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FRIDAYTON MK II: 5.5 million bears and salmon create unholy allliance to sack SONY HQ

P

p3tran

Banned
kewlmyc said:
I'm pretty sure a lot of people in here don't know how RAM works.
Click to expand...
Dirk Benedict said:
One way to find out.
Majestic-Ram.jpg
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majestic-ram4.5qbz1p.jpg
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.
 
T

ThoughtsOfSpeaking

Banned
perineumlick said:
Your username should be "ThoughtsOfNotSpeaking".
Click to expand...


Attack the name not the arguement. Cute. My point stands. In terms of value proposition, how has the PS4 not lost ground against the Xbox 1. Whether 4.5gb of ram is "good enough" for now is besides the point? The console was promoted as something and now we find it is something else. Im not going to do the same mental gymnastics to be ok with that. Less ram + More OS bloat = worth less money. Simples.
 
N

Nuts.Pistachio_Nuts!

Member
Lol this thread

Give me 4x TLOU everyday the rest of my life I'd die happy. I think we're too jaded honestly. Just 3 years ago 2 gbs on my laptop was a godsend.

Just loom at it thia way you're still getting mustang just not with custom spinners lol wow.
 
B

BleachAndPepsi

Banned
ThoughtsOfSpeaking said:
Outside of stupid gifs do you have something to argue? because if you do, lets hear it. Why should I buy on day one the same console that is now more limited in in scope than known previously? I dont want a Media box. I want a games console.
Click to expand...
It is a games console. They're reserving some RAM just in case. Devs (aka those who actually know what the fuck is going on) have absolutely no problem with the PS4 RAM. John Bellomy (from Naughty Dog) tweeted that their devs are "giddy" about the GPU, and that "the amount of parallel execution available is just nutso," which has me thinking this truly is a damn fine console.

Let's just step back, take a breath, and realize that the console is a) still more powerful than its competition at a lower price, and b) still just as capable a machine as it was yesterday (meaning every kind thing a developer has said about it and its power still holds up, since they've known about this since forever).
 
G

GoofsterStud

Member
kevm3 said:
If the OS is so horribly unoptimized as to require 3.5 GB of RAM, that's a problem. With that much RAM being blocked off, we should have a 3d interface along the lines of something akin to Home, but much better that we log in to. At least the 3GB of RAM being blocked off on the One is being used for something. People ridiculed the One for MS blocking off so much RAM and not being game-oriented, so Sony deserves just as much, and in my opinion, MORE criticism for actually blocking off more RAM and not doing anything of note with it. The one is kinect integrated, has all the DVR functionality and is running 3 OSs... so it at least is being used for a purpose, which I don't particularly care for as I'd rather have those resources be available for games. What has Sony shown that could possibly take up 3.5, much less 2 GB of RAM in the OS?
Click to expand...

What we know.
Xbox One is no DVR subsititute... Got that one out of the way.

What we don't know
If PS4 OS is built with move capabilities like the Xbox One OS.

What we really don't know
How accurate all of this is.
 
Gold_Loot

Gold_Loot

Member
I swear to god I stepped into some strange bizarre realm where GAF has turned into some strange carnival of stupid. The hell is going on in here?
 
K

kaching

"GAF's biggest wanker"
Piggus said:
It amazes me how many people are forgetting that the OS can be streamlined and optimized to use less RAM, which is what they did on PS3. Do any of you honestly think Sony won't attempt to optimize the OS as the generation goes on?
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They've almost doubled the RAM allocation for OS just to have a huge reserve for ???

This isn't a matter of mere "streamlining". This is a matter of having an effective sense of the direction you want to take the console in. Putting aside that much RAM "just in case" doesn't convey that they have a good sense of where their priorities are.
 
