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[Adaren]

Can't it go both ways in both languages? A messenger from the stars, or a messenger to the stars? Celestial implies that it belongs or relates to the heavens, but I don't think it strongly implies anything beyond that.

Can you rephrase your second paragraph? I'm not sure I'm understanding what you're getting at here.

I had a typo in the last paragraph that made it not make any sense...

To me, "Celestial Emissary" suggests that the creature is visiting Yharnam from the stars (in the same way that a "U.S. Ambassador" is from the U.S., instead of visiting the U.S.). Google Translate's interpretation of the Japanese name seems to think the same thing.

A while back, we were speculating that the "Celestial Emissary" could be an ascended human that the Choir was using to communicate with Ebrietas. Assuming we take the name literally and the Choir didn't just tack on "Celestial" to be showy and romantic, this seems pretty unlikely. A human communicating with Ebrietas would probably be better described as "The Yharnam Emissary to the Celestial", but "Celestial Emissary" seems to imply the opposite.

It did make me recall the "Call Beyond" description, though, which suggests that the Choir has made semi-successful attempts to reach out into the Cosmos. Perhaps that is where the Celestial Emissary came from? Perhaps one of the Choir members went out into the Cosmos, gained knowledge, ascended into an alien, and returned to Yharnam as the "Celestial Emissary"?

Or perhaps everything's just straight from space.

 

[Skii]

Is Mergo a Great One? It's the newborn baby we are trying to kill, right?

 

[OniBarubary]

Is Mergo a Great One? It's the newborn baby we are trying to kill, right?

It's heavily implied that it is.

 

[cm osi]

Good point! Perhaps that's why the altar doesn't work? Ebrietas made the same mistake I did: the altar can reverse time for the living, but doesn't work on the dead.

*cry*



Not sure on the first part, but if Ebrietas originated in Pthumeru, then the altar likely did too. Could Yharnam have used the altar to revive and continue her rule? That would have let Ebrietas see how the Altar worked, though she may not have understood that it only worked for certain people.

isn't ebrietas from Isz chalice? you fight her on isz again, and the description says that the chalice was the first found by the choir and thanks to that they managed to met ebrietas

I feel Ebrietas has to be a full on Great One because she was found in the labyrinth and brought out. Her design is way too cthulu to not be a full on base Great One rather than a transformation. But then Rom complicates things. Perhaps Rom was her surrogate/kid.

rom is a great one, but i think it was a human experiment to gain insight (Micolash dialogue, grant us eyes like you did with the vacuous rom, plant eyes on our brain / Iosefka talking about eyes inside her head when she's on the bed) but it destroyed his brain, making him vacuous. i don't know why he's hiding the red moon tho.
miyazaki in the interview refers to rom as "her"

i've probably missed it pages ago but aside being mergo's mother how deep goes Yarhnam influence in the lore?

and something that bugs me, why there's a Iosefka vial blood in mergo's nightmare near yarhnam?

 

[Clear]

and something that bugs me, why there's a Iosefka vial blood in mergo's nightmare near yarhnam?

Probably just a reminder about Iosefka so you can get another cord if you need it.

 

[Edzi]

I had a typo in the last paragraph that made it not make any sense...

To me, "Celestial Emissary" suggests that the creature is visiting Yharnam from the stars (in the same way that a "U.S. Ambassador" is from the U.S., instead of visiting the U.S.). Google Translate's interpretation of the Japanese name seems to think the same thing.

A while back, we were speculating that the "Celestial Emissary" could be an ascended human that the Choir was using to communicate with Ebrietas. Assuming we take the name literally and the Choir didn't just tack on "Celestial" to be showy and romantic, this seems pretty unlikely. A human communicating with Ebrietas would probably be better described as "The Yharnam Emissary to the Celestial", but "Celestial Emissary" seems to imply the opposite.

