Death Stranding 2: On The Beach - PS5/PS5 Pro - Digital Foundry Tech Review

What's with all the "This is the first game to sell the pro" comments? Did you guys miss the last 6+ months filled with nice upgrades? The pro is worth it (to some of us at least) because it collectively improves a large number of games, some a lot and some less. If you're always judging the merits of upgrading based on a a single game, nobody would ever upgrade their PC either. But they do because the upgrade will improve all games, not just one. Similar deal here.

On topic, If they're using the same upscaling method as forbidden west, image quality on the pro is going to look amazing up close while in motion. Not every upgrade will be transformative, especially when the base version is already good.
 
You have NO idea what you're talking about.

He's not wrong, going by the video and article, the only notable difference is somewhat sharper IQ and less shimmering in mid-field detail.

This is *far* from an upgrade like Rebirth's, if we're comparing.
 
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there are some people that really expected way too much from a Pro console that only adds about 45% more GPU grunt.

I don't think people realise just how small of an upgrade that is.
PSSR is the only way to really make a noticeable difference on that system.

People are only complaining because of the price of the Pro. Its that simple.

Pro is obviously better, but their issue is "its not that much money's-worth better". Which is fair I suppose. Even if you could say that about an awful lot of CPU and GPU upgrades over the years!

The reality is that the whole pitch for Pro support to devs is that it allows for minimal cost-intensive upgrading. Essentially meaning that gains will be relative to how well optimized the base PS5 code is; its not specifically targeting a defined higher level, all it does is guarantee a certain surplus over base.

To give an simple example; You should only expect higher LODs to be used when the base version is using a lower quality than it could, for whatever reason. Not for a higher LODs to be implemented above the previous highest because that would require additional work.

So when people do side-by-sides of PS5 and PS5 Pro screens, they should bear the above in mind.
 
The Decima Engine is beautiful and it's at 60fps!

zOcILvCH6JPZ8swZ.gif
 
DS1




DS1B




DS2




DS2B




DS2C




DS3





DS9


Not only that DS2 is running at higher res on pro, it's got higher texture setting as well as better LODs.

It seems that the pro 60fps performance mode is a match for ps5 30fps quality mode in visual fidelity,

which is what precisely ps5 pro was meant to do, so this is an excellent example of pro enhanced game.
 
Pro quality is higher in res and details.

Pro perf = baseline PS5 Quality.

Might be, the DF article wording makes it seem like it's a small difference between the two PS5's.

There are only minor differences in terms of image quality and graphics settings between the two machines, with the performance mode on PS5 using a 1440p internal resolution and slightly higher than this on PS5 Pro. On the base PS5, fine details often exhibit extra pixel break-up, while the Pro produces slightly cleaner results. You'll also spot some additional distant detail on PS5 Pro, for a more refined presentation overall.
 
Not only that DS2 is running at higher res on pro, it's got higher texture setting as well as better LODs.

It seems that the pro 60fps performance mode is a match for ps5 30fps quality mode in visual fidelity,

which is what precisely ps5 pro was meant to do, so this is an excellent example of pro enhanced game.
It isn't a good upgrade and that's just cope on your part. A slight bump in IQ is not an "excellent" upgrade. What kind of joke is this? If you were trying to sell the Pro to anyone over the PS5, you would NOT use this game.

An excellent upgrade is something that takes advantages of all the Pro has to offer and it shows a clear and visible difference, not a couple of zoomed in shots.
 
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It isn't a good upgrade and that's just cope on your part. A slight bump in IQ is not an "excellent" upgrade. What kind of joke is this? If you were trying to sell the Pro to anyone over the PS5, you would NOT use this game.

An excellent upgrade is something that takes advantages of all the Pro has to offer and it shows a clear and visible difference, not a couple of zoomed in shots.


It's far more than just a slight bump in IQ as you get better textures and LODs on pro.

The pro is basically running 30fps quality mode of PS5 in 60fps, which is what PS5 pro was promised to do but underdelivered.
 
It's far more than just a slight bump in IQ as you get better textures and LODs on pro.
No, it's not "far more". The textures are also the same with the Pro resolving them better since it holds a slightly higher resolution. Even John, who gushes over this game, calls the LOD "slightly improved". Know what would have a been nice upgrade? To improve the mid-field terrain details that are lacking as John points out.

aZTdr4e.jpeg


As far as upgrades go, this is mediocre. Rift Apart, AC Shadows, Callisto Protocol, RE4R, Spider-Man 2, F1 24, GT7, and Stellar Blade, are all much better upgrades. This goes on the list of bare minimums. It's great that the base PS5 version shines, but it's also a shame that the Pro doesn't do much over it. And note, I didn't mention FF7R or Alan Wake 2 because those games look like turds on the base PS5. I used games that are already competent on the base console and are further enhanced with the Pro.
 
