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[Rickenslacker]

I'd also love to see co-op play out as truly different characters. Halo 3 did it best imo with the Arbiter and cohorts rather than just 2-4 Chiefs or 2-4 Rookies or 2-4 Noble Sixes. For a game so focused on co-op I've always wondered why they went this route.

I think it's because Halo was never afraid to be "gamey". The multiple Noble Six route was a pretty smart one with the character customization in the game.

 

[Barrow Roll]

But dark and gritty brown and gray is next-gen.

But this is current gen.

Speaking of which, Gears of War 3 has embraced color to it's fullest. It looks amazing.

 

[NullPointer]

The multiple Noble Six route was a pretty smart one with the character customization in the game.

It was smart, but it was also a missed opportunity. The customization alone has me watching each and every cutscene in campaign replays just to see how cool my current spartan looks, but when playing co-op you never see your friends in those cut-scenes. Its just a weird disconnect that I'd only expect form a game that added co-op late in the series, not for one that started with it.

 

[Ken]

But this is current gen.

Speaking of which, Gears of War 3 has embraced color to it's fullest. It looks amazing.

Then Halo 7 should be next-gen by the time that comes out.

 

[Tawpgun]

I'd love to see the Elites again as allies, but with an agenda that clearly isn't totally in tune with Chief and Cortana.

This sounds interesting.

 

[Plywood]

Halo 4 on the Corrine engine not the Bungalow 500 engine, kthxbai.

 

[MrBig]

Speaking of which, Gears of War 3 has embraced color to it's fullest. It looks amazing.

The turn around from Gears 1 is great. Halo and Gears are pretty much the last mainline games to embrace hand drawn textures, and to have a definitive style.

 

[Steelyuhas]

I'd love to see the Elites again as allies, but with an agenda that clearly isn't totally in tune with Chief and Cortana.

Agreed, that would be interesting.

True, but I guess I was talking more about the maps. I don't like how the environments in MP and Campaign were almost exactly the same. I like what they did in the first 3 Halo games. The MP maps shared the same aesthetic as Campaign maps, but the layouts were completely different.

Oh Yeah I agree on that. Even Bungie said after Reach came out that if they were to do it over again, they wouldn't have done that.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Good to hear. I'll wait on the paperback because I am currently read A Song of Ice and Fire. I just finished A Clash of Kings and I'm going to start A Storm of Swords later today.

From the looks of it the paper back version is already out!?? I checked Amazon and I can order it right now which is odd as before the date was set as September?

 

[RebornYeti]

Oh Yeah I agree on that. Even Bungie said after Reach came out that if they were to do it over again, they wouldn't have done that.

That's good then. Hopefully 343i follows that example and realize that's it's not a good idea.

 

[Striker]

I'd also love to see co-op play out as truly different characters. Halo 3 did it best imo with the Arbiter and cohorts rather than just 2-4 Chiefs or 2-4 Rookies or 2-4 Noble Sixes. For a game so focused on co-op I've always wondered why they went this route.

We had a butchered Arbiter whose story wasn't as fleshed out nearly as much as it should have, and two random infantry classed Elites.

 

[NullPointer]

We had a butchered Arbiter whose story wasn't as fleshed out nearly as much as it should have, and two random infantry classed Elites.

Well yeah, I'd like a better version of what was attempted in Halo 3. Like for Reach if the players were Noble Six, Seven, Eight and Nine. Although it would've looked funny to see Jorge toss each one of us out of that ship ;P

Its not a dealbreaker by any means, its just always been a nitpick, especially after seeing how it could play out in games like Gears of War.

 

[Tunavi]

I've got like 45 minutes left on my 48 hour trial. GET ONLINE PEOPLE

 

[Domino Theory]

Why do some of you want the fiction to hold true in multiplayer, too? I think weapons like the Battle Rifle, Plasma Grenade, Sword, etc. should all be included in multiplayer. For campaign? Go ahead and limit the sandbox for the sake of fiction and level design.

For multiplayer? Go crazy.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

All this talk is interesting, personally I dont really want 343 to sideline the Covenant just yet, as quite frankly unless they copy the same archtypes I just dont see how they can make an enemy as fun to fight. I would love for them to flesh out the flood/ Forerunners and for us to get amazing 3 way battles going but I dont think the new enemies should take the spotlight. 343 already have a lot to prove without totally changing the dynamic of the combat lol.

I hope Halo 4 is in the same style as the older Halo games, but I would LOVE to see a ODST 2 type game where they really do push a dark gritty tone. It would be pretty interesting to get a Halo squad based shooter where it really requires teamwork to take on the hunter pair blocking your way. ODST and Reach seemed like they were going down this route, but pulled out late on. I think it would be awesome to have a squad where there was a dedicated Sniper, and that actually meant something for example.

