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Bay Area Commute Horror: BART strike looming

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GungHo

Single-handedly caused Exxon-Mobil to sue FOX, start World War 3
400,000 thousand
Nice to see that the Chronicle continues to be edited by chimpanzees.

For the position I think $60k a year base salary is pretty incredible... its cash handling right?
Not saying it's not high for what it is, but SF Bay salaries are skewed because of COLA. They're not directly comparable to what someone might make in Ohio.
 
Nice to see that the Chronicle continues to be edited by chimpanzees.


Not saying it's not high for what it is, but SF Bay salaries are skewed because of COLA. They're not directly comparable to what someone might make in Ohio.

not THAT badly.



the people that get the high pay at bart should be the engineers and electricians. do the cash handlers and drivers know any skill that makes them invaluable?
 
let's see how this commute is at 430p today from redwood city to Vallejo. planning to take 92 to 580 to 80 and its marina side street to either 80 or back to 580 > richmond pkwy> 80 near pinole. Its fine commuting in the morning, left around 4.
 
not THAT badly.



the people that get the high pay at bart should be the engineers and electricians. do the cash handlers and drivers know any skill that makes them invaluable?

Why does someone have to acquire an "invaluable" skill to make a middle class income for an area? That's the type of thinking that has led to the current stratification.
 
Why does someone have to acquire an "invaluable" skill to make a middle class income for an area? That's the type of thinking that has led to the current stratification.

You're saying an unskilled worker should make as much as a skilled worker? Alright, fine, all waitresses should make 100K incomes!

Sarcasm aside, I'm sorry, but if there is no benefit to becoming skilled, the area would turn into a shithole.
 

Vyroxis

Banned
Just talked tons friend of mine from the area, she drove her camper van to work so she won't need to commute for a few days, she'll just camp out next to the building and shower at the gym across the street she uses.
 
You're saying an unskilled worker should make as much as a skilled worker? Alright, fine, all waitresses should make 100K incomes!

Sarcasm aside, I'm sorry, but if there is no benefit to becoming skilled, the area would turn into a shithole.

No, actually, I'm saying the skilled workers at the tech companies in San Francisco should also unionize so they can collectively bargain for themselves higher wages and better benefits themselves.

If wages had continued on the same level as they were before the 80's, $60,000 or close to it would be considered the right wage for unskilled work because the top one percent hadn't grabbed all the gains from the last thirty years. Look at Austraila, where the minimum wage is $15/hr and people are getting hired off the street for relatively unskilled jobs for $20-22 bucks an hour.
 
Heh, everyone who normally takes BART has basically cleared out from the office I work at.

The commute tonight will probably be worse than this morning's.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
Just got this in my email:

Contra Costa Times editorial: Striking BART workers out of touch with financial reality.

Contra Costa Times editorial © 2013 Bay Area News Group Posted: 07/01/2013 01:32:14 PM PDT


What are striking BART workers thinking?

They're already the top-paid transit system employees in the region and among the best in the nation. They also have free pensions, health care coverage for their entire family for just $92 a month and the same sweet medical insurance deal when they retire after just five years on the job.

They work only 37½ hours a week. They can call in sick during the workweek and then volunteer for overtime shifts on their days off. The rules exacerbate out-of-control overtime that added in 2012 an average 19 percent to base pay for station agents and 33 percent for train operators.

Meanwhile, BART faces a $142 million operating shortfall over the next 10 years.


It already owes a $636 million debt for employees' pension and retiree health care benefits. Aging train cars and the train control system must be replaced. And BART faces billions of dollars of deferred maintenance and repairs.

There is no extra money. Indeed, future tax increase requests are planned. Every dollar that BART raises salaries must come from somewhere, either more taxes, fare increases or more debt that will be pushed onto future generations.

It's against this backdrop that workers demanded 23 percent salary increases over the next four years. Their thinking remains completely divorced from reality.

They complain that they have gone without raises for several years. So have many Bay Area workers, including those who pay their salaries. More importantly, that argument ignores that BART employees are still among the best-compensated for the jobs they perform.

It's time for them to get real. And it's time for local labor-backed politicians to butt out.

We've seen this movie before. We know how well things work out when legislators and members of Congress stick their noses in where they don't belong. Their pressure led to the unaffordable deals that helped get us into this mess. Neither the BART board nor the area can afford to allow that to happen again.

As for commuters, we feel your pain. We understand your frustration. We are out there with you trying to navigate the clogged streets and highways in this sweltering heat. We know exactly how difficult this is.

We ask you to be patient, to recognize that it's a matter of pay now or pay more later. If BART directors fail to rein in costs -- in other words, if they cave -- you will face higher fares and taxes while service deteriorates.


Until Monday, it had been 16 years since the last BART strike. Given the unreasonable labor demands, this one was inevitable. The alternative was a financial train wreck that could dramatically impact the system for decades to come.
 

Rootbeer

Banned
glad I live in the city and walking distance from work :)

I used to be able to... but I moved to the east bay and now I'm having some temporary regret :)

I'm really not looking forward to coming to/from work on the 4th if this continues into then...

