adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Ditto.
Game completely caught me by surprise after the terrible first showing.
This is top 3 in my GoTY list.
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DF: Guardians of the Galaxy: PS5 vs Xbox Series X - Ray Tracing Upgrades Tested
- Thread starter Arioco
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Ditto.
Game completely caught me by surprise after the terrible first showing.
This is top 3 in my GoTY list.
Putonahappyface
Gold Member
I've put ten hours in today on my first run and I'm really enjoying it so far. I was worried about 30fps but it isn't a problem for me.
93xfan
Banned
Can you show me marketing that explicitly says this?
Either way, getting tired of people stating this over and over. We know this and we get it, YOU aren’t their target. No one is suggesting you get a Series S.
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GHG
Gold Member
I don't know what you are trying to imply with that. My thought process has been consistent in regards to the XSS all along. It was always the equivalent of a budget friendly PC GPU in my mind, you lose some resolution, maybe you move some sliders down a bit to hit the target frame rate. It's a solid little box, that accomplishes just that and is perfect for a lot of people. If you looked at some bullet list and made assumptions based on that...
Plus, again, there is a lot of software where sliding the resolution down is all that is needed.
Happy reading:
What is it about the Xbox Series S that worries developers?
A technical producer at Remedy is happy with the Series S looking at it through the lens of a consumer but with regards to development he seems less than happy. https://www.linkedin.com/in/c4rm1n3/?originalSubdomain=fi Microsoft's stance based on their recent Series S video is that it's...
Inside the Xbox Series S Video
Walkthrough by Jason Ronald. Confirms that the CPU is the same as in XSX. Also confirms 10 GB RAM running at 224 GB/sec.
Xbox Series S - Revealed Trailer
All-Digital 4TF RDNA 2 GPU Same CPU as Xbox Series X Nearly 60% smaller than Xbox Series X Custom 512GB NVME SSD powered by Xbox Velocity Architecture (like the Series X) 1440p at up to 120FPS DirectX Raytracing 4K upscaling and media playback Variable rate shading Variable refresh rate...
And bonus reading:
IGN “The Series S could be faster than the PS5”
https://www.ign.com/articles/xbox-series-x-series-s-price-release-date-november-all-access Click the first video for their explanation. EDIT: I’m just reporting what I saw on their page. I have no opinion on it, but enjoy reading tech wiz’s opinions on it. TLDR of IGN’s explanation: “The...
Hopefully after reading through those threads you are no longer confused as to why this discussion surrounding the Series S seems to come up time and time again.
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Werewolfgrandma
Banned
To all the series S shit posters. Would you all rather Microsoft and other console manufactures issue mandates for resolution, effects... or would you rather the developer choose what's best? It seems like your argument is trash without Microsoft forcing mandates which you would also argue against.
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SportsFan581
Member
Huh? It feels like you are trying to talk out of both sides of your mouth here.
What we know for fact in regards to games on XSS:
* Games are available that run at 1440p.
* Games are available that run at 120fps.
* Games are available that feature hardware RT.
* Games are available that are basically identical between XSX and XSS outside of resolution.
They've hit their bullet points already. They might not have ever hit them all at the same time in the same software, but then neither has XSX or PS5.
SportsFan581
Member
It does look good. I'll be sure to give it a go at some point.
FrankWza
Member
That’s not the point. It wasn’t supposed to be a mix and match scenario.
It supposed to be per title. So, on the game that has Ray tracing and or 120fps on series x it’s supposed to have those same features on that same game, only at lower resolutions. It’s also supposed to be, according to people here, a flip of the switch or a matter of just downscaling to make the games run. Obviously, that’s not happening since first party, and third party are already excluding features.
SportsFan581
Member
That's a construct you developed in your own head. Which you are free to do. A lot of the games available that support different framerate modes on XSX do support those framerates on XSS, but it isn't something that was ever guaranteed. What is guaranteed is that you can play Xbox series games on both series consoles and both versions should be playable, that's the red line.
You must be really upset about the PS5 as well, because their bullet list is basically the same as the XSX list and they've never checked every box at the same second either. Food for thought.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
They’d probs need to do the effort to offer a dynamic 720p go 1080p mode on this game to get the raytracing added.
such a shame that we are a year in and these consoles are using the lowest possible raytracing setting, cutting the other reflections from pc and also cutting back settings to get 30fps. I hope we see some drastic shifts soon or basically this gen will be the same as every other.
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dcmk7
Banned
Jason Ronald said it in a marketing video.