Keep that shit away from my mainline Halo, but a covert ops Halo game which required stealth tactics and cunning would be awesome.

 

[NullPointer]

As someone who prefers campaign and co-op modes over multiplayer I just realized that I'd be far more excited to see another ODST than a Halo 4. Strange.

 

[Steelyuhas]

From the looks of it the paper back version is already out!?? I checked Amazon and I can order it right now which is odd as before the date was set as September?

Amazon says the paperback will be released on September 13th. Of course you can order now if you want to.

 

[RebornYeti]

Why do some of you want the fiction to hold true in multiplayer, too? I think weapons like the Battle Rifle, Plasma Grenade, Sword, etc. should all be included in multiplayer. For campaign? Go ahead and limit the sandbox for the sake of fiction and level design.

For multiplayer? Go crazy.

Yes. This.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Amazon says the paperback will be released on September 13th. Of course you can order now if you want to.

I just ordered it now

Halo: Cryptum: Book One of the Forerunner Trilogy [Paperback]
Delivery estimate of 23 July 2011 - 26 July 2011


odd?

Even odder, theres another paperback listed price of about 1.50 cheaper, im not sure how to access that price, but maybe thats the price in September, im confused but if I get my novel this week ill be happy.

 

[Domino Theory]

As someone who prefers campaign and co-op modes over multiplayer I just realized that I'd be far more excited to see another ODST than a Halo 4. Strange.

I hope that Halo 4's campaign is built off of the structure from Halo 3: ODST with some tweaks here and there and, of course, cranked up to 11.

 

[Steelyuhas]

I just ordered it now

Halo: Cryptum: Book One of the Forerunner Trilogy [Paperback]
Delivery estimate of 23 July 2011 - 26 July 2011


odd?

Even odder, theres another paperback listed price of about 1.50 cheaper, im not sure how to access that price, but maybe thats the price in September, im confused but if I get my novel this week ill be happy.

Interesting...Let me know if you get the book this week lol

 

[Tawpgun]

Why do some of you want the fiction to hold true in multiplayer, too? I think weapons like the Battle Rifle, Plasma Grenade, Sword, etc. should all be included in multiplayer. For campaign? Go ahead and limit the sandbox for the sake of fiction and level design.

For multiplayer? Go crazy.

So much truth.



Or at least the option of having those weapons.

 

[Tunavi]

Dat ass

 

[Risen]

Matchmaking seems to work well most of the time when its all randoms. As soon as parties are mixed in it seems to go south. One of the biggest problems to me is guests. I don't care if guests play, in fact they should, but they shouldn't be matched up with my party of 4 or 5. I think guest parties should be matched against other guest parties. I think its safe to assume the vast majority of the time the guests are new or or less frequent players.

Also, I've had similar experiences to Devolution. When I go in alone, Trueskill seems to work great for the other team, but decides to give me lovely teammates.

Just to illustrate the point...

Guests:

http://www.bungie.net/stats/reach/gamestats.aspx?gameid=704990642&player=Risen%20GBG

Lovely Teammates - with Skill Restriction on:

http://www.bungie.net/stats/reach/gamestats.aspx?gameid=706563967&player=Risen%20GBG

These games are why some GAFers have "anecdotal" comments on why TruSkill isn't working as they wish it would. These aren't even anomalies... they are a regular experience.

As it is - if you are a player of skill, the only way to find competitive matches is to search in Arena or MLG. Go in either without a full party and even with the Skill restriction turned on - it does a better job of matching you AGAINST your skill level than with... which is equally important.

Most playlists are a sleepy affair outside of Arena and MLG as a result, and the only way to play a competitive Objective game is in MLG.

I don't remember Halo 3 having this same difficulty as often - but then again it had Ranked playlists.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I hope that Halo 4's campaign is built off of the structure from Halo 3: ODST with some tweaks here and there and, of course, cranked up to 11.

Same. If not one big hub area, then structure the game around a few major locations, each a hub. I was disappointed that Reach went back to the mission progression that the trilogy had.

 

[Risen]

Same. If not one big hub area, then structure the game around a few major locations, each a hub. I was disappointed that Reach went back to the mission progression that the trilogy had.

I loved the campaign structure in ODST too... I just found the parts between missions in the city boring. Playing through with friends on Legendary - I felt it needed far more enemies to make it more interesting.

 

[Tawpgun]

Same. If not one big hub area, then structure the game around a few major locations, each a hub. I was disappointed that Reach went back to the mission progression that the trilogy had.