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No, it's not "far more". The textures are also the same with the Pro resolving them better since it holds a slightly higher resolution.



DS2B


It's just amazing to see those so called 'pc master race' suddenly become blinded when it comes to a ps5 pro comparison :messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy:

And no, AC shadows is not a great pro upgrade because pr5 pro performance mode is far inferior to the normal PS5 quality mode as it runs at much lower res with hair physics turned off. It certainly didn't deliver 'the quality mode in 60fps' pro premise and that is what I'd call a mediocre upgrade.
 
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DS2B


It's just amazing to see those so called 'pc master race' suddenly become blinded when it comes to a ps5 pro comparison

:messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy:
Same as TLOU Part II. Higher resolution resolves more details. The textures are the same.

XIcpvLZ.png

And no, AC shadows is not a great pro upgrade because pr5 pro performance mode is far inferior to the normal PS5 quality mode as it runs at much lower res with hair physics turned off. It certainly didn't deliver 'the quality mode in 60fps' pro premise and that is what I'd call a mediocre upgrade.
And I completely disagree with this because the game looks like garbage without RTGI.

uTLuihP.jpeg


Are you seriously going to tell me the zoomed in shots you used are more significant than just glancing at the game and knowing you're playing the PS5 version? Come on.
 
No, it's not "far more". The textures are also the same with the Pro resolving them better since it holds a slightly higher resolution. Even John, who gushes over this game, calls the LOD "slightly improved". Know what would have a been nice upgrade? To improve the mid-field terrain details that are lacking as John points out.

aZTdr4e.jpeg


As far as upgrades go, this is mediocre. Rift Apart, AC Shadows, Callisto Protocol, RE4R, Spider-Man 2, F1 24, GT7, and Stellar Blade, are all much better upgrades. This goes on the list of bare minimums. It's great that the base PS5 version shines, but it's also a shame that the Pro doesn't do much over it. And note, I didn't mention FF7R or Alan Wake 2 because those games look like turds on the base PS5. I used games that are already competent on the base console and are further enhanced with the Pro.
But even pro quality mode doesn't improve on those details right? They are likely hitting some ceiling/bottleneck there, either in the engine or the hardware. Overall, yeah, it's a pretty mid upgrade. Looks fantastic though

I hope they add a widescreen mode with fov and resolution increased further. I refuse to play this any other way!
 
And no, AC shadows is not a great pro upgrade because pr5 pro performance mode is far inferior to the normal PS5 quality mode as it runs at much lower res with hair physics turned off. It certainly didn't deliver 'the quality mode in 60fps' pro premise and that is what I'd call a mediocre upgrade.

Pro would have to be 100% more powerful to deliver ACS PS5 quality mode in 60fps. So with ~50% more powerful hardware it's LITERALLY impossible.
 
textures are the same. even digital foundry made this mistake in the past

8:30

they thought xbox one x and ps4 pro were using a "higher resolution texture pack". they were actually wrong. all consoles were using the exact same textures. it was just the higher resolution resolving them better after temporal AA. when PC version released, it turned out all consoles were using the exact same textures.

same story as last of us part 2

another example of how much blurrier AA can impact perceived texture quality,

 
And 60 fps at quality settings? lol

"no difference at all", just double the framerate.

Before Pro released everybody here complained about having to choose between IQ and Frame-Rate

They release a console that solved that

"They look the same, they just doubled the frame-rate"

:messenger_tears_of_joy: :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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DS2B


It's just amazing to see those so called 'pc master race' suddenly become blinded when it comes to a ps5 pro comparison :messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy:

And no, AC shadows is not a great pro upgrade because pr5 pro performance mode is far inferior to the normal PS5 quality mode as it runs at much lower res with hair physics turned off. It certainly didn't deliver 'the quality mode in 60fps' pro premise and that is what I'd call a mediocre upgrade.


Ooooh, some nice upgrades on the comparisons shown on this page. Pro looking to have some upgraded textures / assets perhaps.
 
Before Pro released everybody here complained about having to choose between IQ and Frame-Rate

They release a console that solved that

"They look the same, they just doubled the frame-rate"

:messenger_tears_of_joy: :messenger_tears_of_joy:

That's not at all what most games are doing...

What resolution does DS2 have in quality mode on PS5? What resolution does performance mode have on PS5 Pro? For some reason DF didn't gave us those answers...
 
That's not at all what most games are doing...

