DimmuBurgerKing
Member
Never say never. ;_; My heart can't take it.
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Final Fantasy XIV |OT4| Welcome, PS4 users!
- Thread starter tiggerkiddo
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Never say never. ;_; My heart can't take it.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
=3
My robbing days need to be complemented in some way =D
Also need it for Coil 2 >_<, Double Progression Group
tiggerkiddo
Member
I didn't have any issues making a second character on Ultros but that was way back in October, I forgot when I signed up though...it might have been late at night though.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Ugh, that sucks. Mine were only 13k each.
I have a strange question about votekicking from DF, so I'm going to be fairly detailed because I'm not sure how right or wrong this was.
Last night I ran Turn 1 a few times, and ran into a specific PLD twice. I am usually the last person to speak up in a group about somebodies mistakes, but he wiped us 3 times before we even got to the snake, and would not follow directions or even respond. He did speak english, but I'm guessing had no keyboard as I noticed he was on PS3 or PS4.
Anyway, after grabbing the snake at the split, he pretty much jumped around in circles until we all died. The other tank voted to kick him for harassment. After that there was a bit of drama over picking harassment over afk because one party member said you can be banned from the game after several harassment votekicks.
So next run, him again. There were 2 others from the previous group as well, and we all wanted to try to explain the ADS to him since he never caught on the previous run. He refuses to tank ADS, and seems to keep hitting macros like "I'll tank adds". I only say that because he repeated them very quickly. After 2 wipes, they votekicked him again for harassment. In fact, I believe it was the other tank who was not even in the previous run (and so didn't know about the slight drama from the last kick).
I voted no because of what that person said but there was no saving him lol. I just wanted to know if there is any truth to this potential ban, and even so, would you consider that harassment? I mean my instinct would be no because its unintentional, but afk is obviously not true either. Just curious really, as I felt a little bad about it.
Last night I ran Turn 1 a few times, and ran into a specific PLD twice. I am usually the last person to speak up in a group about somebodies mistakes, but he wiped us 3 times before we even got to the snake, and would not follow directions or even respond. He did speak english, but I'm guessing had no keyboard as I noticed he was on PS3 or PS4.
Anyway, after grabbing the snake at the split, he pretty much jumped around in circles until we all died. The other tank voted to kick him for harassment. After that there was a bit of drama over picking harassment over afk because one party member said you can be banned from the game after several harassment votekicks.
So next run, him again. There were 2 others from the previous group as well, and we all wanted to try to explain the ADS to him since he never caught on the previous run. He refuses to tank ADS, and seems to keep hitting macros like "I'll tank adds". I only say that because he repeated them very quickly. After 2 wipes, they votekicked him again for harassment. In fact, I believe it was the other tank who was not even in the previous run (and so didn't know about the slight drama from the last kick).
I voted no because of what that person said but there was no saving him lol. I just wanted to know if there is any truth to this potential ban, and even so, would you consider that harassment? I mean my instinct would be no because its unintentional, but afk is obviously not true either. Just curious really, as I felt a little bad about it.
Pellegri Testament
Member
When it's a clear sign that a person is in it for nothing more than harassing others, I would vote ban too(they will not do a perma on the first time unless it's really serious, but it will be a few days). Do they actually do anything about these people? probably not, but if it gets them on a list that keeps building up the more they screw other groups then it's for the best.
I didn't transfer, so I've still got my GAF character. I'm only checking out another group of complete strangers.
I've left the GAF FC to make one with my friends. They just recently resubbed and we got through Garuda over the weekend. The game is easy for veteran MMO players but I found it pretty fun (if at times frustrating) to help them learn the mechanics and improve their reaction time and skill rotations. I also like helping new players in dungeons, makes me feel like I'm contributing something positive to the community. I may switch my main job to WAR from SMN.
I know, and I certainly didn't want to play with him anymore but sometimes I'm like "what if this is a 12 year old kid and we just MADE HIM CRY."
I know thats ridiculous but people are so ruthless in this game. I try to give tips before people fly off the handle because if I quickly type out something halfway witty about staying out of a circle of death, most people will give up on berating the guy and calling him a fucking retard or some other bullshit I'm tired of constantly reading.