Doesn't it have to?

Halo 4 without a linear structure is a bit weird. It worked for ODST's story mode. Now they COULD do something like Cheif finding something and a flashback mission to a forerunner... but that's out there.

I'd like Halo 4 to be more open ended, but it needs to be linear imo. I don't understand how else you would do it.

Even doing Reach in ODST style would be impossible.

 

[Ken]

Even doing Reach in ODST style would be impossible.

Why's that?

 

[Domino Theory]

Doesn't it have to?

Halo 4 without a linear structure is a bit weird. It worked for ODST's story mode. Now they COULD do something like Cheif finding something and a flashback mission to a forerunner... but that's out there.

I'd like Halo 4 to be more open ended, but it needs to be linear imo. I don't understand how else you would do it.

Even doing Reach in ODST style would be impossible.

The mission design doesn't have to be exactly that of ODST where Chief is by himself going through flashbacks. It can be Chief exploring this open, mysterious planet that is inhabited by whoever is there. Think of it as a miniature Elder Scrolls/Fallout.

 

[Tawpgun]

Why's that?

Please, explain how it would be possible.

Covenant are attacking from Space. All over the planet. The planet gets glassed so unless you play the game in the future as a re-colonization team and are discovering remnants of the battle... flashbacks aren't happening. It's an ENTIRE PLANET. You can't have the hub world be the entire goddamn planet.

A hub world is pointless unless it's some sort of HQ, and you pick what battle you want to fight in and a loading screen takes you there. But that doesn't really fit in with a planet under attack for a month. Or if they stuck to a books, a planet under attack for a few hours.

The mission design doesn't have to be exactly that of ODST where Chief is by himself going through flashbacks. It can be Chief exploring this open, mysterious planet that is inhabited by whoever is there. Think of it as a miniature Elder Scrolls/Fallout.

For Halo 4 it COULD work, but the game would still need to progress along a certain path. Who knows. I can't see how anything that's too free-form could work. I want open levels with mutliple ways to approach encounters and such.

Also, for Gabotron.

http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=20934950&player=Tawpgun

 

[Hypertrooper]

I just ordered it now

Halo: Cryptum: Book One of the Forerunner Trilogy [Paperback]
Delivery estimate of 23 July 2011 - 26 July 2011


odd?

Even odder, theres another paperback listed price of about 1.50 cheaper, im not sure how to access that price, but maybe thats the price in September, im confused but if I get my novel this week ill be happy.

I don't know, but I guess the reason fo that delivery estimate is, that the book isn't officialy published in UK.(You live in the UK?) and they have to get it from the US warehouse.

 

[MrBig]

Please, explain how it would be possible.

Covenant are attacking from Space. All over the planet. The planet gets glassed so unless you play the game in the future as a re-colonization team and are discovering remnants of the battle... flashbacks aren't happening. It's an ENTIRE PLANET. You can't have the hub world be the entire goddamn planet.

A hub world is pointless unless it's some sort of HQ, and you pick what battle you want to fight in and a loading screen takes you there. But that doesn't really fit in with a planet under attack for a month. Or if they stuck to a books, a planet under attack for a few hours.


For Halo 4 it COULD work, but the game would still need to progress along a certain path. Who knows. I can't see how anything that's too free-form could work. I want open levels with mutliple ways to approach encounters and such.

Those explanations are completely bogus and irrelevant.

But still, it wouldn't work. You are soldier being given orders conditional to what the covenant are currently doing. Free-choice missions wouldn't work.

 

[NullPointer]

ODST was a perfect setup in theory.

A scattered team of specialists. Covenant patrols you could stealth past to make your way across the overworld towards exploration, investigation, and re-uniting with your team. Each team member could have been a specialist that could have added a new tactical element to the battles to come (vehicles, sniper, demolitions, stealth), so that the order of how you progressed through the individual team member missions would have a distinct effect on your entire playthrough.

Mix that with a stealth/alert system that could drop a whole firefight scenario on your head at any moment, no matter where you were in the world and you'd have gold Jerry, Gold!

But yeah, pulling that off in Reach would've made for a very, very different kind of Halo experience. One that would be much tougher to pull off.

 

[Hypertrooper]

Those explanations are completely bogus and irrelevant.

But still, it wouldn't work. You are soldier being given orders conditional to what the covenant are currently doing. Free-choice missions wouldn't work.