It did make me recall the "Call Beyond" description, though, which suggests that the Choir has made semi-successful attempts to reach out into the Cosmos. Perhaps that is where the Celestial Emissary came from? Perhaps one of the Choir members went out into the Cosmos, gained knowledge, ascended into an alien, and returned to Yharnam as the "Celestial Emissary"?

Or perhaps everything's just straight from space.

Yeah, I caught your edit after I posted. It definitely works both ways. Either the Emissary was created to contact the Great Ones, or the Emissary was the point of contact for the Choir who reached out to the Great Ones through other means.

 

[Easy_D]

isn't ebrietas from Isz chalice? you fight her on isz again, and the description says that the chalice was the first found by the choir and thanks to that they managed to met ebrietas



rom is not a great one, i think rom was a human experiment to gain insight but it destroyed his brain, making him vacuous. i don't know why he's hiding the red moon tho.
miyazaki in the interview refers to rom as "her"

i've probably missed it pages ago but aside being mergo's mother how deep goes Yarhnam influence in the lore?

and something that bugs me, why there's a Iosefka vial blood in mergo's nightmare near yarhnam?

Since my last crazy speculation went so well, what if... Mother Brain is Rom's brain? Mind and body separated by the Nightmare
Shit I should make my own YouTube series and earn dat YT moolah.

 

[Adaren]

Probably just a reminder about Iosefka so you can get another cord if you need it.

It'd probably be more effective if they put some snakes in a cave to remind you of the side path in the Forgotten Woods.

They can even say "Haven't you done enough already?" or whatever that line is.

 

[Edzi]

isn't ebrietas from Isz chalice? you fight her on isz again, and the description says that the chalice was the first found by the choir and thanks to that they managed to met ebrietas



rom is not a great one, i think rom was a human experiment to gain insight but it destroyed his brain, making him vacuous. i don't know why he's hiding the red moon tho.
miyazaki in the interview refers to rom as "her"

Rom IS a Great One, this much is confirmed by the game itself (the trophy). She just wasn't a Great One originally and so isn't from space.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Didn't Willem create Rom in order to hide the red moon and thus the rituals?

He does point towards the lake though. But perhaps because hes already being completely taken over.

 

[cm osi]

Rom IS a Great One, this much is confirmed by the game itself (the trophy). She just wasn't a Great One originally and so isn't from space.

oh thanks, fixed

 

[OniBarubary]

Probably just a reminder about Iosefka so you can get another cord if you need it.

Yeah, I think the vial is one of the only thing's that's not really a lore point. I think it's just there to remind you of Iosefka as well as give you a big ole super heal before the final set of bosses.

I don't think Willem specifically created Rom, moreso that the school was working on it together and Rom was chosen/volunteered to be the one to have all the shit done to her. She was probably pretty important herself, as the spiders that guard her are more than likely her former students.

 

[Raist]

That sure looks a hell of a lot like the Primordial Demons from Demon's Souls.

edit: Beaten with the same picture! Stupid slow internet.

Doesn't look anything like it. Looks like the 5-2 slugs. With a squid face.

 

[tesqui]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

 

[ElFly]

It looks like the creature you become in the childhood's ending, only with small legs.

 

[silva1991]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

and I thought I saw everything!!!

in what dungeon can I find this?

 

[OniBarubary]

Yeah, weird. Thanks for the vid Tesqui. Edit: lol that roar

Also, after some thought of putting together a number of things I've talked about...

...I think the dead creature that Ebrietas is mourning is it's child. I've repeated a lot of times that line about their needing surrogates is super important and may mean that they can have kids but those kids are always doomed to die so to make new Great Ones they have to impregnate humans. So maybe Ebrietas had a kid however a Great One does it without a surrogate and it died as they always do. So she prays at the Altar of Despair for it to revive but it won't (and has obviously been there a long time from all the growth and mold and coldblood flowers) and so she mourns and remains stationary there, not even caring when you come in and disturb it (til you hit her).

