Oni Link 666
Member
Suckdeki!
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IGN gives Sudeki a...(also 1up score)
- Thread starter Blazing Sword
- Start date
Alex
Member
I admit, I'm not at all interested in Sudeki in the least bit.... But I've got to say, that 1up review is about one of the worst "reviews" I've ever read.
Granted, I'm such abysmal writer I shouldn't even be talking, but c'mon really, that was just really pathetic from my pov.
I'm so out of the loop these days, shit, isn't 1up susposed to be a fairly decent site?
Granted, I'm such abysmal writer I shouldn't even be talking, but c'mon really, that was just really pathetic from my pov.
I'm so out of the loop these days, shit, isn't 1up susposed to be a fairly decent site?
JackFrost2012
Banned
Alex said:
Can you not make a purchasing decision without a "fun factor" score?
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
Kirsten Dunst is not amused
that 1up review really is unusually bad. what's up with the extended metaphor? it's boring and inane, and takes up nearly half the text of the review, but that's not really the problem. let's do the thinking maragos clearly didn't: if sudeki is the "$650 offer," i guess that makes japanese game design the $400 offer, and western game design the $800 offer. so japanese game design is fundamentally better than western game design? and it's good that sudeki makes concessions to japanese styles, but it doesn't go far enough in that direction? that's not what he meant to suggest, is it? granted, this is more likely a sign of lazy writing than bias, but it's amusing that the mistake appears in a review that balks at sudeki's cultural borrowing and doesn't go much further.
nich maragos has written some memorably stupid reviews over at 1up. there was the review that slated beyond good and evil for nebulously failing to exceed the sum of its parts, the review that explicitly indicted sonic heroes for attempting to be a sonic game (and told us this as if it was clever), and now there's this. maybe i should send him some grossly illiterate hate mail.
nich maragos has written some memorably stupid reviews over at 1up. there was the review that slated beyond good and evil for nebulously failing to exceed the sum of its parts, the review that explicitly indicted sonic heroes for attempting to be a sonic game (and told us this as if it was clever), and now there's this. maybe i should send him some grossly illiterate hate mail.
grammar critique? i guess you must be talking to me. except that i haven't critiqued anyone's grammar. i suppose it's no longer necessary to read a post before you respond to it, snarkily.
and preemptively: my message board posts are off the cuff and conversational in tone, and i'm perfectly content with their unorthodox grammar. sentence fragments rock.
and preemptively: my message board posts are off the cuff and conversational in tone, and i'm perfectly content with their unorthodox grammar. sentence fragments rock.
JackFrost2012
Banned
drohne said:
No, it's not.
The point Nich was trying to make was, if you want a Japanese RPG play a Japanese RPG, and if you want a Western RPG play a Western RPG. If you want a Japanese RPG and play a Western RPG that's striving to imitate a Japanese RPG (which Sudeki obviously is despite protestations to the contrary), you're going to wind up with a disappointing, half-assed experience.
See also: Shadow Madness.
maragos was saying one thing, the metaphor was saying another, and neither of them have anything resembling a point. i'm not really into rpg's, but deveopers under the influence of foreign games have given us vagrant story, pikmin, and dozens of nifty euro-shmups. you could make the case that sudeki is an inept borrowing, or a slavish borrowing, but i think it's daft to discourage such borrowing altogether.
and i wonder what sudeki's japanophile detractors would think of korean games in japanese styles. is it really that only the japanese should attempt japanese design and japanese art, or will any old asians do? i'm curious.
nb: i'm not defending sudeki. i have no interest in the game, and i think it looks vile.
and i wonder what sudeki's japanophile detractors would think of korean games in japanese styles. is it really that only the japanese should attempt japanese design and japanese art, or will any old asians do? i'm curious.
nb: i'm not defending sudeki. i have no interest in the game, and i think it looks vile.
JackFrost2012
Banned
drohne said:
Well, yes, of course. I don't think anyone is opposed to inspired borrowing that results in better games. What people don't want is slavish imitation without understanding what makes the things worthwhile in the first place. I'm not opposed to western artists in drawing in an anime style - it's just disingenous when people pretend that's not what's going on (of COURSE Sudeki is trying to appear Japanese). And the fact that the art looks terrible certainly doesn't help.
