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[NervousXtian]

Are you guys serious? You want me to box up my 25-pound PS3 and carry it somewhere on the subway? You want kids to have to lug those behemoths when visiting friends down the street? We're talking about consoles, not little handhelds that you can toss in a backpack. Carrying these giant consoles to other people's homes is absolutely ludicrous.

Kids these days, they just don't appreciate the shit we put up with back in the day.

How about boxing a mid-tower PC, CRT monitor, keyboard, and speakers to take to a friends house to play LAN games? We did that at least once a month for years.

Completely untrue and my library of 200+ games on Steam back me up on that point.



Just because they are a minority doesn't mean they don't matter. Like I said before Microsoft opened to the casuals to open their demographic, closing to internet only will only close the demographic.

How many of those were $50 games marked down sub-$10 just for Steam sales? I have a similar Steam library made of up from various damn there give-away priced old games, humble bundles, Amazon give away deals, etc. I also got games I paid full price for, or almost full price when they came out.

I bought Sleeping Dogs for 5 dollars this christmas.

Well, considering how hard that game bombed, and they were damn there giving it away already on consoles.. yeah.. there's exceptions.. but Steam isn't bargain mart most of the time... not even close.

 

[CaptNink]

Welp, thanks for the last 10 years Microsoft. It's been a slice.

Can someone on the Sony boat send me over a life-raft?

 

[-PXG-]

Anyone even attempting to compare this to Steam automatically doesn't know what the fuck they're talking about. These measures are purely anti consumer and a means to tell you that you can't use software you bought, when you want.

Offline mode. Sales.

Bam.

Do you honestly think MS would implement an offline mode, a la Steam? Do you honestly think that console publishers and GoD will have frequent sales and drop prices of their games to reasonable levels within reasonable time frames? Come on....

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

Technically if the console is always on, they do not have to block used games. They could just ask the second owner to pay a fee in order to activate the game on their end. This is more likely what is going to happen than "You are the second owner of this game, you are not allowed to play it. Die."

Some of this fee will go to the console manufacturer, some will go to the publisher, and finally whatever is left will go to the dev. I expect the amount you have to pay decline at consistent rate: <6 months after release full price, <1yr $50, <2yr $30, <3yr $15, <4yr $10, <5yr $5. Those prices would the cost for a second user to access the game (on top of whatever you payed to get the used copy). It is not pretty but it is the future we are facing.

This will probably reduce used games sales and used games prices (consumers will not go the used route if it becomes less cost efficient than new). This will also MURDER Gamestop's stock. The worst part is we will likely still see day 1 DLC, season passes, and other stupid shit on top of this.

As someone said below, to solve the "Going over to a friends house" problem, if you sign in, you can use the disc you bought on another console. This is a logical solution.

It's down today on this news; came across on alerts on my terminal here at work:

 

[Aquamarine]

So patents are less reliable than an edge article citing rumors?

Kay

Sony makes a lot of stupid patents all the time. EDGE doesn't usually present rumors as news and claim it has "multiple sources" verifying this.

 

[Roo]

I highly HIGHLY doubt this is true but whatever guys

 

[Kev Kev]

So how many of you will buy a nintendo console if both sony and microsoft implement these policies?

Would the surge in return to nintendo by core gamers cause a surge in third party support?

Without hesitation.

However, I believe Sony and MS will be fine if they go through with it. I just won't be one of those people that buys their console day one.

 

[gaming_noob]

All these negative rumours have come at an interesting time, eh?

And Sony just hired a new advertising agency. This is all adding up.

 

[Dahbomb]

Prepare yourselves...

A shitstorm is brewing.

Can't wait to get disconnected from my SINGLE PLAYER DEVIL MAY CRY 5 GAME WHILE I PLAY AS VERGIL!

 

[Baconsammy]

I wonder if Sony or Microsoft could include an always-on 3G chip like they use in Kindles for the sole purpose of verifying licenses. Thus negating the need to always be on Wifi to play/activate one's games.

Regardless, not having the ability to sell/trade games will impact my buying decision greatly. Maybe not the console, but definitely the number of titles I buy for those consoles.

Anyone even attempting to compare this to Steam automatically didn't know what the fuck they're talking about.

Offline mode. Sales.

Bam.

Do you honestly think MS would implement an offline mode, a la Steam? Do you honestly think that console publishers and GoD will have frequent sales and drop prices of their games to reasonable levels within reasonable time frames? Come on....

If there's no used game market, hell yes I believe they will. If they don't, they might as well just shut down now.

