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Final Fantasy XIV |OT2| ARR: Phase 4 August.
- Thread starter Jijidasu
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Semi interesting...
Notice that my Darklight gear comes in like it wasn't dyed.
Notice that my Darklight gear comes in like it wasn't dyed.
While I think that the Blizzard line of spells probably needs to be adjusted, I don't see how that reflects on the combat system as a whole.
Me either. I liked 1.23 combat system and would have been happy with that system as a base in ARR (given better interface, infrastructure, etc.) but how in the world does THM math outlining how to use the spells somehow make it worse than 1.23? I mean, let's not pretend that rotations in 1.23 were rocket science--they were, in theory, less complicated even than what we're seeing in ARR beta (at high level). And THM/BLM? lol. Thunder->Thundara forever, Thundaga after crit buff and toss a Freeze when your threat got too high. That's all there was to it. ARR THM/BLM is infinitely more interesting than before.
Blizzard spells are also pretty useful for soloing and they're also pretty key for a THM that wants to stay busy as a healer/offhealer in a small group setting--keeps your mana regen strong while you cast other stuff.
Riposte
Member
Consider it two partially related thoughts. One is that everything I read about the combat system comes out as negative. Next is that, through my personal experience (which didn't feature much THM play) I liked my time with 1.23 better than ARR.
I wonder how seriously they'll take this criticism. I mean, there are a lot of shortcomings with this system as a product of a rushed schedule no doubt, but can these problems be turned around via patches or do you think it's a real core issue?
Personally I don't think it's bad but I think the extreme flashiness needs to be toned down (looks like it is going to be) because it's giving me bloody headaches. And perhaps they need to re-evaluate the depth of attributes, as it seems a lot of the attributes are useless outside of core modifiers.
I suppose if enough people make noise about the battle system they'll have to do something, although I doubt it'll happen before launch at this rate (~2 months until launch).
Also, FFXIV_JP twitter reported there'll be a new trailer at Japan Expo this coming Thursday. (21:45PM (JST) start for the live stream stage event)
Personally I don't think it's bad but I think the extreme flashiness needs to be toned down (looks like it is going to be) because it's giving me bloody headaches. And perhaps they need to re-evaluate the depth of attributes, as it seems a lot of the attributes are useless outside of core modifiers.
I suppose if enough people make noise about the battle system they'll have to do something, although I doubt it'll happen before launch at this rate (~2 months until launch).
Also, FFXIV_JP twitter reported there'll be a new trailer at Japan Expo this coming Thursday. (21:45PM (JST) start for the live stream stage event)
Riposte
Member
The negativity is my own, although people have talked about the class and job elsewhere and were negative about it.
I don't like the relationship between Fire I and the other fire spells. I don't like where Ice stands in the system, especially with Transpose, which highlights the lack of "combo" feel to Umbral Ice between Astral Fire and is basically a way to get around it entirely. The "Ancient Magic" spells are similarly disappointing from what I've seen. I don't like how Thunder spells are handled, because they are highly conservative spells on a class which already has something like Umbral Ice (consider this more of an Umbral Ice complaint). A smaller thing is that spells sort of go through the same thing as weapon skills in ARR, where they are mostly small, repeated attacks - as a FFXI BLM main it sort of pains me that spamming Fire I alongside what amounts to 3 elemental Dots (Shock) is the optimal. I liked making things go boom (and having to deal with the consequences). Another thing, although I can't say it is conclusive, is that while spamming Fire magic on my THM (levels 15-24~), hate was not an issue at all. In some cases this included AoE fire and ice magic, but I admit while in Toto-rak, I did pull hate on the monsters the tank wasn't fighting. Tanks are much more powerful in this game, so I don't know how that will work with the smaller spells.
EDIT: It seems critical damage+ is less affected by level, which is good. Unfortunately, they also removed critical damage+ gear/materia so that's less of a thing now.
Personally, I think its good at a basic level. They def need to think more about how these things all come together and flow at level 50. Right now there are things that are very awkward and just aren't fun to use. For instance, Howling Fist on my Monk is a 5 minute CD and it barely does more damage than any other WS. Dragoon has a similar issue with all their Jump being on fairly long 3-5min CDs. I also think the staple of Final Fantasy battle systems is the "payoff".
