the first few episodes, LaLaruie's stuff was awesome). I wanted to see the scary messed up stuff in the intro and all I got was witches being bitches.
 
3

3phemeral

Member
I watched Asylum while Coven was on a break. Did a two-night binge and I felt as though it was better done. Sure, there was a lot going on, but ultimately, most everyone had their purpose. Anne Frank may have been out of the blue, but it served to show that despite her delusions, it led S.M. Jude to discovering who Hans was. He didn't just magically flip back and forth on whether he should stick with S.M. Eunice, he stuck with her until he ended himself over his displeasure of her loss of innocence. Plus, Kit convincing Lana Banana to shut down the asylum ike she initially intended after getting distracted by her hunger for fame.

Also, can I just saw how sexy Joseph Fiennes is? My god.

I don't know, I just felt all the loose ends tied together more neatly and more importantly, satisfyingly than Coven ever did. Coven just seemed to fall apart with every episode after Ax Man. I blame Meryl Streep's daughter.
 
indigo-cyclops

indigo-cyclops

Member
Monocle said:
I'm sure people will call total bullshit here, but, his hyperbole aside, I find myself agreeing with Price Peterson's defense of this season's dream logic in his photo recap of the finale. I liked how Coven threw out conventional storytelling in favor of a wild grab bag of entertaining non sequiturs. People can call this season shit if they want, but that won't change the fact that I'll remember the bizarre and delightful Myrtle Snow long after I've forgotten about "better" shows than AHS.

This thread's criticism of Coven is really overblown. Genuinely bad shows have no impact and leave no impression. They take themselves too seriously or not seriously enough and leave nothing to the imagination, killing all drama and intrigue. They abuse their viewers' suspension of disbelief through incompetent craft in writing, production, and performance. Coven is better than that. Every episode kept me engaged in the moment, the production design was well conceived and effective, and so many members of the cast brought unexpected and interesting qualities to their characters with inspired performances that were more than the sum of their quirks. I think people are looking for the wrong things in this show if they have no reservations about trashing the whole season.
Click to expand...

It left too much to be desired, was messy, and was not expertly characterized like you proclaim. This notion that a bad show leaves no impression is just bullshit. Good or bad an impression will be there because we viewed it.

I disagree production design was well conceived and effective.
I disagree that the character's were interesting.

Coven did leave a lot to be desired; it insulted the intelligence of viewers by completely throwing coherent narrative to the side. Instead of an interesting take on how a group of outsiders could possibly survive the onslaught of outside forces, we got a group that does nothing but destroys itself from the inside out, only to be miraculously fixed in the end..

I did love the introduction/title though.
 
T

toastyToast

Member
I think my main issue about this season was I really didn't give a fuck who the next supreme was. Initially it was interesting with Fiona wanting to get rid of her and her losing her powers but then that plot thread persisted the whole season. I wanted witches to do witch shit, I wasn't tuning in for bitchy in-fighting. Even the bitchy in-fighting was bad, Madison was the only one bringing the heat. If it was a whole house full of crazy Madison chicks then yeah I could adjusted my expectations but everyone else was so boring.

Nan + the neighbour boy = why? Zoe + Kyle = why?

Murphy needs to up the crazy factor next season. It's why I enjoyed season 2 and Nip/Tuck so much. I'm not in it for the drama, man.
 
Nemesis_

Nemesis_

Member
toastyToast said:
Murphy needs to up the crazy factor next season. It's why I enjoyed season 2 and Nip/Tuck so much. I'm not in it for the drama, man.
Click to expand...

This is true, I got much more Nip/Tuck vibes from Asylum and I think it's why I enjoyed it so much.

I LOLed at this

c78dbc1edd584253c2324878734b987e.jpg
 
F

Father_Brain

Banned
Monocle said:
I'm sure people will call total bullshit here, but, his hyperbole aside, I find myself agreeing with Price Peterson's defense of this season's dream logic in his photo recap of the finale. I liked how Coven threw out conventional storytelling in favor of a wild grab bag of entertaining non sequiturs. People can call this season shit if they want, but that won't change the fact that I'll remember the bizarre and delightful Myrtle Snow long after I've forgotten about "better" shows than AHS.
Click to expand...

Myrtle may well be Coven's best "character," yes. I put that in quotes precisely because Murphy et al. so quickly abandoned nearly all pretense of writing her as an actual character as opposed to a mouthpiece for whatever campy reference-heavy gay dialogue entered their heads, and the latter is clearly what they were most interested in this season.
 
K

kuppy

Member
Coven lacked in mystery, while the viewer still wanted to know as much as possible about the circumstances the bigger and fearful basics were laid down pretty quickly.