What resolution does DS2 have in quality mode on PS5? What resolution does performance mode have on PS5 Pro? For some reason DF didn't gave us those answers...
there's also possibility that ps5 is not fully utilized with its quality mode
especially if it pushes solid 60 FPS with 4K upscaling quality


for example death stranding 1, FSR quality only gives you 25% performance increase. this game could've had a native 4K 40 FPS mode, most likely

of course quality mode would use higher settings but I don't think they would be THAT much demanding
 
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DS2B


It's just amazing to see those so called 'pc master race' suddenly become blinded when it comes to a ps5 pro comparison :messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy:

And no, AC shadows is not a great pro upgrade because pr5 pro performance mode is far inferior to the normal PS5 quality mode as it runs at much lower res with hair physics turned off. It certainly didn't deliver 'the quality mode in 60fps' pro premise and that is what I'd call a mediocre upgrade.
I beg to disagree. In all honesty I preferred 60 fps mode over any other mode in AC Shadows. Hair physics in gameplay aren't that big deal, not sure why people are so obsessed about it. And PSSR is so good there, the quality mode setting aren't that worthy upgrade to prefer over 60 fps mode.
 
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Same as TLOU Part II. Higher resolution resolves more details. The textures are the same.

XIcpvLZ.png


And I completely disagree with this because the game looks like garbage without RTGI.

uTLuihP.jpeg


Are you seriously going to tell me the zoomed in shots you used are more significant than just glancing at the game and knowing you're playing the PS5 version? Come on.

The difference in TLOU comes from the TAA blur vs sharpness of PSSR at motion, so it's not just the textures but the overall image clarity that is vastly superior on pro.




DS2B


On DS2, entire normal map of leather texture had just disappeared on ps5




DS2C


texture quality just don't parallel with the image clarity as it's so much blurrier.

Just look at the text , do you seriously believe that it's caused by just a 'slight' res bump?





DS4


and it is clearly visible without any zoom





DS5


hell it's even visible at quarter res :messenger_tears_of_joy:


As for AC shadows, I stand with my point. ps5 pro supposed to run ps5 quality mode 60fps which AC shadows failed to do.

So I see it as a disappointment.

Maybe AC shadows has much smaller head room than DS2, so that it couldn't do the quality in 60fps as DS2 does, but that's not my problem.
 
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The difference in TLOU comes from the TAA blur vs sharpness of PSSR at motion, so it's not just the textures but the overall image clarity is vastly higher on pro.




DS2B


On DS2, entire normal map of leather texture had just disappeared on ps5




DS2C


texture quality just don't parallel with the image clarity as it's so much blurrier.

Just look at the text , do you seriously believe that it's caused by just a 'slight' res bump?





DS4


and it is clearly visible without any zoom





DS5


hell it's even clearly visible at quarter res :messenger_tears_of_joy:


As for AC shadows, I stand with my point. ps5 pro supposed to run ps5 quality mode 60fps which AC shadows failed to do.

So I see it as a disappointment.

Maybe AC shadows has much less head room than DS2, so that it couldn't do the quality in 60fps as DS2 does, but it's not problem.
ac shadows is quite demanding on pc.
It's running 40fps with rtgi on pro. that's a good result. And pssr is very clean
 
No ultra wide mode with the black bars?
Apparently not, which is kind of a bummer. Just playing Indy letterboxed (well, for a little under an hour now, then DS2 it is), and even if the settings/IQ/framerate would be identical (I don't know, haven't tried it otherwise), it feels appropriate for the game. Would feel appropriate for DS2 as well. I guess we'll have to wait for the inevitable Director's Cut.
 
The difference in TLOU comes from the TAA blur vs sharpness of PSSR at motion, so it's not just the textures but the overall image clarity that is vastly higher on pro.




DS2B


On DS2, entire normal map of leather texture had just disappeared on ps5




DS2C


texture quality just don't parallel with the image clarity as it's so much blurrier.

Just look at the text , do you seriously believe that it's caused by just a 'slight' res bump?





DS4


and it is clearly visible without any zoom





DS5


hell it's even clearly visible at quarter res :messenger_tears_of_joy:


As for AC shadows, I stand with my point. ps5 pro supposed to run ps5 quality mode 60fps which AC shadows failed to do.

So I see it as a disappointment.

Maybe AC shadows has much less head room than DS2, so that it couldn't do the quality in 60fps as DS2 does, but it's not problem.
I wouldn't take Cerny words literally... expect the same identical setting of quality mode of ps5 base at 60 fps on ps5 pro not seems realistic to me. I don't know any game who did it. If I remember right, Cerny said something about blurred the line between 60 fps and 30 fps quality mode on ps5 pro which means something closer not the exact same setting if I can say. And AC Shadows achieve it in a very appreciable way (I own it).
 
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I wouldn't take Cerny worlds literally... expect the same identical setting of quality mode of ps5 base at 60 fps on ps5 pro not seems realistic to me. I don't know any game who did it. Cerny said something about blurred the line between 60 fps and 30 fps quality mode on ps5 pro which means something closer not the exact same setting if I can say.

