Support NeoGAF

[Yoshichan]

Did that fucking bullshit give me a win at least?

I got INSTANT disconnection as soon as I got the killing blow and it showed the level up screen.

Will that count as a win in arena? Fucking lag switch bullshit or whatever from the opponent.

 

[super-famicom]

Well, that was fun. I beat a gold Hunter with my Freezie Mage.

 

[Kenaras]

Huh? I didn't say anything about an empty board. Of course they'll have minions.

You're supposed to have already removed 1-2 of their minions in turns 2-3. Focusing on slowing them down is the main goal. And swinging the match is what is best done around turn 5-7, which senjin is being used to set up for.

If you're far behind by turn 4, sure - senjin may do very little. But it may bait them or even force them into using doomguard or soulfire inefficiently. That is where you basically get a huge advantage most of the time, especially if they discard 1-2 useful cards. That is why I am saying senjin is a good card. Bringing the doomguard into 4hp is also important. Dealing with an uninjured 5/7 could guarantee it getting 10+ daamge.

Personally I don't even have a taunt in my deck and just focus on early removal. I don't even rely on AOEs, although I have one. But having a taunt to slow down the face damage is very useful in some decks. I wouldn't say it is key, just a useful tool.

The point is that the only time they're going to run a Doomguard into your Sen'jin is if 1) they have an empty board, or 2) they've emptied their hand. It doesn't matter if you've removed some of their minions; with just one minion in play, odds are they can use it to kill your Sen'jin.

Also, Hex doesn't care if it's a 5/7 Doomguard or a 5/4 Doomguard; either way it becomes a 0/1 Taunt. I get the impression you're not even discussing the Shaman vs. Zoo matchup, but rather some other deck vs. Zoo.

 

[Yoshichan]

As expected. Shit deck.

Shaman
4-3
75 gold
Pack

 

[Yoshichan]

Wait, there's no chance Naxx will cost 5k gold...

100 gold = approx 1.20 dollars

5k gold = approx 60 dollars

Blizzard will never take $60 for the expansion, I'm thinking this'll cost max 1000 gold (around 15 bucks).

 

[LaneDS]

Has Blizzard ever talked about the idea of gifting inside of Hearthstone? It's a buddy of mine's birthday and I know he likes the game and I wish I was able to gift like 10 pack of cards or some such. Would be nice if they ever implemented something like that.

 

[Water]

Started new season needing two mage victories for two dailies. Token mage delivered. I don't remember it feeling this fun when I tried it for a couple of games before.

Zoo -> Violet Teacher stalls forever -> Antonidas. I was at 9hp, but since I didn't rush to hit his face and fireballed every unbuffed Voidwalker and Harvest Golem first, I was able to keep a 0/1 Mirror Image on the board so that he could not play Leeroy-Soulfire (both of which he turned out to actually have).

Handlock -> had to tap out to play a 7 mana Giant since I held back on the damage early, my Azure Drake stays on the board, hand full of cheap damage spells. Dat +1 Spell Power. Should have crafted Drakes a long time ago since I was playing F2P style mage for dailies between arenas.

 

[JesseZao]

Has Blizzard ever talked about the idea of gifting inside of Hearthstone? It's a buddy of mine's birthday and I know he likes the game and I wish I was able to gift like 10 pack of cards or some such. Would be nice if they ever implemented something like that.

It's been mentioned, but not a feature to expect soon. You can buy battle.net giftcards though.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

The point is that the only time they're going to run a Doomguard into your Sen'jin is if 1) they have an empty board, or 2) they've emptied their hand. It doesn't matter if you've removed some of their minions; with just one minion in play, odds are they can use it to kill your Sen'jin.

Also, Hex doesn't care if it's a 5/7 Doomguard or a 5/4 Doomguard; either way it becomes a 0/1 Taunt. I get the impression you're not even discussing the Shaman vs. Zoo matchup, but rather some other deck vs. Zoo.

And I am saying that is not the only time they'll use a turn 5 doomguard. If you've been manipulating their board correctly they won't be able to 1:1 senjin. They won't always have an efficient answer for a 5 hp minion they have to kill. And you safe yourself a significant amount of hp even if they do, which is the goal of taunts.

And dealing with 1 doomguard while not using hex is good since at that point you basically have won because you already have an answer to the second doomguard. You can't count on getting a second hex against zoo.

I don't even understand what you're arguing. I'm very aware of how zoolock match up go, whether it is rogue, shaman, paladin etc., and all I am saying is that senjin is a pretty good card in the match up, even in shaman. Senjin has a lot of other weak match ups, which is why it isn't included in a lot of decklists.