P

perineumlick

Member
OryoN said:
And for all that, I don't think there will ever be a point where the average gamer will look at both systems and and think: "Wow, PS4 is way more powerful than XB1!".
The fact that the 'weaker' and yet 'more difficult to program' console(according to Mark Cerny's own breakdown on architectural choice differences) is holding it's own pretty well, should be a reminder that there's a whole lot more to performance than raw theoretical numbers.

Once you've crossed a certain threshold - as both of these consoles have - you're going to need a whole lot more than 50% more raw power to show a significant difference on screen. In fact, I predict that the best exclusive games on both consoles will generally stand head-to-head, and 5 yrs down the line, the bulk of PS-GAF will keep insisting: "That major graphical leap over XB1 is coming... just wait... any day now... "
Click to expand...
I've saved this post for future reference.
 
P

Playsation_

Banned
OK, if true, the PS4 has nothing to offer for me. Underwhelming games, underwhelming features, and its starting to look like a specs upgrade of the PS3 with nothing innovative to offer.
My girlfriend wants a Xbone anyway because of the voice control, motion sensory and instant switch.
Oh well, I should try something new anyway.
 
C

CadetMahoney

Member
quest said:
I am paying 399.99 for 8gigs and to have almost half wasted on features I don't want is not good. There is nothing but bloat. . .
Click to expand...
Sony should clear up these rumors soon or identify why the extra stuff when x1 has Kinect and stuff to explain the bloat. It still has the more powerful console so this isn't a big setback/

Vashetti said:
Some people are going to be shocked when they play these new consoles on their 1080p TVs.
Click to expand...
1080p but lots of motion blur and framedrops below 30fps amirite?
 
Hydrargyrus

Hydrargyrus

Member
So, when they only had 4GB, they talked to the most important developers (and his first party studios) and all that they did was to put another 4GB that no one could use and that no one wants for shitty things in the OS... and increase the price.

Bravo Sony.
 
F

farisr

Member
Mung said:
How does the fact that resolution isn't really increasing this time around affect system and RAM requirements? Last gen had a lot higher res bump to deal with. This time it's very similar... Less increase in pixels to eat up memory? More emphasis on quality?
Click to expand...

Pixel counts:

ps2/xbox = 307,200 (some games on the xbox could do 1,036,800)

ps3/360 = 921,600 (a good amount of games do less than that, some less intensive games do 2,073,600.)

ps4/x1 = 2,073,600 (I doubt we'll be seeing any games less than that).

So yeah, just looking at that. The max pixel counts that the Xbox/PS2 gen could deliver was actually higher than the standard resolution we game in, in this gen.

The max pixel count this gen could deliver on was what is going to be standard in next-gen.

So, doesn't seem like a small jump to me.
 
B

BurnOutBrighter

Banned
ThoughtsOfSpeaking said:
Attack the name not the arguement. Cute. My point stands. In terms of value proposition, how has the PS4 not lost ground against the Xbox 1. Whether 4.5gb of ram is "good enough" for now is besides the point? The console was promoted as something and now we find it is something else. Im not going to do the same mental gymnastics to be ok with that. Less ram + More OS bloat = worth less money. Simples.
Click to expand...

It was advertised as 8GB of RAM, and that's what you're getting.
 
D

dragonbane

Member
PlanetSmasher said:
Here's hoping. It's still just such a "wind out of the sails" moment to have such an easily explained advantage taken away, even if it can be recovered from later.
Click to expand...
True. But devs just don't need it right now, so Sony is doing the right thing here. It would be troubling if just one dev would complain, but no one is doing it. Every dev is going to max out the GPU first before ever hitting 4.5 GB of RAM. It is better this way than fucking up the launch with a slow messy OS. It will be bloated, but it will be fast and responsive Day 1 unlike the WiiU. Games will look great. Sony can work their magic in the background and reduce the bloat while keeping the OS just as responsive with optimizing. No one will notice and devs will get the RAM once they need it.

It is really the best strategy. Not for message boards pre-release, but for the actual launch and the word of mouth.
 
