DrForester
Kills Photobucket
This would be the best solution.
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Final Fantasy XIV |OT5| All You Need is Gil
- Thread starter tiggerkiddo
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This would be the best solution.
Yeah I think most realize that which is why I don't reallly care to argue about hunts directly. The FFXIV team hopefully already has plans and balance fixes set for the future of hunts so all we can do is wait and see.
HM needs to be harder imo.
On that note, I think Leviathan EX is probably the only Extreme mode primal I can run so far reliably.
Combination of vacations, people moving, etc etc. Understandable stuff really, and it hasn't cost us that much time, really.
Mostly I'm just thirsty I think. Id be ecstatic if I could complete the High Allagan set before the next patch, or at least have some sort of gear to prove I've cleared that content.
Shame there isn't a title for that, it wouldn't be as good as gear of course, but at least it'd be some sort of trophy that wasn't subject to RNG.
PS: Really hope they don't put the Tank body piece on the last turn of Coil again.
theSlacker
Member
Well that is how the actually hard stuff has always been in the year that this has been out. Titan was a roadblock for weeks to get the first relics when all it was was "don't stand in shit" to a degree that no fight punished as hard yet in the game. Demon Wall you had to know the dance and not get knocked off while also managing adds. Anatoboga could take a group to the time out of an instance just from people not paying attention to where they were dropping balls. This goes all the way up to the top of 8 mans, where the dance is where they get the difficulty from.
The real problem with Pharos Sirius was that there was no real need to do that instance so people skipped it. Like I said, I don't know how they would fix that on new instances. People had to do AK when it was where you got your tomes, and that wasn't a good system, just having one instance that you have to farm.
My biggest worry about it is that the pendulum will swing too far in the other direction and they will fundamentally change how hunts work. Making them forced spawns or things only the group that is doing can attack, when we have that content already in maps and leves. Whatever though, guess I've had my fun.
About HM dungeons getting "harder" -- couldn't we just see the introduction of Extreme Mode dungeons?
Feels like this would be a good solution as it would leave those HM dungeons as they are but provide an even higher challenge (and reward) for people would are looking for tougher content. Raise the ilvl to get in and I think it'd be a good solution.
Feels like this would be a good solution as it would leave those HM dungeons as they are but provide an even higher challenge (and reward) for people would are looking for tougher content. Raise the ilvl to get in and I think it'd be a good solution.
I think we're stuck with hunts for a long while so there should be enough time to see the pendulum rest in a good spot.
ROBOKITTYZILLA
Member
theSlacker
Member
Well either that or they just become another thing that ends up having no ongoing presence in the gameworld and no one even notices their existence until a quest needs you to do them, like combat leves are.
No need for that extra distinction, and not even really calling for super hard 4 mans, just commenting on how 4 mans in general have gotten easier with no real way to get people to do harder ones if they do come out.
Problem with making the HM dungeons more difficult is that it'll cause impatient people to quit the dungeon as soon as when they get that dungeon in roulette.
I remembered when a few weeks have passed since 2.1 was released. As soon as when I got Pharos Sirius as my daily, half of the members would quit right at the start.
I remembered when a few weeks have passed since 2.1 was released. As soon as when I got Pharos Sirius as my daily, half of the members would quit right at the start.
R_thanatos
Member
4 sets of the two adds.
R_thanatos
Member
What ? but that's impossible . wait i'm confused.
WHAT
you can't reach this fight and play like "this".
EDIT : You saw suprana and chirada 4 times ? was nobody DPSing ?
Ever heard of the infinite Garuda HM?
R_thanatos
Member
Please explain ...
i've done and cleared all 3 garuda fights and i'm always eager to learn something new.
When DPS is too low that the adds spawn and heal Garuda because they are up too long and then by the time you attack her again adds spawn again and get left up too long and heal her some more... etc.
R_thanatos
Member
Loooooool
i knew chirada was to be taken down ASAP because she could heal garuda , BUt that's Stupid.. the OT and the dps must take care of it ASAP! that's their role in phase 2!
I mean there is 80 secs !!!
80 secs is just so much time ! i can't believe it. This is ridiculous ...
Thanks for explaining anyway ..This never happenned to me because well .....my usual party and friends are doing their job.
I can imagine and feel your pain..i trully do.
10 step chain with at least 2 dungeons and a few overworld quests where you need to have your chocobo out for successful completion.
