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[EVH]

Nintendo's next console should try to be able to run the next iteration of Unreal Engine. Even though brown lolz bald space marines uhg and all that, it's the "standard" engine for a lot of projects, so I'm supossing that will happen again when the next gen comes.

I mean, if the third parties doesn't like to work at Wii2 when the PS4 comes, I'm pretty sure that they won't be porting a shit to Wii2 if they're not able to find a way to do it easily.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Nintendo's next console should try to be able to run the next iteration of Unreal Engine. Even though brown lolz bald space marines uhg and all that, it's the "standard" engine for a lot of projects, so I'm supossing that will happen again when the next gen comes.

I mean, if the third parties doesn't like to work at Wii2 when the PS4 comes, I'm pretty sure that they won't be porting a shit to Wii2 if they're not able to find a way to do it easily.

I would love if it could run UE4. I simply do not believe it would be feasible with the power draw consoles can realistically have. I don't see consoles going over 200 watts. High end cards easily hit that I believe (correct me if I'm wrong). Consoles are now limited by thermo-dynamics.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Ok, so Detective Gaf, what power level do you expect for this thing? (no over 9k jokes)

Scenario 1: Xbox 360 level (not much more or less)

Scenario 2: Notch above 360 (running current gen games, regardless of complexity at 1080p)

Scenario 3: Significantly above 360 (running any current game games at 1080p, 60fps with improves textures and IQ)

Scenario 4: Next-gen .5 (Runs current-gen games as listed above, but in addition has just enough horsepower to create innovative new engines to provide graphics and performance never before seen at home, but below expectations for the next Xbox and Playstation)

Scenario 5: True Next-Gen (Xbox 720 or PS4 level, or just a hair or two below)

I'm expecting scenario 2. You will have developers who may want to show graphics beyond what the 360 can do by just lowering the resolution.

Ok, since I'm bored, I'm posting this from another thread. I'm gonna say the rumors point to a 4.

 

[Mr_Brit]

Mr. Brit really does have it out for the 3DS lol.

I think I'm cool with the power of the 3DS and don't see it as a massive cop-out like the DS was. Its not the cutting edge, and I don't think Nintendo will ever go for that. I would f'ing love NGP power or IPAD power of course, but there is a cost associated with that. Sure I would f'ing pay that cost, but Nintendo figures most people won't.

*dreams*


Man how I wish handhelds and consoles in general were like PC's, where most games run on most hardware with minimal fuss but at different detail levels. Want a fucking smoking 3DS with like 1 GB of RAM and some massive HD Screen? Pony up $400 or what have you. Or get the weaksauce version Nintendo is pushing now. Hey, no worries man you get the same games, you can still enjoy the product. But you have a CHOICE about how pretty those games get to be.

I couldn't care less about any platforms or companies, all I care about is whether their hardware is holding back my games.

I don't have any agendas or biases yet when I call out anti gamer decisions made by people's favourite gaming companies it's always me with the issues and never with anyone else. Friend codes, Portal 2's embarassing engine and Brink releasing in a broken state are all things I have argued recently and without fail I have been called a troll simply for stating negative things about people's favourite gaming companies.

Consoles hold back PC games, that is an unarguable fact as evidenced by the Witcher 2.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

Ok, since I'm bored, I'm posting this from another thread. I'm gonna say the rumors point to a 4.

If it's not 3, 4, or 5 (more so 4 or 5), it's a failure IMO. If Microsoft and Sony both launch consoles that put Ninty back where they are currently where the "console pushing" games aren't released as they should be on Cafe, that'll be a problem in 2 years.

 

[orioto]

Ok, so Detective Gaf, what power level do you expect for this thing? (no over 9k jokes)

Scenario 1: Xbox 360 level (not much more or less)

Scenario 2: Notch above 360 (running current gen games, regardless of complexity at 1080p)

Scenario 3: Significantly above 360 (running any current game games at 1080p, 60fps with improves textures and IQ)

Scenario 4: Next-gen .5 (Runs current-gen games as listed above, but in addition has just enough horsepower to create innovative new engines to provide graphics and performance never before seen at home, but below expectations for the next Xbox and Playstation)

Scenario 5: True Next-Gen (Xbox 720 or PS4 level, or just a hair or two below)

I'm expecting scenario 2. You will have developers who may want to show graphics beyond what the 360 can do by just lowering the resolution.

