Support NeoGAF

[Nekrono]

You speak in a very general tone, backing up none of your statements, while brain_stew sounds a lot more educated on the subject in terms of the technical aspects of the game. You're kind of weird.

I think what he is saying is that if you can cut off a bit there you can add more here, which he is completely right, cutting down physics, texture resolution, etc, can free up more memory/processing power to do other things.

This is not new, pretty common technique that developers have been using for a while now, especially in consoles.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

I don't think you backed up your statements very effectively. Brain_stew is using factual evidence about the lighting tech and other aspects of CE3 and you're dismissing them without much of a retort. Whatever, to each their own.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

I don't think you backed up your statements very effectively. Brain_stew is using factual evidence about the lighting tech and other aspects of CE3 and you're dismissing them without much of a retort. Whatever, to each their own.

Factual evidence? He is just making statements, and has not actually posted any evidence, regardless of whether what he is saying is true or not. Please don't confuse technical language with "evidence".

 

[Nekrono]

I don't think you backed up your statements very effectively. Brain_stew is using factual evidence about the lighting tech and other aspects of CE3 and you're dismissing them without much of a retort. Whatever, to each their own.

If you are referring to me i'm not dismissing anything lol i'm just explaining what Alextended is trying to say .

Factual evidence? He is just making statements, and has not actually posted any evidence, regardless of whether what he is saying is true or not. Please don't confuse technical language with "evidence".

This too, thank you .

Fancy words can give the feeling of truth but it's not always the case.

 

[SapientWolf]

If you are referring to me i'm not dismissing anything lol i'm just explaining what Alextended is trying to say .



This too, thank you .

Fancy words can give the feeling of truth but it's not always the case.

brain_stew isn't known to talk out of his ass though.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

brain_stew isn't known to talk out of his ass though.

I know, but that doesn't mean that him making statements means he has "posted evidence". Which is what Heavy seems to be saying.

 

[Nekrono]

brain_stew isn't known to talk out of his ass though.

Exactly what ThoseDeafMutes said.

Also I don't think he is or said he was

 

[JoeBoy101]

Guessing that you are using the op's config?
It did the same exact thing for me, I'm using the config dennis posted instead. (all the detail settings at 3 instead of 4 and way less commands overall)
The game looks so much better then, spraks properly glow again (unlike what you are probably getting), that HORRIBLE ghosting goes away, it's less blurry.

Got a link to Dennis' config? Last one I checked, it was buried deep in the thread.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

I mean the game has global illumination and like 984562 more real-time light sources than the original. Whether it's "factual evidence" or not (poor choice of words, sorry, stop harping on it), that's a colossal leap in tech like brain_stew said. I'm not even tech savvy and I knew that. Just forget it.

 

[Erebus]

Got a link to Dennis' config? Last one I checked, it was buried deep in the thread.

I think that's Dennis' config:

g_skipIntro=0
cl_fov=70
r_DrawNearFoV=70
pl_movement.power_sprint_targetFov=70
i_mouse_accel=0
i_mouse_accel_max=100
i_mouse_smooth=0
r_motionblur=0
g_radialBlur=1
cl_zoomToggle=1
r_UseEdgeAA=0
r_TexMaxAnisotropy=16
sys_spec_shading=3
sys_spec_gameeffects=3
sys_spec_objectdetail=3
sys_spec_particles=3
sys_spec_physics=3
sys_spec_postprocessing=3
sys_spec_shadows=2
sys_spec_sound=3
sys_spec_texture=3
sys_spec_water=3
r_PostMSAA=0

 

[MisterAnderson]

2) I miss my radial middle mouse menu. I know a lot of people hated it, but the flexibility it gave when you got used to it was fantastic. I feel like my left had has too much crap to take care of and I was pretty accustomed to the mouse flick for power swaps.

The radial menu is still there if you prefer to use it.

 

[NIN90]

So anyone tried to mod in the Crysis 1 suit voice yet? D:

 

[Nekrono]

I mean the game has global illumination and like 984562 more real-time light sources than the original. Whether it's "factual evidence" or not (poor choice of words, sorry, stop harping on it), that's a colossal leap in tech like brain_stew said. I'm not even tech savvy and I knew that. Just forget it.

If you're talking about deferred lighting and the number or light sources Crysis 2 has, well that's not something i would call a colossal leap as you can tell by reading here. It's been used in plenty of games now and just because Crysis 2 makes it more "obvious" or notable people are going crazy over this.