Not that there was any helping this guy at this particular time, but I have never played an MMO with people that rage this hard. I understand on some level that nobody wants their time wasted, but the overreactions are comically over the top. I'm sure I'm not the only person that leaves several groups a day just because I'm sick of some macho jackass making fun of another player. It sucks that they might be left without a healer but it saps my enjoyment and frankly drags out the dungeon by an extra 15 minutes. I don't need any gear or tokens since I'm not interested in scheduled raiding, so i'm not missing out on anything but it feels silly to be leaving probably 1 in 3 groups just to avoid these people. I feel bad that this is probably the most successful portion of some of these peoples lives but I just don't feel the need to deal with all the negativity.
Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not defending the guy who refused to listen, just explaining why I'm hesitant to just kick anyone that makes a mistake. I've played a lot of MMOs and I have never seen anything even close to the bullshit that gets flung in this game. It's cringeworthy, and half the time its in fucking CT. Then we have to go through 40 minutes of "lol A team so bad, B team is carrying you all!" If we break for more than 60 seconds for people to argue, I just drop, or unplug my router so I can join another without a 30 minute lockout. Ain't noone got time for that.
It's hard to tell whether someone's on PS4 or PC, but it's easy to tell if someone's on PS3. They'll take longer to load into zones, may be unable to see enemies, etc.
Oh thought there was some icon I was missing.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Doing DR has certainly become more of an adventure with all the new PS4 players
When you examine a player, PSN characters have their ID on the lower right corner of that box.
I'm actually not positive now that I think of it, I feel like I've seen mine before but now I can't remember!
http://www.twitch.tv/jmairu about to do t9
raid going pretty well this week! all one shots so far . . .
raid going pretty well this week! all one shots so far . . .
So, I've heard in passing that, while T7 is a harder DPS check, mechanics wise it's easier to learn than T6.
Is this, accurate?
Also, what are the recommended resources for learning T7. Id just assume not use Mr Happy 's videos, as they somehow manage to both be overly complex, and still manage to omit vital details.
Is this, accurate?
Also, what are the recommended resources for learning T7. Id just assume not use Mr Happy 's videos, as they somehow manage to both be overly complex, and still manage to omit vital details.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I have heard that the person with the hardest job is the kiter in T7. I only had video experience and I was able to beat T7 with a group within an hour.
HylianScribe
Member
Wow, so close on that attempt. Thought you had it.
I have not done T7 but I found this groups T5 video much more helpful than Mr Happy's.
MTQcapture T7: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlFDCI-c9wE
So through 4 weeks of clearing T6, we've had BRD Belt 3 times, BRD Earrings 2 times (we have 1 BRD, me. Also neither of these pieces are BIS) 1 MNK Belt (we have no MNK) and two other pieces that were relevant. This is some serious bullshit, its stunting our progression as a group. None of the other people in our group can genuinely progress gear-wise.
It's really frustrating me. Especially when we're pushing DPS checks so close in T7 at the moment. To see so much useless loot early on is really disheartening.
It's really frustrating me. Especially when we're pushing DPS checks so close in T7 at the moment. To see so much useless loot early on is really disheartening.
I'm not sure I would say that. Your opinion may vary tho.
well you really don't need that to clear turn 7
Black-Wind
Member
Does anyone know of a good Marking Guild for Tanks?
Got a friend whose real anal about me not marking things (She loves to spam sleep which doesn't work with the "rotate my attacks through the mobs" aggro holding system Im working on ... though we're doing low level dungeons and I have had not problem running them with pugs without marking) but I'm having a funky hotbar phase now that I'm a Paladin and I'm gaining more and more skills (Using the gamepad).
Think I'm gonna switch to Mouse set up and use the Game Pad to move around ... I really want those vertical hot bars but they don't show for game pad mode.
Got a friend whose real anal about me not marking things (She loves to spam sleep which doesn't work with the "rotate my attacks through the mobs" aggro holding system Im working on ... though we're doing low level dungeons and I have had not problem running them with pugs without marking) but I'm having a funky hotbar phase now that I'm a Paladin and I'm gaining more and more skills (Using the gamepad).
Think I'm gonna switch to Mouse set up and use the Game Pad to move around ... I really want those vertical hot bars but they don't show for game pad mode.