I say in best case scenario :

_ Scenario 2 or 3 with a bonnus (Modern shader makes all that look scenario 4, as the 3ds and its super effective shaders)

Meaning, what i imagine at best is, let' say, a wave race with geometry and textures (let's say resources) PS3 level, but some magical modern shaders on water + coding tricks makes it look like nothing we know, basically. That at 1080p+60fps, it would look like Scenario 5 for everyone.

That's what Mario Galaxy is in certain regard for the Wii.

 

[Hiro]

You're shtick of bitching about the 3DS specs in every 3DS thread got old long ago.

It's got nothing to do with any agendas, and everything to do with Epic being wholey uninterested in pushing UE3 on the platform, for legitimate busines reasons, just as they were completely uninterested in pushing UE2.5 on the Wii and it was instead up to other developers to do the work for them.

UE3 as we know it couldn't run on the 3DS. I dont doubt that with enough work Epic could get a UE3-lite version running for the 3DS, obviously stripped of the bigger features, or at the very least (and as already said) a souped up version of UE2.5 with shaders, similar to what BioShock is running on.

Capcom can get a perfectly capable version of MT Framework running on the 3DS, shaders and all, and I'm supposed to believe it's impossible for UE3 to run on the same platform in any way, shape or form? Please.

The technical engineers of the Unreal Engine, such as Tim Sweeney, Daniel Wright, Andrew Scheidecker, Jordan Walker, etc. have all made it clear that the Wii couldn't run Unreal Engine 3 and that the 3DS is incapable of running Unreal Engine 3 also. MT Frameworks is a whole other engine made to cater to a different set of systems. Believe what you will, but the technical engineers of UE3 know their engine and know what they are talking about when they say the Wii couldn't run it and neither can the 3DS. Which is quite sad, considering that iOS can run UE3. So don't pretend to know more about what the UE can and cannot do and what it can and cannot operate on because you don't know jack shit compared to, let's say, Andrew Scheidecker, when it comes to UE3 and UDK. End of GODDAMN story. Also, what the fuck in comparing MT Framework to UE3. Let me put it this way: UE3 > MT Framework 2.1

 

[Amir0x]

always a good day to see people legitimately arguing someone can somehow squeeze UE3 onto the outdated technology contained in 3DS. "They can do it, if you just...twist it...er, turn it...this way...there it fits!"

I was hoping we'd be beyond that delusional argument ages ago but I guess people REALLY want UE3 on the thing.

Don't worry, Stream will have UE3!

but some magical modern shaders on water + coding tricks makes it look like nothing we know, basically.

Stream is not going to invent some magical shaders/coding tricks that we don't have a name for. It's using technology that is fairly old that most developers have a very good grasp of

But boy I do hope for WaveRace. With thunderstorm levels so there's huge ocean swells and waves crashing everywhere with next-gen tech! Mmm!

 

[Oblivion]

Is there an actual Unreal Engine 2.5? Or is that just a figure of speech, like "Toy story graphics"?

 

[Log4Girlz]

I couldn't care less about any platforms or companies, all I care about is whether their hardware is holding back my games.

I don't have any agendas or biases yet when I call out anti gamer decisions made by people's favourite gaming companies it's always me with the issues and never with anyone else. Friend codes, Portal 2's embarassing engine and Brink releasing in a broken state are all things I have argued recently and without fail I have been called a troll simply for stating negative things about people's favourite gaming companies.

Consoles hold back PC games, that is an unarguable fact as evidenced by the Witcher 2.

No worries man, I really don't see you as hating the 3DS for the sake of hating, you want the best and the 3DS does not match your standards especially at the price. That's cool. Nothing wrong with having high standards or being vocal about them. I mention you hating as a joke and I'm only just commenting on how frequently you speak out against it

 

[Mr_Brit]

You're shtick of bitching about the 3DS specs in every 3DS thread got old long ago.

It's got nothing to do with any agendas, and everything to do with Epic being wholey uninterested in pushing UE3 on the platform, for legitimate busines reasons, just as they were completely uninterested in pushing UE2.5 on the Wii and it was instead up to other developers to do the work for them.

