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Formula 1 2016 Season |OT| This thread is unavailable due to a copyright claim by FOM

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Mastah

Mastah

Member
Byron Young ‏@byronf1 19m19 minutes ago

Very amused to discover I have been blocked by @LewisHamilton along with several other Fleet Street journalists...

Cuto15sUEAAa0rc.jpg:large
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#noaccessallowed
 
F

Fisico

Member
ramparter said:
I think that Hulk got bored after so many years at FI. He always had potential imo. Renault is a gamble right now, most probably will be behind Force India for the next 2-3 years but there's always the chance they might pull of something good.

Good for Bottas also, I don't like Williams feels like they only rely on a good engine and never improve their car. They start each season close to the top and then it's all downhill from there.
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Renault had a huge stepback this year because they had to squeeze a Renault engine in a Mercedes designed car, but they were on the way to be back in form on a shoestring budget after the joke 2014 was and I definitely think they could already be close to Force India in 2017.
This year was fantastic for FI but imo they kinda hit the ceiling of what they can do while Renault is, supposedly, on their way back to the top and they should be able to get close to that in 2-3 years
If history repeats itself at least

I like the Hulk/Bottas pairing a lot too, rather have these two or any of these two than Sainz.
 
Z

Zaru

Member
Fisico said:
If history repeats itself at least
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I wouldn't bet on it. Sure, the 05/06 Renault and some of the stuff in the early 80s were cars that could really win races if they made it to the finishing line, but they were probably flattered by Alonso and Prost respectively.

Getting up there isn't that easy nowadays considering that we have 4 other teams spending 400+ million with the same intent and locking up desirable talent.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Good for Hulkenberg, next year should not be great (but a good step forward from this year), but 2018 onwards should be fun once they get the right people in the right places there.
 
D

dubc35

Member
I didn't know he had a pole position back in his rookie year. It made me starting to look into the 2010 season. I need to go back and watch that. In going back and looking at the driver numbers, I kind of miss the assigned numbers based on previous year's performance.
 
F

Fisico

Member
dubc35 said:
I didn't know he had a pole position back in his rookie year. It made me starting to look into the 2010 season. I need to go back and watch that. In going back and looking at the driver numbers, I kind of miss the assigned numbers based on previous year's performance.
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The car was garbage and he ended up 8th or something like that though, it just seems like Williams wanted to have the spotlights to look good for sponsors or something (that and Hulk looking for a seat likely).

I don't remember the rules that year but they probably compromised their races to get the pole, the same way you could in 2003 when you could just not put much fuel in the car to gain extra tenths and get the pole (though that strategy worked sometimes).

EDIT

I remember that pole lap in Interlagos. The asphalt was moist and he had the luck to hit the track at the best time possible to get that pole.
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Yeah I do remember there were special circumstances, wasn't able to pinpoint what it was exactly, thanks :p
 
D

DD

Member
Fisico said:
The car was garbage and he ended up 8th or something like that though, it just seems like Williams wanted to have the spotlights to look good for sponsors or something (that and Hulk looking for a seat likely).

I don't remember the rules that year but they probably comprised their races to get the pole, the same way you could in 2003 when you could just not put much fuel in the car to gain extra tenths and get the pole (though that strategy worked sometimes).
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I remember that pole lap in Interlagos. The asphalt was moist and he had the luck to hit the track at the best time possible to get that pole.
 
F

Fisico

Member
Zaru said:
I wouldn't bet on it. Sure, the 05/06 Renault and some of the stuff in the early 80s were cars that could really win races if they made it to the finishing line, but they were probably flattered by Alonso and Prost respectively.

Getting up there isn't that easy nowadays considering that we have 4 other teams spending 400+ million with the same intent and locking up desirable talent.
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Well Renault also won the Hungarian GP in 2003 and the Monaco GP in 2004 and they also won races right in their third year in 1979.