I know. We've had people away and haven't been able to out time into it yet. Doesn't make it any less disheartening or frustrating though.
RellyRell28
Banned
Just gonna log on to do one DR expert and hopefully get some Magician's gear for glamours. Already got the robe. After that it's on to Watch Dogs
on the bright side you guys could make a nomura bard out of those belts
I got the Munificent Mogtome for my SCH. I'm adorable now!
It's my best weapon atm for this class, but I really love these weapons for glamour. I've been using the BLM one for a few weeks and I still love the model and the noise it makes. I got several other classes weapons on greed as well while I farmed for it, just in case I level another one up, I'll be ready to look baller.
It's my best weapon atm for this class, but I really love these weapons for glamour. I've been using the BLM one for a few weeks and I still love the model and the noise it makes. I got several other classes weapons on greed as well while I farmed for it, just in case I level another one up, I'll be ready to look baller.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
I would not really categorize T7 as a dps check. I mean, there is an enrage, but even with multiple deaths you probably won't hit it. The biggest dps check is whether or not you can kill the first set of adds fast enough (hardest set), but if your group can clear T6 I really really doubt this will be an issue. It wasn't even widely known there was an enrage for awhile because no groups were hitting it. Mechanic wise things are more strict, if any one person messes up you can easily wipe the raid within seconds, but it's a lot less chaotic than T6 and is therefore easier overall. (I'd consider it easiest turn in second coil by far). It's also super fun and has the most hilarious wipes.
For strategies, I can't recommend any source specifically since I mainly remember our group watching some random french streams and putting pieces together (and stealing super pro japanese onry strat). However Qhon made some time in between his waifu hunting to post a thread on the guildworks site that has a compilation of strategies/videos for all the turns. Thread is worth a look through. Key thing is to figure out how your group will be handling renauds from the start, that is the most important part of the fight and there are several ways to go about it.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I usually mark them in order of importance. The dangerous ones die first unless you have a certain reason to kill one enemy first. I personally don't like the healer or BLM sleeping mobs because I use Overpower to keep all the mobs in check every so often.
Captain_Cold
Member
I set up a simple macro so that it only takes up one spot on my hotbar:
/enemysign attack <t>
/nexttarget
It's a little finnicky until you get used to it but it's been sufficient for controlling the flow of battle in dungeons so far. If it moves to a target you don't want you still have to cycle through targets manually but it removes some of the steps. I'm sure a mouse would be a much better option as you get into later/endgame dungeons.
Pellegri Testament
Member
t7 is definitely what I would call a mechanics check, a dps check it is not. I think the only time all of our dps could go full on was before vero got his sand wep, after that things continue to get worse and worse. If you push phases too fast then you get really shitty Renaud spawns which may happen after a voice goes out or right as a voice goes out so you need to adjust the entire raid just incase it's a really bad spawn position. The more dps you have, you worse mechanics will become since they happen at random rather than on a set timer if you held off on transitions.
What we did to "fix" the issue for the most part is I actually do not dps 60% of the fight until we get to the final phase after the add is dead(this is easier for me because I have to watch for renauds and voices anyway since I'm the kiter). Taking my dmg away means we get better transitions and we don't have to derp around waiting for an add to spawn or a voice to happen because we went too fast and we know it will screw up the later phases. So in other words, if you're just starting the fight and people only have ilvl 95-100 weps, dps does not matter unless you have really bad dps for whatever reason. Once people start getting 110, that is when someone may need to start holding back.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Reminds me how Xarielle was saying these fights should have been tuned to higher item levels or something to that effect...
Alex
Member
I spent around 35 minutes in a Brayflox yesterday. I was trying to be as polite and helpful as I could be but I was screaming on the inside. This person didn't feel fresh to cap/the dungeon, they felt fresh to tanking...RPGs... perhaps video games on the whole!
I'm just amazed neither of the DPS in there burst a blood vessel.
You quickly categorize them based on your own preconceptions
These fights need a normal and a hard mode instead of the middle of the road line they tread. This applies to Crystal Tower as well, they have a reasonable amount of content I just do not quite feel it's being utilized or divvied up as nicely as it could be.
tiggerkiddo
Member
Coil needs to be truly difficult, people conquered Second Coil way too fast, especially considering how long it will be until the next Coil.