Exact same experience but at a reduced resolution.
Based on that quote we should be seeing 120fps/ray tracing/etc in Series S titles IF Series X has it. But we aren't.
FrankWza
Member
It’s what we’ve been told from launch. I don’t know what the bullet list on the PS5 has to do with this. Maybe you’re not understanding. Every game won’t be full 4K or full1440p with Ray tracing and 120fps. That was never promised. The point is, the series s is supposed to be the exact same as the series x at lower resolution on a per game basis.
SportsFan581
Member
He also mentioned that their could be differences, but that the core experience would be the same. Taking a random two minute video and applying it as a gold standard when longer videos exist that explain the whole thing in detail is disingenuous.
dcmk7
Banned
Random video?
It was a Series S pre-launch marketing video going over all the new features and explaining why the Series S exists. If his words in that particular video doesn't count then what does?
No one puts words in his mouth when he said, to paraphrase, users would get the exact experience at a reduced resolution.
I'm sure you would agree it hasn't been the case. Not even first party studios can achieve feature parity across the consoles.
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
When a majority of ¨4K¨ games aren´t hitting 2160p consistently on either the PS5 or SX, putting all those artificial barriers on the SS is just finding reasons to hate on it just for the sake of it, come on man.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
But even if the seriesS does not have feature parity with the seriesX, who cares?
Just dont buy a seriesS.
And if your issue is inaccurate information from Microsoft, well if thats your issue then to remain consistent in this issue you have to callout sony and Nintendo for there inaccurate claims.
But heres a better idea, instead of complaining about these things and filling threads with negitivity which wont achieve anything, just dont post about it.
This is not aimed solely at you, but anyone doing it in this thread.
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FrankWza
Member
Again, you’re not understanding. The console is supposed to be easy to develop for, not take any development time away from the main consoles and be identical in feature set on a game by game basis as the series s. Instead we are looking at a generation of this if Microsoft doesn’t pull the plug. Devs don’t need more work to do.
Weak. It isn’t the issue of the information being inaccurate. It’s further proof that the console itself potentially poses an issue for developers. A couple have even come out and said as much. I play third party games too.
The point against the s and what is becoming more and more apparent is that it needs time and effort that is taken away from the other 2 consoles. That’s valuable resources that can be used to get the most out of the lead consoles instead.
Coupled with the amount of effort involved just to get the UE5 demo running on s, it appears the devs that called out the s were accurate and justified in their concern and we can assume that if UE5 is used a lot, the s development will take a considerable amount of time away from the lead platforms. All so people that I don’t care about could save $100? Nah…go and break your piggy banks.
Hobbygaming
has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
GHG
Gold Member
All that any reasonable person expects is that people are realistic about the capability of the hardware in question, especially now that we are in a post-release world and can use facts to draw conclusions from. If the hardware is good enough it will sell on it's own merits, no sleazy used car salesmen required, but we can't ignore the data and outcomes not correlating with what has previously been said.
The most interesting thing about all of this is the fact that when people were being reasonable about the capability of the hardware pre-release based on the specs the naysayers cried about "concern" and "shit posters" because everyone must believe Jason Roland and Microsoft's marketing/PR. There were some wild claims going around, to the extent that some people believed the Series S would rival the PS5.
And now that the chickens have come home to roost and people are discussing the reality of the capabilities of the hardware based on real world game releases you have the exact same people crying foul about "concern" and "shit posters". It's got to the point where just discussing the data can result in people attempting to gatekeep who is and who isn't allowed to discuss the Series S' performance in games. Who knew that the mere discussion of performance data could result in such hysteria?
Is it too much to ask to expect people to admit they were wrong, apologise to the people who they insulted prior to the release of the console and be humble? There is no shortage of crow and there is no shame in eating it if you are starving due to self inflicted circumstances.
So in summary, the sequence of events for Series S evangelists has gone like this:
Anyone is free to break the cycle outlined in the gifs above at any point.
P.S. I accept apologies by postcard.
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Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Even if the console does cause issues for developers you bringing it up is not going to change anything.
Also, how much effort was involved with getting the series S version to work? We know the UE5 was designed to be very scalable and the awakens demo was made in a year by 50-70people with help from the coalition.
Theres been no information from EPIC or the coalition saying that it requires a large amount of effort to get it running well on the S, If anything the awakens demo on the S and being feature complete shows that it won't hold current gen development back. The PS5 and XSX are already being taxed with the awaken demo, so the series s is not holding them back, there own performance is holding them back.
