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[LostDonkey]

But it didn't. The best looking games from this gen look notably better than the best of last gen (which include Callisto Protocol, Demon's Souls, Forbidden West, and Alan Wake 2). And that's just in that realistic, gritty style. Ratchet remains not only king for that style of visuals, btut far ahead of last gen's efforts of that kind.

Not trying to downplay Hellbalde, but this idea that it's the first of its kind is simply not true. It loses out to some of the games I mentioned in certain areas too (lack of pathtracing/raytracing, environmental textures are not the best we've seen, water, hair, etc). The more I play it, the more I see some of these minor weaknesses. However, I'd still keep it at or near the top because it truly is a splendor overall.

Lumen IS raytracing?

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Lumen IS raytracing?

How well is it implemented in Hellblade? How does it stack up to games like Alan Wake 2 or Cyberpunk (both of which use pathtracing)?

If that's all you have to work with, my point remains solid.

 

[Romulus]

But it didn't. The best looking games from this gen look notably better than the best of last gen in one way or another (which include Callisto Protocol, Demon's Souls, Forbidden West, and Alan Wake 2). And that's just in that realistic, gritty style. Ratchet remains not only king for that style of visuals, but far ahead of last gen's efforts of that kind.

Not trying to downplay Hellbalde, but this idea that it's the first of its kind is simply not true. It loses out to some of the games I mentioned in certain areas too (lack of pathtracing/raytracing, environmental textures are not the best we've seen, water, hair, etc). The more I play it, the more I see some of these minor weaknesses. However, I'd still keep it at or near the top because it truly is a splendor overall.

It's true for me. I've played all those games, and they didn't sell me as a true leap forward. Hellblade 2 did. That's my opinion.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Keep ignorantly trolling consoles.

As per the last discussion about this everyone there already explained to you. Do you want to keep trolling?

 

[DonF]

game looks awesome, great artistic vision. A real showpiece.

 

[Balducci30]

But it didn't. The best looking games from this gen look notably better than the best of last gen in one way or another (which include Callisto Protocol, Demon's Souls, Forbidden West, and Alan Wake 2). And that's just in that realistic, gritty style. Ratchet remains not only king for that style of visuals, but far ahead of last gen's efforts of that kind.

Not trying to downplay Hellbalde, but this idea that it's the first of its kind is simply not true. It loses out to some of the games I mentioned in certain areas too (lack of pathtracing/raytracing, environmental textures are not the best we've seen, water, hair, etc). The more I play it, the more I see some of these minor weaknesses. However, I'd still keep it at or near the top because it truly is a splendor overall.

I haven’t played the game just watched videos. But none of those look close on a graphical level to this imo, nor as consistent. They’re all actual games though which gives them bonus points

 

[HeWhoWalks]

I haven’t played the game just watched videos. But none of those look close on a graphical level to this imo, nor as consistent. They’re all actual games though which gives them bonus points

"none of those look close"

What aspects of Hellblade are so far ahead of the games I mentioned/showed leads one to this conclusion?

 

[FoxMcChief]

 

[adamsapple]

Not trying to downplay Hellbalde, but this idea that it's the first of its kind is simply not true. It loses out to some of the games I mentioned in certain areas too (lack of pathtracing/raytracing, environmental textures are not the best we've seen, water, hair, etc). The more I play it, the more I see some of these minor weaknesses. However, I'd still keep it at or near the top because it truly is a splendor overall.

Lumen is ray tracing, it's just what Unreal Engine's version is called. This game uses lumen GI and reflections, reflections are paired with SSR.

Also, the video specifically calls out high quality textures, minus some exceptions (which game doesn't) and the water as being highlights.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

As per the last discussion about this everyone there already explained to you. Do you want to keep trolling?

You came in the thread and trolled consoles again.
Specs are clearly there for you to see what you said was wrong again.
Maybe you should start getting reported.

 

[rodrigolfp]

You came in the thread and trolled consoles again.
Specs are clearly there for you to see what you said was wrong again.
Maybe you should start getting reported.

What part of "LOW" you don't understand in the minimum requirements? Or do you really think Series S runs with every settings on low?

 

[AlphaDump]

Really hoping with this experience under their belt using UE5, we now see some really crazy shit in their next effort or from other studios.