 

[Metroid-Squadron]

And yes, your generation statements are hyperbole, sorry.

Regarding the lighting, they aren't.

-HDR is far superior in CE3.
-Hundreds of lights at once VS a handful in CE2.
-Image Based Lighting.
-GI for the sun.

I think what he is saying is that if you can cut off a bit there you can add more here, which he is completely right, cutting down physics, texture resolution, etc, can free up more memory/processing power to do other things.

This is not new, pretty common technique that developers have been using for a while now, especially in consoles.

So, you're saying that scaling the physics down is what allows them to have hundreds of lights on the scene? Because that's stupid.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

So anyone tried to mod in the Crysis 1 suit voice yet? D:

If someone mods out NANOVISION ENABLED but leaves everything else in-tact I'll be perfectly happy.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

Regarding the lighting, they aren't.

-HDR is far superior in CE3.
-Hundreds of lights at once VS a handful in CE2.
-Image Based Lighting.
-GI for the sun.


So, you're saying that scaling the physics down is what allows them to have hundreds of lights on the scene? Because that's stupid.

Werd.

 

[Nekrono]

Regarding the lighting, they aren't.

-HDR is far superior in CE3.
-Hundreds of lights at once VS a handful in CE2.
-Image Based Lighting.
-GI for the sun.


So, you're saying that scaling the physics down is what allows them to have hundreds of lights on the scene? Because that's stupid.

No that is not what i'm saying, again for the 2nd time, I was just explaining what Alextended was trying to say.

Now would having better physics like the ones in Crysis 1 for expample have hurt performance? Definitely yes, and that would have left less room to work better lighting in.

 

[NIN90]

Your silly tech fight is a real downer.

 

[strata8]

I think what he is saying is that if you can cut off a bit there you can add more here, which he is completely right, cutting down physics, texture resolution, etc, can free up more memory/processing power to do other things.

This is not new, pretty common technique that developers have been using for a while now, especially in consoles.

Physics is CPU bound and texture resolution very rarely makes a noticeable impact on the performance. Lighting, for the most part, is completely unrelated.

Here's a few good examples of lighting situations that aren't really possible in CE2/Crysis:

 

[Nekrono]

Physics is CPU bound and texture resolution very rarely makes a noticeable impact on the performance.

True but lets say the game runs at 40 fps, you add in better physics that takes a hit of let's say 10 fps, you're down to 30 now. Better lighting and more light sources let's say will cost you around 5-10 fps, you would be sitting at 20-25 now.

See what I mean? cutting down things does give you more room to work around other stuff.

It's not always the same, and in some cases some things don't even take a performance hit but the principle is the same nonetheless.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

No that is not what i'm saying, again for the 2nd time, I was just explaining what Alextended was trying to say.

Now would having better physics like the ones in Crysis 1 for expample have hurt performance? Definitely yes, and that would have left less room to work better lighting in.

You really don't know what you're talking about.

True but lets say the game runs at 40 fps, you add in better physics that takes a hit of let's say 10 fps, you're down to 30 now. Better lighting and more light sources let's say will cost you around 5-10 fps, you would be sitting at 20-25 now.

See what I mean? cutting down things does give you more room to work around other stuff.

Are you just making this stuff up as you go along? Estimating frame loss, really dude? 5-10 fps here, 5-10 fps there... lol come on.

 

[Nekrono]

You really don't know what you're talking about.

See my post above you.

As a developer i'm going to assume one of the goals is reaching a target framerate (especially in consoles) and cutting down certain things will definitely help you get there or squeeze others in.

 

[strata8]

True but lets say the game runs at 40 fps, you add in better physics that takes a hit of let's say 10 fps, you're down to 30 now. Better lighting and more light sources let's say will cost you around 5-10 fps, you would be sitting at 20-25 now.

See what I mean? cutting down things does give you more room to work around other stuff.

It's not always the same, and in some cases some things don't even take a performance hit but the principle is the same nonetheless.

It's a bit insignificant though since the majority of the performance loss results from rendering, etc. Any relatively modern CPU should be able to breeze through the physics in Crysis without any trouble. The same can't really be said about the GPU side of things.

 

[Nekrono]

You really don't know what you're talking about.


Are you just making this stuff up as you go along? Estimating frame loss, really dude?

Sigh Heavy, you really take everything so literal, that was just an example you know?