Also the devs that have spoken about the seriesS were not specific and had little or no hands on game development time with it.
This generation is going more scalable then ever before.
The biggest advancements I think will happen will be more seamless environments with more realistic world and NPC behaviours, these advancments will be driven by software advancment, better CPU and faster mass storage and iO.
When it comes to visuals this is what the current gen will be about
- Indirect realtime global illumination
- Higher geometry
- Higher object density
- RT reflections+shadows
- Higher effect density
- Higher resolution
- Higher framerate
- Better effects
We have even seen great scalabilty on PS5 exclusives, like a rift apart, the RT FPS mode cuts down object density in the crowds and flying cars in order to hit 60fps with RT with decent image quality.
Also last gen you could run last gen games on PC gpus with 1/3 of the GPU power of the PS4, that didnt hold games back.....
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FrankWza
Member
Nothing written in any post in any thread ultimately changes anything. It’s a forum. We’re not supposed to be crusaders
DF said it was a gargantuan effort with many concessions that ultimately ended up looking deformed.
Wasn’t one of the devs a first party dev? I’m not sure but I think it was.
Then why is 120fps missing from Halo and why is Ray tracing missing from Guardians?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
So, like most comparison threads ?
Werewolfgrandma
Banned
So someone was dumb so now you and a bunch of other people need to shit up every thread that the XSS is missing a "feature"? Why not just move on?All that any reasonable person expects is that people are realistic about the capability of the hardware in question, especially now that we are in a post-release world and can use facts to draw conclusions from. If the hardware is good enough it will sell on it's own merits, no sleazy used car salesmen required, but we can't ignore the data and outcomes not correlating with what has previously been said.
The most interesting thing about all of this is the fact that when people were being reasonable about the capability of the hardware pre-release based on the specs the naysayers cried about "concern" and "shit posters" because everyone must believe Jason Roland and Microsoft's marketing/PR. There were some wild claims going around, to the extent that some people believed the Series S would rival the PS5.
And now that the chickens have come home to roost and people are discussing the reality of the capabilities of the hardware based on real world game releases you have the exact same people crying foul about "concern" and "shit posters". It's got to the point where just discussing the data can result in people attempting to gatekeep who is and who isn't allowed to discuss the Series S' performance in games. Who knew that the mere discussion of performance data could result in such hysteria?
Is it too much to ask to expect people to admit they were wrong, apologise to the people who they insulted prior to the release of the console and be humble? There is no shortage of crow and there is no shame in eating it if you are starving due to self inflicted circumstances.
So in summary, the sequence of events for Series S evangelists has gone like this:
Anyone is free to break the cycle outlined in the gifs above at any point.
P.S. I accept apologies by postcard.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
So an opinion from DF is your source
I watched the DF video on awakens and they were rather positive about seriesS's performance on awakens, they dont personally like it, but from a tech perspective they were pleased that seriesS had main feature parity.
"Then why is 120fps missing from Halo and why is Ray tracing missing from Guardians?"
This demonstrates that the games are scalable....
SeriesS is not the console for you if you want 120fps and RT in every game...
But that does not mean what it offers is a bad experience or makes the experience of the bigger consoles worse.
Check out this, a 614gflop card able to play last gen games at a more comperable resolution then the seriesS will target.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Disagree ...the higher resolution of quality mode is easily visible if you have sharp eyes. It's nice to have options and I have been switching between the two
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
As long a they do some high quality upscaling then that's OK for me. The best example I've seen so far is Returnal. Internally it's 1080p but it looks pristine on a 4k tv. Sony should be looking at what they did and trying to reach that quality of upscaling on other exclusives.
GHG
Gold Member
If only it was just someone.
You included unfortunately:
And that whole thread is full of gems along with the ones I listed above.
It's ok to be wrong.
Werewolfgrandma
Banned
Um the dumb thing was the rival the ps5 part remember. I don't recall saying anything wrong. That comment included.If only it was just someone.
You included unfortunately:
And that whole thread is full of gems along with the ones I listed above.
It's ok to be wrong.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
You said nothing wrong, expecting the seriesS to have 1/3res of the xsx is pretty much what happened.
FrankWza
Member
How is it an opinion? They got the information from epic and coalition. The opinion they made was that it looked deformed on series s.So an opinion from DF is your source
I watched the DF video on awakens and they were rather positive about seriesS's performance on awakens, they dont personally like it, but from a tech perspective they were pleased that seriesS had main feature parity.