I'm not necessary saying championship contenders, but landing podiums regularly and occasionally have the chance to win a race on a good day, for the near future I only see Mercedes Red Bull and Ferrari staying at the stop, but in 2018 could be up there the same way they were a few years ago.
(seems more likely than Mc Honda at least)

10 years ago the big teams were also spending hundreds of millions (I remember Toyota and Ferrari being >300 millions in 2003 with McLaren and Williams not being that far behind >200M) Renault was spending less than that and it didn't stop them for winning races and eventually the titles.

It's still the "same" team that won races and titles twenty years and ten years ago, they're not starting from scratch so they will be up there eventually, when and on a constant basis or not is another matter.
 
Mastah

Mastah

Member
DD said:
I remember that pole lap in Interlagos. The asphalt was moist and he had the luck to hit the track at the best time possible to get that pole.
Click to expand...

But it has to be mentioned that he has done 2 laps good enough for pole, so it wasn't any fluke. Besides, Williams had fantastic car in such conditions, they were 2nd and 4th in Q1 at Suzuka, when track was drying too.
 
D

DD

Member
Mastah said:
But it has to be mentioned that he has done 2 laps good enough for pole, so it wasn't any fluke. Besides, Williams had fantastic car in such conditions, they were 2nd and 4th in Q1 at Suzuka, when track was drying too.
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Williams was (and still is) a weird team. What about that time in 2012 when they decided to test rear facing exhausts that would be mandatory from 2013 onwards instead of the "superior" coanda exhausts they were using that season, which gave Maldonado his only win in Formula 1, in one of the worst seasons in Williams history? :D
 
M

malyce

Member
DD said:
Williams was (and still is) a weird team. What about that time in 2012 when they decided to test rear facing exhausts that would be mandatory from 2013 onwards instead of the "superior" coanda exhausts they were using that season, which gave Maldonado his only win in Formula 1, in one of the worst seasons in Williams history? :D
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Maldonado only won that race because mclaren fucked up Lewis' quali.
 
Fox Mulder

Fox Mulder

Member
Zaru said:
I wouldn't bet on it. Sure, the 05/06 Renault and some of the stuff in the early 80s were cars that could really win races if they made it to the finishing line, but they were probably flattered by Alonso and Prost respectively.

Getting up there isn't that easy nowadays considering that we have 4 other teams spending 400+ million with the same intent and locking up desirable talent.
Click to expand...

I have more hope in them than Williams or FI really. The Renault engine seems solid enough now and isnt giving Redbull the fits it was the last few years. Improve the chassis along with this signing of better drivers and they could be near the top again.
 
Z

Zaru

Member
Fox Mulder said:
I have more hope in them than Williams or FI really.
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Well those two teams are budget-constrained. For spending half as much as the teams above (or in case of Williams in previous years, below!), they're doing about as well as they realistically can.
Renault seems to want to play in the 400mil big league. Or at least they have to if they want to be more than best of the rest after the current big three.
 
S

Staab

Member
I'm very happy for Hulkenberg, sounds like a good move !
Always been impressed by him but I think he lost motivation 2 years ago, being stuck at FI without much opportunity to do better...

Really hope he's in it for the long run and can flourish at Renault :D
 
E

ElTorro

I wanted to dominate the living room. Then I took an ESRAM in the knee.
DrM said:
"Ferrari is no longer a team, but a group of scared people" says former chief engineer Luca Baldisserri
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No wonder. I never understand this stupid impulse to fire people if they aren't immediately number one in a very competitive environment. A team needs time to grow, and it can't do that if you fire good people every year just because your management style is driven by the mentality of a 10-year-old brat. Not even Schumacher, Tod and Brawn won championships right out of the gate.
 
B

brotkasten

Member
jey_16 said:
Marchionne seems like a control freak....should have just left Arrivabene and Allison do their own thing, there were always going to setbacks

wouldn't be surprised if next year is a disaster
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I mean, what the fuck do you expect, when you set the title as the goal, right after you bounce back a little from a shitty year and car that was 2014.

