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Halo |OT11| Forward Unto Dong

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R

Rickenslacker

Banned
MinkTANK said:
I missed the first 100 pages.

Can someone please summarize in the form of expressive dance ?
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is174CCD8EGjI.gif
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Tha Robbertster said:
How do you think the game would become imbalanced if the DMR (and Needle Rifle) were zero bloom, while the rest of the sandbox stayed the same? Sniper, GL and Rockets still work very well in MLG. I guess the shotgun would still work mostly the same. Same thing most power weapons actually. The only weapons that I think would be really affected are the AR and all the other weapons no one ever really use.
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Because 343 touched no other weapons to account for the fact that the DMR and NR are now firing at full speed with no spread.

Look at all the changes Bungie made in the Big Halo 2 TU. They didn't just remove spread from the BR and call it a day, they damn near touched everything they could, even the objectives objects. 343 just added a bloom change Megalo hook (which affects the DMR and NR at the same time) and a separate hook to explicitly be able to change the Magnum's ROF and damage. That was it.
 
K

Karl2177

Member
FyreWulff said:
Because 343 touched no other weapons to account for the fact that the DMR and NR are now firing at full speed with no spread.

Look at all the changes Bungie made in the Big Halo 2 TU. They didn't just remove spread from the BR and call it a day, they damn near touched everything they could, even the objectives objects. 343 just added a bloom change Megalo hook (which affects the DMR and NR at the same time) and a separate hook to explicitly be able to change the Magnum's ROF and damage.
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That makes me really curious. How much memory is devoted to a single hook? Is this why so many options of Megalo are kept away from the player?
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Karl2177 said:
That makes me really curious. How much memory is devoted to a single hook? Is this why so many options of Megalo are kept away from the player?
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We don't know exactly for sure but it was mentioned / hinted somewhere that the TU was never going to be in Invasion because there isn't enough script memory left over to put the TU into it even if they wanted to. The later updates to the Invasion script dropped the announcer saying "SKUNKED!", probably due to memory limits.

They did mention that there was consideration for TU options being present in the UI but that it was outside the time/budget (same with changing the Magnum's clip size) at the Halo TU Panel at Halofest. They seriously would have been better off including the CE Pistol on the Anniversary DLC maps then making a Megalo hook that spawned you with the gun; it's not like they ever planned to use the CE Pistol mode outside of any Anniversary DLC, even though the CE Mode Pistol works on all other Reach maps, including Forge World/Hemmorhage.

We STILL can't play Halo 1 Slayer on Blood Gulch in Reach matchmaking even though we have both the map and the gametype sitting right there. Usuable. Tested. Just doesn't exist. They never seem to want to make it available outside of the Anniversary map paywall.
 
T

Tha Robbertster

Member
FyreWulff said:
Because 343 touched no other weapons to account for the fact that the DMR and NR are now firing at full speed with no spread.

Look at all the changes Bungie made in the Big Halo 2 TU. They didn't just remove spread from the BR and call it a day, they damn near touched everything they could, even the objectives objects. 343 just added a bloom change Megalo hook (which affects the DMR and NR at the same time) and a separate hook to explicitly be able to change the Magnum's ROF and damage. That was it.
Click to expand...

So in your opinion, the the DMR's and NR's killtimes are now to fast when you compare them to the other (non power)weapons?

I don't agree with it but I can see where you're coming from.
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Tha Robbertster said:
So in your opinion, the the DMR's and NR's killtimes are now to fast when you compare them to the other (non power)weapons?

I don't agree with it but I can see where you're coming from.
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Too fast within the way the rest of the sandbox is set up. If they had modified the rest of the sandbox to accomodate the more lethal DMR, NR, and Pistol under Zero Bloom and then made the TU global from day 1 things, I'd be a lot happier. As it is, they had the ability to RoF lock the DMR to achieve both zero bloom and avoid havoc in the sandbox, but didn't do it. They pushed bleedthrough into mainline matchmaking, with weapons and player feedback designed with the lack of bleedthrough in mind.

As it is, the ZB Magnum alone makes even the Shotgun obsolete at shotgun range. I still remember the HaloGAF customs.
 
K

kylej

Banned
Most money Microsoft has ever spend on a game. That's the Forge we get.

Why is Certain Affinity still allowed to work on Halo products?
 
K

Karl2177

Member
FyreWulff said:
We don't know exactly for sure but it was mentioned / hinted somewhere that the TU was never going to be in Invasion because there isn't enough script memory left over to put the TU into it even if they wanted to. The later updates to the Invasion script dropped the announcer saying "SKUNKED!", probably due to memory limits.

