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Hearthstone |OT5| Corrupted Deeprock Salt

I am genuinely curious as to how heroic Skelesaurus ever made it through testing. Like, who allowed this?

It's far and away the worst designed encounter of all three adventures.

Edit: Finally, jeez. Screw that fight.
 

Papercuts

fired zero bullets in the orphanage.
Shredder is not singlehandedly stifling 5/4s. Deaths Bite, Truesilver Champion, 2 mana removal plus pings, lots of stuff can deal 4 damage around those turns. It also makes the main body easier to kill, so earlier minions can trade up, like Minibot, leper gnome, zombie chow, etc. AOE clears it better.

You're basically looking at the difference between Sky Golem and Highmane. Highmane is way better because it has that extra piece of health.

Good points actually, guess I tunnel visioned too much on it, lol.
 

Hupsel

Member
U guys think brawl and shadowflame should be nerfed somehow? Such boring cards :/ Do nothing entire game and boom, board clear :<
 

Dahbomb

Member
U guys think brawl and shadowflame should be nerfed somehow? Such boring cards :/ Do nothing entire game and boom, board clear :<
Hell no.

You know Priest has Light bomb too right? In fact there are Priest decks that do nothing but clear your boards with their board clears and hard removals.


These AOE clears are not even that good against the Deathratte minions. Warrior can have 3 Brawls and still lose to Zoolock.
 
Hell no.

You know Priest has Light bomb too right? In fact there are Priest decks that do nothing but clear your boards with their board clears and hard removals.


These AOE clears are not even that good against the Deathratte minions. Warrior can have 3 Brawls and still lose to Zoolock.

I was looking at the Liquid Hearth net decks and the decks that got to #1 Legend (even for like Secret Paladin) all run nerubian egg now. Which make so much more sense becaue priest has light bomb, warrior has brawl, mage has a blizzard/flamestrike/nova>doomsayer, rough has blade fury, Warlock has shadowflame, shaman has whatever the fuck they have, paladin mirror you might run into consec.

The egg is such an awesome card to keep board control when you already have board control. You AOE 80% of my shit but guess what there's still more. And you probably don't have enough mana to play anything else after your AOE so I still have the board.

And yea Liquid Hearth net decks blow Tempostorm decks out the water, so much more thought into them.
 
I was looking at the Liquid Hearth net decks and the decks that got to #1 Legend (even for like Secret Paladin) all run nerubian egg now. Which make so much more sense becaue priest has light bomb, warrior has brawl, mage has a blizzard/flamestrike/nova>doomsayer, rough has blade fury, Warlock has shadowflame, shaman has whatever the fuck they have, paladin mirror you might run into consec.

The egg is such an awesome card to keep board control when you already have board control. You AOE 80% of my shit but guess what there's still more. And you probably don't have enough mana to play anything else after your AOE so I still have the board.

And yea Liquid Hearth net decks blow Tempostorm decks out the water, so much more thought into them.

Well, the liquid power rankings are derived from input from like a dozen actual pros
 
Apparently you can get rid of the Armor boss' 1 dmg per hit thing by changing his hero power. Someone used Blingtron and gave him that Shaman hammer and when it changed the armor effect was lost. Someone try Cho + Shadowform
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
TIL that if you put Ancestral Spirit on Malorne it will not revive him when killed.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I was looking at the Liquid Hearth net decks and the decks that got to #1 Legend (even for like Secret Paladin) all run nerubian egg now. Which make so much more sense becaue priest has light bomb, warrior has brawl, mage has a blizzard/flamestrike/nova>doomsayer, rough has blade fury, Warlock has shadowflame, shaman has whatever the fuck they have, paladin mirror you might run into consec.

The egg is such an awesome card to keep board control when you already have board control. You AOE 80% of my shit but guess what there's still more. And you probably don't have enough mana to play anything else after your AOE so I still have the board.

And yea Liquid Hearth net decks blow Tempostorm decks out the water, so much more thought into them.
Liquid Hearth ratings are based on tournament level play (ie. what is strong at tournaments) +, Tempostorm is more based on Ladder flavor of the month (ie. what is strong in Ladder). That's why Aggro Shaman is high on Tempostorm but low on Liquid Hearth... on Ladder you can easily grind to Legend with it but against high level players it can get countered much easier and then shut down.

