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[call_kotaku]

What if a couple of the problematic rogue spells got reworked a bit (conceal, preparation, etc), since Gadgetzan works kinda fine in most other classes' decks?

I think the problem with miracle rogue is that it's too reliant on one card, when I think the playstyle is very interesting. Pyromancer + acolyte as a bootleg gadgetzan alternative was a ton of fun in the Freegold miracle deck as well, a lot better than relying on the trickle of cards from shiv/loot hoarder/azure drake or slightly silly things like coldlight oracle.

 

[ViviOggi]

Late to the streamer talk, but dog started streaming last week and he's great. He has an entire climb from start of account to top 16 Legend on EU recorded on his account on twitch (he was already top 10 NA). He's explains his plays and thought process, after watching him my Miracle Rogue play went through the roof.

twitch.tv/hsdogdog

I'm really liking this guy as well, very nice instructional stream.

Smh at chat making him turn off the jazz though

 

[Haly]

What if a couple of the problematic rogue spells got reworked a bit (conceal, preparation, etc), since Gadgetzan works kinda fine in most other classes' decks?

Conceall/Prep/Shadowstep are poor cards, there's not much room for adjustment without completely overhauling them.

I can't see Blizzard remaking 3 cards to nerf one deck, can you? Not this Blizzard anyway. Maybe in late 2013.

In better news, I'm actually having a decent conversation in my Hearthstone thread incroyable!

 

[ChrisW]

Does anyone have a link to a video that covers all the basics for beginners and also goes into depth on deck creation. One thing I'm struggling is building my deck, I'm using the "suggestion" option but I think that will only get me so far

 

[Haly]

Does anyone have a link to a video that covers all the basics for beginners and also goes into depth on deck creation. One thing I'm struggling is building my deck, I'm using the "suggestion" option but I think that will only get me so far

Suggestion is very bad.

http://www.liquidhearth.com/forum/g...tarting-stone-1-six-steps-to-an-ultimate-deck
http://www.liquidhearth.com/forum/g...tarting-stone-1-six-steps-to-an-ultimate-deck
http://www.liquidhearth.com/forum/g...-starting-stone-2-the-best-free-neutral-cards
http://www.liquidhearth.com/forum/general-strategy/458082-starting-stone-3-your-first-crafts

More: http://www.liquidhearth.com/guides/

 

[CoolOff]

Fucking hell Warrior is shit in arena. Facing Shaman feels like the most one-sided match-up there is aside from all the Mage-bullshit. Dealing with the totems is just impossible.

 

[Strider]

Alright Gaf here is the deck I've been using.

I'm mainly struggling vs aggro decks. It just always seems like I never get my clears or have enough. I originally started with 2 sunwalkers but switched one of them for a defender of argus to try and slow them down and lower my mana curve. But I'm still losing more than I should... any suggestions?

 

[FormallyFamicom]

The Blizzard move would be to give Gadgetzan's draw a 50% chance. More RNG for everyone.

 

[Haly]

I am a genius.

Goblin Auctioneer
5 Mana
Minion
5/4
Whenever you play a spell, draw a card. There's a 50% chance it'll be counterfeit.

Counterfeit Merchandise
2 Mana
Spell
Useless, worthless junk. What a ripoff.

 

[Bizazedo]

I am a genius.

Goblin Auctioneer
5 Mana
Minion
5/4
Whenever you play a spell, draw a card. There's a 50% chance it'll be counterfeit.

Counterfeit Merchandise
2 Mana
Spell
Useless, worthless junk. What a ripoff.

He's an Auctioneer, not a swindler. Also, the last thing they'd do is make people wonder how the mechanic works in WoW.
I know, not that people should, but Blizzard thought process....

Make it more in theme. Whenever you play a spell, draw a card. There's a 50% chance you'll be outbid and receive nothing. Percent chance goes down by 25% for every subsequent draw (your bid goes higher).

I know, too many words.

 

[Haly]

Goblins are natural swindlers!