...man, I think that's pretty damn solid. It's resemblance to Rom is...Iunno. That's a little loose.

 

[tesqui]

and I thought I saw everything!!!

in what dungeon can I find this?

I found it @ this glyph: r637xabe
from this reddit post:
http://www.reddit.com/r/bloodborne/comments/34unr3/heres_a_glyph_of_starfox1313s_strange_creature/

"Central Pthumeru Root Chalice with the Fetid Offering" It's in beginning of layer 3.

 

[Edzi]

Yeah, weird. Thanks for the vid Tesqui.

Also, after some thought of putting together a number of things I've talked about...

...I think the dead creature that Ebrietas is mourning is it's child. I've repeated a lot of times that line about their needing surrogates is super important and may mean that they can have kids but those kids are always doomed to die so to make new Great Ones they have to impregnate humans. So maybe Ebrietas had a kid however a Great One does it without a surrogate and it died as they always do. So she prays at the Altar of Despair for it to revive but it won't (and has obviously been there a long time from all the growth and mold and coldblood flowers) and so she mourns and remains stationary there, not even caring when you come in and disturb it (til you hit her).

...man, I think that's pretty damn solid. It's resemblance to Rom is...Iunno. That's a little loose.

Maybe Rom was given a similar form to the lost child when she "ascended"? Maybe Ebrietas had a part in her transformation?

 

[Toxi]

Is Mergo a Great One? It's the newborn baby we are trying to kill, right?

It's called a Great One in the Umbilical Cord description.

 

[SugarDave]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

The tentacles shifting through the body to the other side is really cool.

 

[silva1991]

I found it @ this glyph: r637xabe
from this reddit post:
http://www.reddit.com/r/bloodborne/comments/34unr3/heres_a_glyph_of_starfox1313s_strange_creature/

"Central Pthumeru Root Chalice with the Fetid Offering" It's in beginning of layer 3.

Thanx, will try it tomorrow.

 

[choclaterra]

Hey everyone, just a quick question about Yahar'gul after we kill Rom.

I understand that the rite was broken when we kill Rom and that Yahar'gul is were all the Church conducted the weird as shit experiments.

However, can somebody explain what agenda did the snatchers have? Also, the three hunters later found in the Hypogean jail , can we assume they are part of the church, even though one of them has a beast claw??

That part is really weird to me, I love it, just wish I could understand more of it.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

and I thought I saw everything!!!

in what dungeon can I find this?

Glyph r637xabe, it said so in the video description. Gonna have to check it out.

I've seen a rare monster too (don't know how rare but I've only seen it once or twice), I think in Lower Loran. It's sorta humanoid and seems to buff other enemies, and it wears some sort of robe or cape? I don't remember much but I had never seen it before. I'll try to get a screenshot some time instead of being vague...

 

[Kipper]

Can someone please explain the whole children of Great Ones thing to me? The description of the umbilical chords make it sound like they just cannot have children, but instead use surrogates. So my understanding is that one of the Great Ones used Yharnam as a surrogate mother to give birth to Mergo. How off-base am I?

 

[OniBarubary]

Can someone please explain the whole children of Great Ones thing to me? The description of the umbilical chords make it sound like they just cannot have children, but instead use surrogates. So my understanding is that one of the Great Ones used Yharnam as a surrogate mother to give birth to Mergo. How off-base am I?

Nope, you're pretty much exactly right.

I've seen a rare monster too (don't know how rare but I've only seen it once or twice), I think in Lower Loran. It's sorta humanoid and seems to buff other enemies, and it wears some sort of robe or cape? I don't remember much but I had never seen it before. I'll try to get a screenshot some time instead of being vague...

Darn it guys (,guy and girl or girls)! How you guys finding all these things. I did 12 chalices and didn't find any of this crud!

 

[Kipper]

Nope, you're pretty much exactly right.