Anyways you are one of the people that not only posted the most here but also praised the game the most and to be honest you seem a bit stubborn so i'm not even going to bother arguing this further more lol.

 

[Nekrono]

It's a bit insignificant though since the majority of the performance loss results from rendering, etc. Any relatively modern CPU should be able to breeze through the physics in Crysis without any trouble. The same can't really be said about the GPU side of things.

So if physics don't really take a big hit in overall performance and they are so easy to compute why haven't we seen more of the physics found in Crysis for example?

 

[Barack Lesnar]

Sigh Heavy, you really take everything so literal, that was just an example you know?

Anyways you are one of the people that not only posted the most here but also praised the game the most and to be honest you seem a bit stubborn so i'm not even going to bother arguing this further more lol.

I've criticized the game plenty.

You can't hypothetically say "ok this could cost 5 fps, that could be another 10"... that's not how it works. Physics and lighting aren't even related.

 

[Nekrono]

I've criticized the game plenty.

You can't hypothetically say "ok this could cost 5 fps, that could be another 10"... that's not how it works. Physics and lighting aren't even related.

You know i'm done with you lol, you don't even know why your FireFox memory usage was so high, I take it you're not really much of a tech savvy or anything close to it so yeah you would definitely be the one to say "that's not how it works."

 

[itsnervedamage]

The radial menu is still there if you prefer to use it.

Well, it's there but it has 2 powers and a bunch of other stuff now that gets in the way in the middle of a fight. There's binocs which are terrible to land on in a gunfight, suit upgrades and weapon adjustments. I bring up the weapon thing all the time since it's where cloak used to be...

What I really miss when I say that I guess is when armor, stealth, speed and strength were options in a fight. I like how strength is integrated now, but taking away speed to reduce useful powers to armor and stealth makes the firefights feel more constrained.

Guessing that you are using the op's config?
It did the same exact thing for me, I'm using the config dennis posted instead. (all the detail settings at 3 instead of 4 and way less commands overall)
The game looks so much better then, spraks properly glow again (unlike what you are probably getting), that HORRIBLE ghosting goes away, it's less blurry.

Thanks for the heads up on the config, I will give it a shot. I actually just went in and messed with the config with that app that was posted a while back, but I guess one of the settings is crazy somewhere.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

You know i'm done with you lol, you don't even know why your FireFox memory usage was so high, I take it you're not really much of a tech savvy or anything close to it so yeah you would definitely be the one to say "that's not how it works."

Well neither are you. And I haven't said anything as ill-informed as your posts above...

5 fps here
10 fps there
Physics usage affecting lighting

I haven't said anything that ridic. Sounds like you just wanna crap on the game. I'm not gonna continue this, either. Good luck.

 

[Trent Strong]

If Crysis 2 has the kind of lighting that all you guys who are knowledgeable about tech and prgramming like, then I weep for the future of video games. Shadows in games should not be pitch f-ing black, and you shouldn't be blinded by sunlight reflecting off of every single surface in the world.

 

[strata8]

So if physics don't really take a big hit in overall performance and they are so easy to compute why haven't we seen more of the physics found in Crysis for example?

(I honestly don't know what we're talking about here :lol)

Memory is the biggest issue here, since they need to store all the precalulations, breakage data for all the small breakables, etc.

I really think it's pretty obvious at this point that certain areas have been toned down to fit on consoles, but I don't have any doubt that if you ported Crysis to CE3, it would look and run better on the same hardware.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Well neither are you. And I haven't said anything as ill-informed as your posts above...

5 fps here
10 fps there
Physics usage affecting lighting

I haven't said anything that ridic. Sounds like you just wanna crap on the game. I'm not gonna continue this, either. Good luck.

It's pretty basic, if your framerate is CPU bottlenecked then you can't get any more performance regardless of how low you turn the visual effects. I get the feeling that CPU limitations on consoles would be one reason why destructibility and physicsweren't as good as the original game, although in principle this shouldn't matter since the first game ran fine on reasonably low end CPUs anyway. Another possibility is RAM limitations, which is probably the more likely reason imo.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

If Crysis 2 has the kind of lighting that all you guys who are knowledgeable about tech and prgramming like, then I weep for the future of video games. Shadows in games should not be pitch f-ing black, and you shouldn't be blinded by sunlight reflecting off of every single surface in the world.