And if you want to just counter play AOE clears, play Zoolock with mostly Deathrattle minions. No one is going to clear a board that has Void Callers, Shredders, Imp Gang, Creepers and Eggs on the field.
 
Liquid Hearth ratings are based on tournament level play (ie. what is strong at tournaments) +, Tempostorm is more based on Ladder flavor of the month (ie. what is strong in Ladder). That's why Aggro Shaman is high on Tempostorm but low on Liquid Hearth... on Ladder you can easily grind to Legend with it but against high level players it can get countered much easier and then shut down.

And if you want to just counter play AOE clears, play Zoolock with mostly Deathrattle minions. No one is going to clear a board that has Void Callers, Shredders, Imp Gang, Creepers and Eggs on the field.

I'm not going to play Zoolock just cause of AOE clears. >.<

What I was saying was that I look over common decks that I personally play and the Liquid Hearth decks just made so much more sense. Their deck is build around the current meta and how to beat it. While Tempostorm decks to me is following the meta.

Like with me personally AOE clear is something I struggle with as a Paladin player, and the Liquid Hearth paladin decks address those issues.
 

Pooya

Member
why would anyone play Reno priest? lmao. so bad.

tomb pillager is alright, I probably just play one. even then the only card I'm willing to cut now is a second fan but even that is hard in current meta. I played it in place of a single shredder I had and it was fine, maybe better than shredder for oil rogue even. shredder drop isn't all that important to me I think, I feel 5 attack is kinda nice against druid actually or belchers in general.

Getting a coin in mid game isn't amazing overall like it is in the opening but it enables more options for sure. I think it's worth playing a single one for 11 mana possible lethals!
 

Dahbomb

Member
I'm not going to play Zoolock just cause of AOE clears. >.<

What I was saying was that I look over common decks that I personally play and the Liquid Hearth decks just made so much more sense. Their deck is build around the current meta and how to beat it. While Tempostorm decks to me is following the meta.

Like with me personally AOE clear is something I struggle with as a Paladin player, and the Liquid Hearth paladin decks address those issues.
Don't you play Midrange Paladin?

You got Minibot, Shredders, Justicar to generate tokens, Muster to generate tokens, Tirion, Dr Balanced, Belchers, Loatheb...

Like if you are struggling with AOE with that stuff then you are probably doing something wrong there.
 
Don't you play Midrange Paladin?

You got Minibot, Shredders, Justicar to generate tokens, Muster to generate tokens, Tirion, Dr Balanced, Belchers, Loatheb...

Like if you are struggling with AOE with that stuff then you are probably doing something wrong there.

Brawl.... Freeze mage... light bomb, swipe... etc.

It's not like I get perfect curve every game. Sometimes you get shit like Aldor/BGH and you have no turn 3 play. Or shit like Slyvanas > Shadowflame or Slyvanas > Brawl.

There's a fine line of when do you hold back on playing because X AOE is coming or when do you play a push damage for lethal. Obviously I can't look at the other guys hand and know exactly what he is holding but just best assumption on his mulligan, and how he has played. I think that where the rank 1-3 players differentiate from the legend players. Legends guy kind of have a good sense when to trade and when to push. Something I still struggle with.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Druids have 2 AOEs total... Swipe which is a pretty weak board control. Play around it and you can body them. Normally Paladin loses to Druid because one or two of the bigger minions survive and they get comboed. Druid struggles heavily in controlling a Paladin board. Swipe usually just clears some tokens and a mid sized threat... unless you forget to play around it, it's not usually game winning (but it can be combined with Azure Drake).

Freeze Mage is a tough match up and you need to probably tech against that. Thankfully Freeze Mage is very uncommon on Ladder these days especially since Tempostorm moved it out of tier 1. As long as you save Silences for Doomsayer and use Loatheb appropriately, you can make it a fight. Generally speaking it's not because Freeze Mage can clear Paladin board that makes it a bad match up.. it's that Paladin doesn't have burst to put enough pressure even with frozen minions and Paladin can't overheal like Warrior can.

