Support NeoGAF

[Hugare]

Eh like I said I started tlou2 last week on pc and it was pretty much immediately obvious who they are and what her motivation is

Pretty obvious, but still respected your intelligence much more than the show did.

There was a reason for Druckman directing the scenes the way he did in the game.

Them changing it for the show reeks of producers/Mazin telling him that they should change it cause people are dumb, so we gotta have exposition.

Shit like this is why the show will always be inferior to the game. "We gotta have exposition! We gotta make Abby relatable from the very first scene!"

 

[drotahorror]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

 

[rabbity-thing]

I actually found Abby a much more compelling character in Part 2 than Ellie. Ellie is in the "revenge" with not much depth beyond that. Abby has her revenge, and now dealing with how it hasn't helped her understand her grief or alleviate it in anyway. The depth of going through that, to me, is much more compelling.

Last of Us Part II is such a master class in how it tells its story. Like, it follows a narrative of "revenge bad," but does it with two different characters at two different points along a similar path. What's really interesting is how the game's story beats and arcs of character growth tell a unified chronology even though we keep switching perspectives. Like, at the point where we should be seeing Ellie dealing with having gotten her revenge, we instead cut backwards in time to see how Abby dealt with the same problem. We're still continuing the thread, but from a different perspective. I can't even with how cool that was.

 

[Principal]

Last of Us Part II is such a master class in how it tells its story. Like, it follows a narrative of "revenge bad," but does it with two different characters at two different points along a similar path. What's really interesting is how the game's story beats and arcs of character growth tell a unified chronology even though we keep switching perspectives. Like, at the point where we should be seeing Ellie dealing with having gotten her revenge, we instead cut backwards in time to see how Abby dealt with the same problem. We're still continuing the thread, but from a different perspective. I can't even with how cool that was.

God Of War 2018 does this FAAAAR better, without having to disrespect a character xD (And no, Last of Us is not darker than God of War)

 

[Principal]

My girlfriend doesn't know thats how it happens with Joel (she really likes the show). We had just finished up watchin the Masters as well. I kept making comments about the Masters much to my personal amusement.

Tell me what you guys mean with masters thingy. I can take a DM or whatever.

 

[HoodWinked]

Tell me what you guys mean with masters thingy. I can take a DM or whatever.

golf

 

[Raven117]

Last of Us Part II is such a master class in how it tells its story. Like, it follows a narrative of "revenge bad," but does it with two different characters at two different points along a similar path. What's really interesting is how the game's story beats and arcs of character growth tell a unified chronology even though we keep switching perspectives. Like, at the point where we should be seeing Ellie dealing with having gotten her revenge, we instead cut backwards in time to see how Abby dealt with the same problem. We're still continuing the thread, but from a different perspective. I can't even with how cool that was.

Yup. I do wish Druckman didn't go for a few cheap gags that had some folks miss the point, but overall, yeah, I agree with you.

Tell me what you guys mean with masters thingy. I can take a DM or whatever.

Lol. It's a major golf tournament. It was this last weekend

 

[Spukc]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

 

[adamsapple]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

"Season 2 is awful"

Bruh we've only had one fucking episode come out. Some folks are just itching to get their soundbites out asap.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The game is climbing the charts on PSN and Steam

Currently 42 on PSN among all games.
Complete edition ranked 90th among all games
Part 1 is 135th

Among games priced 40 dollars or more

P2 is ranked 2nd

P2 is sold out on Amazon and maybe never got new stock?

 

[RickSanchez]

Ellie doesnt look like Ellie

Abby looks more like Ellie

Somehow Dina in the show is hotter than Dina in the games

Agreed on all 3 counts. Isabela Merced is really pretty.

 

[Nocty]

just finished watching it and man, the scenes with ellie and dina was super awkward... she's like a cardboard cutout.

She also looks super young which makes it even worse, like watching a kid kiss their parent or something lmao... that party scene, wtf.

I kinda expected more from the first episode but it was a good setup. Lets hope they stick to the story as much as possible, even though I was not a huge fan of it in the games, it will be silly if major changes happen just to 'pad it out'.

They better have done a good job of that certain death scene thats all I have to say. My wife is fully invested in that character, has no idea what is coming, lmao.