Maybe I will find a static by then lol
Maybe I will find a static by then lol
Pellegri Testament
Member
Outside of t9 the only other turn I would say was tuned perfectly for the gear they expected you to go in with or even have some gear before attempting it, was turn 8. It required high dps at all times ontop of learning the mechanics, all of which have the ability to one shot multiple people or the entire group.
There are many people who attempting coil 2 now, who if you told them they need to do 300+ dps in a 10+ min fight, they'd laugh at you and say you're joking because they do nowhere near that. A single person doing really subpar however can bring the entire raid down when it comes to that fight, where as if they were doing subpar for t6/7 yet understood the mechanics, they could actually carry their own weight in those fights.
I'd honestly say Coil 1 would have been done just as fast if not a few weeks later had it not been for the twisters that gave absolutely no room for error. I'd say t7-9 all have much more unforgiving mechanics than t5 did and yet all of them had some room to screw up on. Twisters however you had about half a second to move(in a circle before they nerfed it) before you blew up, the margin for error was so tiny that only a single guild was able to beat it before they nerfed it a week later, something that I highly doubt was more than just a fluke that got them the kill.
The mechanics are there to make these fights really challenging, what is not there however is a true sense of danger(on most of them) to the point where a single screw up(before people get geared) could lead to a wipe. T7 does a good job at this where depending on the screw up it could easily lead to a raid wipe, what it lacked however was about 100-200k more health on the boss so that mechanics could line up better with everyone still doing something(this would also lead to cutting it closer to the enrage). The other problem is a lot of these fights have multiple ways to defeat them(some of which are borderline exploit), you should not be able to completely bypass core mechanics of a fight like you could from week 1 in coil 1 with Cadaceus.
Should of required full crafted i90 pentamelded to even do t6 trash, amirite.
*cough*, anyway....
How do you define difficulty? Personally I think of something that requires a great deal of coordination and skill. If you do not think coil takes that, why is it not being cleared by more groups, and what changes would you make specifically to add difficulty. If it is just gear checks then I am very glad they did not go that route, especially with how piss poor I've seen RNG be to some people. I absolutely despise artificial roadblocks like heavy gear checks/jumps. It's lazy design.
Going based solely on clear time doesn't give the whole picture, especially when you ignore some important context regarding turn 5. The fight was so broken they had to actually take the entire instance down for an entire lock out week. This happened more than once. Twisters were just not a well done mechanic, and that was the sole roadblock, it definitely was not gear in any way shape or form. This isn't SE making second coil too easy, it's SE not making second coil a broken mess.
As for the lasting part, that is just SE's completely ridiculous release schedule and not really anything to do with Coil's difficulty. Most games would introduce new progressive content each patch, they don't do an endgame tier in one patch and then an easier tier in next without advancing the higher at all. Due to how far ahead they've likely planned things up until at least the expansion, I doubt we will see any changes on this front, but I really hope they will consider it. Like how they changed their mind on saving all QoL/hotfix style changes for big patches and actually gave them to us when ready.
Coil is what I consider difficult because a lot of casual/semi casual players haven't even reached t6 yet. The thing is, if you take a few good static groups who throw 12+ hours at a fight everyday, it'll probably be done in what somewhat quick fashion. I hear about these elite groups who, on day one of new material, pretty much spend the whole day attempting to beat said material.
Truly difficult? Isn't there something like 2-3 statics that have beat T9 on our server?
What are you expecting? Content that no one can clear for months on end until geared enough? That sounds horrible.
The stats on Titan are mostly identical, but it has determination instead of skill speed so at the moment I'm sticking with Titan. Started up Brayflox hard last night so I can either go for my zenith or, more likely, I'll buy the myth chest instead.
Uh, are these accurate?
http://xivdb.com/?item/6259/Bravura-Zenith
http://xivdb.com/?item/7826/Bravura-Atma
No stat difference?
EDIT: Just realised the Atma isn't the finished product. Duh!
EDIT2: Also, I haven't watched this in full yet (and apologies if it's been posted already), but:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_XZmQqp7m0
there's no stat gain on Atma until you start buffing the stats through books, and even then you don't get the WD/MD buff that really puts it at i100 level worth until you finish all 9 books and turn it into Bravura Animus.