Also each Disciple of the Hand gets two exclusive dye recipes at level 50 so you'll need them crafted.
Also each Disciple of the Hand gets two exclusive dye recipes at level 50 so you'll need them crafted.
BudokaiMR2
Member
So, I have a question for all the GAF Eorzean Adventurers.
How do you feel about going into content like EX Primals blind?
Personally, I am the type that hates having to watch videos etc. before going into content like that.
I can understand if some people trying to do speed runs would be annoyed by me dragging the team behind, but I am stubborn and play the games the way I want to. I haven't had any problems mostly because I stay away from DF for most of the content when I go through the first time, but I had a long annoying conversation with some people in our Linkshell about how I am going to start running into assholes who complain about my performance.
And that I really need to watch videos before ever attempting the content.
Personally, I think going in blind is the best way to prepare myself for eventually doing the new end-game content blind with everyone else once I am caught up.
I also feel like it is kinda bullshit that some people feel that once someone has managed to clear it blind everyone else is expected to just study and miss out on that same experience.
I have no problem getting my face melted by EX Primals and that learning process is probably the most fun I have in the game.
Am I just being a stubborn ass? Does anyone else on here feel the same way?
How do you feel about going into content like EX Primals blind?
Personally, I am the type that hates having to watch videos etc. before going into content like that.
I can understand if some people trying to do speed runs would be annoyed by me dragging the team behind, but I am stubborn and play the games the way I want to. I haven't had any problems mostly because I stay away from DF for most of the content when I go through the first time, but I had a long annoying conversation with some people in our Linkshell about how I am going to start running into assholes who complain about my performance.
And that I really need to watch videos before ever attempting the content.
Personally, I think going in blind is the best way to prepare myself for eventually doing the new end-game content blind with everyone else once I am caught up.
I also feel like it is kinda bullshit that some people feel that once someone has managed to clear it blind everyone else is expected to just study and miss out on that same experience.
I have no problem getting my face melted by EX Primals and that learning process is probably the most fun I have in the game.
Am I just being a stubborn ass? Does anyone else on here feel the same way?
I plan to at least do some research for stuff like Coil, but even then I am going to do my best to avoid videos at least until I give it 2-3 tries on my own.
Coming from a MOBA background, there's little I find more frustrating than players who approach a new hero/build/strategy without taking the time to read anything about it, and just hope it works out.
I apply the same logic here. It's not just me playing this game, but me and between 3-7 other people. Most of them might be idiots who probably didn't read up on the fight anyway, but it would be hypocritical me to expect a basic level of studiousness on their part if I didn't apply the same standard to myself.
So, yeah, I have Chrome tabs open to all the content I want to tackle in the foreseeable future at any given time so I can read up whenever I want.
I apply the same logic here. It's not just me playing this game, but me and between 3-7 other people. Most of them might be idiots who probably didn't read up on the fight anyway, but it would be hypocritical me to expect a basic level of studiousness on their part if I didn't apply the same standard to myself.
So, yeah, I have Chrome tabs open to all the content I want to tackle in the foreseeable future at any given time so I can read up whenever I want.
The way FFXIV fights are designed you are just wasting everyone time but meh, don't care. Don't use DF for these kind of things.
Learning parties in Party Finder or go with guildmates. But never through Duty Finder.
I'll go in blind, ask for tips or if its a fight everyone is fresh to, adapt on the fly. Its really not that hard, and i'll stick with the viewpoint that watching a fight prior to attempting it cheapens the experience.
Never watched a video in XI and I dont intend to for XIV. Then again, I only go with company mates.
I mean lets just say that for some reason, there is boss that no one has been able to beat for awhile, and no videos exist of any winning. Are you going to shy away from the content until someone releases a guide video? And even watching the video doesnt help you in a real fight. Also are people really that busy that in an MMO, they cant take the time to give someone a quick rundown on the basics of a battle/dungeon?
R_thanatos
Member
Going blind is not a problem..but only if you're with a party that knows this.
and agrees...
I usually did all the dongeons pre 50 blind , ( except qarn ) but after you're taking Extreme primal content where 1 mistake usually means death or wipe , going blind is not good unless you're with people that are doing the same thing.. Seriously, having all your équipement broken because of wipes when the difficulty is that high is not good if you respect other players.