Even still, unreal engine 5 is something i question. I appreciate HB2 but also can't help but think the narrow scope of the game helped mask the limitations of the engine in clever ways. Especially on the gameplay side.

 

[Zathalus]

Not really as there is parity with console version.

Despite the game looking really good, this is quite true. To truly be the modern Crysis moment the game would need to have an optional toggle for the more demanding Unreal 5 features such as Path Tracing. That would bring a 4090 to its knees.

As per the last discussion about this everyone the already explained to you there. What to keep trolling?

GTX 1070, RX 5700, and ARC A580 are all more powerful then the Series S anyway.

Its a silly comparison though, Ratchet and Clank was designed from the ground up for the PS5 yet runs on the Steam Deck. Go figure.

 

[Clear]

The fact is that we already have a real indication that what we see in HB2 can be transferred to something broader and more complex..... The Matrix demo that already worked on consoles (even with RT Lumen hardware active) and therefore At that time UE5 was not nearly as optimized as it is today. In fact, the latest tests indicate that performance has improved by up to 40-60% depending on the situation.

That is to say, something more complex and broad is possible and it is only in the means and resources that you put into it. Of course studios of 250-350+ developers can achieve higher goals.

Obviously, those who bet on 60fps will have it twice as difficult, but I think that the base of top games on consoles will be 30fps. Marvel 1943, the next Tomb Raider and Gears 6 could perfectly be better exponents than Hellblade 2 because of the aforementioned.

We will see.

Nope. Matrix demo wasn't especially complex. UE5 is great at using tesselation to create super dense mesh facades and lighting them realistically. But flying around the shortcuts being taken were extremely obvious; the lack of animation on the many air-con fans, the stark difference in quality between organic and inorganic scene elements, the need to use pre-baked anims for collision and damage in the car combat scenes, etc. etc.

Remember when people were going to mod it out into something amazing, but all we ever got was a single superman figure flying around the same static world?

I'm not saying its not good, certainly not discarding its technical and artistic merit. I'm just pointing out that if you want the same fidelity for every scene element it really behooves you to limit the number of elements so as not to spread a resource pool that is never going to be infinite beyond its limits.

You start combining things that have their own systemic demands and it gets tricky. Because the small interstitial details really stand out qualitatively if they are omitted or executed to a lower level of fidelity than the major scene elements. Quality needs to be uniform or else the cohesion of the scene "breaks" and the verisimilitude is lost.
A really basic example of this is having super dense and detailed character models that animate stiffly or unconvincingly, it diminishes the impact greatly.

 

[Jaybe]

964 to 1070p huh?

 

[Balducci30]

"none of those look close"

What aspects of Hellblade are so far ahead of the games I mentioned/showed leads one to this conclusion?

Character models, lighting, environment and consistency. I’ve played the shit out of every one of those games: Ratchet was the first “next gen” looking game to me, Raytracing very high quality - but still looked gamey, Horizon has great character models but the lighting sucks, there’s a lot of pop in and it’s inconsistent, AW2 looks amazing at points but not consistent and has a lot of image break up/jaggies, character models not on the level of this, demons souls looks great but simple, avatar has great foliage but character models aren’t very good nor are animations, and there’s a lot of weird fx that look like shit. FF16 also very inconsistent.

The water, fire and hair fx aren’t the greatest they’ve ever been in Hellblade - but they do some things better and some things worse in those areas compared to the others. They are not bad enough to bring it down in any noticeable way. The waves and fluid of some of the shots look great better than anything, then in others they look kinda bad and that’s jarring considering how high quality everything else is.

Like I said I’m only judging off videos of this game vs having played the others - but people are saying it looks better when playing it. Which is insane because it’s a clear step above the others.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Its a silly comparison though, Ratchet and Clank was designed from the ground up for the PS5 yet runs on the Steam Deck. Go figure.

S0ULZB0URNE : "Sony clearly thought about the Steam Deck when developing R&C RA".​

 

[rodrigolfp]

lighting

If software lumen is better/more accurate than Path tracing than the later is a lie.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

What part of "LOW" you don't understand in the minimum requirements? Or do you really think Series S runs with every settings on low?