Why? ODST hadn't any real free-choice mission. You played level after level. You could do the same with a spartan, who wakes up after he/she was unconscious for a few hours. But Bungie tried to show the covenant invasion on on many different location with Reach.(We saw the beginning of the invasion in a forest, we saw some space fights *lol*, and we saw the fall of Reach's biggest city.) With an Hub-World you were bond in a specific area.

ODST was a perfect setup in theory.

A scattered team of specialists. Covenant patrols you could stealth past to make your way across the overworld towards exploration, investigation, and re-uniting with your team. Each team member could have been a specialist that could have added a new tactical element to the battles to come (vehicles, sniper, demolitions, stealth), so that the order of how you progressed through the individual team member missions would have a distinct effect on your entire playthrough.

I hoped for Halo 3: ODST, that you could give your squadmates some orders.

 

[Domino Theory]

Oh and 343, please leave room in the new trilogy for campaign DLC. PLEASE.

 

[RebornYeti]

Yeah, I don't think think free-choice missions would be able to work in a traditional Halo game. The best you could do is what ODST did, but of course on a much grander scale.

I actually wouldn't mind it either.

 

[NullPointer]

Oh and 343, please leave room in the new trilogy for campaign DLC. PLEASE.

+1 to this.

Yeah, I don't think think free-choice missions would be able to work in a traditional Halo game.

Which is kindof funny when you consider Halo has this great sandbox and AI, which is more than most open world / free roaming games have to offer.

Imagine something like a FarCry 2 done in Halo, in terms of mission structure and overworld and choice. Weird to be sure, but it could also work.

 

[Hypertrooper]

Oh and 343, please leave room in the new trilogy for campaign DLC. PLEASE.

Crazy theory: If the planet in the Halo 3 Legendary ending and the Halo 4 is onyx, maybe 343i will release a singleplayer dlc for Reach next spring that continues the story of Jun. We see how Halsey flees from Reach and the ending cutscene shows the ending of Ghost Of Onyx. (Naturally there is a time leap in the Ending Cutscene of the DLC ending).

Spoiler

It will never happen

But yeah some singleplayer DLC for an Halo game would be awesome.

 

[Tunavi]

Oh and 343, please leave room in the new trilogy for campaign DLC. PLEASE.

if the campaign is as good as ODST, maybe
if the campaign is as bad as Reach, no

 

[Merguson]

Now I think about it, the level where Noble Six gets isolated from Noble Team in New Alexandria would have been perfect for a hub world.

Anyone else think so? It would be on a smaller scale but I think it would have been interesting to see.

For example, Noble Team gets assigned to secure and protect the ONI building. Upon their arrival in New Alexandria, Noble Team gets scattered all over New Alexandria and have to regroup so they can proceed with their primary objective. Noble Six, for example, can choose to save Jun first if he (or she) wishes so you have a choice of which approach to take with the game.

EDIT: Admittedly, it's basically a rehash of the ODST story but if you get my drift...

 

[The Librarian]

We could be seeing Engineers at the very least. Seeing as how they're Forerunner creations.

 

[Tawpgun]

The biggest disappointedment BY FAR for ODST was the lack of Stealth.

Silenced Pistol. SMG. Night. VISR. All alone.

You're just a Spartan LITE. Shooting a grunt at the back of the pack with the pistol would alert everyone. Seeing a patrol, memorizing their route, setting up for a takeout... you shoot one and EVERYONE suddently knows you're exact location.

They just hashed the Halo 3 AI and assets into this game that while still good, could have been MUCH better if it was built from the ground up with that stealth combat in mind.

If they make another Halo game with a marine character they need to make him feel like a marine. Teamwork is essential and when you don't have you're team... planning is essential.

Now I think about it, the level where Noble Six gets isolated from Noble Team in New Alexandria would have been perfect for a hub world.

Anyone else think so? It would be on a smaller scale but I think it would have been interesting to see.

For example, Noble Team gets assigned to secure and protect the ONI building. Upon their arrival in New Alexandria, Noble Team gets scattered all over New Alexandria and have to regroup so they can proceed with their primary objective. Noble Six, for example, can choose to save Jun first if he (or she) wishes so you have a choice of which approach to take with the game.

EDIT: Admittedly, it's basically a rehash of the ODST story but if you get my drift...

Then you're fighting for one city rather than the planet. Now, a marine/ODST squad fighting hopelessley to re-take New Alexandria from the time the Corvette's arrive to the final glassing....

That would be amazing. DLC do it. Buck is in Reach, would be a cool cameo. As well as indirectly helping Noble 6 as he passes through. The game would detect your Reach spartan and input him in the campaign. So good.

 

[RebornYeti]

+1 to this.


Which is kindof funny when you consider Halo has this great sandbox and AI, which is more than most open world / free roaming games have to offer.

