SirTerry-T
Member
You realise it takes more geo to make a rounded rock than a squarish one, right?
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[Digital Foundry] Senua's Saga: Hellblade 2 - DF Tech Review - The Next Level in Real-Time Visuals
- Thread starter Lunatic_Gamer
- Start date
- Analysis Review Platform
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
The screens space part disappears when out of camera. So games with full RT reflections wins.
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Chiggs
Gold Member
As someone who has openly trashed Microsoft since at least 2020 for the damage they've done to their brand and their boneheaded decision-making, I hope this post comes across as about as reasonable as a post like this can get on this message board.
Sony Bros, seriously...give it a rest. Your console is the best and you're still completely dominant. You have all the best games, period.
Okay? Really, the sheer brittleness and sensitivity you're showing over a single game that will ONLY be regarded for its graphics and art design, is deranged....and embarrassing.
Sony Bros, seriously...give it a rest. Your console is the best and you're still completely dominant. You have all the best games, period.
Okay? Really, the sheer brittleness and sensitivity you're showing over a single game that will ONLY be regarded for its graphics and art design, is deranged....and embarrassing.
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DanielG165
Member
It’s unbecoming and weird lol.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
What exactly are you getting at?You realise it takes more geo to make a rounded rock than a squarish one, right?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
'Flight Sim sacrifices by not having alternate costumes for Boeing Max 737's'
Connxtion
Member
Yup you can see it at work if you zoom into foliage in the distance, all leaves turn to triangles
they don’t update the geometry when zooming in (FOV) in photomode.
Connxtion
Member
Here is the thing, it’s all subjective.
People will think a NASCAR game for example has no gameplay or lack off, as all you do is go round in a circles (oval) over and over and over.
This game isn’t about free roaming, running about hacking up everything you see. It’s walking simulator, with a bit of combat & easy puzzles. From the perspective of a person with psychosis & how she sees the word round her.
I enjoy the game & I can’t stand NASCAR games as they are boring to me. Even Forza horizon is boring to me. (Am not a big fan of driving games
)You see my point?
So basing your assumptions off of some people’s/your opinions doesn’t mean it’s fact. If you don’t enjoy the games that cool, but don’t try and piss all over it over and over because it’s not what you like. (You don’t need to be other people’s voices either.)
Anyways am off to take a stroll, fight some demons in my head, hack some folks made of shards to death and take some cool photos in photomode.
Edit: Fixed a typo.
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Mr Moose
Member
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
thats odd. they removed the lumen reflections in series s, why would they do this in the caves that arent even that heavy on the GPU. i get a steady 60 fps in there with room to spare where as i drop to 30-40 fps routinely while outdoors.Not in the caves. They look bad.
Don't expect this as the norm, HB2 is a tiny walking sim. That's why the visuals are cranked up. This won't be the norm this gen on AAA games.
Balducci30
Member
Yeah I’m not sure if Hellblade uses the new version of the engine so it may not be doing that. But basically at this point they’re trying to make it so you can nanite everything on screenFrom Epic's own dev site:
Nanite Virtualized Geometry In Unreal Engine | Unreal Engine 5.0 Documentation | Epic Developer Community
Overview of Unreal Engine 5's virtualized geometry system to achieve pixel scale detail and high object counts.dev.epicgames.com
============
My mistake. It seems you're right. It has come a long way since last I was in the loop.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
Indeed. On top of that, tech demo quality is rarely seen at the start of a gen. Getting there was always going to be a tall order and even Hellblade, doesn’t quite get there (though it’s headed in the right direction).
That said, I have no doubt that plenty of games will top Hellblade as the gen progresses because it isn’t so far out of reach that other studios won’t achieve it, especially if they focus on 30fps.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
Balducci30
Member
I think foliage was 5.2? Or 5.3? And then they’re trying to do nanite skeletal meshes for 5.5? 5.0 didn’t even have tessellation from my understanding. I would also be curious to see what version it’s on, they apparently have gotten the engine to run 2x faster in the newer version comparatively. So there’s a chance we get a game that looks even better and has real gameplay
EDIT: someone actually already figured it out, it’s using 5.3 but not all the features of 5.3 (perhaps not using nanite on smaller objects/foliage)
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GymWolf
Gold Member
Rocks have the same problem of robocop rocks from what i saw, they look incredible but the more you get close and zoom, the more mushy they become.I'm about halfway through and I have to agree it's the most CG-like presentation I've seen in 5+ years (the next closest thing was Detroit - and this eclipses it in every way, as it should).
The first 50 minutes are practically immaculate - and also without looking 'gamey' - you can practically count $s on every frame
But - I'll just leave this here because what good would a Gaf thread be with only praise
It doesn't need photo mode and it's not just tree branches - rocks look like this up close (this is PC version maxed out for anyone wondering):
That said - this is a 3rd person camera game designed to look good in that view - it's not meant to hold up at FPS angles.