They did mention that there was consideration for TU options being present in the UI but that it was outside the time/budget (same with changing the Magnum's clip size) at the Halo TU Panel at Halofest. They seriously would have been better off including the CE Pistol on the Anniversary DLC maps then making a Megalo hook that spawned you with the gun; it's not like they ever planned to use the CE Pistol mode outside of any Anniversary DLC, even though the CE Mode Pistol works on all other Reach maps, including Forge World/Hemmorhage.

We STILL can't play Halo 1 Slayer on Blood Gulch in Reach matchmaking even though we have both the map and the gametype sitting right there. Usuable. Tested. Just doesn't exist. They never seem to want to make it available outside of the Anniversary map paywall.
Click to expand...

I remember this much. I'm talking about future iterations of Megalo like say in Halo 4 or future games. Essentially the custom game options are blocks of Megalo, compared to the developer sliders, correct? Well, what is keeping the end user from those same dials and switches that the evelopers have? I guess to clarify my question is: With future generations of Xboxes and more memory, could Megalo options be hooked into the UI? Or could the same options be presented to the player without having to sacrifice memory from graphics/networking/etc.?
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
ElzarTheBam said:
Lol, unsurprising.

I liked popular revolt god dammit.
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Yeah, me too, but I wanted something that at least referenced my GAF name. Then I changed my mind. Then I changed my mind again. Wasted $40 or something, haha.

OH WELL
 
T

Tha Robbertster

Member
FyreWulff said:
Too fast within the way the rest of the sandbox is set up. If they had modified the rest of the sandbox to accomodate the more lethal DMR, NR, and Pistol under Zero Bloom and then made the TU global from day 1 things, I'd be a lot happier. As it is, they had the ability to RoF lock the DMR to achieve both zero bloom and avoid havoc in the sandbox, but didn't do it. They pushed bleedthrough into mainline matchmaking, with weapons and player feedback designed with the lack of bleedthrough in mind.

As it is, the ZB Magnum alone makes even the Shotgun obsolete at shotgun range. I still remember the HaloGAF customs.
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Ah okay. I agree with you that the tittle update should have looked at the whole game and how the things it fixed would affect other aspects of the game.
 
H

heckfu

Banned
kittens said:
Yeah, me too, but I wanted something that at least referenced my GAF name. Then I changed my mind. Then I changed my mind again. Wasted $40 or something, haha.

OH WELL
Click to expand...

Holy shit I've forgotten about Popular Revolt. My my, look at where the time has gone.
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Karl2177 said:
I remember this much. I'm talking about future iterations of Megalo like say in Halo 4 or future games. Essentially the custom game options are blocks of Megalo, compared to the developer sliders, correct? Well, what is keeping the end user from those same dials and switches that the evelopers have? I guess to clarify my question is: With future generations of Xboxes and more memory, could Megalo options be hooked into the UI? Or could the same options be presented to the player without having to sacrifice memory from graphics/networking/etc.?
Click to expand...

They could. They already are in Reach - one of the submenus in the Gametype options is populated by what the designer puts into the script. So in Assault, all the Assault Options are there because the Megalo script put them there.

But newer consoles would definitely give you more breathing room for more flexible options like that. I guess there wasn't enough memory to add both the TU and a TU options UI, or they just didn't want to fuck with the UI codebase more than they had to. Personally, even without UI I would have done it in a roundabout way; I would have added a BLOOM_FACTOR label to every TU gametype. You'd apply this to an invisible hill object on a map, and it's Spawn Sequence would have determined the bloom of the DMR while playing on that map.

Also, I'll answer your PM now, I got distracted when I went to go reply to it last time :p
 
T

TCKaos

Member
kylej said:
Most money Microsoft has ever spend on a game. That's the Forge we get.

Why is Certain Affinity still allowed to work on Halo products?
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Disc space. It was enough to justify having to create a second disc just to house all of this stuff. You can only do so much when the technologically limitations of the system come in to play.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
TCKaos said:
Disc space. It was enough to justify having to create a second disc just to house all of this stuff. You can only do so much when the technologically limitations of the system come in to play.
Click to expand...

I'd love the developers to be frank about what they can and can't do based on tech limitations. Yeah, it makes your product sound less cool, but if there are technical reasons or things that get cut or lost based on prioritizing, I'd love to know about them.

Also, nice to see the Erosion lagoon is pretty big. Might be a better place to Forge flat than I thought.
 
H

Homeboyd

Member
I would love a standalone Forge "package"... even if it was sold separately. I just... love it. :/


Edit: Also, JellyCrackers is fucking awesome. That is all.
 
U

User 73706

Banned
Financially speaking, is there a downside to releasing games on multiple discs minus the obvious printing cost? It may be me being dumb, but I feel like a game with an expanded feature set (or even Halo 4, but with a fully fleshed-out feature set, campaign theater, etc.) and three discs would earn more than enough revenue to pay it off as long as there was a digital download for it. Someone mind explaining?
 
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