Brawl is also easy to play around, don't put more minions on the board than you have to. Usually you can put just enough pressure where they will have to use up their Brawls early and after that it's GG for sure. This is actually a very bad match up for Warrior because once Justicar is played by Paladin the Warrior can't keep controlling the board. Grim Patron Warrior is a better match up but they don't usually run Brawl, just a bunch of whirlwind effects which usually have a better effect against Paladin. But again, Grim Patron is very uncommon on Ladder... if it's a Warrior then it's probably going to be CW (and you are favored).

Warlock Shadow Flame? Paladin is favored again here as long as you play around Molten Shadow Flame. Worst thing to look out for is Sylvanas Shadowflame but you can still recover from it. And that's a 10 mana play using two cards, Equality + Consecrate is superior. Equality demolishes Handlock, combined with Aldors and Uldamans this match up is now even more in favor of the Paladin.

Oil Rogue is favored against Paladins but you only have to play around a limited amount of AOEs (Fan of Knives and Blade Flurry). If you get the Blade Flurry out early from them then they lose a big chunk of their potential damage so getting your board wiped out isn't a big issue.


Paladin is like Zoolock where they can easily repopulate the board after they get wiped. Plus they can put enough pressure on the board with fewer cards. I mean so what if your Minibot + Muster for Battle got cleared by a Swipe... That's not even a clean 2 for 1 there. Most decks run a limited amount of board clears and you only need to play around stuff to an extent.
 
Well I think the hard part is knowing when they will play it. They obviously have it in the deck but to maximize your play you need to know exactly when.

Is it brawl on turn #5, 6, 7, 8, 9 or 10? Etc.. For example if I mulligan and end up with a muster, and top deck another muster turn #4.

So I muster turn #3 and Druid swipes. Do I play muster turn #4 (let say I didn't get a shredder)? Does he have a 2nd swipe. Yes or no? And if he does will he play it.

Another easy example is let say Druid hold 3 cards on turn #10. I can set up for a two turn lethal or I can clear his board (let say I'm sitting on 20 hp). Do I push for win and if he has combo then he has combo I lose. Or do I play around him having combo. Continue to clear the board and try to stay above 14? You can't exactly know you can only make the best educated guess on how he has played. There are scenarios where both are the right play.

I think any idiot can play on curve but that isn't the hard part the hard part is when you get shitty draws and how you can play from it. Like when I watch Hoej play his secret paladin so many times he wouldn't make the trade and just go face. Now him being a top player he just seemed to almost always top deck what he needed for exact lethal, but obviously would look like an idiot if that Truesilver/blessing/consec never came for that extra 2-4 damage to push for win. Now obviously he sees something that tells him to push rather than control the board so it isn't luck. It's a educated guess with probably some math/odds behind it.

As to someone like Trump who probably can't make that play because of his inability to know when to say fuck value/board and push. When can I push and say he doesn't have his AOE or he won't have it in time. When do I know he does have his AOE so what's the best way to play around it and when is my lethal turn coming? What can he top deck that would ruin my game, what can I top deck would ruin his plans?
 

KuroNeeko

Member
Playing around with some Control Rogue / Elise Starseeker.

I haven't got the Golden Monkey in play yet, but I've managed to get it in my deck.
The deck has Reno and Sir Finley and plays a lot like a Grinder deck, without the Duplicate / Effigy value.

If that doesn't work, I may try Grinder Mage or Priest. Hmm, Reno Warlock might also be all right -- or perhaps a Fatigue Druid variant? Actually, Fatigue Priest with two Entombs and Elise as an alternate win condition might work ... wow.

No time to even play with Museum Curator or Tomb Pillager. Better enjoy this time of "discovery" while it lasts.

So how's Museum Curator? Anyone using it?

Not yet. I'd like to but my Control Priest is already so packed, I have no idea what to drop.
 

KuroNeeko

Member
Yeah dunno why Museum Curator is a 1/2 when Dark Peddler is a 2/2

I don't know, maybe because you can pull things like Sylvanas, Sludge Belcher, Dark Cultists, or Sneed's from it? Isn't DP limited to a 1-cost Discover? I mean, JS is a guaranteed three-drop and it's a 1/1.

Just guessing....
 