 

[Foffy]

Dev from Twisted Pixel



https://twitter.com/deliciousbees/status/299186799656443905

He's not denying it, is he..?

 

[Glorified G]

So patents are less reliable than an edge article citing rumors?

Kay

Hundreds of patents are files that are never used.

So yes.

And Sony just hired a new advertising agency. This is all adding up.

ok, i laughed

 

[lupinko]

EDGE partnership with Sony....confirmed?

Sony first party games still get 6/10 from EDGE confirmed. j/k lol

 

[Alienous]

Are they allowed to confirm or deny rumors based on an as yet unannounced console?

When it potentially means that customers will continue to spread the rumours, and tout the PS4 as superior, it is in Microsoft's interests to release a firm "These leaks are not true".

But they haven't.

 

[Duxxy3]

gamestop is already on a downward path at the moment something like this would be a nail in the coffin.

They would be dead if both sony and microsoft did this. If it's just microsoft doing it i could see them dump microsoft.

 

[Tyrone_Biggums]

Anyone even attempting to compare this to Steam automatically didn't know what the fuck they're talking about.

Offline mode. Sales.

Bam.

Do you honestly think MS would implement an offline mode, a la Steam? Do you honestly think that console publishers and GoD will have frequent sales and drop prices of their games to reasonable levels within reasonable time frames? Come on....

How can you definitively say they won't have offline mode? You can't even verify with certainty that 'always online' is even a feature as the console hasn't even been officially announced. You're making claims on hearsay and rumor.

 

[mattp]

someone in another thread brought up the fact that movies have a theatrical run where you essentially have to "buy" the movie "new" since you can only see it in theaters

what if game publishers did something similar? hardcode a 6 month expiration date into the game's code so the "forced online, no used games" check stops after 6 months
edit: the date check would have to be via NTP servers so you couldn't just change your console's clock

 

[Earendil]

I pray to God, Zeus, Baby Jesus, Allah, Elohim, Ishvara, Q, The Atlantians, Timelords, Vorlons, the Combine, the Forerunners and the Lords of Kobol that Sony wins this generation.

MS and Nintendo are on some bullshit right now.

Incidentally, as I read this, I have the theme to Dr. Who playing in the background.

Kids these days, they just don't appreciate the shit we put up with back in the day.

How about boxing a mid-tower PC, CRT monitor, keyboard, and speakers to take to a friends house to play LAN games? We did that at least once a month for years.

My monitor was soooo damn heavy. Glad I don't do that crap anymore, my back can't handle it.

 

[Aquamarine]

He's not denying it, is he..?

It would be more like "I can't believe these stupid rumors even exist," if he was actually denying it.

 

[Baron_Calamity]

So how many of you will buy a nintendo console if both sony and microsoft implement these policies?

Would the surge in return to nintendo by core gamers cause a surge in third party support?

I wouldn't. Just lean more on PC and ios games.

 

[Hindle]

The dev all but confirms this is false. Most likely a smear from Sony.

 

[scar tissue]

As with all rumors, sometimes what you get are half-truths. Using simple logic...

-Blu-ray is in.

-Kinect 2.0 will be ready at launch or soon thereafter but not as a pack-in with the base SKU. Maybe with a premium SKU.

-"Always online" simply means that the online only features, which will be more prominent next gen, won't be available so users will be missing out w/out an internet connection. Still, games *will work* w/out a connection.

-Will ps4/720 have bar code readers built in and non-used capabilities built in? probably, *but* I think they will leave it up to publishers on how to utilize it. Most likely we will see online passes linked to new discs, with a fee for used purchasers just like it is now. Neither company will dare make it mandatory. That will happen the following gen when things go 95% digital download.

Calm. down.

Yeah, online passes will probably become mandatory for all games. Sucks but I don't value the online MP of most games anyway, and if I do, I'm buying them new, day 1 to experience the community.
Locking the single player of a game to a console/account is kinda unlikely. But then again, big corporations are always looking for new ways to screw the consumer. I wouldn't say it's totally impossible that it will happen.

 

[OmnipotentO]

I would be okay with blocking used games if it was more like Steam where we have a huge variety of price points to choose from. Price ranges like crazy so even if it is DRM and you can't re-sell your games you can put up with it a little better because it only cost you anywhere from $0.50 - $20.

So guys trying to damage control by comparing it to Steam, stop. It's not even close to the same thing.

 

[KungFucius]

Gaming isn't a human right, its a voluntary hobby you participate in. Companies do not owe you anything and nobody is taking advantage of you.

