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Destiny |OT43| Just What the Doctor Ordered

L

LiK

Member
LiveFromKyoto said:
And those same Youtubers will still all be using Last Word & Thorn when it counts. It's just a Grasp/PDX-45, there's nothing to really be afraid of that's not already out there. It's a pea shooter unless they get a high stability roll and/or high calibre rounds, and even then True Vanguard said he wasn't think he preferred it to his Hawksaw, and those were easy to come by as dirt.

That said, the firing action on it feels really cool, I wish I'd gotten a better roll on mine.
Click to expand...

It's one of the few IB weapons that consistently picks me off from a distance right now. More annoying than any other gun atm.
 
ERMint13

ERMint13

Member
I really think Clever Dragon with HCR is on of the best guns right now. It completely throws off even my PB/CB Grasp enough that they kill me first. The flinch is real...

I only have my Warlock to go for my hopes of getting one...I keep getting the sidearm which is still a beast with a great roll but don't need any more of them.
 
J

jacobs34

Member
snowblind said:
I have an uber god roll hawksaw as well and it's amazing! That said, i still think this new Clever Dragon bests it.

Hawk is .87s time to kill 2.6 bursts (8 crit) 1.33s time to kill 4 bursts (12 body) 73 rof 7 impact 25/17 damage 27 range 72 stability 60 aim assist

Clever is .80s time to kill 3 burst (8 crit) 1.33s time to kill 4.33 bursts (13 body) 77 rof 4 impact 23/16 damage 31 range 58 stability 77 aim assist

Depending on perks theyre both similar however, with aim assist perks the Clever just rails headshots like crazy.
Click to expand...

Wow. This is some really great info. I will be on the lookout for a god roll Clever Dragon.
 
X

X-Frame

Member
ERMint13 said:
I really think Clever Dragon with HCR is on of the best guns right now. It completely throws off even my PB/CB Grasp enough that they kill me first. The flinch is real...

I only have my Warlock to go for my hopes of getting one...I keep getting the sidearm which is still a beast with a great roll but don't need any more of them.
Click to expand...

I have one with Braced Frame and HCR and Hidden Hand. I thought my roll was "meh" but the more I read I may have hit the jackpot.

Not a Pulse guy and never used this archetype before so I'll give it a shot.
 
M

MrDaravon

Member
So I've lost every single match I've played with my Warlock so far in IB, but I somehow only have two medallions, and two of my last three matches I've played I have been the only player to get literally zero items post-match. And these weren't matches I idled in or anything. The fuck is this shit.
 
H

hoggert

Member
Clever Dragon is a fucking beast. Using a Hawksaw with PB+RB+HH for IB, most 1v1s and 1v2s were easy peasy lag gods allowing. Except I ran a couple of matches against a fireteam with some dude with a high range as well Dragon and that thing just melts.
 
A

Agent_Tiro

Member
Zakalwe said:
Red bar doesn't always equal advantage, I can assure you.

I'm a long time fps pvp player. Back in the day I played Halo Ce/2 competitively. In public servers my K/d was 10-1 on average. Both on pc and console. Back then I had the best internet connection available, plus I was between 5-110 years younger so my game was a lot higher...

These days I'm almost always 2-3 k/d in fps games. I know how to play.

Currently working with a terrible, cheap phone line connection. Barely pulls 3mb down, 500k/bs up. Constant red/yellow bars. Hits don't register, players warp, takes 2-3 seconds to register kills/actions like picking up crests, splash damage is completely inconsistent, etc...

My tactics and aim are solid, but it's like playing in mud.

Upgrading my internet soon so I'm hoping I simply haven't lost my ability to play. Back in OG Destiny I was 2-3 k/d, since my return on this connection I've dropped to 1.5.

Anyway, I haven't had a single game yet where my red bar feels like an advantage.
Click to expand...

I've had the same experience. Back when I had a similar connection to what you are on about I would red bar and get 0 advantage. Then I upgraded to fibre the difference was night and day. But if I have multiple devices connected and the missus is doing something bandwidth heavy I will be that Red bar at the top of the scoreboards. Once I got a router to replace the PoS garbage my isp gave me it is damn hard to red bar.