There's nothing "Japanophile" about it - the point is just, if you're going to do something, do it well or don't do it at all. Sudeki does a lousy job and it's gotten called on it. The issue is not in the copied style but with the degree of incompetence with which said copying was executed.
drohne said:
The worst part is that the review reads like a review of the art and story, forgetting it's a game. Hardly any of the game mechanics are addressed, instead it's a diatribe against some bad art and storytelling, as if they're the first western developer to be guilty of such crimes (granted they are more important in RPG's). If he had taken some time to talk about the game rather than think up some "clever" metaphors it would be a lot more relevant. Otherwise it's nothing you haven't read here for the last 18 months.
At least he's consistent.
JackFrost2012" said:
It's a shame he couldn't have been as succinct as you were.
JackFrost2012
Banned
Sysgen said:
I didn't want to bring it up, cause I know Che really likes it for some reason, but in countering the Japanophile argument, I'd bring up Breakdown as a counter-example: a Japanese development house copying Western gameplay and style without "getting" what makes it work. All cultures are guilty of incompetent cloning.
bobbyconover
Member
I actually like this review for the most part, but "this was as good or better than he was expecting" is some piss-poor parallel construction.
On another note, I want to thank the 1up guys for delivering reviews that are thorough and informative yet concise. I've long since had enough of reading 8-page IGN reviews that rant at ridiculous length about inconsequential crap or spend paragraphs trying to be funny.
They're talking a lot, but they're not saying anything.
On another note, I want to thank the 1up guys for delivering reviews that are thorough and informative yet concise. I've long since had enough of reading 8-page IGN reviews that rant at ridiculous length about inconsequential crap or spend paragraphs trying to be funny.
They're talking a lot, but they're not saying anything.
Borrowing happens all the time. Compare korean art that was "borrowed from japan" (was it really? i dunno maybe) then compare it to sudeki. The korean stuff 99/100 times will look 100000 times better than sudeki. its not shitty design cause they borrowed from the japanese, its shitty design because it reeks of marketing ploy(referring to the "sex appeal") and looks like amateur crap.
JackFrost2012
Banned
sp0rsk said:
In its defense, the actual character art for Sudeki isn't half-bad. But somewhere along the line, the in-game models turns out not even half-good.
JackFrost2012
Banned
bobbyconover said:
The 1UP review details what works (battle system, some dungeons) and what doesn't (art, characters, story). As Ebert said in his wonderful review of A Cinderella Story last week: "Even when a critic dislikes a movie, if it's a good review, it has enough information so you can figure out whether you'd like it, anyway."
I know that videogame fans like to think that every review should have a a +/- margin of error of 0.2 points with their own opinions, but seriously: if you read Nich's review and thought "I like games with good battle systems and don't care about story; I still want to play Sudeki," then even if you disagree with Nich's final score, HE HAS DONE HIS JOB AS A REVIEWER.
So get over it, play the game, form your own opinion, and move on.
(not bloodly likely, but)
Alex
Member
My issue with it, besides the eyesore of an introduction, was the utter lack of breaking down the finer points of the gameplay, or even some freaking mention of most of it.
Personally, what little interest I had with Sudeki only took the JP/US decable as far as: "Christ, these are ugly characters".
There's a few decent points brought up, but really, there's so much fluff and focus on lesser issues (RPG or not) that it boggles the mind.
I agree with those 4-5 page IGN monsters being a real pain, but rooting through story/acting/JP RPG convention blurbs only to wind up with a vague, ultimately uninformative descrip of the battle engine solely as far as the game itself goes, well, to me that's a pretty iffy review.
Personally, what little interest I had with Sudeki only took the JP/US decable as far as: "Christ, these are ugly characters".
There's a few decent points brought up, but really, there's so much fluff and focus on lesser issues (RPG or not) that it boggles the mind.
I agree with those 4-5 page IGN monsters being a real pain, but rooting through story/acting/JP RPG convention blurbs only to wind up with a vague, ultimately uninformative descrip of the battle engine solely as far as the game itself goes, well, to me that's a pretty iffy review.