My wife: Ahhh, I bet you Joel is going to kill all of those guys like he did the other fireflies... he's clearly going to become the leader of the settlement

Me:

 

[Just_one]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

oh fuck off you fucking youtuber

the 2nd game is a masterpiece , even in the story department.

talking about the show

Spoiler

joel´s death gotta be next week right? or at the very best episode 3 isnt?

 

[GymWolf]

Really enjoyed the first episode. never played the games so I have no qualms with the casting, but what is up with Ellie's dialogue? Everything she says and insufferable and so arrogant. Do they want us to dislike her? Is she like this in the games?

In the second game she is an annoying bitch, yes.

(I found her annoying in the first game aswell tbh)

 

[simpatico]

Playing TLOU2 for the first time. Was wondering how they'd pull off Ellie's transformation into a beast. Turns out that is impossible with the actress they cast. I've got no idea why they thought this character was in her range.

 

[RickSanchez]

just finished watching it and man, the scenes with ellie and dina was super awkward... she's like a cardboard cutout.

She also looks super young which makes it even worse, like watching a kid kiss their parent or something lmao... that party scene, wtf.

Agree, Bella Ramsey just looks like a 10 year old. I don't know what fluke of genetics causes it, but she does. She has chubby cheeks for heaven's sake. She also simply doesn't have a good enough acting range to show a tough grizzled character that Ellie is supposed to be in Part 2.

And it is very problematic to discuss, because Bella Ramsey is a member of the LGBTQ community (self-described as non-binary), so any criticism toward her is taken as bigotry. In reality, it has nothing to do with her gender identity. She looks too damn young, and she is simply not a good enough actor. It's that simple.

So when she's supposed to be in dire situations, her cute puppy face is unable to reflect complex, conflicted emotions or any gravitas whatsoever. I just can't take her seriously, or at the very least, it makes it awkward to watch, like you said. Because it looks like a kid forced into a terrible situation.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

I miss teh days when we had TV shows with a ton of episodes in less amount of time. Just finished watching this first episode, stayed pretty much true to the original but there are only six more episodes. I wouldnt be even surprised the climax of this season is the killing of Joel the way they are going because If they are taking these slow approaches I dont even know how they will manage to tell both Abby's and Down syndrome girl's side of the story after his death in time.

I recently started rewatching LOST again.....22 episodes per season! Same for Breaking Bad, True Blood, Dexter etc. On top of that each season came out a year later and here we are 2 years later only getting 7 episodes and the way things are going, no way is Joel's end gonna come in next 2 episodes. I can almost guarantee thats going to be the cliff hanger for the end of season 2. Then what, we gotta wait another 2 years for 7 more that will somehow fast track both sides of the story including everything in the middle.

 

[VulcanRaven]

just finished watching it and man, the scenes with ellie and dina was super awkward... she's like a cardboard cutout.

She also looks super young which makes it even worse, like watching a kid kiss their parent or something lmao... that party scene, wtf.

I thought that scene was very well done. I was worried it wouldn't match the game version but it was great. Both actors did good job.

 

[Great Auk]

This is going to sound silly but I have a problem with the wardrobe department lol.

All their clothes look brand new and always have coordinated outfits on as if this is a realistic option in post apocalyptic Earth.

I've noticed that with some recent movies as well.

 

[Great Auk]

I miss teh days when we had TV shows with a ton of episodes in less amount of time. Just finished watching this first episode, stayed pretty much true to the original but there are only six more episodes. I wouldnt be even surprised the climax of this season is the killing of Joel the way they are going because If they are taking these slow approaches I dont even know how they will manage to tell both Abby's and Down syndrome girl's side of the story after his death in time.

I recently started rewatching LOST again.....22 episodes per season! Same for Breaking Bad, True Blood, Dexter etc. On top of that each season came out a year later and here we are 2 years later only getting 7 episodes and the way things are going, no way is Joel's end gonna come in next 2 episodes. I can almost guarantee thats going to be the cliff hanger for the end of season 2. Then what, we gotta wait another 2 years for 7 more that will somehow fast track both sides of the story including everything in the middle.