 

[Kenaras]

And I am saying that is not the only time they'll use a turn 5 doomguard. If you've been manipulating their board correctly they won't be able to 1:1 senjin. They won't always have an efficient answer for a 5 hp minion they have to kill. And you safe yourself a significant amount of hp even if they do, which is the goal of taunts.

And dealing with 1 doomguard while not using hex is good since at that point you basically have won because you already have an answer to the second doomguard. You can't count on getting a second hex against zoo.

I don't even understand what you're arguing. I'm very aware of how zoolock match up go, whether it is rogue, shaman, paladin etc., and all I am saying is that senjin is a pretty good card in the match up, even in shaman. Senjin has a lot of other weak match ups, which is why it isn't included in a lot of decklists.

Explain how you manipulate their board so that "they won't be able to 1:1 senjin."

Protecting your face is not the only purpose of taunts, particularly in a Shaman deck. It's also to protect your other minions from unfavorable trades. Doomguard into Sen'jin is an unfavorable trade for the Shaman unless the Warlock discarded two cards. There have been many, many times where a Zoo player has run a Doomguard into my face and I was thankful for it. It got Hexed the next turn, I gained a tempo advantage, and I won the game. Even better is when they're forced to run Doomguard into a wolf token, totem, or taunted Squire.

What I've been arguing is pretty clear: if you're going to adjust a Shaman deck to better handle Zoo, Sen'jin Shieldmasta is not a particularly great card to put in. Wild Pyromancer and Blood Knight are. A Sen'jin is just as likely to lose you tempo as it is to gain you tempo. (Sen'jin will gain tempo if the Warlock has no efficient way to deal with it in his hand.) I'm also not saying it's a bad card against Zoo; if you have one in your deck already, you wouldn't take it out to improve your Zoo matchup. Sen'jin is a great card against "face" decks (16hp Warlock, Shockadin, Charge Hunter, etc.) It's also good against Charge-based finishers (Miracle's Leeroy, Druid's Force of Nature, and so on.) Against Zoo, it's merely decent.

 

[giapel]

That feeling when the opponent plays Onyxia and you topdeck a Swipe

 

[Minsc]

Wait, there's no chance Naxx will cost 5k gold...

100 gold = approx 1.20 dollars

5k gold = approx 60 dollars

Blizzard will never take $60 for the expansion, I'm thinking this'll cost max 1000 gold (around 15 bucks).

There's nothing that says they'd price the PVE content at the same gold:dollar ratio as expert packs or arena entries. Of course there's nothing that says they'd change it, but since they're spacing the wings a week apart and the first week is free... given you earn ~400+ gold/week, it seems logical they'd price it at over 400 gold otherwise extremely few people would bother to pay money for it since you earn the entry for free every week.

So if you believe they'll price it at around 500 or higher per wing, then you probably also have to believe they'd not use the same gold:dollar ratio, so that paying money is actually a better value than just saving gold, not a worse value.

 

[LaneDS]

It's been mentioned, but not a feature to expect soon. You can buy battle.net giftcards though.

Good to hear, and thanks.

 

[Ashodin]

I'm certain it'll be 2K.

 

[Yoshichan]

EU down? Maintenance?

 

[AllGamer]

EU down? Maintenance?

Probably. It's down for me too.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Explain how you manipulate their board so that "they won't be able to 1:1 senjin."

Protecting your face is not the only purpose of taunts, particularly in a Shaman deck. It's also to protect your other minions from unfavorable trades. Doomguard into Sen'jin is an unfavorable trade for the Shaman unless the Warlock discarded two cards. There have been many, many times where a Zoo player has run a Doomguard into my face and I was thankful for it. It got Hexed the next turn, I gained a tempo advantage, and I won the game. Even better is when they're forced to run Doomguard into a wolf token, totem, or taunted Squire.

What I've been arguing is pretty clear: if you're going to adjust a Shaman deck to better handle Zoo, Sen'jin Shieldmasta is not a particularly great card to put in. Wild Pyromancer and Blood Knight are. A Sen'jin is just as likely to lose you tempo as it is to gain you tempo. (Sen'jin will gain tempo if the Warlock has no efficient way to deal with it in his hand.) I'm also not saying it's a bad card against Zoo; if you have one in your deck already, you wouldn't take it out to improve your Zoo matchup. Sen'jin is a great card against "face" decks (16hp Warlock, Shockadin, Charge Hunter, etc.) It's also good against Charge-based finishers (Miracle's Leeroy, Druid's Force of Nature, and so on.) Against Zoo, it's merely decent.