Awesome. I have some follow-ups, if you don't mind. Do we know which Great One is the parent? I feel like I'd read something that made me think it was Oedon. Also, by killing Mergo's Wet Nurse, we indirectly kill Mergo, right? After defeating the wet nurse, that long period of time where you just hear cries, and then the "Nightmare Slain" all of a sudden, seemed to me that Mergo, somewhere, had just died.

 

[Clear]

That's a cool unique monster. While I haven't run across that I've encountered a couple of odd variants in some of the lower tier dungeons that I didn't see during my initial platinum run.

First one was the tall, lanky blue glowing enemy that kind of looks like a cross between one of the lantern-holding tomb watchers and the white-glowy wailing phantoms. Didn't do anything terribly interesting but I've only ever seen the one of them.

Similarly I ran across some a black spider with a kind of crusty carapace that could be smashed off with repeated blows. I don't mean like the Rom minion types with the hardened "heads" but like a regular spider with a breakaway crusty armor over its body.

Anyone else run into these? Both seemed very uncommon on my playthroughs.

 

[Zocano]

That's a cool unique monster. While I haven't run across that I've encountered a couple of odd variants in some of the lower tier dungeons that I didn't see during my initial platinum run.

First one was the tall, lanky blue glowing enemy that kind of looks like a cross between one of the lantern-holding tomb watchers and the white-glowy wailing phantoms. Didn't do anything terribly interesting but I've only ever seen the one of them.

Similarly I ran across some a black spider with a kind of crusty carapace that could be smashed off with repeated blows. I don't mean like the Rom minion types with the hardened "heads" but like a regular spider with a breakaway crusty armor over its body.

Anyone else run into these? Both seemed very uncommon on my playthroughs.

waaat. I don't think I've found anything like the spider you described. The glowy lady is something preplaced in one of the "storyline" chalices so that's a known factor. But that spider is something I haven't heard about at all.

 

[OniBarubary]

Awesome. I have some follow-ups, if you don't mind. Do we know which Great One is the parent? I feel like I'd read something that made me think it was Oedon. Also, by killing Mergo's Wet Nurse, we indirectly kill Mergo, right? After defeating the wet nurse, that long period of time where you just hear cries, and then the "Nightmare Slain" all of a sudden, seemed to me that Mergo, somewhere, had just died.

1. No, but a lot of people seem to think it's Oedon. The only real evidence leading to this is that he's the one impregnating all the ladies during the course of the game. Other than that, no one really knows.

2. Yep, that baby dead. If it has a physical body then the Wet Nurse picked it up and when you strike the final blow against the Wet Nurse it hits the baby or the Nurse drops it on it's head or something. Or like Arianna and her baby, they're connected so when one dies the other does. Other than that, the Wet Nurse might be a load-bearing boss and the Nightmare IS Mergo and without the Nurse to hold it together the Nightmare fades.

Whatever the case, you totes killed a baby

Actually as I reread my explanation I kinda like the load bearing idea. Maybe the baby isn't strong/old enough to exist on it's own so it needs a Great One to take care of it a la a Wet Nurse and without one it simply falls apart and fades away

 

[Drencrom]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

Hmm, why isn't this enemy in the guide? FROM Software gave images/info for every enemy in the game to Future Press so they couldn't possibly miss it that way.

 

[PirateKing]

Glyph r637xabe, it said so in the video description. Gonna have to check it out.

I've seen a rare monster too (don't know how rare but I've only seen it once or twice), I think in Lower Loran. It's sorta humanoid and seems to buff other enemies, and it wears some sort of robe or cape? I don't remember much but I had never seen it before. I'll try to get a screenshot some time instead of being vague...

Pics pls

 

[Mafro]

Hey everyone, just a quick question about Yahar'gul after we kill Rom.

I understand that the rite was broken when we kill Rom and that Yahar'gul is were all the Church conducted the weird as shit experiments.