There are so many factors that come into what makes a connection laggy that we can't base it purely upon the speed.
 
S

spyder_ur

Member
How do so many people have this Clever Dragon?

I always wish the IB loot pool wasn't as restrictive as it is, though this format seems to make that issue much better.
 
Z

Zoso Achilles

Member
Darryl M R said:
Clever Dragon vs Blind Perdition (adept), which one is better?
Click to expand...
Those are two different archetypes. You want to compare clever dragon to grasp. Those are both in the high rate of fire pulse rifle archtype. For people saying clever dragon is going to be nerfed, stop. Plenty of people already have grasp from when omnigul was the nightfall a while back, and that archtype has since seen a nerf. Clever dragon isn't far and away better than grasp, it's just new and cool. People want new and cool things. There are many more god-rolled grasps than there are of clever dragon.

Edit:
For those looking, a god roll on clever dragon is the same for what you want on grasp: counterbalance and braced frame. High caliber rounds is an added bonus.
 
M

Mixolydian

Member
Wanna do an Xbox WOTM raid so bad. Still haven't done it yet.

377 Titan if anyone is down tonight (or tomorrow). Wanted to run it blind, but all my friends have done it, so now I just simply want to try it.
 
T

TheCanisDirus

Member
X-Frame said:
I have one with Braced Frame and HCR and Hidden Hand. I thought my roll was "meh" but the more I read I may have hit the jackpot.

Not a Pulse guy and never used this archetype before so I'll give it a shot.
Click to expand...

Good roll! I personally prefer range perks on the Clever Dragon as it nails crits with the default stability... it just needs some added "reach out and touch somebody" lol. Regardless that roll will melt fools!
 
Z

Zakalwe

Banned
Agent_Tiro said:
I've had the same experience. Back when I had a similar connection to what you are on about I would red bar and get 0 advantage. Then I upgraded to fibre the difference was night and day. But if I have multiple devices connected and the missus is doing something bandwidth heavy I will be that Red bar at the top of the scoreboards. Once I got a router to replace the PoS garbage my isp gave me it is damn hard to red bar.

There are so many factors that come into what makes a connection laggy that we can't base it purely upon the speed.
Click to expand...

The new connection is 200 down, 20 up, fibre. I'm buying a decent router too. It'll be installed in my room so I'll be wired. I'm really hoping this fixes things.

I know there will still be lag, but I'm feeling optimistic after your "night and day" comment.
 
A

Agent_Tiro

Member
I got 2x clever dragons. It is a beast.

My first was 381 with perfect balance / braced frame. Lightweight/ appended magazine. Counter balance / outlaw. It is a fricking laser.

My second was 385 with small bore/ braced frame. Snapshot/ HCR. Headseeker/ life support

Both have good rolls imo


Edit - Zakalwe. With those speeds you deffo will tell a huge difference. My stats spiked on destiny tracker the day my connection changed. It was ridiculous.
 
T

TheAquaticApe

Member
Clever Dragon is Grasp archetype. Actually hitting all the crits is really tough to do even with a God Roll. The Vendor Hawksaw from last year is a laser and much more forgiving. I even have the Adept Trials Pulse and I still go to the Hawksaw for schweaty matches.
 
L

LiK

Member
TheAquaticApe said:
Clever Dragon is Grasp archetype. Actually hitting all the crits is really tough to do even with a God Roll. The Vendor Hawksaw from last year is a laser and much more forgiving. I even have the Adept Trials Pulse and go to the Hawksaw for schweaty matches.
Click to expand...

are you up for Trials? can i add you for some weekend ToO?
 
M

MrDaravon

Member
Wow, just saw someone get the IB sparrow for the first time, I didn't even know that was a droppable item. That's crazy, I've got to be like 50-60+ matches in and that's the first I've seen drop o_o
 
D

DjRalford

Member
Wow

Just joined an IB in progress which lasted all of 2 minutes before the loss was complete and was rewarded with a 377 Artifact and a 377 secondary, taken me to 375 now.
 
W

wesleyshark

Banned
DjRalford said:
Wow

Just joined an IB in progress which lasted all of 2 minutes before the loss was complete and was rewarded with a 377 Artifact and a 377 secondary, taken me to 375 now.
Click to expand...
That's why I never complain about joining a match in progress, even on the losing side. It's the shortest route to rep, a 3oC chance, and post game rewards haha.
 