In Murder House we didn't know what the heck was going on and therefore were presented with one part of the puzzle at the time, getting us closer and closer to the whole truth.
Asylum started to use this technique not as major portion anymore and instead gave the feeling of never knowing for certain what can be trusted, creating a very haunting atmosphere.
Coven couldn't deliver on such a level, I think that goes down to the nature of this horror story, which, well, focuses on witches, it’s the way we were introduced and told about this story, a rather open way. I don’t think this had necessarily to do with the story being more focused on a younger part of the cast, but maybe it didn’t feel as mature in theme because of that.

While I’m definitely not watching American Horror Story just to get scared, I still think this season also could have had the opportunity to set the point of view differently to present more surprises/reveal and a more frightening atmosphere. It's almost like the title intro showed more potential (in theme and tone) than the actual season, guess it's kind of ironic that the biggest mistake was to take away the magic surrounding the witches.

In general I still think that this season was awesome, but maybe not as good as the previous ones, it was a more enjoyable and pleasant season though.

Edit: Oh and for the for the record, my favorite season so far is Asylum, damn that one had it all. I'm not completely sure, but this season might still helped a lot for developing a better style of this series, the amount of different and significant recognizable shots should carry over.
 
F

Fantastical

Death Prophet
I'm still baffled that "Who is the next Supreme?" was supposed to be the season long arc. I thought that would be answered mid season.

Also fuck Cordelia for being all badass "I DON'T CARE IF U DIE" and then crying when Misty was sent to hell. Honestly, fuck her. Misty was doing fine before meeting any of them. She helped them and got completely fucked. Zoe with the cold as hell "there's nothing we can do" when Misty has helped her. Zoe should have stayed dead.

BearPawB said:
I don't understand how anyone can call this season disjointed, when the last season had Anne Frank, Nazis, Aliens, Beasts, serial killers, possessions and so much more i am forgetting.

This season had witches. And it pretty much stuck to that theme.
That being said it was still a complete mess that didn't go anywhere.

There needs to be a better overal arc for this show to work. It is why murder house remains the best season.

Sidenotes:

It is a sin to not have a better character arc for zoe and tate (forget his name this season). They are the best, and were given nothing worthwhile to do. A complete shame.

I hope Kathy Bates comes back, she is great. This could be the "old actress show" and i would gobble up every second of it.

All i ask is that they stop trying to throw every idea they have into one season. If you want to do aliens, do aliens right. If you want to do witches, don't waste episodes on the axe man. Just a little bit of focus would be nice.
Click to expand...

Yeah I have to agree. Asylum gets too much praise and its flaws are so easily looked over while Murder House's are overplayed. Anne Frank was dumb as hell and the aliens were pointless.

HGEtv22.jpg


LOL
 
P

pokeystaples

Banned
Aw, I really liked this season and couldn't bring myself to finish Asylum. I loved how over the top and ridiculous it was. Myrtle with the theremin. Delphine and Obama. Things happened that made absolutely no sense. Where the hell has Queenie been? What happened to the baby? Cordelia tho? And yet, I woke up every Thursday morning and downloaded it to watch after work. It was like eating your goods on Halloween night when you're on the cusp of being too old to trick r treat. Yeah, you're a little queasy after all is said and done, but damn if it wasn't fun to get dressed up and be silly.
 
K

kirblar

Member
If you end strong, which Asylum did, people will be a lot more forgiving. The Shield has a lot of bloat in its midsection (S4 in particular) but due to its strong ending and overall arc, people remember it fondly.
 
K

kuppy

Member
ultron87 said:
Then by the end of the season they just reveal themselves to the world as an afterthought with no mention of the previously mentioned disastrous consequences.
Click to expand...
Maybe I'm reading to much into it, but in that interview Cordelia mentioned something like that they will always be hunted and misunderstood. So in the end it is better if they stay together, have their backs instead of being killed when they are out there and the other people don't know how to react to them (the way Misty first got exposed). The witches are also greatly benefiting of each other, building a stronger elite, maybe getting stronger just being around each other, most definitely now starting to get a better training under the new supreme. You may say that some of them only got into trouble when they started being together, but then there were also moments like when Fiona just got the murder case away from them. Charges most of the inexperienced witches would have to face over time, simply because they can not straight away control their powers, which might be what the death while having sex was supposed to show. It seemed like Zoe didn't know about her powers before that at all, and while having sex she might have concentrated or felt the way a witch can cast a spell.

Edit: Also let's not forget that the witches get offered a great home and that sure is the personal favor of Cordelia, specially since she can't have children on her own.
 
B

backflip10019

Member
Man, I have so many thoughts on this show (most of them negative). Finally got a chance to watch the finale last night, and I wasn't particularly disappointed (probably because I have zero expectations of this show following the rest of this season) but I was underwhelmed.