C

Cidd

Member
To be honest I was expecting a lot worse. 4.5/5.5GB for games and will increase as time goes on and the OS is optimized isn't bad. A spec downgrade would be a nightmare but this meh.

I think Sony is just trying to stay equal with MS after what happened with the PS3 and the whole cross game chat thing.
 
G

GoofsterStud

Member
Playsation_ said:
OK, if true, the PS4 has nothing to offer for me. Underwhelming games, underwhelming features, and its starting to look like a specs upgrade of the PS3 with nothing innovative to offer.
My girlfriend wants a Xbone anyway because of the voice control, motion sensory and instant switch.
Oh well, I should try something new anyway.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you were sold on the Xbox One from day One.

PS4 still offers 50% gpu upgrade. That is a lot more than any ram difference will ever be for gaming. >.> Don't kid yourself the PS4 is still the powerhouse with the better ram.
 
W

Wynnebeck

Banned
OryoN said:
And for all that, I don't think there will ever be a point where the average gamer will look at both systems and and think: "Wow, PS4 is way more powerful than XB1!".
The fact that the 'weaker' and yet 'more difficult to program' console(according to Mark Cerny's own breakdown on architectural choice differences) is holding it's own pretty well, should be a reminder that there's a whole lot more to performance than raw theoretical numbers.

Once you've crossed a certain threshold - as both of these consoles have - you're going to need a whole lot more than 50% more raw power to show a significant difference on screen. In fact, I predict that the best exclusive games on both consoles will generally stand head-to-head, and 5 yrs down the line, the bulk of PS-GAF will keep insisting: "That major graphical leap over XB1 is coming... just wait... any day now... "
Click to expand...

So pray tell how Xbone is going to output better graphics than its rival which has already been technically proven to be stronger?
 
I

iammeiam

Member
Gold_Loot said:
I swear to god I stepped into some strange bizarre realm where GAF has turned into some strange carnival of stupid. The hell is going on in here?
Click to expand...

One side senses a potential chink in the other's previously flawless armor, and is moving in for the kill, even though the damage is largely cosmetic. The other side is desperately trying to pretend that what was lost was never bandied about as an advantage before. Honor is on the line!

Also rams.
 
A

amr

Banned
Cidd said:
To be honest I was expecting a lot worse. 4.5/5.5GB for games and will increase as time goes on and the OS is optimized. A spec downgrade would be a nightmare but this meh.

I think Sony is just trying to stay equal with the MS after what happened with the PS3 and the whole cross game chat thing.
Click to expand...
Stop being reasonable!
 
P

Pristine_Condition

Member
Orayn said:
I was going with YouTube's recommended settings for uploading, which are admittedly kinda high. If you got that figure from downloading a video, I believe it's because YouTube transcodes/compresses to a lower bitrate for playback.
Click to expand...

I got that figure from a pro video editor who I work with a lot. (I'm a photographer/videographer by trade.) His biggest client is an action sports company that does a lot of HD YouTube stuff for promotions.
 
T

ThoughtsOfSpeaking

Banned
BleachAndPepsi said:
It is a games console. They're reserving some RAM just in case. Devs (aka those who actually know what the fuck is going on) have absolutely no problem with the PS4 RAM. John Bellomy (from Naughty Dog) tweeted that their devs are "giddy" about the GPU, and that "the amount of parallel execution available is just nutso," which has me thinking this truly is a damn fine console.

Let's just step back, take a breath, and realize that the console is a) still more powerful than its competition at a lower price, and b) still just as capable a machine as it was yesterday (meaning every kind thing a developer has said about it and its power still holds up, since they've known about this since forever).
Click to expand...

Its not as capable as it was yesterday. Again the fact that is still more capable than its competition is beside the point.

Listen, im not saying its suddenly a piece of shit. It is still a damn fine console. But now have reservations on its limitations and would rather wait and see how things play out, rather than ignore my better judgement and be a day one adopter, which rarely ever works out.
 