Yeah I guess. I kinda think the strength of Discover is giving yourself something you can use pretty much immediately though. You will end up with a lot of Dark Cultists since the class cards are weighed so heavily so thats probably pretty good.
 
Yeah I guess. I kinda think the strength of Discover is giving yourself something you can use pretty much immediately though. You will end up with a lot of Dark Cultists since the class cards are weighed so heavily so thats probably pretty good.

Yep, if you pretty much always get a cultist as a minimum choice, it can be a very strong card.

In real terms, I was tracking a metaltooth 4/5 times with gorilla in hunter, so I'd expect much the same result.

Maybe it doesn't have the class bias though? But either way a haunted creeper is maybe even better.

Discover is so good in priest because it effectively (for the most part) enlarges the size of your deck.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Well I think the hard part is knowing when they will play it. They obviously have it in the deck but to maximize your play you need to know exactly when.

Is it brawl on turn #5, 6, 7, 8, 9 or 10? Etc.. For example if I mulligan and end up with a muster, and top deck another muster turn #4.
You play like they have Brawl in their hand from turn 5 going up.

So I muster turn #3 and Druid swipes. Do I play muster turn #4 (let say I didn't get a shredder)? Does he have a 2nd swipe. Yes or no? And if he does will he play it.
You play Muster again with Impunity. This example is easy. They spend Swipe to clear part of one card (you still have the weapon from the Muster) and then they do it again to clear one card again. You actually want them to use the 2nd Swipe because after that they can't clear your board. A good Druid player will probably not Swipe just a board of 3 tokens unless he strongly suspects a Quartermaster is incoming.

Another easy example is let say Druid hold 3 cards on turn #10. I can set up for a two turn lethal or I can clear his board (let say I'm sitting on 20 hp). Do I push for win and if he has combo then he has combo I lose. Or do I play around him having combo. Continue to clear the board and try to stay above 14? You can't exactly know you can only make the best educated guess on how he has played. There are scenarios where both are the right play.
You play around combo all the time every time. If you clear his board then you are playing it safe and increasing your chances to win. If you try to set up a 2 turn lethal and they had combo in hand... well then you are going to feel pretty bad about it afterwards.

You only don't play around combo if you are not going to win otherwise. Let's say you are running out of cards, already on very low health and he has heavy advantage. Basically you are going to lose if he has combo anyway so in that situation you DON'T play around combo because otherwise you will never win (just lose slowly or lose when they eventually top dick combo).

I think any idiot can play on curve but that isn't the hard part the hard part is when you get shitty draws and how you can play from it. Like when I watch Hoej play his secret paladin so many times he wouldn't make the trade and just go face. Now him being a top player he just seemed to almost always top deck what he needed for exact lethal, but obviously would look like an idiot if that Truesilver/blessing/consec never came for that extra 2-4 damage to push for win. Now obviously he sees something that tells him to push rather than control the board so it isn't luck. It's a educated guess with probably some math/odds behind it.
That just comes from experience. Usually as a Secret Paladin you can make an estimate on what's left on your deck (ie. look at Deck tracker) and say "ok he has used up his heals and if I go face I can set up a 2 turn lethal on board with extra damage from hand. Next turn I can kill him if I just top dick 2+ damage. I have 4 cards in my deck that can do 4 damage which is good chance to get. Even if I don't get it I would still be in OK spot."


As to someone like Trump who probably can't make that play because of his inability to know when to say fuck value/board and push. When can I push and say he doesn't have his AOE or he won't have it in time. When do I know he does have his AOE so what's the best way to play around it and when is my lethal turn coming? What can he top deck that would ruin my game, what can I top deck would ruin his plans?
There's no easy answer to these questions but there are general guidelines.

*You always assume they have one AOE clear in hand so you play around that. Once that is played, odds are they don't have a 2nd AOE right after that so you play a bit more aggressively after that but not too aggressively in the off chance they do.

*If you are winning then you have to be extra careful about what card they can use that can put them back in the game. If you are winning and you think you can set up a 2 turn lethal by playing 2 extra minions but playing those 2 minions means you would lose to Lightbomb... then don't play those 2 extra minions to set up a 2 turn lethal.

*If you are losing then you can't afford to play around board clears and have to start playing for tempo/closing the game fast.