 

[Bizazedo]

Goblins are natural swindlers!

Honorable members of the Horde!!

.

Actually, your suggestion does cause a possible interesting gameplay effect that makes me like it. It puts a useless card in the hand they have to eject, costing mana. In your mind, did you envision it as a spell?

 

[Haly]

Actually, your suggestion does cause a possible interesting gameplay effect that makes me like it. It puts a useless card in the hand they have to eject, costing mana. In your mind, did you envision it as a spell?

Yes, it's supposed to be a spell, and something they will want to get rid of eventually, but will have hard time doing so because it's expensive. It'll cycle off of Auctioneer, but it's 1 card draw for 2 mana cost, which is pretty steep. They don't have to play it right then and there, but I doubt they want it hanging around.

It's like Mukla'ing yourself.

It also enables Lorewalker Cho shenanigans.

 

[scy]

I remembered why posting on Blizzard official forums is always a bad idea.

http://us.battle.net/hearthstone/en/forum/topic/13204360606?page=1#0

Jesus Christ these people.

Literally every single one of these was also said in this thread. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if you just quoted the thread. The only change I would want for Auctioneer is a way to deal with stealthed minions. And then to go off the deep-end with adding more stealth minions worth using to make it not a "this card was created just for that" situation.

Edit: Actually reading the thread linked, hey, you found someone reasonable in there! I like the "you and your idea are dumb btw" posts. And apparently the ones that think you're whining about losing to Miracle.

Ah, I see. My mistake for jumping down your throat. As you can see, I've given this problem a lot of thought because I'm desperate for Miracle to survive the next balance patch so I get really annoyed when people propose mindless nerfs to kill it.

The whole notion that Miracle needs to be destroyed via nerfs is hilarious to me. It's a very strong deck due to the meta. It was okay in some prior metas. It is pretty much like any other big deck thus far. Good when it was good, okay otherwise, and then bad when it was targeted.

"Drawing 6 cards!" is ridiculous because it's 20% of your deck (realistically, ~25% by the time turn 6 rolls around). It's less ridiculous when those 6 cards are a Prep, 2x Conceal, Shadowstep, Eviscerate, and Shiv and you're left looking for the last live draw in the deck to begin with.

 

[Haly]

Edit: Actually reading the thread linked, hey, you found someone reasonable in there! I like the "you and your idea are dumb btw" posts. And apparently the ones that think you're whining about losing to Miracle.

Some of them also seem to be under the impression that I want to kill Miracle Rogue I mean why else would they suggest those thin--

Oh, wait.

I get it.

 

[scy]

if only there was a first post

Incidentally, while the flavor of the swindler effect on the Auctioneer is neat, I'm not sure I like the idea of it adding an RNG trigger like that. I guess it's a big part of the game anyway but ... I dunno. Even if it mitigates itself slightly by giving you a "Try Again?" for 2 mana.

 

[Haly]

If only reading the OP was a rule like it is here.

 

[shadowstar]

I still think Auctioneer being a legendary is the best solution. Only one in the deck means the Rogue has to play super smart and against many match ups they can only use it when they can guarantee they'll get value out of it.

 

[Haly]

I still think Auctioneer being a legendary is the best solution. Only one in the deck means the Rogue has to play super smart and against many match ups they can only use it when they can guarantee they'll get value out of it.

Are there famous Auctioneers in WoW?

This may be the "nerf" the situation needs but, like, I dunno, promoting a rare to a Legendary is a big deal. Imagine the outcry from people who dusted their Auctioneers before the change.

 

[scy]

If only reading the OP was a rule like it is here.

Yea...wait.

I still think Auctioneer being a legendary is the best solution. Only one in the deck means the Rogue has to play super smart and against many match ups they can only use it when they can guarantee they'll get value out of it.

In hindsight? Hm, probably. All spells gaining "Draw a card" is a really powerful effect. I doubt we'll see a sweeping change like that now, however.

I'm kind of curious how the internal design process went for Auctioneer.