However, can somebody explain what agenda did the snatchers have? Also, the three hunters later found in the Hypogean jail , can we assume they are part of the church, even though one of them has a beast claw??

That part is really weird to me, I love it, just wish I could understand more of it.

I think the snatchers were there to kidnap people for the ritual. The nun you find in the basement of the prison tells you how she was also taken by one while in the Cathedral Ward.

 

[SargerusBR]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

 

[Toxi]

Here's video of that weird creature from the chalice dungeons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnxcwaWz50o

Looking at the comments... Wow, the Souls fanbase has a lot of worthless sacks of shit in it. :-\ Glad that the people here are much better.

But yeah, that's weird as hell. It reminds me of the Vagrants from Dark Souls in how rare it is.

 

[FF Seraphim]

Talking about Rom, listening to the soundtrack again at the gym and her song had feint whispers in it, thought that was interesting. Cannot make out what it's try to say but I think that's the point. Rom has secrets you ca never understand. Also reading the note before getting the cinder armor set makes it known that the red moon is hanging low yet in OY it looks like Normal full moon...

 

[JudgmentJay]

Looking at the comments... Wow, the Souls fanbase has a lot of worthless sacks of shit in it. :-\ Glad that the people here are much better.

I was just thinking the same thing. I don't know why I read comments...

 

[Cess007]

Just finished the game, and i'm ready to dive in this thread to have some stuff explained. But i wanted to know; any good video out there explainig the lore?

 

[Metalingus5150]

Hmm, why isn't this enemy in the guide? FROM Software gave images/info for every enemy in the game to Future Press so they couldn't possibly miss it that way.

Clearly the great ones put it in the game without even From knowing.

 

[PirateKing]

What if most From don't know that exist but a select few inside the team? But yeah it's weird it wasn't included anywhere. Could be an enemy from the DLC they wanted to tease.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Looking at the comments... Wow, the Souls fanbase has a lot of worthless sacks of shit in it. :-\ Glad that the people here are much better.

I wouldn't judge any fanbase based on youtube comments...

 

[DealWithIt]

Since my last crazy speculation went so well, what if... Mother Brain is Rom's brain? Mind and body separated by the Nightmare
Shit I should make my own YouTube series and earn dat YT moolah.

The guide calls it the "Brain of Mensis"

 

[DealWithIt]

Maybe Rom was given a similar form to the lost child when she "ascended"? Maybe Ebrietas had a part in her transformation?

The theory I read about this that I like is that cosmos had two surrogate children. One was Ebrietas, The other was Rom. That is why you find E kneeling at the altar of despair (which looks like a vacuous spider statue) in apparent sadness. You have just killed her sister.

 

[Skii]

It's heavily implied that it is.

It's called a Great One in the Umbilical Cord description.

So why do the school of Mensis want to contact Mergo? It seems like they've been trying to this a long time with the mention of "still births of the brain". I'm assuming all those people dead with Mensis cages on their heads tried to contact Mergo and died as a result. But how is that possible if Mergo's just been born during the current night of the hunt? The time line doesn't make sense.

Why do they even want to contact Mergo? It's a baby. It cries for the majority of the time we are playing the game. You aren't going to get any wisdom from it.

 

[OniBarubary]

So why do the school of Mensis want to contact Mergo? It seems like they've been trying to this a long time with the mention of "still births of the brain". I'm assuming all those people dead with Mensis cages on their heads tried to contact Mergo and died as a result. But how is that possible if Mergo's just been born during the current night of the hunt? The time line doesn't make sense.

Why do they even want to contact Mergo? It's a baby. It cries for the majority of the time we are playing the game. You aren't going to get any wisdom from it.

I don't think they want to specifically contact Mergo. I think they just wanted to contact A Great One and Mergo was the one they got for whatever reason. Maybe cause it was easiest. Dunno, I might be forgetting item descriptions as per usual.

