LOL - if you think that's going to matter at all.
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Democrat Debate 8 [Univision] Agent Smith goes to Washington
- Thread starter Makai
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LOL - if you think that's going to matter at all.
Plasticine
Member
Everyone knows Hillary's skeletons, though. There's nothing shocking or new the Republicans can hit her with. She is as known a quantity as you can get in politics.
Is this Castro stuff even that big of a deal? Will it really resonate with Florida voters enough to seriously hurt Bernie? I hope it does, but the crowd seemed to still like him by the end, so who knows.
Everything they could possibly throw at her has been out in the open for months now. They haven't even started with Bernie.
Everything they could possibly throw at her has been out in the open for months now. They haven't even started with Bernie.
Good.
I'd wait till people vote next week before judging how this will effect him.
JesseEwiak
Member
This is craven bumping, but I'm not going to let my sample for Hillary's SuperPAC die at the bottom of the page.
JordanN
Banned
He's made it this far now, why should he care what the Republicans say? His aim is for the Whitehouse.
Republicans are still split on letting Trump run their party. If they can't resolve that, where will they have the time or unity to talk down Sanders?
Bernie's just getting his first licks in, Hillary's been dealing with this longer than new voters in this year's election have been alive.
The difference being and has always been that Sec. Clinton's closet doors have been wide open since 1992 and that Sanders has never in his career been put through that level of scrutiny.
ShironRedshift
Member
He obviously doesn't support it, but the problem is he didn't explicitly condemn it when he was given every chance to. He could easily condemn those aspects of Castro while still praising universal health care, etc, but he didn't. If he can't shut down something completely simple like that in a debate, it's not a good luck to how he'll be able to handle it if he somehow gets the nomination and it's used against him in Republican attack ads. He had the perfect chance to defend himself and clarify and didn't take it for whatever reason. That's on him.
valkillmore
Member
Van just threw water on it before Anderson threw to commercial. The voters, I believe, will see through it.
RustyNails
Member
A gop pac is probably writing this right now and saving it in the "in case bernie LOL" folder.
FunkyMunkey
Banned
teetering. right. lol
hillary has a much better chance beating trump than sanders does, this debate just being one example showing that.
and no, the predictive general election match-up poll sanders keep splashing on facebook and instagram doesn't mean shit as he hasn't been even remotely microscoped yet. as soon as that happens, his odds dwindle dramatically
What praise?
maabus1999
Member
Lol, saw this on Twitter:
RustyNails
Member
Actually..uh...it's likely going to be a whole lot worse.
That 1985 interview question was like a 5 minute version of the Clinton Email/Benghazi stuff she's been handling for 8 years, and he messed it up.
GOP has been mostly ignoring him, how is he gonna handle it if they shift focus from her to him and he flubbed this quick? I'm not even sure Clinton hit him as hard as she could have on that either. If this was a General Election debate I think she wouldn't have let it go (and rightfully so)
GOP has been mostly ignoring him, how is he gonna handle it if they shift focus from her to him and he flubbed this quick? I'm not even sure Clinton hit him as hard as she could have on that either. If this was a General Election debate I think she wouldn't have let it go (and rightfully so)
NullPointer
Member
FunkyMunkey
Banned
i also find it funny how people are underestimating how badly he just fucked himself out of florida. not that he had it anyways
ieptbarakat
Member
That's taken out of context, he was praising him only for the good they've done on socialist matters. To completely renounce what he said, he would also be going back on his socialist viewpoints. Though I agree that it would have been a lot more crowd pleasing if he burned Ortega/Castro in the process.
He couldn't. He does that and it dulls his best weapons against Clinton. Dude had no choice but to take it in the teeth.
Well, Kissinger wasn't a dictator, he wasn't even President. Some of his policies may have been disastrous but he wasn't an autocratic ruler imposing his ideas without any checks from the people. I'm agreeing with that Twitter statement by the way but I think context is also key.
It doesn't matter that it was taken out of context. He didn't clarify that context. He wouldn't have to completely renounce what he said, only to distance himself from an endorsement of Castro. He could describe what he thinks are the good things that have developed in Cuba, while condemning the bad.
No way. He does not have to accept an endorsement of Castro, especially after Clinton described murdering people.
JesseEwiak
Member
"I fully support the goals of expanding access to single payer health care and debt free higher education but despise and deplore the authoritarian and anti-democratic ways in which Fidel and Ortega ruled their countries."
There - I'm an idiot and I did that in 30 seconds.
Lol it's a dishonest argument that's all. That article says nothing tho...