But that's what DS2 delivers so I think it's an excellent pro upgrade :messenger_winking:
 
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The difference in TLOU comes from the TAA blur vs sharpness of PSSR at motion, so it's not just the textures but the overall image clarity that is vastly superior on pro.
You mean like this?

dCUok9a.png


TAAU/FSR are known to destroy texture details and completely make parts of them disappear, especially at lower resolutions. Furthermore, has this ever been a thing in any game for the Pro to have higher resolution textures? I don't think this has ever happened.
As for AC shadows, I stand with my point. ps5 pro supposed to run ps5 quality mode 60fps which AC shadows failed to do.
Those words Cerny said aren't gospel, nor a slogan. He stated that one of the objectives was to remove the choice or at least remove the divide, so I don't see why you guys keep bringing this up, especially when it's entirely dependent upon the difference between the quality and performance mode on the base PS5 anyway. In some instances like in FF7R, the quality difference is enormous. In other games like DS2, the main different is really just IQ, but the performance mode still has good IQ anyway. As a result, the Pro performance mode won't be a massive improvement over even the PS5 performance mode, since the latter is good anyway.
So I see it as a disappointment.

Maybe AC shadows has much smaller head room than DS2, so that it couldn't do the quality in 60fps as DS2 does, but that's not my problem.
Tell me this, if you had a regular PS5 and PS5 Pro and was allowed to pick only ONE game for each (ACS or DS2), what would the combination be?
 
You mean like this?



TAAU/FSR are known to destroy texture details and completely make parts of them disappear, especially at lower resolutions. Furthermore, has this ever been a thing in any game for the Pro to have higher resolution textures? I don't think this has ever happened.
and why should that happen anyways? especially on the main character textures. ps5 pro literally only has 1 GB more memory. that's 12.5 GB budget versus 13.5 GB budget. these people mean to tell me that ps5 is so vram limited that it has to use lesser quality textures on the literal main character? it makes no sense. i do not see this kind of a difference on main characters with 7 GB buffer in games that are optimized for 10 or 12.5 GB buffer. when a system is VRAM limited, most games are smart and often start reducing texture quality on things that are in the distance. and no one can convince me PS5 is VRAM limited in this game anyways
 
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and why should that happen anyways? especially on the main character textures. ps5 pro literally only has 1 GB more memory. that's 12.5 GB budget versus 13.5 GB budget. these people mean to tell me that ps5 is so vram limited that it has to use lesser quality textures on the literal main character? it makes no sense. i do not see this kind of a difference on main characters with 7 GB buffer in games that are optimized for 10 GB buffer. when a system is VRAM limited, most games are smart and often start reducing texture quality on things that are in the distance. and no one can convince me PS5 is VRAM limited in this game anyways
Probably because base ps5 can't handle steady 60 fps with more higher res texture? Where is the crazyness? It has also less bandwith.
 
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It would be DS2 on pro of course, as I'd rather take one definitive experience over 2 half assed ones :messenger_winking:
So DS2 on the Pro and ACS on the regular PS5. In that situation, you'd be stuck with ACS at 30fps or in Performance Mode, which looks way worse than Quality Mode. Or you could get DS2 on PS5 that still looks great, and ACS with RTGI and 60fps that looks MUCH better than the Performance Mode on regular PS5.

The gap between ACS Performance Mode on Pro vs base PS5 is much larger than the gap between DS2 Performance Mode on Pro vs base PS5.

Probably because base ps5 can't handle steady 60 fps with more higher res texture? Where is the crazyness?
And why couldn't it handle higher textures at a steady 60fps unless its VRAM started running out?
 
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So DS2 on the Pro and ACS on the regular PS5. In that situation, you'd be stuck with ACS at 30fps or in Performance Mode, which looks way worse than Quality Mode. Or you could get DS2 on PS5 that still looks great, and ACS with RTGI and 60fps that looks MUCH better than the Performance Mode on regular PS5.

The gap between ACS Performance Mode on Pro vs base PS5 is much larger than the gap between DS2 Performance Mode on Pro vs base PS5.


And why couldn't it handle higher textures at a steady 60fps unless its VRAM started running out?
You know how work the engine? More bandwidth and RAM could allow of some graphic setting upgrade. Just depending of the engine.
 
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I don't see much difference between the Pro and base versions. I'll probably play on quality mode on the Pro.
 
You know how work the engine?
Do you?
More bandwidth and RAM could allow of some graphic setting upgrade. Just depending of the engine.
Sure, but this has never been a thing for texture quality. A system with a larger frame buffer will allow for better textures than a system with a lower frame buffer but more bandwidth. Your only bottleneck when it comes to texture quality/resolution is the amount of VRAM available. Bandwidth can make a difference, but it would have to be like 2 generational gaps, say GDDR5 vs GDDR7 or even more.
 
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