"2016 should be the year for us to return to the top," said Marchionne. "Our investments have not been lacking.
"We want to present ourselves in Australia as the team to beat. We know that our rivals are strong, but we are not afraid of them as we are the most successful team in the history of formula one," he insisted.
 
N

NHale

Member
Jibbed said:
Wehrlein in talks with Force India, as is K-Mag.

Sounds like Renault want a clean slate.
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K-Mag has no shot of landing that seat. That seat has Wehrlein written all over it because of the Mercedes ties with FI. If you can get cheaper engines while still getting a real fast driver (if the hype is to be believed), you are going to take it.

If Bottas is really going to Renault in a 1-year deal (apparently Renault wants to keep a 2018 seat open for Alonso or Sainz) then Magnussen needs to keep talking with Claire right away. Unless of course Wehrlein is going to Williams...

Ocon has ties with Mercedes as well and I've read somewhere that Force India shown interest in him.

Manor is empty to take every spare drivers that Sauber doesn't want guys! (It will probably be Kvyat and Giovanazzi)
 
D

DrM

Redmond's Baby
NHale said:
Ocon has ties with Mercedes as well and I've read somewhere that Force India shown interest in him.

Manor is empty to take every spare drivers that Sauber doesn't want guys! (It will probably be Kvyat and Giovanazzi)
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Looks like infos were wrong and FI will get Wehrlein, I can see Ocon staying one more year at Manor (he could be interesting for Force India for 2018, if Checo leaves for Ferrari). In that case I see as second Manor driver somebody with significant money backing.
 
C

chadskin

Member
Considering Ocon came in mid-season and was almost immediately on pace with Wehrlein and actually beat him last weekend, it remains to be seen if the Wehrlein hype was justified.

He's probably going to be driving for his F1 career at Force India if he gets the seat.
 
N

NHale

Member
DrM said:
Looks like infos were wrong and FI will get Wehrlein, I can see Ocon staying one more year at Manor (he could be interesting for Force India for 2018, if Checo leaves for Ferrari). In that case I see as second Manor driver somebody with significant money backing.
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Assuming the Bottas rumors are true then who goes to Williams? Nasr? That would be a very risky pairing for next year...
 
P

PdotMichael

Banned
DD said:
I remember that pole lap in Interlagos. The asphalt was moist and he had the luck to hit the track at the best time possible to get that pole.
Click to expand...

I mean if a slow team gets a pole or even wins a race then that's the result of many factors.

But they were there, just remember how Perez threw a victory away because of a mistake.
 
T

tomtom94

Member
Fox Mulder

Fox Mulder

Member
NHale said:
K-Mag has no shot of landing that seat. That seat has Wehrlein written all over it because of the Mercedes ties with FI. If you can get cheaper engines while still getting a real fast driver (if the hype is to be believed), you are going to take it.
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I thought I read somewhere that Mercedes doesn't want to offer an engine discount for wehrlein anymore because he's so good or whatever.
 
C

chadskin

Member
tomtom94 said:
http://grandprixrankings.com/compare/2016-f1/wehrlein-versus-ocon/

Not quite sure where you're getting that from, especially considering Ocon had been doing FP1 sessions as well.
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To be fair, Ocon had technical issues in Spa (brakes) and Monza (electronics) and the pitstops screwed up his race in Singapore (1st stop took 75 seconds, 3rd stop 15 seconds).

Last two races, he was 0.1s and 0.2s respectively quicker in qualifying, lost to Wehrlein by a second in the race in Sepang and finished the race in Suzuka 17 seconds ahead of Wehrlein. For a guy who didn't have the chance to drive the Manor in pre-season tests and influence the direction of the development of the car, that's pretty good in my book.

I don't think results necessarily tell the whole story here, especially after just five races.

edit: Also just remembered they changed his seating position for the Malaysian GP and he felt more comfortable since: http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ocon-boosted-by-revised-seating-position-835251/
 
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