I

ironchair

Banned
ThoughtsOfSpeaking said:
Attack the name not the arguement. Cute. My point stands. In terms of value proposition, how has the PS4 not lost ground against the Xbox 1. Whether 4.5gb of ram is "good enough" for now is besides the point? The console was promoted as something and now we find it is something else. Im not going to do the same mental gymnastics to be ok with that. Less ram + More OS bloat = worth less money. Simples.
Click to expand...
But it still is the same thing, and the RAM allocation is not set in stone and can be changed later on once the OS footprint has diminished. There is still 8GB DDR5 in the console, nothing has been downgraded.
 
I

i-Lo

Member
Playsation_ said:
OK, if true, the PS4 has nothing to offer for me. Underwhelming games, underwhelming features, and its starting to look like a specs upgrade of the PS3 with nothing innovative to offer.
My girlfriend wants a Xbone anyway because of the voice control, motion sensory and instant switch.
Oh well, I should try something new anyway.
Click to expand...

Launch games. In a 6+ year life cycle if that's going to be your final decision not to buy it through its lifespan then it's asinine. Pertaining to features, we don't know a lot but remote play and 15 minutes recording (that I don't remember anyone specifically asking for, livestreaming notwithstanding) are exclusive to PS4.

Xbone will be a good investment as well, but for me, not at $500 with that kind of spec.
 
N

Nozem

Member
This is unacceptable!

Preorder canceled, I trashed my PS3, and tomorrow I'm getting an Xbox One tattoo on my forehead.
 
M

Markadias

Banned
Am I the only one who thinks people are massively overreacting here? Sony were going to stick 4gb in there, would people really care at this stage?
I mean... The Last of Us was made with 512mb for crying out loud.

I mean it does kinda suck that Sony are using a lot for the OS... But what if the OS is awesome?

The Wii U is going to churn out amazing games, and that has 2gb... With even less available for devs (1gb I believe?)

Like it has been said many times in this thread already, Sony don't want to be left missing out on features like cross game chat this time due to RAM constraints. So it makes sense to have plenty in reserve.

Pre-orders being cancelled over this is bloody silly in my opinion. But hey ho... Each to their own.
 
SEGAvangelist

SEGAvangelist

Member
GoofsterStud said:
Sounds like you were sold on the Xbox One from day One.

PS4 still offers 50% gpu upgrade. That is a lot more than any ram difference will ever be for gaming. >.> Don't kid yourself the PS4 is still the powerhouse with the better ram.
Click to expand...

Have you read his post history? He's been just as critical of Xbox One in other threads if I recall.
 
B

BleachAndPepsi

Banned
kaching said:
They've almost doubled the RAM allocation for OS just to have a huge reserve for ???

This isn't a matter of mere "streamlining". This is a matter of having an effective sense of the direction you want to take the console in. Putting aside that much RAM "just in case" doesn't convey that they have a good sense of where their priorities are.
Click to expand...
I would argue exactly the opposite.

They know devs will not be needing more than a few GB of RAM for the foreseeable future. They do not kow the kinds of OS improvements they could implement down the road, though I'm sure they have an idea where it's going. So for the time being, devs get 4.5-5.5GB and some is locked away just in case.

They don't have crystal balls there. They don't know exactly what they future will bring. But as they work to streamline OS code and implement new features, I'm sure more RAM will be unlocked for devs when they need it.
 
C

Corto

Member
Bigmac1910 said:
Not sure why I would be multitasking while I'm playing a game, would just break the immersion, but as long as it won't affect the games down the line I'll be ok.
Click to expand...

Checking a walkthrough or a video of that particular portion of the game where you're stuck. Video Chatting with friends in a picture-in-picture window while you play. Play a mini-game and switch instantly back and forth while you wait in a multiplayer lobby for some friends to join your party. And some multitasks could be running on the background (an email client, patch downloads from games in your library or firmware updates, etc).
 
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