UE3 as we know it couldn't run on the 3DS. I dont doubt that with enough work Epic could get a UE3-lite version running for the 3DS, obviously stripped of the bigger features, or at the very least (and as already said) a souped up version of UE2.5 with shaders, similar to what BioShock is running on.

Capcom can get a perfectly capable version of MT Framework running on the 3DS, shaders and all, and I'm supposed to believe it's impossible for UE3 to run on the same platform in any way, shape or form? Please.

MT framework is a completely different engine and has nothing to do with the feasibility of porting UE3 to the 3DS. On top of that we don't even know how much of MT framework actually made it onto the 3DS.

I'll also take the word of Tim Sweeney who knows a lot more about UE3 and programming in general than you ever will over your word. No offense intended.

Also, instead of expecting Epic to Frankenstein their cutting edge engine onto the system, how about expecting Nintendo to design modern hardware able to run a relatively svelte engine.

No worries man, I really don't see you as hating the 3DS for the sake of hating, you want the best and the 3DS does not match your standards especially at the price. That's cool. Nothing wrong with having high standards or being vocal about them. I mention you hating as a joke and I'm only just commenting on how frequently you speak out against it

No offense taken, I mainly post in hardware threads so that's probably why it may seem that I speak out about the 3DS a lot.

Is there an actual Unreal Engine 2.5? Or is that just a figure of speech, like "Toy story graphics"?

UE 2.5 is just an upgraded version of Unreal Engine 2 which is the predeccsor to UE3.

 

[Hiro]

Is there an actual Unreal Engine 2.5? Or is that just a figure of speech, like "Toy story graphics"?

There is an UE 2.5 just as there is a UE 3.5, which is the horespower behind GoW3. There's also a UE 3.97 too. =P

 

[Hiro]

MT framework is a completely different engine and has nothing to do with the feasibility of porting UE3 to the 3DS. On top of that we don't even know how much of MT framework actually made it onto the 3DS.

I'll also take the word of Tim Sweeney who knows a lot more about UE3 and programming in general than you ever will over your word. No offense intended.

Also, instead of expecting Epic to Frankenstein their cutting edge engine onto the system, how about expecting Nintendo to design modern hardware able to run a relatively svelte engine.


No offense taken, I mainly post in hardware threads so that's probably why it may seem that I speak about the 3DS a lot.


UE 2.5 is just an upgraded version of Unreal Engine 2 which is the predeccsor to UE3.

A man after my own heart.

 

[Log4Girlz]

always a good day to see people legitimately arguing someone can somehow squeeze UE3 onto the outdated technology contained in 3DS. "They can do it, if you just...twist it...er, turn it...this way...there it fits!"

I was hoping we'd be beyond that delusional argument ages ago but I guess people REALLY want UE3 on the thing.

Don't worry, Stream will have UE3!



Stream is not going to invent some magical shaders/coding tricks that we don't have a name for. It's using technology that is fairly old that most developers have a very good grasp of

But boy I do hope for WaveRace. With thunderstorm levels so there's huge ocean swells and waves crashing everywhere with next-gen tech! Mmm!

Not old man, seasoned...seasoned As for Wave Race. I played countless hours on Wave Race 64. Countless. What a fucking amazing IP to show off the hardware. But...I want the racers to be wearing racing gear (Helmets, skin-tight body suits).

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

Sometimes I wonder...

Seriously. I know, intellectually, that it makes no sense, but half the time I just get the feeling that 50% of western devs have some sort of hatred for the system. The notion that they would be making a Wii game would be like sending them to the kiddy table or something, and no self respecting developers would make a game for the system.

I think the real reason is that they can't stand the idea of going back to older hardware when they've tasted the fruit. Probably the same reason why we see so few AAA studios make handheld games. It's not handhelds or Nintendo they hate per se, they just hate working with weak hardware.

 

[orioto]

Stream is not going to invent some magical shaders/coding tricks that we don't have a name for. It's using technology that is fairly old that most developers have a very good grasp of

But boy I do hope for WaveRace. With thunderstorm levels so there's huge ocean swells and waves crashing everywhere with next-gen tech! Mmm!