This is BS. Companies should meet their customers needs and desires and not have to remove features that customers are used to just to continue to meet shareholders' demand for growth. As a customer we all have the right and the duty to bitch and moan at the huge companies that make these decisions because it effects the way we use the product. When there are only 2 choices and they both due the same thing, then they are taking advantage of their power to collude. All business is basically changing from providing the customer the best experience possible, to finding ways to extract more and more money from them by removing any alternatives. This is not a free market, its a controlled market where companies copy each-other rather than compete. In the case of used games this policy directly impacts consumers who resell old games in order to get funds to buy new games. The hope is that it keeps more money in their ecosystem but it will reduce jobs at Gamestop and it will make a large number of people unwilling to try new games that are not AAA must-haves because they lost a large chunk of value. I think this will really hurt teenage-college gamers that do not have rich parents to pay for their hobby. Why shouldn't these people be upset by this? And if they wait for the price drop, it also is bad for the industry because new games will sell less and slow initial sales are often tied to studio closures.

 

[Snapshot King]

I'm curious if Nextgen will be the end of piracy. With 50GB blurays becoming the norm, I don't think rapidshare and bittorrent will be popular any more. Add the price of a bluray writer plus blank blurays, and I think most cheap people will resort to waiting for the bargain bin again.

If these rumours are true I can honestly the drive to piracy being stronger than its ever been, and if and when it pops off it will EXPLODE.

 

[So Many Bullets]

Gaming isn't a human right, its a voluntary hobby you participate in. Companies do not owe you anything and nobody is taking advantage of you.

Really, man?

Yes, and I am choosing not to participate with this upcoming console. Gamers as a group of consumers/customers, however you want to word it, are continually lied to, misled, and generally taken advantage of all in the name of profit (greed). We have no one's ear when it comes to our well being as consumers.

When was the last time Toyota released a 60% complete car?
When's the last time Toyota told you, you can't sell your Camry to your neighbor? Or even hand it over to your kid so they can use it?
If you buy a Samsung Fridge, guess what? It's gonna keep your food cold and make ice cubes?

When you are buying games in this day and age, unless you are like us and follow these things from beginning to end, you are rolling the dice with your $50 - $60. This very forum is full of examples.

Now for a company to try and eliminate a secondary market, is great strategy for them and will most likely pay off. It is shitty for us. It restricts choices and puts us at the mercy of these companies. If we choose to participate.

You may want to reevaluate your perspective. Unless of course, you stand to gain from this, then by all means monetize and DRM all the things.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

The dev all but confirms this is false. Most likely a smear from Sony.

LOL?

 

[sh4mike]

Perhaps just an online check at bootup, similar to how the disk spins during bootup on 360 even when fully installed.

 

[hlhbk]

If both Sony and Microsoft do this I will not be getting the next gen consoles and sticking to PC only.

 

[Plinko]

Are they allowed to confirm or deny rumors based on an as yet unannounced console?

No, but devs and Microsoft themselves could instantly contact EDGE as a "source" and shoot down the rumor. EDGE would instantly post that on its website.

 

[Huff]

The dev all but confirms this is false. Most likely a smear from Sony.

err no he doesnt

 

[AndrewDean84xX]

If true, I will skip the xbox. If sony follows suit, I will skip it as well and go Wii U/PC/3DS/Vita.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

Sony makes a lot of stupid patents all the time. EDGE doesn't usually present rumors as news and claim it has "multiple sources" verifying this.

Well and nobody is saying Sony is for sure not going to. As others have said if anything I don't see either one doing it unless they both are. If that's the case both will be hurting like hell. I have no doubt at all of that. Both will also sure as hell not be bought by me. I will not buy any console that has required always on net and anti used games tech. Hell I don't even support the online passes except one time. That was Twisted metal on PS3. Other then that one game I've held true and refused to buy any game with an online pass.

 

[DEADEVIL]

Edge just took their first shot at trying to gain some of that kotaku marketshare, but it will clearly be proven false in the future.

MS is not going to give up the Goodwill of Gamestop in the US just to try to gain more revenue on games.

Gamestop wouldnt even stock the Next Xbox if they knew that it was the only console blocking used games.

We all know what's going to happen when the Next Xbox is revealed. It'll be like the 360 in that there will be an authentication for games to be connected to Live.

Offline gaming and used games will be completely undettered, but I bet MS included away to make it easier to detect and implement the Next gen Ban Hammer bait.

It's going to be fun around here when the official info is released.

 

[Takuya]

Dev from Twisted Pixel

https://twitter.com/deliciousbees/status/299186799656443905

I also like the X-Files.