Again, nobody is saying it has to be in every game. But it is supposed to be in every game where the same feature is in series x, just at lower resolutions.
Spitfire098
Member
RIf only it was just someone.
You included unfortunately:
And that whole thread is full of gems along with the ones I listed above.
It's ok to be wrong.
Werewolfgrandma
Banned
Following conversations is not your strong suit. That's in no way a "gotcha" moment
ReBurn
Gold Member
Probably because the developers elected not to include those features. Halo had 120 FPS on Series S during the network tests, so we know it's possible. We also know that ray tracing is possible on Series S. Several games implement it. So the developer elected not to include it.
It's actually pretty weird to be using Guardians of the Galaxy as some sort of tent pole for performance given that its resolution drops to 1080p on PS5 and XSX to be able to hit 60 FPS in performance mode. But people argue over less I guess.
Werewolfgrandma
Banned
You will notice in most of my posts in that thread I included caveats because I know lots of games run like shit so those games are obviously going to run even worse on XSS. Again, I'm not sure why people can't just move on.
Jimmy_liv
Member
Who gives a shit. Just enjoy your game and not the piece of plastic.
avin
Member
What I don't really get is the people hacking at the Series S, because devs might spend time developing for it that somehow rightfully belongs to them.
It exists. You can actually buy one. If enough people buy it, it'll be worth developers time. If they don't, then it won't. Either way, some people could stop acting like what they personally prefer is the important thing.
avin
It exists. You can actually buy one. If enough people buy it, it'll be worth developers time. If they don't, then it won't. Either way, some people could stop acting like what they personally prefer is the important thing.
avin
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Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Where did DF actually say this? Could u provide link please.
I dont disagree with your 2nd paragraph.
I dont see missing RT or 120fps here and there a problem, people have a choice, they dont have to get an S.
Also I do think the seriesS will create more work for devs, again I dont think this will be an issue.
Dodkrake
Banned
FrankWza
Member
If it’s possible and it isn’t included then it’s too much work. If it isn’t possible then the system isn’t as promised. They wouldn’t just take it out for no reason.
About it looking deformed? In the first comparison video.
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
I am not sure how far it falls down.
I sit very close to big tv, so for me, the sharper the image the better.
But if it's like 1800p more often than 1440p, then I can deal with it and have ray tracing
captainraincoat
Banned
once again ray tracing is one of the biggest performance hit features with no real big payoff
games are better off just cheesing it to be honest
games are better off just cheesing it to be honest
mansoor1980
Gold Member
series s beating ps5? i hope no one bought it for that REASON
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
The reflections are worth it in this game. Df video kinda didn’t show much.
thismeinteil
Member
Reminds me of the same people getting upset at the constant DF threads because "who cares if the PS5 is winning comparisons or basically tying with the Series X." As if they didn't spend months prior to release mocking the PS5's "9Tflop RDNA 1.5 architecture."All that any reasonable person expects is that people are realistic about the capability of the hardware in question, especially now that we are in a post-release world and can use facts to draw conclusions from. If the hardware is good enough it will sell on it's own merits, no sleazy used car salesmen required, but we can't ignore the data and outcomes not correlating with what has previously been said.
The most interesting thing about all of this is the fact that when people were being reasonable about the capability of the hardware pre-release based on the specs the naysayers cried about "concern" and "shit posters" because everyone must believe Jason Roland and Microsoft's marketing/PR. There were some wild claims going around, to the extent that some people believed the Series S would rival the PS5.
And now that the chickens have come home to roost and people are discussing the reality of the capabilities of the hardware based on real world game releases you have the exact same people crying foul about "concern" and "shit posters". It's got to the point where just discussing the data can result in people attempting to gatekeep who is and who isn't allowed to discuss the Series S' performance in games. Who knew that the mere discussion of performance data could result in such hysteria?
Is it too much to ask to expect people to admit they were wrong, apologise to the people who they insulted prior to the release of the console and be humble? There is no shortage of crow and there is no shame in eating it if you are starving due to self inflicted circumstances.
So in summary, the sequence of events for Series S evangelists has gone like this:
Anyone is free to break the cycle outlined in the gifs above at any point.
P.S. I accept apologies by postcard.
Tchu-Espresso
likes mayo on everthing and can't dance
Wow. What should have been a fart manifested itself as a thought.
Where are the goal posts now?
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Shmunter
Member
When they do, it’s likely the X just upressing a series S game, not being taken proper advantage off.
I stand by my conviction off target platform and minspecs matter!
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