I feel like you are twisting my words each time I say something. I never said the only purpose of taunts is to protect face. In fact, the whole point I was making was to force warlock to drop doomguard earlier than intended, thus discarding cards and you come back and say "dg into senjin is unfavorable unless they discard two cards", which is the whole point I was making. If lock has only doomguard in hand turn 5, he uses it regardless of senjin or not. I am talking about situations where you force him to use it (to save his other minion's) and discard cards. I thought that was quite clear.

 

[Raxus]

So did the pricing even get delayed?

Blizzard going to Blizzard.

 

[inky]

So did the pricing even get delayed?

Blizzard going to Blizzard.

Yup, it probably went like this:

"Hey guys, if we release the pricing a couple of weeks before the content everyone will save gold and not spend money on it when it comes out!"

"He's right! Give that man a promotion!"

"Phew, that was a close one"

*dives into McDuck's pool of money*

 

[JesseZao]

Yup, it probably went like this:

"Hey guys, if we release the pricing a couple of weeks before the content everyone will save gold and not spend money on it when it comes out!"

"He's right! Give that man a promotion!"

"Phew, that was a close one"

*dives into McDuck's pool of money*

Somebody asked, "What's stopping us from charging more gold? Ever since the bonehead included 'Be sure to start saving for Naxx!' in the announcement, everybody did. Go figure."

Which was followed up with, "We should tack on another 100-200 gold per wing to compensate. 600 or 700 gold is now our debate. Delay the announcement a few days."

 

[RumblingRosco]

I bet Blizzard is tracking the average gold across all players and has seen it has risen dramatically recently. It is a form of virtual inflation. We could probably create a great study off of this.

Y'all hoarders are ruining it for the rest of us!

 

[rac]

Priest vs priest is the most unbearable shit ever. Just save all your 4 damage cards till the very end and don't argus your 4-3.

Also anyone who runs leeroy is an asshole.

 

[ZZMitch]

Does Hearthstats reset Ranked/Arena win percentages each month or is the website just messed up atm?

 

[Bizazedo]

I bet Blizzard is tracking the average gold across all players and has seen it has risen dramatically recently. It is a form of virtual inflation. We could probably create a great study off of this.

Y'all hoarders are ruining it for the rest of us!

Oh crap, better hoard more!

 

[JesseZao]

I bet Blizzard is tracking the average gold across all players and has seen it has risen dramatically recently. It is a form of virtual inflation. We could probably create a great study off of this.

Y'all hoarders are ruining it for the rest of us!

I secretly expected this and have blown my thousands already muhaha. Oh wait, they may not give much warning before release now. Guess I'll have to dive back into arena.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I only have 1k gold, but I have been pretty lazy about completing daily quests for like the last month and a half.

 

[de1irium]

Archmage is stupid good. Mage played his. I faceless, starfall, innervate, hero. Pretty sure I went on to have at least 4 fireballs in my hand by the end of the match, too.

 

[johnsmith]

Woo, just won like 4 games straight with miracle without even needing to use leroy.

 

[Yoshichan]

Hearthstone EU back up!!

 

[Yoshichan]

Yet another shit shaman deck drafted. I'll be lucky to get 1-3.

 

[Yoshichan]

Disconnected just before a win... are you shitting me?

Everything is just standing completely still... WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS TO ME, BLIZZARD. WHY?!?!?#!)=¤#=!(¤)!(5490185015015141

 

[johnsmith]

Seriously, so many wins without Leroy or even auctioneer. This is why this deck is so damn good. If you can establish any sort of board presence, it's gg. Getting really tempted to craft Van Cleef to step my miracle game up to the next level. But I know as soon as I do the deck will get nerfed.

 

[Aquavelvaman]

I'm thinking about starting up some kind of buddy-play system. Watching Trump talk over every play with Hafu and Otter is really helpful. Even small, seemingly obvious plays get a little discussion and you end up seeing a lot more options throughout a match when you have to talk through every action you take.

Even if both players aren't great at the game , they can both learn a lot from each other by just slowly playing through a dozen or so games while taking their time and discussing every move they make. It's sort of like co-operative coaching.

Is there any organization that already does this? Any interest on GAF?