They definitely overdid some of the sun glare... probably to show off the engine. Mickey's config helps a bit.

It's pretty basic, if your framerate is CPU bottlenecked then you can't get any more performance regardless of how low you turn the visual effects. I get the feeling that CPU limitations on consoles would be one reason why destructibility and physicsweren't as good as the original game, although in principle this shouldn't matter since the first game ran fine on reasonably low end CPUs anyway. Another possibility is RAM limitations, which is probably the more likely reason imo.

I don't think it has much of anything to do with consoles because Red Faction: Guerilla is on PS3 & 360 and has an infinitely more detailed physics engine than everything out there, so the consoles can definitely handle physics.

 

[Nekrono]

Well neither are you. And I haven't said anything as ill-informed as your posts above...

5 fps here
10 fps there
Physics usage affecting lighting

I haven't said anything that ridic. Sounds like you just wanna crap on the game. I'm not gonna continue this, either. Good luck.

Umm when did I say this? All I said is physics taking a chunk of FPS could potentially prevent or diminish the number of light sources for example if it's going to take you below your target performance.

And no for your information I don't want to take a crap on the game, I think it's a pretty good game overall, I will however have something to say when people start talking about how it is a technical marvel or saying how 'next gen' this game is or even saying it's ages ahead from it's predecessor when it's not, Crysis 1 had a bunch of flaws and they attempted to fix them in Crysis 2 but that created flaws of it's own too.

 

[SneakyStephan]

True but lets say the game runs at 40 fps, you add in better physics that takes a hit of let's say 10 fps, you're down to 30 now. Better lighting and more light sources let's say will cost you around 5-10 fps, you would be sitting at 20-25 now.

See what I mean? cutting down things does give you more room to work around other stuff.

It's not always the same, and in some cases some things don't even take a performance hit but the principle is the same nonetheless.

Ugh what?
I don't even...

Having your cpu sit idle twiddling it's thumbs because you cut the physics doesn't magically make the gpu any faster at what it's doing meanwhile.
There are also many factors and bottlenecks in what makes a gpu work.

They have a limited fillrate/vram bandwidth, if you go over that amount it will take more cycles to process which bogs things down (the game may be done calculating physics, ai, lighting, geometry for that frame but it has to wait on the vram for example to load/send textures/shadows to the gpu.

Consoles have serious ram/vram bottlenecks, so if you don't design the maps around that things will slow down to a crawl or not work at all.
Same goes for graphics cards on pc with little vram. (try forcing gta 4 or stalker complete mod to run at 1080p with textures maxed on a graphics card with only 512 MB or less vram, it will run out and have to fileswap to your normal ram or HDD, which both have horribly slow bandwidth compared to the vram (hdd especially), so suddenly you are down to 1-2 fps instead of 100, all because the game requires just 5 MB more vram than you have.
Lower res or any setting a bit to bring you just under the 512MB peak usage and suddenly your fps skyrockets back up.

It's not a linear affair at all like you suggest.

Cutting geometry doesn't magically give you more gpu power to spend on lighting.

The only things that are really related are for example textures, resolution and shadow.
Because they are all bottlenecked by the same resource (fillrate) as far as I know.

On the xbox you have 10MB of ridiculously fast EDRAM , so anything that fits in that 10MB can be done lightning fast.
It's used as framebuffer.
That's why you see these sub HD resolutions or bad shadows or lack of AA on it, because otherwise they simply can't fit the image into the framebuffer anymore, making the edram useless and slowing everything down. (if only the 360 had twice as much EDRAM and some more ram/vram overall)

Anyone else feel free to correct me where/if I'm wrong about any of this.

 

[Kyaw]

Finally someone who knows what he's talking about! (at least looks like it )

 

[Alexios]

Guys, he just explained what I said, he didn't agree with me. No need to get so aggressive with a junior.

I never said Crysis 2 lighting isn't better than Crysis 1, isn't great, or isn't top stuff.

I just disputed it being called genuinely next gen and, imo, no tech speak saying it has this, that, or the other technology is in any way "proof" as was stated by some that it is indeed genuinely next gen. It's proof it's a new version, and top stuff, which I didn't dispute. As a mod said earlier, next gen isn't exactly a scientific term itself.