Originally Posted by chespace:
hey buddy, if you can stomach playing through sudeki, you're a better man than i.
godspeed, and more power to you.
----
http://chespace.1up.com
Dude, you stomached Breakdown if I remember correctly. An Western style FPS butchered by a Japanese development house, yet received scores form GMR and EGM in the range of 85-90%. I smell a double standard.
I played Breakdown and in the end I enjoyed it. I knew what it was going in and I set my expectations accordingly. If I expected Halo, I would of rated Breakdown a 5 or a miserable failure. No one expected Sudeki to be Final Fantasy and if you did then there is something wrong. No one expected Climax to produce an RPG like SquareEnix could and if you did then there is something wrong. Games in the past have had bad voice acting and yet I have been able to enjoy them. Shenmue anyone? Why did MS not allow early reviews? Was it because Sudeki is so horrible and it just SUX0rS or is it becuase of review sites like 1up that want it to be something it's not and have used the oppurtunity to bury it as a dog would cover it's shit?
On another note this same site awarded Manhunt one of it's lowest scores received yet I found many redeeming features in the title as did many reviewers. Between their Breakdown orgasm, their Manhunt "I don't like what this game does to my inner self" review and now thier Sudeki "is it really a review" review, perhaps this time and in the future I'll look elsewhere for something coherent.
hey buddy, if you can stomach playing through sudeki, you're a better man than i.
godspeed, and more power to you.
----
http://chespace.1up.com
Dude, you stomached Breakdown if I remember correctly. An Western style FPS butchered by a Japanese development house, yet received scores form GMR and EGM in the range of 85-90%. I smell a double standard.
I played Breakdown and in the end I enjoyed it. I knew what it was going in and I set my expectations accordingly. If I expected Halo, I would of rated Breakdown a 5 or a miserable failure. No one expected Sudeki to be Final Fantasy and if you did then there is something wrong. No one expected Climax to produce an RPG like SquareEnix could and if you did then there is something wrong. Games in the past have had bad voice acting and yet I have been able to enjoy them. Shenmue anyone? Why did MS not allow early reviews? Was it because Sudeki is so horrible and it just SUX0rS or is it becuase of review sites like 1up that want it to be something it's not and have used the oppurtunity to bury it as a dog would cover it's shit?
On another note this same site awarded Manhunt one of it's lowest scores received yet I found many redeeming features in the title as did many reviewers. Between their Breakdown orgasm, their Manhunt "I don't like what this game does to my inner self" review and now thier Sudeki "is it really a review" review, perhaps this time and in the future I'll look elsewhere for something coherent.
JackFrost2012
Banned
Sysgen said:
Good?
Dr.Guru of Peru
played the long game
This game looks amazing.
JackFrost2012 said:Good?
Expecting something to be what it's not is not a good thing. Though I'm just speculating and I like to write
. In the end I may agree with 1ups final score or maybe not. Teamxbox just put up thier score. http://reviews.teamxbox.com/xbox/767/Sudeki/p1
About what IGN gave it.
This game is just more proof (as if we needed any more) that a company who has a bad track record isn't likely to turn it around with a bigger budget/high profile game. Has Climax ever made one game that was above mediocre or significant in any way? No.
So why did people get their hopes up so high that they would deliver with this one?
So why did people get their hopes up so high that they would deliver with this one?
MightyHedgehog
Member
Huh? Moto GP 1 & 2 were great.
SolidSnakex
Member
Dave Long said:
They've made the MotoGP series which is top notch. You're confusing them with the other Climax (who aren't really that bad).
JackFrost2012
Banned
Sysgen said:
*sigh* okay, annotated version:
They expected it to be good? And it wasn't?
^^
joke
This is sad... too much hate...
Also... too many cube fanboys in this thread. Away with you! SHOO! SHOOOOOOOOOOOO!
I'll be picking this up though. As long as the combat remains engaging and the environments varied, I'll be satisfied. Hell, I am having a great time with ToS which has a shitty storyline, generic characters and mediocre graphics.
Also... too many cube fanboys in this thread. Away with you! SHOO! SHOOOOOOOOOOOO!