Confirmation? =P

 

[jetsetfluken]

Edit: New page

 

[BobTheFork]

How fucking dare all of you draw your opinion from the only piece of information we have!
If it's not true then MS needs to get in front of it soon. Of course it's not like they will make this shit a bullet point if it's true, it will just be found out.

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

I highly HIGHLY doubt this is true but whatever guys

EDGE sounds pretty confident about it. This isn't reported with ass-covering question marks in the headline, or vague allusions to "rumblings" or "rumors". They don't even use the word "rumor". They have sources and are reporting it.

They could be getting bad information but this will require some serious walking back on EDGE's part if it turns out to not be true.

 

[phisheep]

Never understood why people are so against this. Always online is not a problem whatsoever in this day and age. I don't think my Internet connection has gone off in like 2 years. No second-hand games, well Steam has been doing it for years.

Maybe if you're at home. Maybe if your internet is reliable.

But consider this scenario. A few years back I spent a week in a remote converted chapel in Derbyshire. Took my console with me and a bunch of favourite games of course. Was there any internet there? Was there fuck.

So - you can't take your console on holiday/business with you huh?

Doesn't sound good to me.

 

[Plinko]

The dev all but confirms this is false. Most likely a smear from Sony.

Please explain how that is a denial.

 

[abadguy]

When it potentially means that customers will continue to spread the rumours, and tout the PS4 as superior, it is in Microsoft's interests to release a firm "These leaks are not true".

But they haven't.

So you think they are willing to break NDA and officially acknowledge the existence of the next gen Xbox before Microsoft does, to quell some internet chatter?

 

[Camp Lo]

Confirmation? =P

Bomba

 

[-PXG-]

How can you definitively say they won't have offline mode? You can't even verify with certainty that 'always online' is even a feature as the console hasn't even been officially announced. You're making claims on hearsay and rumor.

Well, yes, it's speculation. The article in the OP is a rumor. I hope I'm wrong. I just don't trust MS to play nice and what's fair.

 

[Hana-Bi]

He didn't deny any of those "negative rumors," though. :-(

Officially there is no confirmation of a 720, so what can he deny what officially doesn't exist till now?

 

[Foffy]

someone in another thread brought up the fact that movies have a theatrical run where you essentially have to "buy" the movie "new" since you can only see it in theaters

what if game publishers did something similar? hardcode a 6 month expiration date into the game's code so the "forced online, no used games" check stops after 6 months
edit: the date check would have to be via NTP servers so you couldn't just change your console's clock

In principle, I would buy any new title six months after it launches.

 

[Rikyfree]

I refuse to believe that this is true. It just goes beyond common sense. I mean I don't agree with MS on a bunch of things in their business platform, but I absolutely refuse to believe that they would be this fucking stupid.

 

[kaching]

Dev from Twisted Pixel

https://twitter.com/deliciousbees/status/299186799656443905

One of the console manufacturers announces they'll be unveiling their next-gen console soon and that re-ignites interest in finding out where their competition stands. What ARE the odds?!?

 

[Trevelyon]

I do not put it past any of them to taint the well for their competitors.

So a Sony fan or someone acting in the interest of Sony, in the industry, who's close to Nextbox development (be it game development or otherwise) is selling Edge a load of horse manure and they're so confident in this source enough to run this as 'news'.

MmmMMmm!

 

[JJD]

Well, considering how hard that game bombed, and they were damn there giving it away already on consoles.. yeah.. there's exceptions.. but Steam isn't bargain mart most of the time... not even close.

Are you really serious? I bought Sleeping Dogs 2 weeks ago on the PSN for 49.99.

I wish PSN and XBLA were like Steam when it comes to pricing and discounts.

Steam is great in this regard.

 

[cookie-monster]

.

There will come a time when one cannot find new copies of the nextgen games. What then is the answer to playing them? Trying to search for the original fabled console that was linked to that used disc?

The digital issue is even greater IMO: we have already seen how fast game content/support is pulled during this gen(look how fast EA content goes down, XBLA games, etc), what's to say nextgen will be any better? If you honestly think that your digital console content will be playable X years in the future, you'd better go read the back of those DLC fliers in the current gen packaging("content code good until Y date, upon which it will no longer be supported").

Yep, it is already difficult to archive XBLA content, you have to keep the console you activated it on originally alive. The fact that they have chosen to report 'always-on' suggests that not even the activated hardware DRM will be around next time (or else it needn't have been mentioned at all).

Speculation of course, but these large corporations are now addicted to removing content, forced upgrades and planned obsolescence. Occam's razor suggests the worst case scenario we're discussing here is actually quite likely.