But it will have shaders that we don't have on 360 and PS3 due to new gpu, no ? What i mean is that if you mix those new tools, + enough horse power and especially Nintendo magic (You say there won't be any tricks, but .. Wave Race 64 or even Mario Galaxy were totally out of nowhere in term of tech when they were released, Wave race for it's water engine and Galaxy for it's next gen shaders everywhere) can make that like nothing we saw. That's not like we saw a lot of next gen games already right ?

 

[Hiro]

I think the real reason is that they can't stand the idea of going back to older hardware......

Or ya know, their tools won't function on older hardware. You are being a nintendofanboy/girl and it's very annoying. There is no conspiracy against nintendo. And whether or not UE3 can run on the Wii/3DS (protip: IT CAN'T), Nintendo is still going to win the console wars as far as sales. So your getting your way, so stop complaining.

 

[Mr_Brit]

But it will have shaders that we don't have on 360 and PS3 due to new gpu, no ? What i mean is that if you mix those new tools, + enough horse power and especially Nintendo magic (You say there won't be any tricks, but .. Wave Race 64 or even Mario Galaxy were totally out of nowhere in term of tech when they were released, Wave race for it's water engine and Galaxy for it's next gen shaders everywhere) can make that like nothing we saw. That's not like we saw a lot of next gen games already right ?

Yes, the GPU in Wii 2 will be able to pull off shaders that 360 or PS3 can't which means that Nintendo will be able to get much closer to their artists visions, imagine a HD Wave Race with photorealistic water that reacts with completely lifelike physics, that is something that Nintendo could do on the system.

 

[Log4Girlz]

But it will have shaders that we don't have on 360 and PS3 due to new gpu, no ? What i mean is that if you mix those new tools, + enough horse power and especially Nintendo magic (You say there won't be any tricks, but .. Wave Race 64 or even Mario Galaxy were totally out of nowhere in term of tech when they were released, Wave race for it's water engine and Galaxy for it's next gen shaders everywhere) can make that like nothing we saw. That's not like we saw a lot of next gen games already right ?

I was playing Galaxy the other day and...I didn't see any next-gen shaders. What I saw was fabulous art design that coaxed a next-gen look. I mean, still looks nice.

 

[orioto]

I was playing Galaxy the other day and...I didn't see any next-gen shaders. What I saw was fabulous art design that coaxed a next-gen look. I mean, still looks nice.

Well i'm not 100% sure but it seems Mario galaxy is full of shaders everywhere, multitexturing, normal maps (or at least bump mapping), reflection.. things you don't see in other wii games for sure.

 

[SneakyStephan]

But it will have shaders that we don't have on 360 and PS3 due to new gpu, no ? What i mean is that if you mix those new tools, + enough horse power and especially Nintendo magic (You say there won't be any tricks, but .. Wave Race 64 or even Mario Galaxy were totally out of nowhere in term of tech when they were released, Wave race for it's water engine and Galaxy for it's next gen shaders everywhere) can make that like nothing we saw. That's not like we saw a lot of next gen games already right ?

If it uses rv700 it'll have a directx 10 gpu, the tech has been around on pc for like 4 years now.
There won't be anything new that you haven't seen before.

As far as I'm aware dx9 could already do any effect dx10 could anyway, so even compared to the current consoles there won't be anything spectacularly new.

If the games end up looking like the current pc equivalent of ports (and at 1080p 60 fps) you can thank the gods for that.
That's already much better than what you get right now on ps360.

You might see something looking as good as the witcher 2 but the framerate would suck badly.

But hey, seeing how batshit insane people are going over 3DS graphics when most launch games look worse than the prettiest psp games, I'm sure people will be more than content with that.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Yes, the GPU in Wii 2 will be able to pull off shaders that 360 or PS3 can't which means that Nintendo will be able to get much closer to their artists visions, imagine a HD Wave Race with photorealistic water that reacts with completely lifelike physics, that is something that Nintendo could do on the system.

My frothing demand is reaching unhealthy levels.

Wave Race: Fucking photo-realistic water

F-Zero: Colorful, crisp as fuck 1080p (or i lol) 60 fps graphix with GRIT. I always picture a next-gen game with just grit and subtle details like dings and dents and...fuck just imagine a Star Wars like aesthetic in that regard. If you don't understand, ask me to clarify my vision further.