The only thing you can go blind is coil of bahamut 1 to 3 , after that , peopel are going to be angry and they'll be right to be.
and agrees...
I usually did all the dongeons pre 50 blind , ( except qarn ) but after you're taking Extreme primal content where 1 mistake usually means death or wipe , going blind is not good unless you're with people that are doing the same thing.. Seriously, having all your équipement broken because of wipes when the difficulty is that high is not good if you respect other players.
The only thing you can go blind is coil of bahamut 1 to 3 , after that , peopel are going to be angry and they'll be right to be.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
XI and XIV fights works significantly differently, though.
Well thats true, but think how many people are still bowing down under the weight, yet they've watched and gone through Titan EX (or maybe even Garuda and Leviathan EX) many times. I honestly dont think watching a video beats having actual experience, even if its going in based on party advice you know?
EDIT: And i'd think it would take alot of wipes to have broken equipment? We wiped like 3-4 times in Leviathan EX during our first attempt (came out on top after the 5th?) because of the rails, but no one had drastic repairs from what I could remember. Or at least no one made a comment.
This is fine, just make sure you are in a group with other people who want to learn. Whether be with friends or PF or whatever.
Because going into any other kinda group, with people who are looking for a clear, not researching is being selfish yes. You're essentially wasting everyone else's time, and it's not surprising some people would get upset about that. For a lot of content you can just brute force your way through, but extreme primals and certain coil turns that's not really the case, and if you don't follow the mechanics you can get yourself and possibly everyone else killed.
No one is suggesting it is. But watching a video DOES beat going in blind, and no, getting advice from party isn't blind. If you are going to have someone in group explain the fight to you, why can't you just go and read up the basics beforehand and save some time. I don't expect someone to know the fight by heart if they watched a video, I just expect them to not be surprised about basic mechanics.
I don't even like watching fight videos, but I do like reading mechanic outlines, even basic ones.
In this case, it would probably be a better idea to make a learning party and mention first hand that you're walking into the fight with no experience. That way, everyone who joins knows what they are getting into. You're bound to have a few experienced people who are nice and patient enough to help and explain stuff to you which will make the experience much easier.
DF is pretty much random as and if you party up with a few experienced (impatient) people, don't be surprised if they rage quit after 2-3 wipes.
I know this is a cyclical argument, but the first few parties to beat those areas didnt have videos or guides to go off of. Sure, you cant just brute force your way through the fights, but can you really learn the mechanics of Titan EX by just watching a video or reading a guide? You still need to have reflexes, time your movements and switching precisely, and be able to adjust to small mishaps.
I guess it just heightens the MMO part of the game for me, having to communicate with someone prior to and during battle. Of course I cant speak from fighting primals or any bosses outside of a majority FC composed party, aside from CT content...but thats usually more forgiving. Which might explain my FFXI experience. Most story battles and important boss fights were done with friends, LSmates, or combinations of the two...which honestly makes them more memorable imo.
I might end up venturing into DF to try to get a Leviathan mirror though lol.
I guess it just heightens the MMO part of the game for me, having to communicate with someone prior to and during battle. Of course I cant speak from fighting primals or any bosses outside of a majority FC composed party, aside from CT content...but thats usually more forgiving. Which might explain my FFXI experience. Most story battles and important boss fights were done with friends, LSmates, or combinations of the two...which honestly makes them more memorable imo.
I might end up venturing into DF to try to get a Leviathan mirror though lol.
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
I'm with teknoman. The most fun you can have in an MMO is being one of the first groups to figure out a dungeon. What's wrong with replicating that even though the how tos are online? I'm trying to have fun, not get through everything as fast as possible.
R_thanatos
Member
Lol , i' once met a tank that was doing LB lv1 and didn't let the bar go up past that ( when you could stock 2 or 3 levels )
We still cleared the dongeons but NEVER AGAIN.
Because people going at first will get wiped ..it's perfectly understandable to get wipes when everyone is learning.. but there comes a times where you expect the knowledge to be there ( and i mean widespread among players ) .
People are still asking if someone is new at the start of a complicated dongeon
Heck it's just basic courtesy to inform your party that it's your first time so they can give you tips.
If the fight is new, then people will get wipes and learn , but nobody will understand wipes when something exist for a large period of time and the information is available.Heck i can forgive newcommers that can't dodge shit in ultima HARD mode and i play WHM or SCH , it's annoying but at least i know that i have to take care of them a little more when healing.. 95% of the people in duty finder can and will understand.