Series s is more powerful than the PC required specs.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Character models, lighting, environment and consistency. I’ve played the shit out of every one of those games: Ratchet was the first “next gen” looking game to me, Raytracing very high quality - but still looked gamey, Horizon has great character models but the lighting sucks, there’s a lot of pop in and it’s inconsistent, AW2 looks amazing at points but not consistent and has a lot of image break up/jaggies, character models not on the level of this, demons souls looks great but simple, avatar has great foliage but character models aren’t very good nor are animations, and there’s a lot of weird fx that look like shit. FF16 also very inconsistent.

Like I said I’m only judging off videos of this game vs having played the others - but people are saying it looks better when playing it. Which is insane because it’s a clear step above the others.

- Lighting? Other games are at least as good.

- Character models? Sure, Senua is about as good as it gets. But "nothing even close"?

Nonsense.

- Environment? No. Other games have it beat.

- Consistency? It's about as consistent as other top games.

I own and play the game. Its accolodaes are it's close to, or at, the top. But it isn't so far ahead of everything that "nothing comes close" is accurate. Based on you continuing to say "I haven't played those", I would advise to check it out if one is to have this convo proper. All of the games I've highlighted I own.

 

[Balducci30]

If software lumen is better/more accurate than Path tracing than the later is a lie.

I’m not saying it is, but which of those games is fully path traced? AW2 does some sort of mix on pc, I haven’t played that version only Ps5 - and Cyberpunk 2077 is pathtraced. Which I also haven’t played, but it wasn’t built to be pathtraced from the ground up.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Series s is more powerful than the PC required specs.

Read again what you quoted and try again/answer.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Read again what you quoted and try again/answer.

I gave you a right to the point fact that silences your original trolling claim.

 

[Balducci30]

- Lighting? Other games are at least as good.

- Character models? Sure, Senua is about as good as it gets. But "nothing even close"?

Nonsense.

- Environment? No. Other games have it beat.

- Consistency? It's about as consistent as other top games.

I own and play the game. Its accolodaes are it's close to, or at, the top. But it isn't so far ahead of everything that "nothing comes close" is accurate. Based on you continuing to say "I haven't played those", I would advise to check it out if one is to have this convo proper. All of the games I've highlighted I own.

I haven’t played Hellblade 2. That’s the only one I haven’t played. apparently it’s more of a movie than a game. I am not into this, maybe I’ll try it - but I have played everything else except cyberpunk 2077 on Pc and AW2 PC. I’ve played them on Ps5 tho. I’ve played all the games you highlighted. Just by image alone that LOU part 1 shot does not look on the same level

 

[dem]

It's the way it all comes together in Hellblade that make it look crazy. It just feels like you're playing an Unreal 5 tech demo.

If you start focusing on individual things it sort of brings you back to reality. But as a cohesive image.... it really does look special.

Its probably the only game I've played where I just had to go into photo mode dick around.

 

[XXL]

Gaf the first three years of this Gen when dev after dev sacrificed visuals: why do games still look like ps4 era games?

Gaf when a next Gen game finally arrives:

I'm super confused, I was literally just reading this from you about Hellblade 2 in another thread.

Just played what felt like a 2 hour cave level that made me want to kill myself. the level is basically walking in a cave lighting up the path and then walking some more. maybe 3 combat scenarios and they all play the same so not like it matters. Not to mention the constant fucking talking in your ear through out those 2 hours. and i mean constant. literally every second there is someone talking. every single mother fucking second.

And all of that inner dialogue is trash. its extremely poorly written. it basically boils down to this.
Voice 1: She's brave.
Voice 2: She's not.

Voice 1: Go back.
voice 2: Keep going.

Voice 1: Sky is blue.
voice 2: fuck you.

voice 1: its dark.
voice 2: its bright you cunt.

It's like this ALL the time. Literally every second. Not every other second, on every single second these two cunts are talking over each other.

I dont care if this is what schizophrenia is like. It is not fun. It is bad writing. Whoever thought this was good writing needs to be fired and then sent to epstein's island. The writing deserves an fucking razzie. Level designer of that level deserves to be laid off or forced to go work on elder scrolls online levels just so he sees what basic level design 101 from the 50s looks like.

Seriously, fuck the constant whining and constant walking. I hope phil shuts this studio down because this isnt video games. this is torture.

It doesn't sound like you want it.....you want Phil to shut the studio down. Lol.

 

[rodrigolfp]

I’m not saying it is, but which of those games is fully path traced? AW2 does some sort of mix on pc, I haven’t played that version only Ps5 - and Cyberpunk 2077 is pathtraced. Which I also haven’t played, but it wasn’t built to be pathtraced from the ground up.