T

TheCanisDirus

Member
TheAquaticApe said:
Clever Dragon is Grasp archetype. Actually hitting all the crits is really tough to do even with a God Roll. The Vendor Hawksaw from last year is a laser and much more forgiving. I even have the Adept Trials Pulse and go to the Hawksaw for schweaty matches.
Click to expand...

It is and the Grasp is a crit nail driver... i'm confused. Stock they both crit very well with an avg recoil control. Most rolls end up having some stability perks with all weapons so range is really what the Grasp and Clever need. I'm a Hawksaw guy too myself but I cant explain it.. the Clever might have some other erroneous advantage behind the scenes right now because it really does kill more accurately and quickly than the Hawksaw in practice in my experience and that of a lot of the communities. It will be nerfed i'm sure.
 
T

Tjamato88

Member
Gonna give the Clever Dragon a run tonight in PVP. I have a Cryptic Dragon with a god roll (IMO) that I want to try in PVE.

It has Triple Tap, Armor Piercing Rounds/Braced Frame/Rifled Barrel, Firefly
 
Q

Quantum

Member
Mixolydian said:
Wanna do an Xbox WOTM raid so bad. Still haven't done it yet.

377 Titan if anyone is down tonight (or tomorrow). Wanted to run it blind, but all my friends have done it, so now I just simply want to try it.
Click to expand...

I think I'm 378 warlock (after finishing IB on three toons), I still haven't done the raid, and have avoided reading about it (other than some mechanic spoilers)

I'm going to try to find a laid back/casual/fresh run tomorrow - I haven't raided much in the past but would like to check it out and willing to join up.

xbox/quantum thermos
 
W

wesleyshark

Banned
I got a Clever Dragon with perfect balance, high caliber rounds and counterbalance. Will be trying that out later today, though I do quite enjoy using Blind Perdition and Hawksaw as far as pulses go (still haven't gotten a good Grasp roll).

Edited 2nd perk
 
X

X-Frame

Member
snowblind said:
Good roll! I personally prefer range perks on the Clever Dragon as it nails crits with the default stability... it just needs some added "reach out and touch somebody" lol. Regardless that roll will melt fools!
Click to expand...

Well mine also came with Smallbore as an alt to Braced Frame. I lose some Stability but get Range back and 3 more ammo in the mag which is another burst. Which should I go for? I'll obviously try both.
 
M

Mixolydian

Member
Quantum said:
I think I'm 378 warlock (after finishing IB on three toons), I still haven't done the raid, and have avoided reading about it (other than some mechanic spoilers)

I'm going to try to find a laid back/casual/fresh run tomorrow - I haven't raided much in the past but would like to check it out and willing to join up.

xbox/quantum thermos
Click to expand...

I'm down. I'll add you later today.
 
L

LiK

Member
X-Frame said:
Well mine also came with Smallbore as an alt to Braced Frame. I lose some Stability but get Range back and 3 more ammo in the mag which is another burst. Which should I go for? I'll obviously try both.
Click to expand...

I would always go range if the lower stability ain't that bad.
 
M

Mr_Antimatter

Member
Stuck at 363, need a heavy and a ghost, and no one seems to want to drop one for me.

Clever dragon is doing work though, really made IB a lot more fun.
 
G

GustyGardens

Banned
Llyrwenne said:
4th Omnigul Bond in a row. .-.

One day I'll get a good Grasp... I hope...
Click to expand...

Don't stress it too much.

Aegis of the Reef & Clever Dragon are very good alternatives, and they both kill slightly faster than the Grasp. The Crucible Quartermaster also sells the B-29 Party Favor pulse rifle, and that has the same ROF and Impact as Grasp, Aegis and the Dragon.

I don't believe the Party Favor can roll with Full Auto, but if you can get one with Braced Frame and Headseeker or Glass Half Full, it would be quite nice. I really like Outlaw on my Pulse Rifles.