Of course this all changes from match up to match up. Against a Freeze Mage you would have to play a bit more aggressively to pop Ice Block if it means playing into Frost Nova + Doomsayer sometimes. Against a Druid/Oil Rogue.. you would play extra safe even at 20 HP and clear their board completely, even if it's an inefficient clear (like using Consecrate to remove just one minion).

All these things come from experience. That balancing act of playing safely vs playing aggressively/playing to win and how to switch from one to another seamlessly.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I swear people mulligan FOR Reno. I don't think I've played a game today where it wasn't in the opening hand.
Spoken like a true Aggro player.

For the record... against Hunters people actually DO mulligan for Reno. Basically for Renolock it's an auto win against Hunters if they get it.

Against Druids I probably would not because it could just be standard Midrange Druid and then I would get punished for it.
 
Spoken like a true Aggro player.

For the record... against Hunters people actually DO mulligan for Reno. Basically for Renolock it's an auto win against Hunters if they get it.

Against Druids I probably would not because it could just be standard Midrange Druid and then I would get punished for it.

Eh, I'm only playing aggro at the moment cause it's the most efficient and control warrior is pretty bad in this meta. Freeze mage pretty hit or miss too. I mean, I could play secret pally instead, but that's even more brain dead with Dr. 2, Dr. 3, etc. Aggro druid is actually pretty tactical at times - whether to save keepers for silence vs. removal, push face damage or not, risk playing fel reaver, etc.
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
How to beat heroic rafaam.

Step 1. Put Alarm-o-Bots in your deck.
Step 2. Draw Rare Spear
Step 3. ???
Step 4. PROFIT!
 

Dahbomb

Member
Eh, I'm only playing aggro at the moment cause it's the most efficient and control warrior is pretty bad in this meta. Freeze mage pretty hit or miss too. I mean, I could play secret pally instead, but that's even more brain dead with Dr. 2, Dr. 3, etc. Aggro druid is actually pretty tactical at times - whether to save keepers for silence vs. removal, push face damage or not, risk playing fel reaver, etc.
Don't worry, most people aggro because it is in fact the most efficient. I do too especially for quests.

It was just a meme before that whoever complained about Reno Jackson was a Hunter player (and 90% of the time it ended up being true). LOL!


How to beat heroic rafaam.

Step 1. Put Alarm-o-Bots in your deck.
Step 2. Draw Rare Spear
Step 3. ???
Step 4. PROFIT!
You don't even need Step 1 really, it might even back fire sometimes. You really just need Spear turn 1 and stuff your deck with shitty Rares like Target Dummies.
 

Triz

Member
I'm having loads of fun with paladin decks with anyfin can happen. I've wrecked just about every deck with it. I didn't think the card would be that good.
 

Owzers

Member
My face hunter is officially useless on the ladder, and although people would rejoice, it's only replaced by other people using even better face decks.
 

Cipherr

Member
I cant wait to see someone put up the decklists for these bosses so I can see how blatantly they are fixing the opening hand in their PvE bosses for this wing. Skele gets Ancestral in his opening hand so often that he had better have like 8 of those motherfuckers or its obvious blizzard loads the hand a good percentage of the time.

I played this guy over 20 times (start game and concede after turn 2) and a clear 85%+ of the time he has that card usable on turn two.
 
I wish there were more 4 mana aoe clears. no point in holy nova or lightbomb when you cant stabilize against an aggro shaman by turn 5 w/ control priest
 

KuroNeeko

Member
YES!

I got the Golden Monkey out on Ladder!

Then proceeded to Hemet Nesingwary my opponents Druid of the Claw and Black Knight is Ancient of War ... to bad he conceded after that. ^^;
 
This Shaman just went face with Totem Golem while I had 9/2 Lightwarden on the board. Next turn he conceded. I love the people that go face no matter the cost.

Anyway, I actually quite like Museum Curator so far. Hasn't failed to give me a useful card yet.
 

ricelord

Member
Been playing around with cursed blade, and i came to a conclusion that it suck mighty balls. its unable if you don't have it or draw to on turn one. if you do use it, it a run against time until your opponent gonna have the cards to rekt you. sure it allow you to use charge + molten combo and have the full effect mortal strike way sooner., but atm its not enough to reliable.
 
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