At least this is not a first person game like robocop so it's less noticeable.
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Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
GymWolf
Gold Member
What game has more detailed environment?- Lighting? Other games are at least as good.
- Character models? Sure, Senua is about as good as it gets. But "nothing even close"?
Nonsense.
- Environment? No. Other games have it beat.
- Consistency? It's about as consistent as other top games.
I own and play the game. Its accolodaes are it's close to, or at, the top. But it isn't so far ahead of everything that "nothing comes close" is accurate. Based on you continuing to say "I haven't played those", I would advise to check it out if one is to have this convo proper. All of the games I'voine highlighted I own.
Best i can think on top of my head are the robo cantina in rift apart, the city of aw2, some cherry picked shot of path traced cyberpunk, some cherry picked shot of forbidden west, some cherry picked shot of plague tale 2, some parts of avatar, some parts of demons remake but none of this look as detailed a hb2 i think??!
But i haven't played hb2 and probably never going to do that so i'm just judgying from pics and yt.
I'm with you on the characters, the callisto dude face looks even more real than senua and we had incredible character models in the past years so even if senua is a bit better, it's definitely not a gen ahead.
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HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
Forbidden West and Demon’s Souls have crisper ground and/or rock textures, and the former has a better sky map and water.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Come on....
Senua
Member
Clouds yes, everything else no
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
Comparison shots of ground and rock textures + water from the two games if that’s the case.
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Fbh
Gold Member
Visually it looks amazing, easily the best looking game this gen so far.
On the downside though now we'll have to listen to people whine about all upcoming AAA games that don't look as good despite having a lot more going on in every other area.
I can already see the "why does this open world game with tons of enemies, locations and mechanics not look as good as this linear 6 hours long, 30fps walking simulator with black bars"
On the downside though now we'll have to listen to people whine about all upcoming AAA games that don't look as good despite having a lot more going on in every other area.
I can already see the "why does this open world game with tons of enemies, locations and mechanics not look as good as this linear 6 hours long, 30fps walking simulator with black bars"
GymWolf
Gold Member
I edited my previous post but mmm...no?
And i'm the biggest fan of forbidden west graphic in the entire forum.
I can see an argument for water or clouds but i don't see one for rocks and ground textures.
And i had a third run with the game maxed out on pc at 4k...
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
You're the one in a digital foundry thread where they say its the most impressive visuals yet and provide reasons.
I think it's you who needs to provide receipts comparing both games as you don't agree with them.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
So, perhaps a few screenshot comparisons in regard to these elements? I get the gate keeping as this game’s overall makeup is one of a kind, but that doesn’t mean it’s not without minor visual shortcomings.
To me, the environmental textures, sky, and water aren’t the best out there. If that’s a point of contention, coolbeans!
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Jibran#one
Member
So flight Sim on consoles is dethroned as best looking game ?
I know graphics are subjective but flight Sims graphics always blew me away on series x
I know graphics are subjective but flight Sims graphics always blew me away on series x
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
In case anyone wants a link.
|OT| - Exclusive Horizon Forbidden West Photo Mode Thread. Lets take Sexy Beautiful Pics. PS4|PS5
As the title says. You can post your Sexy ass photos, exclusively for Horizon Forbidden West. please tag the console that you are taking from. Let the fun begin.. On ps5. Edit: sry i forgot the console tag.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Until Flight Sim '24 comes out probably, no idea how much improvements they can make there for a game that already uses real life satellite data.
Moses85
Member
Yes, because it always looked boring.Gaf the first three years of this Gen when dev after dev sacrificed visuals: why do games still look like ps4 era games?
Gaf when a next Gen game finally arrives:
GymWolf
Gold Member
I prefer to take my pics from the purple asylum, their lack of gender identity make their pics pretty fucking good.In case anyone wants a link.
|OT| - Exclusive Horizon Forbidden West Photo Mode Thread. Lets take Sexy Beautiful Pics. PS4|PS5
As the title says. You can post your Sexy ass photos, exclusively for Horizon Forbidden West. please tag the console that you are taking from. Let the fun begin.. On ps5. Edit: sry i forgot the console tag.www.neogaf.com
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GymWolf
Gold Member
Never said that the game is perfect, in the post i wrote before quoting you i literally said that the rocks lose details the more you zoom like robocop, and i'm not a fan of the digital acting, and the hairs use the same tech as horizon so even inferior to fucking fifa games
But even as a huge fan of FW graphic, i think hb2 looks noticeably better, as it should be because one is a gigantic crossgen open world game with a lot of shit on screen and the other is a fully nextgen 5 hours, small, stricted, scripted experience, the comparison is the quintessential arnie.noshit.gif.
Guerrilla are wizards but you can only squeeze these cheap boxes to a certain degree with an open world game.
We can do a pic comparison if you want but maybe this is not the right topic, you can come in the graphical fidelity topic where we do this stuff all the time.