 

[Tarazet]

I played Tempo Rogue all evening and only got from rank 20 to 19. At least I was a little better than 50/50. I saw a lot more aggro than I usually do in that rank. How would you adapt the deck to an aggro meta? If I go up against a Warrior I might as well concede, because it is just not going to go my way if they get even one Fiery Win Axe. Zoo is a tough matchup too. BGH always gets played as a pure vanilla minion unless I'm up against a Druid or Handlock and he does OK, but maybe a Betrayal would be helpful.

http://hearthstoneplayers.com/guide-tempo-rogue-sipiwi94/

 

[johnsmith]

Switch to miracle unless you're lacking the legendaries? I've given up on tempo. I can't do good with it either. Early game works well, but it completely falls apart mid to late game as my hand empties out, and I can't replenish it like miracle can.

Oh wait, that version of tempo uses the same legendaries as miracle. Yeah, no reason at all to play it, unless you're trying to be "different." It's an inferior deck. I went rank 18-15 tonight without playing too much.

 

[Tarazet]

Switch to miracle unless you're lacking the legendaries? I've given up on tempo. I can't do good with it either. Early game works well, but it completely falls apart mid to late game as my hand empties out, and I can't replenish it like miracle can.

Oh wait, that version of tempo uses the same legendaries as miracle. Yeah, no reason at all to play it, unless you're trying to be "different." It's an inferior deck.

I don't have Van Cleef, or any copies of Preparation. For what it's worth, I've been destroying Miracle Rogues. The best games I have with Tempo usually start on turn 2 coining into SI:7 Agent, which is why Warrior is such a rough matchup. And it is tough to mulligan it because there are too many 3 drops and very little that works on turn 1 or 2.

However, I don't have the same issue with late game as you're describing. If I've been putting together plays correctly, then I run out of cards just as I have enough mana for Sprint. If I'm up against a control deck I may not even need it.

 

[Yoshichan]

Bitch ass Shaman deck:
2-3

Deck + Misdirection

edit: HOLY SHIT AND FROM THAT ONE DECK, I GOT THIS:

 

[rac]

fun game

 

[Birdman02]

It looks like the infinite quest reroll thing was fixed? It usually works for me at this time, but no luck tonight

 

[Officerrob]

It looks like the infinite quest reroll thing was fixed? It usually works for me at this time, but no luck tonight

Same here

 

[MisterArrogant]

It looks like the infinite quest reroll thing was fixed? It usually works for me at this time, but no luck tonight

Same here

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I'm starting to hate savage roar... cause even when I don't lose to it, I lose to playing around it...

 

[Yoshichan]

Not gonna play more arena until the rank reset hysteria is over.

It affects the difficulty in arena because everyone is so excited getting dem super exciting decks for e-penis' growth. Great fucking decks drafted and still can't go over 3 wins.

 

[Yoshichan]

I have three arcanite reapers

4 cards left in my deck (before dying)

I got 0 arcanite reapers in that game

"RNG". Sureeeeeeeeee. I trust ya Blizz.

 

[zoukka]

Breathe Yoshi.

A tip to all control warriors playing against Priest. Think of the matchup as you were playing freezemage. Keep the board clear and wait for Alex. Don't try to peck the priests life apart because that won't do you no good in the long run, they will stabilize always against a warrior.

I'm starting to hate savage roar... cause even when I don't lose to it, I lose to playing around it...

Ramp druid is just as bad as zoo.

 

[Yoshichan]

Breathing... breathing... breathing...

 

[zoukka]

I can't beat zoo's with my warrior. Even with amazing opening hands, my cards will eventually run out. I hope to god Blizz has sense to buff control decks or nerf the fucking warlock ability.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I can't beat zoo's with my warrior. Even with amazing opening hands, my cards will eventually run out. I hope to god Blizz has sense to buff control decks or nerf the fucking warlock ability.

I almost went undefeated vs zoolock tonight... just one lock had to drop like 5 minions before turn 4 and I only had 1 piece that I needed to slow that train down.

I'm playing pretty bad tonight overall though. I moved nowhere...

 

[zoukka]

Games against zoo are so depressing too because it's just a roll of the dice when they Soul Tap -> play whatever they drew -> Soul Tap -> play whatever they drew Soul Tap -> play whatever they drew...

 

[Aquavelvaman]

My win rate against zoo is really high as warrior. Sometimes the draws just don't go my way but most of the time it's no problem. You'll never get good value in the early game vs zoo so just throw out all of your cards and keep the board neutral until your godly late game is ready. You have to be okay with using execute to do 2 damage or running a kok'ron elite into something for just 1:1, you'll make up for it later. Are you running Baron?