If you feel it has been proven that it's genuinely next gen, that's fine by me. Personally I expect a much, much bigger leap for next gen (and one that won't be turned off @ night) but feel free to settle for whatever your personal definition is. I'm done arguing, I never wanted to focus on the lighting anyway, I just made a passing comment that somehow derailed the whole Crysis 1 vs 2 discussion that was going on there when it's the least of their differences.

I was wrong to dispute someone's definition of next gen and I'm sorry. How about we all move on before someone gets banned over such insignificant shit? Just a thought.

 

[Nekrono]

People seem to have taken that post of mine so wrong it's hilarious lol.

I'll clarify it now in a very simple way.

Cutting things down (like physics for example) would make the game not as intense, in consoles it will make it run better, help reach that 30 fps target. In PC it would translate as a game that's not that demanding as if it did have complex physics.

And no, cutting down physics will not make your GPU faster, how the fuck you interpreted that is kinda weird, but choosing not to implement something that you know will most likely take a big hit in performance (especially in firefights when there is a lot of shit going on) will definitely give you more room to squeeze in another effect that will most likely would have lowered the framerate further down if you did have full physics implemented.

Get it now? If you don't then w/e, im done with this lol.

 

[MickeyKnox]

Replaying the game again because of the the bullshit attachment lockups that were happening and I have to say my latest config is a huge improvement, performance is tops too.

 

[SapientWolf]

Guys, he just explained what I said, he didn't agree with me. No need to get so aggressive with a junior.

I never said Crysis 2 lighting isn't better than Crysis 1, isn't great, or isn't top stuff.

I just said it's not genuinely next gen and no tech speak saying it has this, that, or the other technology is in any way "proof" that it is next gen. It's proof it's top stuff, which I didn't dispute. As a mod said earlier, next gen isn't exactly a scientific term in the first place, so no scientific terms can prove that.

If you feel it has been proven that it's genuinely next gen, that's fine by me. Personally I expect a bigger leap for next gen but feel free to settle for whatever your personal definition is. I'm done arguing, I never wanted to focus on the lighting anyway, I just made a passing comment that somehow derailed the whole Crysis 1 vs 2 discussion that was going on there when it's the least of their differences.

How about we all move on before someone gets banned over such insignificant shit? Just a thought.

Next gen is a poorly defined term but there are usually a lot of white papers with lots of tech talk to justify moving from one game engine or console to a newer one.

 

[Zomba13]

Just tried some multiplayer again. Is it broken for anyone else?
Really laggy for me (lowest ping in server browser is 109. Lots of them). In game I have a fairly all right ping, around 50 or something, but it still seems laggy
The kill cam is a lying son of a bitch, never shows what I saw happen
I get kicked every so often saying I've been logged out and then I have to log back into the mycrysis.com stuff.
You can see stealthed peoples shadows (don't know if this is intentional)

 

[SneakyStephan]

Just tried some multiplayer again. Is it broken for anyone else?
Really laggy for me (lowest ping in server browser is 109. Lots of them). In game I have a fairly all right ping, around 50 or something, but it still seems laggy
The kill cam is a lying son of a bitch, never shows what I saw happen
I get kicked every so often saying I've been logged out and then I have to log back into the mycrysis.com stuff.
You can see stealthed peoples shadows (don't know if this is intentional)

Yeah the mp is rubbish on pc.
Lowest server ping here is 93, ingame I supposedly have 20-30 but there is either a retarded amount of packet loss or their netcode/hit detection is rubbish (probably both).

Judging from the killcams and huge delays on kills (2-3 sec after I stop shooting often) the tick rate of these servers must be like... 1... or 0,5.
(100-200 tickrate is the norm for a good dedi)

 

[-tetsuo-]

Replaying the game again because of the the bullshit attachment lockups that were happening and I have to say my latest config is a huge improvement, performance is tops too.

Played some rounds in multiplayer with it. Lookin' good, lookin' great. The head bob change is very noticeable.

 

[Man]

Just finished the game for the first time (PS3). Veteran difficulty - 9hours 48min.

Campaign:

Pros:
+ Lighting and Vertigo are the most impressive aspects of the graphics
+ Still pretty freeform gameplay despite fears (at least in the majority of the game)
+ Some action scenarios are really well done and intense
+ Good sound fx and base
+ The levels feel like a city thanks to scale and attention to detail
+ Enjoyable weapons and modifications
+ hold X to power jump, Hold R3 to power melee, other power toggles on shoulders make for practical control layout. Feels agile.