 

[shadowstar]

Are there famous Auctioneers in WoW?

This may be the "nerf" the situation needs but, like, I dunno, promoting a rare to a Legendary is a big deal. Imagine the outcry from people who dusted their Auctioneers before the change.

I can't imagine that as I don't know who did or would DE one of the best cards in the game. Also, they would now get to DE their duplicate Auctioneer for 400 (or maybe even full value of 1600).

There are named auctioneers, but yeah, no famous ones.

 

[Haly]

Yea...wait.

Hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

In hindsight? Hm, probably. All spells gaining "Draw a card" is a really powerful effect. I doubt we'll see a sweeping change like that now, however.

I'm kind of curious how the internal design process went for Auctioneer.

The same process that gave us built in Necropotence.

"How 2 make card gaem?????"

 

[scy]

So there's a chance we get Cascade.

 

[Haly]

Dark Portal
8 Mana
Spell
Cascade
Cascade
Cascade

 

[manhack]

Divine Favour is the only card making Paladin viable.

It's funny because until recently you would never see Divine Favor in any Paladin decks. Now with Handlocks, Freeze Mage, Miracle Rogue in play, Divine Favor in a Pally aggro deck is bonkers. It sucks playing Zoo, Druids and hunters who can't get their draw on.

 

[iirate]

I still think Auctioneer being a legendary is the best solution. Only one in the deck means the Rogue has to play super smart and against many match ups they can only use it when they can guarantee they'll get value out of it.

This is my favorite "solution" too, although I don't really think it's something that needs to be solved.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

The best solution is to release new cards. This game should get like 15 new cards a month instead of every 6 months if we are lucky

 

[Haly]

That would be ideal, but it's just not going to happen.

I would rather brainstorm ideas within the realm of possibility, if any Blue should happen to be going through the threads on the boards, than to bet on them suddenly creating a real content schedule.

 

[Minsc]

The best solution is to release new cards. This game should get like 15 new cards a month instead of every 6 months if we are lucky

Haha, 15 cards a month... how about 1 expansion every 1.5 years, and a PvE adventure every 3-4 months (of 10-15 cards, Naxx was said to be unusually ambitious since it is the first, much more content than the normal PvE adventure - though perhaps they take to the format of a PvE adventure twice a year instead, of ~30 cards a piece).

 

[Professor Lich]

Are there famous Auctioneers in WoW?

Not really but Blizzard is good with making stuff up on the spot. They could easily make it Gallywix or something like that. I mean, who wouldn't want this guy in their deck?

However, I say before any big changes, just wait for Naxx and see how the meta changes, then see what needs to be nerf'd / buff'd / whatever.

 

[Jrmint]

Alright Gaf here is the deck I've been using.

I'm mainly struggling vs aggro decks. It just always seems like I never get my clears or have enough. I originally started with 2 sunwalkers but switched one of them for a defender of argus to try and slow them down and lower my mana curve. But I'm still losing more than I should... any suggestions?

I've played a lot of Paladin control and against really fast rush decks it really is hard to catch up. I wouldn't run the argent squire, it doesn't do much for you. I'd run a holy light and a second Guardian of Kings for starters. 2 mana for 6 health is pretty good, and it can synergize with wild pyro.

Also if you're gonna run rag I would also run a BGH and Faceless. Without those Rag can sometimes lose the game for you if your opponent has the other 2 cards.

To make room for that stuff id also drop the argent protectors since they also don't do much in pally control. Usually in your first few turns you're just using the hero power and using farseer.

 

[Strider]

I've played a lot of Paladin control and against really fast rush decks it really is hard to catch up. I wouldn't run the argent squire, it doesn't do much for you. I'd run a holy light and a second Guardian of Kings for starters. 2 mana for 6 health is pretty good, and it can synergize with wild pyro.

Also if you're gonna run rag I would also run a BGH and Faceless. Without those Rag can sometimes lose the game for you if your opponent has the other 2 cards.