Radical_3d
Member
ManaByte
Banned
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HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Ass of Can Whooping
Gold Member
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Not at all, not even remotely. You may see some rock with a less defined texture here or there, but in general the detail, variety and finish is another level compared to Robocop. The best thing is that each area uses different types and models. There's a photo mode where you can zoom in more extreme and still maintain fidelity amazingly.
some more
GymWolf
Gold Member
first, that is not the level of zoom i'm talking about, the first pic get close but not quite as close as i was talking about, at that distance robocop rocks also looks as good as the ue5 demo or slightly worse, you can find my pics in the graphical fidelity topic, but if you played the game you already know that.Not at all, not even remotely. You may see some rock with a less defined texture here or there, but in general the detail, variety and finish is another level compared to Robocop. The best thing is that each area uses different types and models. There's a photo mode where you can zoom in more extreme and still maintain fidelity amazingly.
some more
second, you posted this pic in the first page, can't you really notice how the rocks looks mushy and there is less granular detail? they look way smoother than when you are at a distance, in real life rocks don't lose microdetails because you look at them from up close.
Dude i just finished defending the game in this very page, but the game is clearly not perfect yet, devs are not gonna burn all the the rendering budget to make rocks uberdetailed even when you are 20 cm from them, especially in a third person game.
If you can't notice the difference in rock detail from a mid distance compared to your pic then we have different meaning of the words "retaining all the details" because in your pics, the rocks on the ground are clearly mushier and less defined, at least for me, this is the physical limit of these hardwares and rocks are uberdifficult to nail from up close, other material are easier to achieve.
Maybe it doesn't happen with all the rocks, but with some it certaintly appear to be the case.
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TxKnight7
Member
- Lighting? Other games are at least as good.
- Character models? Sure, Senua is about as good as it gets. But "nothing even close"?
Nonsense.
- Environment? No. Other games have it beat.
- Consistency? It's about as consistent as other top games.
I own and play the game. Its accolodaes are it's close to, or at, the top. But it isn't so far ahead of everything that "nothing comes close" is accurate. Based on you continuing to say "I haven't played those", I would advise to check it out if one is to have this convo proper. All of the games I've highlighted I own.
Radical_3d
Member
You’ll never find a bigger Hennig stand than me, but I wouldn’t place my bets on the interactivity of this one.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
Yeeep, looks good. Never said otherwise.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
I never said anything about the rocks vs Robocop.Never said that the game is perfect, in the post i wrote before quoting you i literally said that the rocks lose details the more you zoom like robocop, and i'm not a fan of the digital acting, and the hairs use the same tech as horizon so even inferior to fucking fifa games
But even as a huge fan of FW graphic, i think hb2 looks noticeably better, as it should be because one is a gigantic crossgen open world game with a lot of shit on screen and the other is a fully nextgen 5 hours, small, stricted, scripted experience, the comparison is the quintessential arnie.noshit.gif.
Guerrilla are wizards but you can only squeeze these cheap boxes to a certain degree with an open world game.
We can do a pic comparison if you want but maybe this is not the right topic, you can come in the graphical fidelity topic where we do this stuff all the time.
My friend, I was only responding to your opinion that HB2 has the same problem and the same degree of Nanite in rocks as in Robocop. Having played both games, of course, my opinion is different. The level of texturing and fidelity is higher as well as the variety. Sure, it's not perfect at 400% zoom, but it's extraordinarily well done, to the point that there's nothing that comes close to it. Perhaps in the future more will be reached, of course
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GymWolf
Gold Member
It was to show you that i'm open to the idea that the game is not perfect, but it remain the closest thing to perfection we have today.I never said anything about the rocks vs Robocop.
I can only think about the rift apart robot cantina having the same level of perfection but the pixar style is naturally less detailed than the photorealistic style of hb2 so it's easier to achieve and the rest of rift apart is very uneven.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Never said otherwise, the game is the best looking game out there, cyberpunk may have pathtracing but for my taste, hb2 looks much better because i'm more of a texture whore than an rtx nutjob.
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Connxtion
Member
The first giant, if you enter photomode she has a big gap around her neck area. Game broken!
Serious note, yeah. Up close they turn to blurred textures for smaller detailed items. Same with zooming into the distance of any of the areas.
But you really need to zoom in
, the focus also goes out of whack when FOV (zoom) is max (lowest) need to be further away to get it to focus which defeats the point of zooming in 
Edit: why did I get a male sign added when I added an emoji?
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HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
As a student of game development, I can tell you there is no such thing as a perfect nor near perfect game. They all use tricks and climb hoops to make work what they make work. Even the visuals aren't near perfect. Plenty of flaws when you get underneath.
That said, I also didn't say that anyone said it was, just that, there's nothing wrong with admitting it has flaws. But really, I get where you are coming from overall, so I'm not meaning that to be a jerk or anything.
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