I'll be picking this up though. As long as the combat remains engaging and the environments varied, I'll be satisfied. Hell, I am having a great time with ToS which has a shitty storyline, generic characters and mediocre graphics.
nitewulf said:
THIS is the type of ignorant comments that really bothers me. The one thing the 1up review absolutely does not touch upon at all is the incredibly gorgeous environments in the game and the stunning graphics. And that's what's important about the art. You barely ever see the character's faces, usually just looking at their backs and really seeing the environments 90% of the time.
This game does NOT suck. I've played objectively crappy games, and this is definitely not one of them. If you're not a fan of the genre this isn't going to swing you over, but if you are then it's definitely a game you should check out.
Where all this hate is coming from just astonishes me. I really have to chalk it up to nipponophile pretentious jackasses that fear any "gaijin" treading on their beloved misappropriated culture. Maybe they're all just pissed off that no black people talk in ebonics in the game.
boutrosinit
Street Fighter IV World Champion
Kobun Heat said:
You and I both mon frere. I wander if they'll sell enough to keep that sequel in devevlopment.
SolidSnakex
Member
boutrosinit said:
I figure it'll clear anywhere from 200-300k in the US. Just on the hype alone and because of the Xbox's overall lack of RPG's.
boutrosinit
Street Fighter IV World Champion
rastex said:
Hi Rastex. If this game were released a good few years ago, perhaps we would not consider it a game that sucks. When you compare the likes of KOTOR, Jade Empire, or even RPGS on other consoles, then this game is A JOKE.
The combat mechanics are clunky and sloppy, the character design (well we've beat that horse a few times, but for one last time) is horrendous, the colour scheme is very much an aquired taste - if you like the colour scheme in the ginger bread house children's stories, then you'll like this - and the level design set-pieces have been seen and done a million times before. Oh and don't forget the pre-pubescant script writing, or the game world logic - oh look a treasure chest in the middle of a town market that I can just steal, because that's where everyone leaves their valuables!?!?!
The game is a lazily designed, ugly, generic, joke that M$ has spunked nearly four years of budget into and this is what they've handed us. This deserves no more than an average mark, if that.
Suikoguy said:
nitewulf said:
You know, I'd really like to see a comparison done of Sudeki and ToS. One thing I've heard about both games is that they have a horrible storyline, it's just that Sudeki gets WAY more flack for it than ToS for some reason. That's why I chalk it up to pretentious elitist nipponomania.
SolidSnakex
Member
"You know, I'd really like to see a comparison done of Sudeki and ToS. One thing I've heard about both games is that they have a horrible storyline, it's just that Sudeki gets WAY more flack for it than ToS for some reason. That's why I chalk it up to pretentious elitist nipponomania."
While ToS story isn't really anything great, one thing it does have going for it in that area is some really charming characters. So even though the story might not be great, some things the characters say will put a smile on your face. I'm not saying Sudeki won't, but I haven't heard anything positive about it's story, even from people that like it.
While ToS story isn't really anything great, one thing it does have going for it in that area is some really charming characters. So even though the story might not be great, some things the characters say will put a smile on your face. I'm not saying Sudeki won't, but I haven't heard anything positive about it's story, even from people that like it.
Fresh Prince
Banned
I see this as more of xbots vs nintendorks myself
While the PS2 laughs at the scraps it's dogs have to share.
boutrosinit said:
Give me a break. Seriously. Do you even read what you write? It's the very definition of making a mountain out of a mole hill. Every single "point" you came up with can be levied against almost every single game in existence. EVERY game has design issues. EVERY game has backwards ass logic.
Let me give you an example for the highly esteemed Miyamoto. In Wind Waker Link goes into a bomb shop at night to purchase some bombs, the original version he just purchases some bombs, Miyamoto says "hey hey, let's think about this for a second" new version happens where the shop owner comments on Link (a kid) being out late at night and there's some consequence of that. Now notice how the issue wasn't the fact that a kid is trying to buy some friggin bombs. Obviously if Link couldn't buy bombs in any shops because he's a kid it'd make for a very frustrating game, so the game logic takes a bend to accomodate that situation. Do you see how that works? It happens in EVERY game. Even KOTOR, you can just go into some people's apartments and take their crap right from under them, that's messed up.
All your other lame-ass anal points are of the same type. Like I said before, give me a friggin break.