To make room for that stuff id also drop the argent protectors since they also don't do much in pally control. Usually in your first few turns you're just using the hero power and using farseer.

Thanks for the feedback.

So I think for starters I'm going to drop the Argent Squire and 1 of the Argent Protectors. You're definitely right about the squire. This was always going to be the first card to go because it's basically just there to beef up the blood knight. kinda pointless. As for the Protector I can usually get pretty good value out of them but yea, 1 of them is enough. I may change my mind going forward and get rid of the other one too. But for now I've replaced just the 2 cards with a holy light and another Guardian of Kings.

As far as Rag goes he's there as he's one of the few powerful late game cards I have. When he gets BGH'ed it def makes me nervous, but usually he's in play when the game is already decided. Whether than add BGH/Faceless I think I may be better off just removing him altogether. I'm thinking about disenchanting some cards and attempting to craft a Cairne in its place. Thoughts on that?

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Freeze mage running two flamestrikes >_>

 

[bjaelke]

Trump?

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Trump?

No but maybe copying his decklist. Funny thing was he discarded his Alexstraza, but I couldn't kill him because of Blizzard, Flamestike, Flamestrike killing all my minions.

 

[ViviOggi]

No but maybe copying his decklist. Funny thing was he discarded his Alexstraza, but I couldn't kill him because of Blizzard, Flamestike, Flamestrike killing all my minions.

Glad to see these fun spells making their way to constructed again.

I would like to be a scumbag Freeze Mage too once in a while but can't scrape together the dust for the epics I'd need right now.

 

[GeoGonzo]

Blargh, won 9 arenas and still got a regular card as one of the rewards. Weren't they supposed to be golden after many wins? Maybe after 10, I guess...

 

[shadowstar]

Anyone play miracle with a Faceless? It's on the same slot as Auctioneer, but you don't always draw it and it would open up some fun options:

Copy a beefed up Van Cleef on turn 5
Open up more liberal use of Shadowstep with Agent and Farseer since you can Leeroy, Cold Blood, Faceless for 20 on turn 10 without prep (versus 18-22 depending on cards left).
Copy opposing Auctioneer on turn 5 for those mirror match ups when you cannot ******* draw your own!
Surprise Grommash against the current influx of control warriors (or at least it seems like I keep getting matched up against them).

I may try it tonight and drop a Farseer for it.

 

[Violet_0]

so this is a top 100 legend EU deck by Xixo
http://puu.sh/9H17z/0108c4e559.jpg

the goal is to humiliate your opponent, apparently

 

[JesseZao]

Anyone play miracle with a Faceless? It's on the same slot as Auctioneer, but you don't always draw it and it would open up some fun options:

1.Copy a beefed up Van Cleef on turn 5
2.Open up more liberal use of Shadowstep with Agent and Farseer since you can Leeroy, Cold Blood, Faceless for 20 on turn 10 without prep (versus 18-22 depending on cards left).
3.Copy opposing Auctioneer on turn 5 for those mirror match ups when you cannot ******* draw your own!
4.Surprise Grommash against the current influx of control warriors (or at least it seems like I keep getting matched up against them).

I may try it tonight and drop a Farseer for it.

1. That's assuming Edwin wasn't dealt with last turn. In that case, you probably already won and would be better off finishing with spells.

2. Takes too much mana. You want to combo with just leeroy and set up lethal to use him turn 6-8.

3. Might as well have your own.

4. If they can play and activate Grommash, it's already late and you may have already lost. A sap is more useful.

 

[shadowstar]

1. That's assuming Edwin wasn't dealt with last turn. In that case, you probably already won and would be better off finishing with spells.

2. Takes too much mana. You want to combo with just leeroy and set up lethal to use him turn 6-8.

3. Might as well have your own.

4. If they can play and activate Grommash, it's already late and you may have already lost. A sap is more useful.

1. Edwin is often not dealt with. When it is, you save it for another play.

2. Don't always get to. This gives you options in case you have to burn your Shadowstep for something like heals or clear.