Imagine something like a FarCry 2 done in Halo, in terms of mission structure and overworld and choice. Weird to be sure, but it could also work.

That would be an interesting mechanic for Halo. In certain missions, you have a choice of what you want to do. Like for example, you have a choice to either lower a bridge to let your squad move up to attack, or leave them behind and take the enemy out by yourself. But by doing that, you later find out you left your squad to die and it could potentially change the way how the mission (or even game) ends.

 

[Merguson]

We could be seeing Engineers at the very least. Seeing as how they're Forerunner creations.

The Flood. Believe.


EDIT: And before someone says something, I know The Flood are not forerunner creations.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

The biggest disappointedment BY FAR for ODST was the lack of Stealth.

Silenced Pistol. SMG. Night. VISR. All alone.

You're just a Spartan LITE. Shooting a grunt at the back of the pack with the pistol would alert everyone. Seeing a patrol, memorizing their route, setting up for a takeout... you shoot one and EVERYONE suddently knows you're exact location.

They just hashed the Halo 3 AI and assets into this game that while still good, could have been MUCH better if it was built from the ground up with that stealth combat in mind.

If they make another Halo game with a marine character they need to make him feel like a marine. Teamwork is essential and when you don't have you're team... planning is essential.


Then you're fighting for one city rather than the planet. Now, a marine/ODST squad fighting hopelessley to re-take New Alexandria from the time the Corvette's arrive to the final glassing....

That would be amazing. DLC do it.

I agree with this post 100%, especially the bolded. Another ODST style game which had an open hub to explore should allow us to stalk the covies and really plan our approach in dealing with them, it should require a fair amount of planning to take out a squad. Or imagine a game which played like Headhunters, where a small Spartan 3 squad did covert ops behind enemy lines.

spec ops Halo would be cool, especially as the expanded fiction has showed how interesting this side of the conflict could be. I think it would be pretty damn difficult to pull off in game though.

I don't know, but I guess the reason fo that delivery estimate is, that the book isn't officialy published in UK.(You live in the UK?) and they have to get it from the US warehouse.

That would be an awesome delivery estimate considering I didnt think it came out till sept, I hope this isnt just a typo, I want my Halo Cryptum

 

[Kuroyume]

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK EVVVVVVVVVVAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

How great is matchmaking btw? Quit Elite Slayer a minute in because I don't want to play that. Even worse on Tempest. Next game? Elite Slayer... FUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

 

[GhaleonEB]

Please, explain how it would be possible.

I can think of a few ways to build out hub or two, from which major missions could stem. One would be to retain a linear level design, but let us choose how to progress through a few of them. Think of the mission ONI Sword Base, the second in Reach. It begins at the titular ONI base, and then moves out into the open. From there it branches out into two big paths, which eventually join. Imagine if each of those paths were entire missions, and three or four of them spiraled out from the hub.

Or the second mission from the first game, where we have a central canyon from which three major branches stem. The first mission in Reach is structured very similarly, first linear and then opening up into a folding series of paths. That's the kind of structure I'd love to see, but writ large.

Another option would be a linear mission progression, but provide a central hub - say, the crashed ship - as a tweener space between levels from which we launch into the next mission.

I dunno. There are a few ways to make the concept work. After tasting ODST, and seeing how well Halo's emergent combat mechanics mesh with a semi-open city, I'm craving a lot more of that. Reach's design felt like a step backward to me.

It's crazy hard to to, but I loved ODST's city so damn much.

 

[Domino Theory]

Halo 4 on the Corrine engine not the Bungalow 500 engine, kthxbai.

Isn't the Reach engine a heavily modified Halo 3 engine which is a modified CE engine? Isn't that what Corrinne Yu is working off of?

 

[Plywood]

Why do some of you want the fiction to hold true in multiplayer, too? I think weapons like the Battle Rifle, Plasma Grenade, Sword, etc. should all be included in multiplayer. For campaign? Go ahead and limit the sandbox for the sake of fiction and level design.

For multiplayer? Go crazy.

I don't see them making all of the weapons, old and new balanced to work with each other so I was trying to be realistic in that regard. That is unless they implement a weapon tweaker.

Isn't the Reach engine a heavily modified Halo 3 engine which is a modified CE engine? Isn't that what Corrinne Yu is working off of?

Don't tell me this horrible thing.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Isn't the Reach engine a heavily modified Halo 3 engine which is a modified CE engine? Isn't that what Corrinne Yu is working off of?

We don't know, but that sure sounds like a great question for the Halo 4 panel at PAX. Or perhaps one of the weekly updates on Waypoint.