1000% agree! What is up with these huge delays in new seasons and then they only put out a handful of episodes? What the hell are they doing all that time?

I'm a big fan of Star Trek TNG and they were cranking out 26 episodes a season every single year! And many other shows as you mentioned did the same.

I get that the production value is supposed to be higher with these shows, but the lack of episodes and multi year waits for new seasons is inexcusable.

 

[Just_one]

I miss teh days when we had TV shows with a ton of episodes in less amount of time. Just finished watching this first episode, stayed pretty much true to the original but there are only six more episodes. I wouldnt be even surprised the climax of this season is the killing of Joel the way they are going because If they are taking these slow approaches I dont even know how they will manage to tell both Abby's and Down syndrome girl's side of the story after his death in time.

I recently started rewatching LOST again.....22 episodes per season! Same for Breaking Bad, True Blood, Dexter etc. On top of that each season came out a year later and here we are 2 years later only getting 7 episodes and the way things are going, no way is Joel's end gonna come in next 2 episodes. I can almost guarantee thats going to be the cliff hanger for the end of season 2. Then what, we gotta wait another 2 years for 7 more that will somehow fast track both sides of the story including everything in the middle.

there is no way they extend the story for 6 more episodes without killing joel. he will die next week or in the 3rd episode for sure.

2nd ep - abby , joel and tommy meet in the snow , ends with abby and the gang attack on joel
3rd ep - starts with ellie going looking for joel, ends with ellie watching joel dying after abby goes golfing

also breaking bad and dexter were not 22 eps per season.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

also breaking bad and dexter were not 22 eps per season.

I never said EVERY show mentioned had 24, but they all had way way above something as low as 7 episodes. Prison Break had 22, True Blood and Dexter had 12-14 episodes per season, Breaking Bad had 16....none had something as low as 7 with a 2 year wait time in between seasons. In general, most new shows have way less episodes than we ever had before. It can work for Black Mirror because its 7-8 different stories pretty much. TLOU 2 story has been written and shown in gaming format like 5 years ago, its not as if they are making this from scratch and are brainstorming what will be next. LOST guys were going with the flow yet they still put out a ton of quality content, I really dont know what HBO was doing so long with these 7 episodes, we should of gotten a full season ending, not third continuation of the second season probably in like 2027 lol.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

"season 2 is awful", says random youtuber after 1 episode.

 

[Clover904]

ddaaammmnn… that was a great episode. If youre a fan of the game, this show is a must watch. The way HBO has brought the game to life, and expanded on it. Wow. This is high quality stuff. Brilliant acting from everyone.

 

[Clover904]

Last of Us Part II is such a master class in how it tells its story. Like, it follows a narrative of "revenge bad," but does it with two different characters at two different points along a similar path. What's really interesting is how the game's story beats and arcs of character growth tell a unified chronology even though we keep switching perspectives. Like, at the point where we should be seeing Ellie dealing with having gotten her revenge, we instead cut backwards in time to see how Abby dealt with the same problem. We're still continuing the thread, but from a different perspective. I can't even with how cool that was.

"You realize that so much of this story is going to be about perspective. Who the heroes are and who the villains are is based on where you're standing."

 

[Just_one]

"You realize that so much of this story is going to be about perspective. Who the heroes are and who the villains are is based on where you're standing."

and thats exactly why it is such a masterpiece , neither ellie or abby are wrong on their motives...and u the player being able to play both sides and see exactly why both are in a way right is amazing

 

[Represent.]

and thats exactly why it is such a masterpiece , neither ellie or abby are wrong on their motives...and u the player being able to play both sides and see exactly why both are in a way right is amazing

Yep, I don't know why this became so controversial.. Its like they just wanted a simple story in a straight ass line. I loved when the game switched to Abby, its not like we weren't ever going back to Ellie. Lmao

 

[R6Rider]

"season 2 is awful", says random youtuber after 1 episode.

That YouTuber in particular is trash.

 

[Represent.]

Which one of you hacked me?

 

[drotahorror]

"Season 2 is awful"

Bruh we've only had one fucking episode come out. Some folks are just itching to get their soundbites out asap.

I thought the show was based on the game.