 

[Negotiator101]

How well is it implemented in Hellblade? How does it stack up to games like Alan Wake 2 or Cyberpunk (both of which use pathtracing)?

If that's all you have to work with, my point remains solid.

Listen to John in the video (who's a big PS fan). Nothing is doing everything to the level of HB2. Sure path-tracing is superior but only Cyberpunk is doing that correctly. AW2 takes short cuts in that regard.

Character rendering, animation, environmental effects are a level above any of the games you mentioned. In the case of Forbidden West the lighting on that is a generation behind.

Nanite is also producing geometric details not possible in the games you mentioned, like it or not HB2 is the new benchmark and will likely remain so until 2025.

 

[GudOlRub]

Yep. Removing the black borders and everything else that’s necessary for this game absolutely strips away its artistic integrity. Those things are not there to “hide” anything; Hellblade 2 is going for a filmic look, and those techniques help it to achieve such.

I removed the letterboxing and enjoyed it way more that way, if there's something I hate in media, is people fucking with my screen real-estate just because "it is more stylish".

 

[HeWhoWalks]

I haven’t played Hellblade 2. That’s the only one I haven’t played. apparently it’s more of a movie than a game. I am not into this, maybe I’ll try it - but I have played everything else except cyberpunk 2077 on Pc and AW2 PC. I’ve played them on Ps5 tho. Just by image alone that LOU part 1 shot does not look on the same level

That Part I shot is good enough that it's not a complete shutout vs Hellblade II, is my point. I can get behind the argument that Hellblade II is on top, but the hyperbolic "nothing comes close" is what I challenge.

 

[Balducci30]

I watched this back when it came out, don’t they say that it’s using some sort of mix of PT and a different form of lighting? Like it’s fully PT layered over the other?

 

[twilo99]

To see what is the best way to play a game in technical terms.

That would be a high end PC 100% of the time.

 

[Negotiator101]

I watched this back when it came out, don’t they say that it’s using some sort of mix of PT and a different form of lighting? Like it’s fully PT layered over the other?

Yeah it's not completely accurate.

 

[SlimySnake]

I'm super confused, I was literally just reading this from you about Hellblade 2 in another thread.


It doesn't sound like you want it.....you want Phil to shut the studio down. Lol.

this is a graphics thread. i want next gen visuals like everyone else seeing as how many of those where is next gen threads we get lately.

 

[rodrigolfp]

I watched this back when it came out, don’t they say that it’s using some sort of mix of PT and a different form of lighting? Like it’s fully PT layered over the other?

Not full yeah, but lumen alone, so far, can't come close.

 

[Balducci30]

That Part I shot is good enough that it's not a complete shutout vs Hellblade II, is my point. I can get behind the argument that Hellblade II is on top, but the hyperbolic "nothing comes close" is what I challenge.

Fair enough - to my eyes it looks like a major leap. Obviously the cost is that it’s so limited.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Listen to John in the video (who's a big PS fan). Nothing is doing everything to the level of HB2. Sure path-tracing is superior but only Cyberpunk is doing that correctly. AW2 takes short cuts in that regard.

Character rendering, animation, environmental effects are a level above any of the games you mentioned. In the case of Forbidden West the lighting on that is a generation behind.

Nanite is also producing geometric details not possible in the games you mentioned, like it or not HB2 is the new benchmark and will likely remain so until 2025.

John being a PS fan is irrelevant.

If we look at one, or two, aspects of Hellblade and ignore everything else, sure, we can make that point. But, as a total package, Hellblade doesn't top every game in every aspect. That's all I'm saying, while acknowledging its superiority in a number of areas.

 

[NonPhixion]

30fps and sub 1080p? I love 2014 2024

 

[Balducci30]

Not full yeah, but lumen alone, so far, can't came close.

I guess to my eyes it looks more cgi in this than in that AW2 video, maybe it’s not as accurate but I can’t tell - I wonder if because this was built from the ground up using lumen as the lighting system, vs layering it over an existing lighting system because u have to cater to lower specs. The Marvel 1945 game looks even better

 

[Negotiator101]

30fps and sub 1080p? I love 2014 2024

Seriously decided to post this drivel?

 

[XXL]

this is a graphics thread. i want next gen visuals like everyone else seeing as how many of those where is next gen threads we get lately.