Also Mergo is physically dead and has been for a long time before the game starts. Mergo exists only in the Nightmare and as a Great One I'm not sure it has the same rules about growing up or maturing that humans do. Besides, that baby's cries are able to resonate anywhere in Yharnam in the real world even though it's dead and exists in a dream (which might be a cause of people going mad) and since we were sent to kill it I don't think it was gonna grow up to be a random scrub Great One. Dude was probably gonna be a big shot if he matured.

 

[Gbraga]

I had a typo in the last paragraph that made it not make any sense...

To me, "Celestial Emissary" suggests that the creature is visiting Yharnam from the stars (in the same way that a "U.S. Ambassador" is from the U.S., instead of visiting the U.S.). Google Translate's interpretation of the Japanese name seems to think the same thing.

A while back, we were speculating that the "Celestial Emissary" could be an ascended human that the Choir was using to communicate with Ebrietas. Assuming we take the name literally and the Choir didn't just tack on "Celestial" to be showy and romantic, this seems pretty unlikely. A human communicating with Ebrietas would probably be better described as "The Yharnam Emissary to the Celestial", but "Celestial Emissary" seems to imply the opposite.

It did make me recall the "Call Beyond" description, though, which suggests that the Choir has made semi-successful attempts to reach out into the Cosmos. Perhaps that is where the Celestial Emissary came from? Perhaps one of the Choir members went out into the Cosmos, gained knowledge, ascended into an alien, and returned to Yharnam as the "Celestial Emissary"?

Or perhaps everything's just straight from space.

Maybe both interpretations could work together? The Celestial Emissary is just one alien dude, and the other celestial mobs are orphans transformed to partake in communion with this alien dude. Also explains why only one of them becomes a giant other than "because videogames boss fights". Because we know for a fact they can make celestial mobs out of humans, if it's not our emissary, it wouldn't make sense that they'd successfully replicate a Great One but still weren't satisfied, or kept pursuing that instead of the church still using blood and the school of mensis doing whatever the fuck they do in those rituals.

 

[theSlacker]

Looking at the comments... Wow, the Souls fanbase has a lot of worthless sacks of shit in it. :-\ Glad that the people here are much better.

But yeah, that's weird as hell. It reminds me of the Vagrants from Dark Souls in how rare it is.

( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)

 

[Edzi]

I don't think they want to specifically contact Mergo. I think they just wanted to contact A Great One and Mergo was the one they got for whatever reason. Maybe cause it was easiest. Dunno, I might be forgetting item descriptions as per usual.

Also Mergo is physically dead and has been for a long time before the game starts. Mergo exists only in the Nightmare and as a Great One I'm not sure it has the same rules about growing up or maturing that humans do. Besides, that baby's cries are able to resonate anywhere in Yharnam in the real world even though it's dead and exists in a dream (which might be a cause of people going mad) and since we were sent to kill it I don't think it was gonna grow up to be a random scrub Great One. Dude was probably gonna be a big shot if he matured.

Where in the game does it mention that Mergo is/has been dead? Is the theory just based on the line about the stillbirth of brains when Mensis contacted Mergo?

 

[Gbraga]

Where in the game does it mention that Mergo is/has been dead? Is the theory just based on the line about the stillbirth of brains when Mensis contacted Mergo?

I think people just assumed Mergo died because of the "Every Great One loses its child" and the blood on Yharnam's dress. But you're right, it doesn't explicitly say Mergo's dead.

We also don't know if Arianna's baby would die anyway, if it would, Oedon is kind of an idiot. Every red moon he does the same thing, it never works, and he keeps doing it anyway.

 

[Kipper]

I'm assuming all those people dead with Mensis cages on their heads tried to contact Mergo and died as a result. But how is that possible if Mergo's just been born during the current night of the hunt?

That is a good question. After defeating Rom, I believe we are instructed to "slay the nightmare newborn" (or something like that), which would make me think that Mergo was just born. But that can't be right if Yharnam gave birth to Mergo however many years ago.