 

[Madflavor]

Honestly he's right the story in Part 2 is so fuckin bad. Gameplay is great and makes it worth slogging through the bullshit.

Everyone is completely unlikeable in Part 2 as well.

Not that I'm defending TLOU2's story, but this is one of those "Gaming is Dead" guys who's always posting videos about "actually this game sucks, here's why".

 

[Represent.]

I thought the show was based on the game.

Theres literally 1 episode out, how can you say the season sucks.

 

[Just_one]

Yep, I don't know why this became so controversial.. Its like they just wanted a simple story in a straight ass line. I loved when the game switched to Abby, its not like we weren't ever going back to Ellie. Lmao

because people are stupid nowadays and are entitled little fuckers that if something doesnt go the way they want its instantly stupid and dumb.

newsflash for those assholes who threw a fit and broke cds of the game when the game switched to abby which was just the dumbest thing i ever saw , talk about entitled.

joel was not a good guy no more than abby was a bad girl , joel killed a lot of people before the ellie job and even during the first game

 

[drotahorror]

Theres literally 1 episode out, how can you say the season sucks.

I didn't. I said the story in Part 2 sucks. But if S2 is anything like Part 2, it's not going to be a good time. For all I know the whole show is rewritten. I honestly hope so.

 

[RickSanchez]

1000% agree! What is up with these huge delays in new seasons and then they only put out a handful of episodes? What the hell are they doing all that time?

I'm a big fan of Star Trek TNG and they were cranking out 26 episodes a season every single year! And many other shows as you mentioned did the same.

I get that the production value is supposed to be higher with these shows, but the lack of episodes and multi year waits for new seasons is inexcusable.

A big reason for this is episodic vs serialized content.

If your TV show has a set formula to follow, based on which you can quickly generate 'mystery of the week' episodes; then you can keep the show going for many seasons with 22 episodes per season. Every episode can be its own thing, tell its own story and is not burdened (or very lightly burdened) with an over-arching narrative. Example: the very many detective and/or lawyer procedural shows of the 90s and 2000s

If your TV show is completely serialized, that means every single episode has to serve and carry forward the main plot. Something has to happen in every episode to keep the story going. And a single story cannot be too long, you have to get to the end sooner rather than later. So if you want to maintain quality of storytelling, then you can stretch over maybe a maximum of 3 to 4 seasons with 10-13 episodes per season. Example: all the good and bad streaming shows we have had since 2010.

 

[QLQ]

It was a good episode. I like the follow-up with Joel doing therapy. I liked the infected encounter, Dina is A+. I agree Ellie stills comes off a little bit childish, first in the initial training/fight scene, the screaming with Tony and some other minor things...maybe the makers are trying to remind us of old-good natured Ellie (who doesn't seem specially traumatized by all the events from 5 years before), before she goes all Rambo first blood chasing after Abby.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

A big reason for this is episodic vs serialized content.

If your TV show has a set formula to follow, based on which you can quickly generate 'mystery of the week' episodes; then you can keep the show going for many seasons with 22 episodes per season. Every episode can be its own thing, tell its own story and is not burdened (or very lightly burdened) with an over-arching narrative. Example: the very many detective and/or lawyer procedural shows of the 90s and 2000s

If your TV show is completely serialized, that means every single episode has to serve and carry forward the main plot. Something has to happen in every episode to keep the story going. And a single story cannot be too long, you have to get to the end sooner rather than later. So if you want to maintain quality of storytelling, then you can stretch over maybe a maximum of 3 to 4 seasons with 10-13 episodes per season. Example: all the good and bad streaming shows we have had since 2010.

Except they wasted in S1 a whole episode on Bill and his backstory which we barely knew anything about in the game. Actually we didnt even spend that much time with Bill anyway but they still dedicated a whole episode to him which I found baffling considering we are only getting a handful of episodes and the story wasnt even close to climax. His part would work perfectly if it was a 12-15 episode season. Just like the "fly" episode in Breaking Bad was something fun with Jesse and Heisenberg.

Thats what you call a filler episode and IMO that episode was there just to pamper a minority instead of keeping the story on its tracks.

 

[simpatico]

Ready to check the post histories of the people who like the casting and acting of Ep1. I'm morbidly curious.