3. The point was you didn't draw yours. Miracle mirror is often decided by who drew it first.

4. You can do both if turn 8 when Grommash would come out. I've often forced out Grommash to clear which is what gave me the idea. I do usually just sap it. I'm only rank 3 though, maybe its harder to force in legend.

The thought is to just have additional options to do a variety of things. One less Farseer isn't that big a deal.

 

[Jrmint]

Thanks for the feedback.

So I think for starters I'm going to drop the Argent Squire and 1 of the Argent Protectors. You're definitely right about the squire. This was always going to be the first card to go because it's basically just there to beef up the blood knight. kinda pointless. As for the Protector I can usually get pretty good value out of them but yea, 1 of them is enough. I may change my mind going forward and get rid of the other one too. But for now I've replaced just the 2 cards with a holy light and another Guardian of Kings.

As far as Rag goes he's there as he's one of the few powerful late game cards I have. When he gets BGH'ed it def makes me nervous, but usually he's in play when the game is already decided. Whether than add BGH/Faceless I think I may be better off just removing him altogether. I'm thinking about disenchanting some cards and attempting to craft a Cairne in its place. Thoughts on that?

Cairne is great in Pally control, I say go for it.

 

[DyslexicAlucard]

So I made remix after one of my favourite streamers (PapaBoris) suggested it. What do you guys think?

http://youtu.be/y2EJni9aGe4

 

[Fragamemnon]

The thought is to just have additional options to do a variety of things. One less Farseer isn't that big a deal.

Strongly disagree with that. I would never drop under 2 ERFs unless there was a significant metagame shift. Staying above combo breakpoints is critical given the deck doesn't have any taunts.

 

[Zakalwe]

Are there famous Auctioneers in WoW?

This may be the "nerf" the situation needs but, like, I dunno, promoting a rare to a Legendary is a big deal. Imagine the outcry from people who dusted their Auctioneers before the change.

Simple solution.

Make a legendary with exact stats as auctioneer (maybe a tiny boost). Call it something else, new character and new rational for power.


Nerf auctioneer stats. Make it 50% chance and less mana cost, or something that makes it a viable cheap option.

Pow: legendary auctioneer without making auctioneer a legendary.

 

[Bleeether]

Speaking of Freeze Mage.

It's Turn 8 and i have a taunted Mountain giant and some other minions on board sitting pretty at 22 health i pass the turn.

Opponent plays 2 Sorcerer's Apprentice, 2 Fireballs, 1 Frost Bolt, 2 Ice Lances on the same turn for a total of 23 damage to the face GG.

What an epic turn for him, i was very impressed. I'm making a highlight vid hah.

 

[CarbonatedFalcon]

Played quite a bit of Mana Addict Miracle today and it's pretty gud. Currently setup as an aggro counter more than anything else. Might switch to a more vanilla version of Miracle as I climb the ranks though.

 

[Sumidor]

Had a horrible run of 2-3 with a Warlock in arena.. But it was all worth it because I got to use sacrificial pact against Lord Jaraxxus. So goooood.

 

[JesseZao]

Speaking of Freeze Mage.

It's Turn 8 and i have a taunted Mountain giant and some other minions on board sitting pretty at 22 health i pass the turn.

Opponent plays 2 Sorcerer's Apprentice, 2 Fireballs, 1 Frost Bolt, 2 Ice Lances on the same turn for a total of 23 damage to the face GG.

What an epic turn for him, i was very impressed. I'm making a highlight vid hah.

Haven't seen that in a while. Probably a good time to bring it back though with freeze mage being popular again. Giants mage is good because of this too.

 

[Bleeether]

Haven't seen that in a while. Probably a good time to bring it back though with freeze mage being popular again. Giants mage is good because of this too.

What i meant was that i had the Giants [playing handlock] and my opponent was the one with the freeze mage.

Giants in a Freeze deck does seem viable considering they sit on their hands often hmmm maybe i should try this.