Np. I wasn't trying to gotcha you.

Out of curiosity. I'm going to try this out on PC Game Pass and play Persona Reload after. Lol.

 

[DanielG165]

30fps and sub 1080p? I love 2014 2024

It being 2024 is irrelevant. Resources are finite, and when you push a game to a level that HB2 is sitting at, comprises have to be made somewhere in order to achieve that vision. On a console with fixed hardware and limited wattage, the resulting compromises are frame rate and resolution.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Fair enough - to my eyes it looks like a major leap. Obviously the cost is that it’s so limited.

That's fair.

 

[rodrigolfp]

I guess to my eyes it looks more cgi in this than in that AW2 video, maybe it’s not as accurate but I can’t tell - I wonder if because this was built from the ground up using lumen as the lighting system, vs layering it over an existing lighting system because u have to cater to lower specs. The Marvel 1945 game looks even better

More cgi can mean anything. CGIs don't necessarily mean more "real life like" accurate lighting.

 

[cinnamonandgravy]

Nanite+Lumen from small details to big pictures is the real next level here. The night scene noted in the video is the closest thing to a real scene from a real movie

oo thats nice

 

[adamsapple]

oo thats nice

They use Nanite (and Lumen, or hell all of UE5) pretty effectively here.

A couple of other UE5 based 'bigger' games are supposed to come out later this year, STALKER 2 and that SH2 Remake, will be interesting to see how they do comparatively.

 

[NonPhixion]

Seriously decided to post this drivel?

I’m sorry my Xbox One joke upset you. You’ll be okay, Ma’am

 

[SlimySnake]

- Lighting? Other games are at least as good.

- Character models? Sure, Senua is about as good as it gets. But "nothing even close"?

Nonsense.

- Environment? No. Other games have it beat.

- Consistency? It's about as consistent as other top games.

I own and play the game. Its accolodaes are it's close to, or at, the top. But it isn't so far ahead of everything that "nothing comes close" is accurate. Based on you continuing to say "I haven't played those", I would advise to check it out if one is to have this convo proper. All of the games I've highlighted I own.

Depends on where you rank the OG UE5 PS5 demo compared to the DS, Callisto, TLOU, HFW and AW2.

Hellblade does lighting, environment and characters better than any other game out there. some games do come close like alan wake 2, callisto and tlou1 in cutscenes but this game is in a league of its own thanks to nanite, lumen and other UE5 features that were present in the UE5 PS5 demo but missing in every single game released since.

If you are one of those who believe the matrix demo and ue5 demo havent been topped then you believe TLOU1, Callisto, AW2 havent gotten there yet. This game gets us there and then some.

Nanite lets them push more high quality assets than ever before. It is mind boggling how detailed and varied some of these rock textures are. And they dont feel painted on like they do in TLOU and other last gen games. they feel individually modeled.

The lighting is as photorealistic and cg quality as we have seen in a game before. other games like AW2, HFW and callisto have their moments but during very specific lighting scenarios and not as often. this game feels next gen 99% of the time, and legit cg/photorealistic from time to time which is completely missing from those other games.

The water effects both for ocean waves and small streams are ahead of sony's best which is expected considering hfw and tlou were held back by the ps4 hardware. i have chronicled water gifs of both games if you are interested.

And finally, character models. There are times this bitch looks real. TLOU1 and Callisto were the queen and king of character models but they have been topped. Her facial animations are too exaggerated at times so she doesnt look great while talking but any other time, im hard pressed to find flaws and am constantly having to tell my brain that im watching a game instead of a tv show.

Id highly suggest you boot up tlou1, horizon and the other games you mentioned. even if you played them recently, it will become apparent as you switch between these games thanks to lumen, nanite, and the sheer cg quality wizardry on display here by Ninja Theory's artists.

Sony studios maybe more talented but they all tied themselves to last gen hardware or 60 fps modes, we shall see what they come up with at e3, but now the gauntlet has been thrown and Ninja Theory holds the crown. Hopefully this is the kick up the bum most other studios needed.

 

[Senua]

From the footage in the video the series X version holds up very well. The PC version with dlss is definitely sharper though. My 3080 cannot handle native 4k with DLAA well but I did it just to take a look and man the game is just so fucking stunning

 

[Frwrd]

starring greta thunberg