 

[spookyfish]

just finished watching it and man, the scenes with ellie and dina was super awkward... she's like a cardboard cutout.

She also looks super young which makes it even worse, like watching a kid kiss their parent or something lmao... that party scene, wtf.

I kinda expected more from the first episode but it was a good setup. Lets hope they stick to the story as much as possible, even though I was not a huge fan of it in the games, it will be silly if major changes happen just to 'pad it out'.

They better have done a good job of that certain death scene thats all I have to say. My wife is fully invested in that character, has no idea what is coming, lmao.

My wife: Ahhh, I bet you Joel is going to kill all of those guys like he did the other fireflies... he's clearly going to become the leader of the settlement

Me:

>Nic Cage voice< Most impressive use of this meme. Well done.

 

[DragoonKain]

I know people are disappointed that they started with the Abby reveal, but I think as long as they wait until after Joel dies to reveal that the doctor was her dad then that is the most important thing. It's important they hold onto that reveal IMO because it humanizes Abby after the fact. If they reveal that before she kills Joel, it will take away so much of the emotional impact of that moment. We're supposed to hate her right away, and then gradually start to humanize her over time and give us complex feelings about Ellie's vengeance tour.

 

[MSduderino]

I don't really have a problem with Bella Ramsey's acting or her looking too young, but her being 19 here means she was 14 in season 1 which she clearly does not look and doesn't look like she aged 5 years at that age. Why didn't they change it in some way? Like, she could've been 16 or 18 in S1 and 21 or 23 now? She would've looked more her character's age in both seasons. I hate to nitpick but this stood out to me.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Narcos, mandalorian and now last of us to go along with those pretty good tv show history for Pedro for sure

 

[Gp1]

If a girl the size of Ellie gets a guy the size of Calleb in a sloppy ass triangle like that...



Just the slam/bate estaca alone would put Ellie on a wheel chair for the rest of the saga.

 

[xenosys]

 

[Zephyranthes]

Pretty good first episode overall. I haven't played the second game, so I'll be watching a playthrough as new episodes are released. The prologue section of the first game vaguely alludes to Joel having a job in construction, so it was a nice touch having him be responsible for building new homes in Jackson. Pedro Pascal is still killing it....the scene with him and the therapist was the highlight of the episode for me.

I didn't mind Bella Ramsey as Ellie in the first season, because she managed to act the part even if she didn't necessarily look it. From what I've seen of the early parts of the second game, Ellie is much more shy and reserved than she was in the first. Unfortunately this change isn't really reflected in Ramsey's performance, though poor direction is probably at fault there.

 

[taizuke]

Given some of the odd changes, i wonder if ultimately the show is going to make us appreciate the game more. Especially for those that didn't like or hated Part II. Kinda like how the Star Wars sequels made the prequels better by comparison.

 

[CrimsonSquall]

I know people are disappointed that they started with the Abby reveal, but I think as long as they wait until after Joel dies to reveal that the doctor was her dad then that is the most important thing. It's important they hold onto that reveal IMO because it humanizes Abby after the fact. If they reveal that before she kills Joel, it will take away so much of the emotional impact of that moment. We're supposed to hate her right away, and then gradually start to humanize her over time and give us complex feelings about Ellie's vengeance tour.

I think at bare minimum they understand this is the most controversial piece and have to keep that sacred as the building blocks of S2/S3

 

[DragoonKain]

I think at bare minimum they understand this is the most controversial piece and have to keep that sacred as the building blocks of S2/S3

I'm worried they're going to do that reveal beforehand because they don't think the TV audience can handle it. Hope I'm wrong.

 

[Emedan]

Been said to death, but I can't get into it. Might be a bit fucked up and borderline forbidden to say but I can't muster any sympathy for Ellie, she just too ugly in the show. Though to be even more honest, that's just human nature I guess..

 

[HoodWinked]

I'm about the ruin the show for everyone. The Ellie casting didn't bother me despite the constant complaints, I even defended it on occasion. Then ran across a tweet showing Cailee Spaeny and as I watched S2E1 it made it way too distracted to watch Bella in the role. There are no re-dos and we live in the timeline that we are in.