Don't you know that K'tai beat T7 in the first half of his first lockout ever? That must mean Coil is easy peasy lemon squeazy!
Don't you know that K'tai beat T7 in the first half of his first lockout ever? That must mean Coil is easy peasy lemon squeazy!
Well, I will admit that people cleared T9 a bit sooner than I expected. That's not the end of the world, and the vast, vast, VAST majority of the population hasn't even cleared T6 yet, but it is a subtle miscalculation on the devs part.
I think the issue, is that the jump from ilvl90 to ilvl110, isn't all THAT dramatic stat wise, especially since a large portion of that difference can be made up via HQ Pentamelded Crafted Gear. If the max ilvl had been raised to say, 120, and you were expected to have ilvl110 or higher gear, just to survive some of the more basic attacks in the second half of second coil, then, the first clear would've taken more time, simply because there'd have been no way to possibly make up the stat differences via pentamelding.
People would've needed at least a few more weeks to gear up, no matter how efficient a system they used.
Ironically, I think the easiest way to deal with this sort of thing, would be to just start adding Materia slots to non-crafted armor, and design the fights with the expectation that people are going to take advantage of materia slotting.
Maybe limit Pentamelding to crafted armor or something, but, that alone would've make up the difference if you could at least put, "some," materia on non-crafted armor.
Also, again, only a slight whoops. It's important to design the fights so people don't clear them too quickly, buuuut, it's not as if we want them so insanely difficult that each fight took a month of nightly practice, with top tier gear, and all that.
I think the issue, is that the jump from ilvl90 to ilvl110, isn't all THAT dramatic stat wise, especially since a large portion of that difference can be made up via HQ Pentamelded Crafted Gear. If the max ilvl had been raised to say, 120, and you were expected to have ilvl110 or higher gear, just to survive some of the more basic attacks in the second half of second coil, then, the first clear would've taken more time, simply because there'd have been no way to possibly make up the stat differences via pentamelding.
People would've needed at least a few more weeks to gear up, no matter how efficient a system they used.
Ironically, I think the easiest way to deal with this sort of thing, would be to just start adding Materia slots to non-crafted armor, and design the fights with the expectation that people are going to take advantage of materia slotting.
Maybe limit Pentamelding to crafted armor or something, but, that alone would've make up the difference if you could at least put, "some," materia on non-crafted armor.
Also, again, only a slight whoops. It's important to design the fights so people don't clear them too quickly, buuuut, it's not as if we want them so insanely difficult that each fight took a month of nightly practice, with top tier gear, and all that.
I'm not sure why you guys care so much about the speed that Coil 2 was cleared by probably less than 10% of the population or something (I pulled this number out of my butt).
sorry this is pretty stupid lol
I think it's okay to accept that the Coil2 is actually pretty well tuned thanks to what they learned from Coil1, and that anything short of a literal item level hard restriction won't stop groups like BG from clearing it within a week or two. Right now, I'm pretty sure Kagari's group has a much higher combined ilevel total compared to the BG group that first cleared T9 at the time, but last I checked they're still grinding away at it so I'm not really sure that your gear proposal will change anything in regards to content clears, not that I think anything needs to be changed.
Less than 1% most likely, I really don't see that many players walking around with Second Coil gear yet. I mean, heck, a not insignificant portion of the user-base isn't even past T5 yet.
I don't care too much, it means that the best groups might put whole thing on farm status 2-3 weeks sooner than they otherwise would have. Only problem with that is that, well, it'll be awhile until these players get anymore content that's similarly challenging. So for these players, the longer it keeps them occupied the better.
Still, again, few weeks difference and all, Square Enix wasn't that far off from hitting the mark.
Edit: Also, Coil 1 did demand gear of a certain level, just to be able to survive basic attacks. Trying to tackle T1 as a Tank without at least mostly Darklight was, pretty dubious there for awhile. The difference of course being that, just to get to T6, you have to clear T5, which for most players means ilvl90 or higher. The amount of initial gearing you needed to do was drastically reduced because of this. That's fine for the most part, especially for the first half of a raid like this. Second half though, well requiring a smidge more gearing for the second half wouldn't have been a bad thing.
The damage from Caduceus could be manipulated through slugs though, which was pretty much the prevalent strategy in lieu of decent gear.
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