AC Transit has agreed to give 24 hours notice if they will also strike.
 
East Bay to San Fran is what I am looking for, I have to check AC transit for times later in the day.

From what I seen today, as long as it isn't during rush hour, you should be fine taking AC Transit. It only got really heavy trying to reach the Bay Bridge during the morning commute.
 
From what I seen today, as long as it isn't during rush hour, you should be fine taking AC Transit. It only got really heavy trying to reach the Bay Bridge during the morning commute.

I am finding it hard to get a schedule that runs during the time that I need to be there (3PM)

on top of it I cant find anything from Diablo Valley, or even Pleasanton/Dublin to SF, its all Oakland and beyond those Berkeley Hills.

I have NO clue where I could park in Oakland...
 
I am finding it hard to get a schedule that runs during the time that I need to be there (3PM)

on top of it I cant find anything from Diablo Valley, or even Pleasanton/Dublin to SF, its all Oakland and beyond those Berkeley Hills.

I have NO clue where I could park in Oakland...

You can try parking at Jack London Square and take the ferry to SF. There is a garage there and I'm sure it will be packed but you might get a chance.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
I'm really sick of seeing protesting workers holding signs for "More safety." Maybe if safety is such a concern you'll lower your ridiculous raise demands.
 

sh4mike

Member
You can try parking at Jack London Square and take the ferry to SF. There is a garage there and I'm sure it will be packed but you might get a chance.
The line at the Ferry Building from SF to Oakland was more than one boat's worth of passengers at 5:20pm yesterday. No idea what it will look like today.
 
You're saying an unskilled worker should make as much as a skilled worker? Alright, fine, all waitresses should make 100K incomes!

Sarcasm aside, I'm sorry, but if there is no benefit to becoming skilled, the area would turn into a shithole.

That's just silly. Someone has to do the 'unskilled' jobs. Since no one really wants to do them, especially at bullshit wages like minimum wage, then yes, they should make a decent amount.

And no benefit to becoming skilled? Talk about hyperbole. There will always be room for skilled positions making far more than those 'unskilled' positions.
 
The line at the Ferry Building from SF to Oakland was more than one boat's worth of passengers at 5:20pm yesterday. No idea what it will look like today.

Yeah I saw that on the news last night-they did a helicopter aerial shot of that line-fucking unbelievable.
 

Gigglepoo

Member
they're not negotiating for a second day in a row. this strike might be awhile...

They're resuming talks at 6pm tonight. The two sides should be locked into a room until they agree to a new deal. If they can't, let an arbitrator settle things. This strike has gone on long enough.
 
They're resuming talks at 6pm tonight. The two sides should be locked into a room until they agree to a new deal. If they can't, let an arbitrator settle things. This strike has gone on long enough.

Yes, and at the stroke of midnight, toxic gas will fill the room, and the doors won't be unlocked until a contract is signed.
 

Gallbaro

Banned
Looks like negotiations are resuming in about 10 minutes. BART is offering an 8% raise but the union still wants 23%.
Fire the motormen and station agents, automate both.

Staten agents for a public transit org are the worseoff the worse when it comes to customer service.

Automate the trains and you will get higher throughput as you can then run smaller trains, more often and closer together.
 
You're saying an unskilled worker should make as much as a skilled worker? Alright, fine, all waitresses should make 100K incomes!

Sarcasm aside, I'm sorry, but if there is no benefit to becoming skilled, the area would turn into a shithole.

Regardless of whether or not there's a financial upshot to becoming skilled, there will always be a benefit: you can do work that's mentally challenging and not be bored out of your skull all day. Do you honestly think someone with the intellectual capacity to handle a six-figure engineering job would be satisfied operating a train or waiting tables for decades of their working life even if it paid well?
 

Gallbaro

Banned
Regardless of whether or not there's a financial upshot to becoming skilled, there will always be a benefit: you can do work that's mentally challenging and not be bored out of your skull all day. Do you honestly think someone with the intellectual capacity to handle a six-figure engineering job would be satisfied operating a train or waiting tables for decades of their working life even if it paid well?

The engineers have already been intellectually stimulated designing the systems that are far more productive and economical than those employees.

-BART is a completely closed system that some idiot state spec'd at Indian Gauge, the FRA has no jurisdiction.
-If the employees are replaced they no longer have to worry about their safety.
-The BART system was designed with faulty brakes, so computer control will make it safer.

EDIT: BART was designed by fucking idiots the more I read. Why they hell is it on third rail instead of overhead? Literally no reason, only legacy systems need third rail because their tunnels where originally designed for steam fucking locomotive.
 

RuGalz

Member
Regardless of whether or not there's a financial upshot to becoming skilled, there will always be a benefit: you can do work that's mentally challenging and not be bored out of your skull all day. Do you honestly think someone with the intellectual capacity to handle a six-figure engineering job would be satisfied operating a train or waiting tables for decades of their working life even if it paid well?

Shit, sign me up. If I only need 5 years to get life time health care/pension @ $92/month for the rest of my life for my family. That equates to a huge amount of money. I will go look for another proper job afterwards.
 
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