Misc:
+/- Music was Okay but repetitive.
+/- Enemy variety was so-so but no mistakes

Cons:
- Enemy A.I is surprisingly glitchy, getting stuck in each other and environment relatively often. Grunt commentary repeats and repeats...
- Game in general is a bit bugged (had to restart a level due to checkpoint save being screwed, sound errors etc)
- LOD switching is very visible, game is a bit muddy on the PS3 and framerate is a bit low. Everything is nice and dynamic though and not static ala UE3.
- Story was bad on many levels. I don't care what Crysis 3 will be about plotwise.

Conclusion:
The game has fun gameplay and a lot of oomph which is the most important aspect. It it is very free-form for a urban shooter but it's not as open as the original game(s) though I find C2 more entertaining. Definitely pick this up above your usual COD or Bulletstorm. I like the campaign better than Halo Reach and KZ3 (though haven't finished the latter one yet) though I doubt I would recommend C2 above those two as a total package.

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Would be interested to compare a heavily modded Crysis with Crysis 2. ToD mods and Xzero's work has made it much better looking than vanilla.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

People seem to have taken that post of mine so wrong it's hilarious lol.

I'll clarify it now in a very simple way.

Cutting things down (like physics for example) would make the game not as intense, in consoles it will make it run better, help reach that 30 fps target. In PC it would translate as a game that's not that demanding as if it did have complex physics.

And no, cutting down physics will not make your GPU faster, how the fuck you interpreted that is kinda weird, but choosing not to implement something that you know will most likely take a big hit in performance (especially in firefights when there is a lot of shit going on) will definitely give you more room to squeeze in another effect that will most likely would have lowered the framerate further down if you did have full physics implemented.

Get it now? If you don't then w/e, im done with this lol.

Actually the limitation on PC is dx9, limiting PC devs to just two cores. DX11 gives you full access to quad cores and up. Personally, I think the physics was just allocated to power kicking cars, that large alien that flip cars that may be more complicated than shooting stationary trees and knocking down thin aluminum wall/roof cabins.

 

[strata8]

Would be interested to compare a heavily modded Crysis with Crysis 2. ToD mods and Xzero's work has made it much better looking than vanilla.

Really what I can say here is apples to oranges.

 

[neoism]

The lack of understanding about what exactly an API is and does has really come to an unbearable point with the release of Crysis 2. There's no such thing as "DX9 lighting" and not a single game on the market can touch Crytek's lighting engine, no matter what API they are using.

The API used says nothing of the complexity of the lighting engine and as Crysis 2 has shown there's very little (outside of tesselation) that can't be achieved with DX9. Upgrades in DX have been less about adding new effects and more about cleaning up the API and making it easier and cheaper (in both rendertime and development effort) to achieve the same results for several releases now. That Crytek have achieved more with DX9 than anyone ever has with DX11 is a huge testament to their talent.

A huge improvement in the quality of the SSAO implementation, a full dynamic global illumination solution and more than an order of magnitude more (full shadow casting) dynamic lights means its ahead of anything else on the market, DX11 or no DX11 and light years (pun intended) ahead of the original Crysis.

Yes the lighting is insane.... but how do you get rid of the glow every light makes.

 

[Alexios]

I think the physics was just allocated to power kicking cars, that large alien that flip cars that may be more complicated than shooting stationary trees and knocking down thin aluminum wall/roof cabins.

Umm, similar calculations would be done for all those objects you mention with the only difference being their shape. That it's a heavy looking car model rather than whatever light object doesn't make it harder for the engine just because it would be harder to move in real life, lol. They're no different to random clutter objects really. There are vehicles in Crysis too anyway, and they're more interactive as previously mentioned, being able to blow off their tires and what not (and have them react to that if in motion). I think I couldn't power punch them or easily move them as in Crysis 2 but that's just because they were set to be heavier, explosions and other more powerful forces still moved them.

 

[riceandbeans]

Yeah the mp is rubbish on pc.
Lowest server ping here is 93, ingame I supposedly have 20-30 but there is either a retarded amount of packet loss or their netcode/hit detection is rubbish (probably both).

Judging from the killcams and huge delays on kills (2-3 sec after I stop shooting often) the tick rate of these servers must be like... 1... or 0,5.
(100-200 tickrate is the norm for a good dedi)

It's the same thing on the consoles as well. I played the 360 version for a few days and it never felt right. The killcam never almost never showed exactly what happened either.