He sort of did. What debate did we watch?
Didn't he denounce the fact that Cuba is undemocratic? Again this was a gotcha question with no gotcha but Bernie didn't give the response that the media knew they wouldn't get so they'll run with the narrative that's clearly at play. It's an expectations game.
ShironRedshift
Member
Forgot that he threw that in there again when he tried to throw his entire load on HRC early on the debate with the Iraq vote, fracking, and everything else. Oy...
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
In the primary, sure, but he's trying to be a candidate for the general election and he just pissed all over Florida.
Uh, Clinton had DIRECT interaction with Kissinger.
Sanders did not with Castro
YUUUGE difference.
Like the one about him never supporting the auto-industry. And about the auto-bailout itself. The bill Hillary keeps attacking Bernie on in question was about Wall-Street, not the auto-industry. And anyone with two seconds of research can see Bernie's support for the auto-industry. She's been repeating this lie since the Town Hall. \
It is teetering, whether you want to acknowledge that fact or not. Hillary has a trust problem, which frankly isn't entirely unwarranted. I've gone over my lack of trust regarding LGBT issues, particularly T ones, in the past. And that's just one issue of many to be critical of her on. Her hawksih nature is also something less than to be desired. She also isn't doing so hot in electability polls either.
These are issues for a reason. They relate directly back to her consistent flip-flopping/inability to acknowledge social issues til it's the safe thing that will be okay for her to come out in support of to gain votes.
I didn't even bring up anything regarding social media. I am speaking directly to the claim that Bernie is unelectable because of this when Hillary has numerous issues she'll need to overcome for voters who refuse to stick to party lines regardless of the nom. for the betterment of the people. I will already vote for whoever the Dem. nom. is but airing concerns with Hillary isn't me arguing that I won't vote for her. I am pointing out a hypocrisy on this matter regarding how Hillary supporters are addressing it.
That doesn't mean said skeletons don't affect her though.
Kissinger wasn't a dictator. YUUUGE difference.
NullPointer
Member
He specifically clarified his context.
It doesn't matter to those who want to hang him with it. Doesn't matter the truth of it, nuance, or what he actually believes now or then - a string of words can be put together, cut and shown in clips on the news with the headline "praise for dictators".
This is the stupid, pandering aspect of politics.
TheOohChild
Member
He didn't really avoid the question. He doubled down on what he originally supported. But I guess he didn't notice how loaded the question was and failed to make it perfectly clear he doesn't want to see anyone get disappeared.
The thing is, she could have. And even Bernie's not silly enough to not realize that.
Her hitting back on the response not just won her points, but it was a warning. If you want to get mean, Bernie, you just fed me a whole lot of ammo.
I would argue he didn't. He tried to clarify the context, while holding on to his original compliment. And he thought he could get away with it. You don't do that.
This was definitely his KKK/Duke moment. You denounce in no uncertain terms, and you leave it at that.
Exactly.
And he never hurted a fly
That's not exactly the point.
Are you serious? Hillary has been getting mean with Bernie for debate after debate now.
googleplex
Member
Is this the Litmus test now?
JesseEwiak
Member
The vast majority of American's don't care or straight up approve other Americans killing brown people. We only care if it begins to cost American lives.
I giggle at the idea that you think the Clinton Machine has even turned the dial up to '3' yet. This last week was them finally getting tired and flipping the switch up to '2.' With Trump, you'll see a '10.'
ShironRedshift
Member
Doesn't matter that it's dishonest. That's what a lot of politics is, for better or worse (mostly worse, of course). Sanders had a chance to clear up the dishonesty and how out of context that segment is, but he completely dodged and focused on something else instead. If he dodges direct attacks like that instead of taking them head on and clearing up the dishonesty and manipulation there, that's not a good luck and is ultimately on him for not being able to effectively convey himself, not anyone else.
VendettaRed07
Member
But Kissinger never gave people healthcare guys.
THAT MAKES IT ALL OK
THAT MAKES IT ALL OK
A lot of his best attacks have hit her on changing her stances over the years. You don't think him doing that exact thing on a stage this big isn't going to dull those attacks?
JesseEwiak
Member
Kissinger never supported dictators who attempted to put nuclear missiles 90 miles outside of Key West.
It wouldn't be a change.
BrutishMrFish
Member
Hah, no. Both Bernie and Hillary have been going easy on each other until now.
The point is that Sanders' Castro comments are specifically on healthcare and quality of life improvements, not at all about his dictatorship.
It's getting twisted out of context because people are eager to find any weak link in Sanders' armor.
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