For the record I think ARR Monk plays much better than 1.23 did, there are just some rough edges I'd like to see addressed before release.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
This.
redfiend00
Member
Is that what we used in Garuda? I didn't get to use BLM that much on her so i can't remember.
I agree that the combat system doesn't feel "FFXI" at all for two reasons.
1. You basically just spam weapon skills all day.
You have an autoattack, but you might never notice it because you're just mashing the button for Straight Shot over and over. Sometimes you re-apply Heavy Shot's buff or reapply the poison weapon skill, sometimes you use a skill with marginally higher damage but a greater cooldown. Overall, I feel like I'm going to wear out my R2 and O buttons.
2. None of your abilities are particularly drastic.
If you've played for any length of time, you have a buff move that gives you 20-30s of 20% more defense or attack and a cooldown of several minutes. I moved mine off the R2 crossbars because I almost never use it-- no battle is going to swing in the balance if I forget to use it or use it at the wrong time.
By comparison, FFXI abilities were all drastic. Sentinel was 90% damage reduction for 30 seconds (5 minute cooldown), Elemental Seal doubled the potency of your next spell, and let's not get started on Hundred Fists.
Weapon Skills are so watered down you could mistake them for Bud Lite, and there's no need to coordinate with your party for anything as crazy/tactical as skill chains and magic bursts. FFXIV's combat is nothing like FFXI's.
1. You basically just spam weapon skills all day.
You have an autoattack, but you might never notice it because you're just mashing the button for Straight Shot over and over. Sometimes you re-apply Heavy Shot's buff or reapply the poison weapon skill, sometimes you use a skill with marginally higher damage but a greater cooldown. Overall, I feel like I'm going to wear out my R2 and O buttons.
2. None of your abilities are particularly drastic.
If you've played for any length of time, you have a buff move that gives you 20-30s of 20% more defense or attack and a cooldown of several minutes. I moved mine off the R2 crossbars because I almost never use it-- no battle is going to swing in the balance if I forget to use it or use it at the wrong time.
By comparison, FFXI abilities were all drastic. Sentinel was 90% damage reduction for 30 seconds (5 minute cooldown), Elemental Seal doubled the potency of your next spell, and let's not get started on Hundred Fists.
Weapon Skills are so watered down you could mistake them for Bud Lite, and there's no need to coordinate with your party for anything as crazy/tactical as skill chains and magic bursts. FFXIV's combat is nothing like FFXI's.
I was usually tanking or healing so I didn't have it memorized on BLM but it was basically Thunder->Thundara a few times at first, then you switched to your burn rotation which was Thunder (Excruciate right before or right after) -> Thundara->Parsimony->Thundaga->Thunder->Thundara->Blizzard->Thunder->Thundara->probably Freeze by now just to be safe->Thunder->Thundara->Convert->Necrogenesis ->Burst->Second Wind (by this time she should have already done her blast)->Thunder->Thundara->(MP allowing) Thundaga->Blizzara-> then if not dead, elixir/kiss->Thunder->Thundara->Thundaga. By this time she'd either be dead or you would.
Something like that.
How much did sentinel reduce damage in 1.0, because that was the difference between life and death during Ifrit battle hellfire.
Also the flashy effects are supposed to be toned down, or at least will have the option to do so later. As for the battle system, things started feeling more interesting for me around level 15, or at least when you start unlocking more new class skills via quests.
Also the flashy effects are supposed to be toned down, or at least will have the option to do so later. As for the battle system, things started feeling more interesting for me around level 15, or at least when you start unlocking more new class skills via quests.
Boss Man
Member
Honestly, if they just changed the "Limit Break" thing to where it's a unique ability that each class and/or job gets after a certain amount of 'combat' takes place (X many abilities used, Y many abilities used on you or a party member) that might alleviate a lot of this.
So they arent called gigas anymore then? In that case, even though that enemy in the art slightly represents Hecaton boss from FF3, its something else entirely? What i was fighting was a fate nm, so wasnt sure the name of the beast tribe type, aside from the fact that it looked like a gigas from xi.