And you can , just go with players in a party that share your POV , hoping that people in the duty finder would share your POV isn't really realistic.
It's also not an applicable argument. All the people in those groups knew they needed to learn it, they were all on same page. As was said, going in blind is absolutely fine when you are with people who are either also blind or willing to learn. That is however not the scenario we are talking about, it is one in which you refuse to look up beforehand and then go with a group who isn't blind or interested in relearning a fight. You're just being selfish and wasting those people's time.
You can absolutely learn the mechanics, even if you do not understand every nuance, you are far more prepared then you would have been. Knowing that you need to separate gaols, that you need to kill the adds on top of each other, that you need to stand under titan before his stomp. These are basic pass/fail checks that FFXIV is absolutely filled with, if you mess up those mechanics you will die. Again no one is arguing you will be an expert, but you definitely know what to expect, so you don't die at the first surprise.
I don't mind explaining the fight to new people personally(I even set up macros to do just that for certain fights), at least when it is a fight that is easily explained, but I don't see the difference between having someone in party type out some wall of text and you being proactive, saving people time, and reading someone else's wall of text on reddit or the forums or whatever.
Oh yeah, i'd always give someone a heads up if I was fresh to the fight or dungeon. Not sure why some people just clam up...especially since it becomes evident when say...their party is the only one that constantly wipes in Sycrus.
I'm ok with going blind in dungeons, I even go blind myself.
But Primal Exe are another thing.
irfaanator
Banned
find other people that are willing to go in blind with you I guess. I'm in the boat, if a strat is out, some research should be done.
BudokaiMR2
Member
Yeah I don't think people are reading my entire post or at least misunderstanding it.
I specifically said I don't go through DF on my first run if I can help it. I have been going with people in a linkshell. I only really use DF for roulettes most of the time. Although I did manage to clear Titan EX in DF....
And yeah, I usually ask for advice and even did so last night on my first run of Ifrit EX.
I am mostly just against people expecting me to watch videos to study every facet of a fight.
I also think the "You are wasting other people's time" argument is extremely weak. If they are going to be that snobby about it they can wait around in a PF or set up a static imo. They are agreeing to play with randoms when they do DF and should know there are consequences from that. Heh.
If they want me to do homework and destroy my enjoyment of the game for something like Ifrit EX then they can send me $15 in the mail each month. Maybe then I will play their way and not my own.
Again, I haven't even had this problem yet. I always ask for advice before a fight I know will be tough and always offer advice if I know someone else is new to content that I know.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I agree. On FFXI, I had the fortune to be with a wonderful linkshell that did a lot of things first on our server.
I was in the first party on our server to defeat Diablos and get the summon. We then proceeded to a low level zone near Windurst to show off.
I was in the first party to defeat Prometheus on the server, after the final COP update was released.
Our LS was the first to defeat Jorgumand on our server, a week after we spent 8 hours on him without a win. We also were the first to take down Vrtra.
Kinda sucks that the closest thing to showing off in XIV is either a mount that people might not have a clue how you got, or a minion. Then again, I have seen some armor that i've never seen before, but not that often. I guess thats more of a complaint at how summoner works this time around.
Augemitbutter
Member
playing games with walkthroughs is very zzzzzz to me. i only do it to make it easier for my static. if i could find a dedicated hardcore group, i'd switch right away. then again, you only "need" to watch a video for 6 fights for current patch status. it's just for coil+primals. you don't need to spoil anything for dungeons, hunts (lol) or frontlines. there is just a tiny amount of challenging content in this game.
1 hour.
I was in a group that definitely died to one of the first Dune Parties/Goblin Trains in XI.
Didn't come back in time on 2.3 to try out CT2 for the 1st time, with no clue about the dungeon.
Just came across a "A" Hunt Monster, 10 minutes before maintenance. Think we cleared it with 2 minutes left :lol
I too am in the camp of borderline refusal to watch strat video's. Screw that, either give me a rough lesson in the game, or let me learn on my own.
Personally I think watching a video is a bit spoilerish. But I do read a quick run down/briefing before I try anything new so I at least have an outline of what will happen. You are never going to go in truly blind because someone will almost certainly explain it to you before you start so you might as well read a quick outline.
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