The Waltz, from Future War Cult also has similar stats, though the ROF is slightly higher and the impact is slightly lower. I don't think this one can roll Full Auto either. Speaking of Future War Cult, The Villainy was also a great PR. This was a Taken King weapon, so I don't think you can get it anymore.
 
T

TheCanisDirus

Member
X-Frame said:
Well mine also came with Smallbore as an alt to Braced Frame. I lose some Stability but get Range back and 3 more ammo in the mag which is another burst. Which should I go for? I'll obviously try both.
Click to expand...

LiK said:
I would always go range if the lower stability ain't that bad.
Click to expand...

Exactly this. Range, range, range. Range affects aim assist and bullet spread cone etc. Stability is soooooo overrated and people think that means accuracy when it DOES NOT.

On a weapon like Clever with good stability out of the box you want range.
 
J

Jabronium

Member
What are good rolls for the sidearm, if any? I haven't gotten to mess with them yet but so far I've got 2.

A: Fitted stock/reinforced barrel, quickdraw/feather mag (bleh), battle runner/crowd control
B: Hand loaded/oiled frame, lightweight/high cal rds, battle runner/hidden hand

Where does the Cryptic Dragon drop, is that just a post-match reward in regular crucible?

All this pulse talk has made me go back through the vault and wonder about digging these back up:

Aegis 1: Perfect balance/full auto/rangefinder
Aegis 2: Send it/full auto/counterbalance
 
T

TheCanisDirus

Member
MWake said:
How about this clever dragon roll? Perfect balance, HC Rounds and Hidden Hand.
Click to expand...

That will rock just fine. I'm not a fan of HC rounds but hidden hand and perfect balance are always welcome perks. Move stuff around where you need to in order to max out range while keeping hidden hand is what i would do.
 
C

CrudeDiatribe

Member
GustyGardens said:
Aegis of the Reef & Clever Dragon are very good alternatives, and they both kill slightly faster than the Grasp. The Crucible Quartermaster also sells the B-29 Party Favor pulse rifle, and that has the same ROF and Impact as Grasp, Aegis and the Dragon.
Click to expand...

These guns are not the same archetype at all.

Grasp and Dragon are the same archetype, same as the new FWC pulse; they have a faster ideal TTK than: Aegis, B-29 and the new Trials pulse, which are the same as Hawksaw.
 
Z

ZeroDivide

Unconfirmed Member
GustyGardens said:
Don't stress it too much.

Aegis of the Reef & Clever Dragon are very good alternatives, and they both kill slightly faster than the Grasp. The Crucible Quartermaster also sells the B-29 Party Favor pulse rifle, and that has the same ROF and Impact as Grasp, Aegis and the Dragon.

I don't believe the Party Favor can roll with Full Auto, but if you can get one with Braced Frame and Headseeker or Glass Half Full, it would be quite nice. I really like Outlaw on my Pulse Rifles.

The Waltz, from Future War Cult also has similar stats, though the ROF is slightly higher and the impact is slightly lower. I don't think this one can roll Full Auto either. Speaking of Future War Cult, The Villainy was also a great PR. This was a Taken King weapon, so I don't think you can get it anymore.
Click to expand...

I got a Party Favor with

rodeo
rifled barrel
Glass Half Full

(alts are partial refund and braced frame)

and I love it in Crucible/IB. I also run with gloves that have pulse reload, so I'm always firing with it. Its a great mid-range weapon that I back up with my Trespasser for shotgunners.
 
X

X-Frame

Member
snowblind said:
Exactly this. Range, range, range. Range affects aim assist and bullet spread cone etc. Stability is soooooo overrated and people think that means accuracy when it DOES NOT.

On a weapon like Clever with good stability out of the box you want range.
Click to expand...

Cool I'll try Smallbore for a few games then!

I had decided on Braced because of the recent CoolGuy video that showed the Grasp archetype barely suffering any Range damage dropoff when reducing Range.

Here is the video FYI: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EPfJAUzQo3Y
 
M

MWake

Neo Member
snowblind said:
That will rock just fine. I'm not a fan of HC rounds but hidden hand and perfect balance are always welcome perks. Move stuff around where you need to in order to max out range while keeping hidden hand is what i would do.
Click to expand...

Has armor piercing instead of HC rounds if needed.
 
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