Agreed. A proper limit break system would cap off the battle system nicely. As I mentioned above there are a bunch of long CD/awkward use skills that don't make much sense right now (howling fist, dmg jumps, ancient magic ect), they'd be perfect for that type of thing.
I really wish limit breaks were individual and not group & role based. It's one the few disappointing things for me in combat.
I quit 1.0 before they started charging, so I've never seen a gigas in XIV. Those things are called Hecatoncheir. It doesn't make any sense to me since they only have two arms.
While I agree that each class should have its own unique Limit Break-- it is utterly stupid that Archers have Healing Wind-- I don't think that would change all that much. You're still stuck with one Limit Break gauge for the entire party, so most classes are never going to get to use theirs anyway.
Oh they werent in 1.0, so its still a new intro here. I agree with the fact that it doesnt make sense, but then again neither did:
and his name was Hecaton/Hecatoncheir
Square isnt one for sticking too close to what their enemy names originated from. Qiqirn for example are supposed to be big hairless dog monsters.Boo, wasn't home this weekend so I didn't get to play, and now the phase is done? Argh. I just got my beta key, too.
You've still got next weekend/whatever they extend it to.
Well, Hecatoncheires in FFXIII was at least somewhat accurate. Maybe not in how Vanille used his Gestalt, but I won't say more about that in case children are present.Oh they werent in 1.0, so its still a new intro here. I agree with the fact that it doesnt make sense, but then again neither did:
and his name was Hecaton/Hecatoncheir
You've still got next weekend/whatever they extend it to.
Robobandit
Member
I'd like to see each player have their own limit break bar and for players to be able to combine their limit breaks into some kind of cool combo attack instead of just deciding which limit break would be most helpful in a given situation and saving it so that one player can use it at the right time.
I like the limit break concept more than I like them in practice so far. I expect they'll be getting a number of modifications due to feedback, but we'll see.
I like the limit break concept more than I like them in practice so far. I expect they'll be getting a number of modifications due to feedback, but we'll see.
Xux
Member
Eh, that's not too far off. Maybe their Primal is Fenrir.
Agreed, but I wouldn't hold your breath on that feedback. The beta forums are full of stupid, and it doesn't help that they're closed most of the time and extremely limited when they're open.
YOO GIVE CLINK-CLINK TO SUMMON FENREER?
Qiqirns having a Primal seems odd. I don't think there's a single Qiqirn mage in the game? They just seem too stupid to wield magic.
I dunno, I think they're supposed to have odd vocal chords or something. At any rate, i'm not sure if this is canon but:
http://www.eorzeapedia.com/wiki/Category:Qiqirn
All the same, they are exceedingly clever things. They know their numbers as well as any scholar, and have a gift for merchant trade, as well.
(I know they are usually merchants and go after shiny stuff, I mean the entry from the Ul'dah npc)
Maybe they just sound stupid? I mean I never thought i'd see a lizardman buying sausage from a butcher, anything is possible now
After the 7th Umbral Era, they went the way of the... well...
I saw a dodo! But I can't remember where. I think in Lower Noscea?
Seeing that water in the artwork really makes me wish you could swim in the game.
Robobandit
Member
I've yet to see an official forum that isn't full of stupid...
I think Yoshi-P and the dev team have done an admirable job of filtering through the stupid stuff and pulling out the posts that make sense and the requests that are reasonable and have taken that and improved the game quite a bit for phase 3.
Munba
Member
That seems goblin architecture, very similar to the building in the materia-goblin camp.
I saw dodos in northern la noscea and they have their little nests too lol.
It looks like it's made out of Goblin masks, with some added metal bits, to me.
Ironic really considering there has been complaint on the offical forums that mage loot doesn't drop as often as the other classes, yet it still doesn't get fixed.
I reckon the loot list should be based/influenced on the party make up personally.
Bullshit lol. When I ran the first 3 dungeons two weeks ago we got nothing but mage gear... we even got one or two of the same mage items twice in the same session. Last weekend doing the higher level dungeons we saw a more even mix (maybe a little higher on the DoW, but RNG is RNG).
Robobandit
Member
Well whatever still loot based on party make up would still make more sense.
If this were a game like WoW then I would agree (DAMN YOU WARLOCK GEAR) but since you can switch classes getting random gear is fine since you can greed it for your other classes.
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