Overall, I found the Fleetwood Mac/Stevie Nicks integration to be so forced (and boring). I fast forwarded through all of her songs because they felt so out of place. Ultimately, I also hated the voodoo aspects because they felt completely wasted. Could've had a really compelling give and take between voodoo and regular witch magic, but they killed off Marie Leveau's crew far too early. I was also completely disappointed by the entire Delphine story line. Felt super unnecessary.

I think the show focuses far too much on shock value --
thinking back to past seasons, we've had school shooters, serial killers, countless rapes, beheadings
-- and not enough on building compelling, genuinely terrifying characters
maybe with the exception of Zachary Quinto's character in Asylum
.

I'm interested to see what they do with the next season, but my hopes aren't very high.
 
F

Fusebox

Banned
Well I loved Coven. Easily my fave AHS so far. Purely in order of how much I enjoyed each series I'd say 3 > 1 > 2 for me.
 
D

DominoKid

Member
Watched the last 3 eps this morning. I thought it was a pretty good season overall. The only thing I didn't like was the Axeman/Fiona relationship but I even like how that played out in the end.

Pretty satisfied w/ all 3 seasons so far. Asylum is the best but Coven is the most entertaining to me.

Sarah Paulson is great. I hope she gets to play a villain if she's in another season.

edit: i also thought the Stevie Nicks appearances were great even if they were mostly just random music videos.
 
C

commedieu

Banned
Rez said:
God what a turd
Click to expand...

Yeah. Just stopped watching it. It felt like it fast forwarded ep 8-9, and... I just cant continue. AHS season 1 & 2 are pretty good still. But 3 fell off, the voodoo is laughable now with that bloke showing up. Eh, just... unfortunate. 2 is definitely my favorite, and had some great writing behind it. And yeah, it had the kitchen sink in it, but it polished up each part of the sink nicely. Season 3... i mean...

jump cut to a bathtub? Unless ep 8-9 etc are a dream and fiona's going to wake up? It was almost slapstick the way things are done. just writing to not spoil anything.. but someone has to get what I mean here?
 
F

Fusebox

Banned
ARTPOP said:
I just binge watched all three seasons for the first time, Coven was probably my favorite *.*

Followed by Murder House, and Asylum last. Asylum had the best conclusion, but it had too much going on and sacrificed the development of too many characters in order to give Lana her storyline.
Click to expand...

Haha wow, I thought I'd be the only person here to rank them in that order. *fistbump*
 
E

Ekdrm2d1

Member
'American Horror Story' Season 4 Will Be Set In A Carnival
by Erin Whitney / 03/17/2014 / The Huffington Post

It's been a while since "American Horror Story" Season 4 clues and theories have circulated, but now a new -- and huge -- one has been confirmed.

In a podcast with Nerdist Writers Panel, "AHS" writer and co-executive producer Douglas Petrie spilled the setting of Season 4. When first asked about it, he quickly responded, "I can say nothing." Then Moira Kirkland, a writer for "Castle" and "Arrow" also on the podcast, said, "Well I don't know if it's true, but I heard carnival." Petrie responded, "Yes -- that was the, it -- it does not have a title."

Podcast moderator Ben Blacker then asked, "But that's the setting?" and Petrie confirmed, "That's the idea, that's very roughly the idea." Listen to the podcast around the 33-minute mark to hear for yourself.

Carnival and circus themes were a popular theory trending earlier this year when a slew of fan-made posters hit the web. It seemed like Ryan Murphy put those theories to bed when he told Entertainment Weekly, "No one has completely guessed what it is." But the key word there was "completely" and now we think Murphy was trying to throw us off.

FX did not immediately return The Huffington Post's request for comment

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/17/american-horror-story-season-4_n_4978440.html
 
M

Matt_

World's #1 One Direction Fan: Everyone else in the room can see it, everyone else but you~~~
The imagery could be absolutely stunning
 
M

Matt_

World's #1 One Direction Fan: Everyone else in the room can see it, everyone else but you~~~
Jessica Lange as a mystical crystal ball gazer would be everything
Wouldn't mind a big refresh but I'd like to see Emma Roberts back at least
 
R

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
Didn't Murphy deny rumors that S4 would take place at a circus? Cause a circus and a carnival are essentially the same thing...

Anyway, 1950s carnival. I like it.
 
M

Matt_

World's #1 One Direction Fan: Everyone else in the room can see it, everyone else but you~~~
Should have called it Cirque des Monstres
 
Nemesis_

Nemesis_

Member
I liked the idea of one word names but then again I guess they retroactively titled the original Murder House.

I'm excited to see what they do with this season. I do hope more attention is paid to the overall are rather than individual moments (like Coven)
 
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