Mario: Ultra-clean, cartoony world. I want things to have a squash and stretch and vivid animation like a classic cartoon.

Zelda: Ni no kuni graphix plz. I mean seriously, I would go ape-shit

Metroid: GRIT. DETAIL. MINUTIA. A living breathing world brimming with subtle detail.

Man what other IP's to whore out. Oh yeah teh Pikmins. Just give me a photo-realistic world to explore with Pikmin sorta rendered to look like stop-motion clay figuerines. Just like the cover to Pikmin 2. Kinda cartoony, surreal but very much real looking, convincingly photo-realistic.

 

[goomba]

Makes me :rolleyes when anyone talks about DX9, DX10 or DX11 in regard to anything except PC gaming or the XBox. DirectX is a Microsoft technology, nobody else uses it!.

 

[orioto]

If it uses rv700 it'll have a directx 10 gpu, the tech has been around on pc for like 4 years now.
There won't be anything new that you haven't seen before.

As far as I'm aware dx9 could already do any effect dx10 could anyway, so even compared to the current consoles there won't be anything spectacularly new.

If the games end up looking like the current pc equivalent of ports (and at 1080p 60 fps) you can thank the gods for that.
That's already much better than what you get right now on ps360.

You might see something looking as good as the witcher 2 but the framerate would suck badly.

But hey, seeing how batshit insane people are going over 3DS graphics when most launch games look worse than the prettiest psp games, I'm sure people will be more than content with that.

A tool and what people can do with it are two different thing sir.

 

[SneakyStephan]

Makes me :rolleyes when anyone talks about DX9, DX10 or DX11 in regard to anything except PC gaming or the XBox. DirectX is a Microsoft technology, nobody else uses it!.

You tell me how it doesn't apply to cafe when the rumors are that it'll use a rv700 series gpu?

 

[Log4Girlz]

Makes me :rolleyes when anyone talks about DX9, DX10 or DX11 in regard to anything except PC gaming or the XBox. DirectX is a Microsoft technology, nobody else uses it!.

Well, its a benchmark to shoot for in these discussions. You do not have to have DX10 compliant hardware to replicate nearly every effect i offers. The techniques are not exclusive to direct x technology, direct x is a standard of producing said effects.

Anyone, feel free to correct me if i am wrong.

 

[Jerk]

You tell me how it doesn't apply to cafe when the rumors are that it'll use a rv700 series gpu?

OpenGL?

 

[goomba]

Well, its a benchmark to shoot for in these discussions. You do not have to have DX10 compliant hardware to replicate nearly every effect i offers. The techniques are not exclusive to direct x technology, direct x is a standard of producing said effects.

Anyone, feel free to correct me if i am wrong.

Its not a standard, its a MS propriety system included as part of MS platforms.. i.e Windows and Xbox.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

damn I hate this wait

just think, in more than one location on this planet there are Logos, A Name, Hardware and Software for this thing we are waiting on

Name
Logo
Controllers
Specs
Games

We need our own Ninja team!

 

[Mr_Brit]

Makes me :rolleyes when anyone talks about DX9, DX10 or DX11 in regard to anything except PC gaming or the XBox. DirectX is a Microsoft technology, nobody else uses it!.

Nobody was suggesting that they do simply that the DX level of a PC GPU is a good way of telling you what features it has e.g. DX9 GPUs have separate pixel and vertex shaders, DX10 have unified shaders and DX11 GPUs have tesselators. Since Wii 2 is using a PC GPU derivative the direct X level of the GPU tells you what features it is likely to have and how old it is.

 

[goomba]

You tell me how it doesn't apply to cafe when the rumors are that it'll use a rv700 series gpu?

OpenGL

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Well i'm not 100% sure but it seems Mario galaxy is full of shaders everywhere, multitexturing, normal maps (or at least bump mapping), reflection.. things you don't see in other wii games for sure.

DX8 level shaders.

Rim lights, speculars, embm, some light scattering, nothing that puts it into the range of 360. Art design is what gives SMG its luster. Well... the Conduit and its sequel are using engines much more technically advanced, and they look much worse than SMG. Normal maps don't mean much if your team is full of deviant artists.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Its not a standard, its a MS propriety system included as part of MS platforms.. i.e Windows and Xbox.

What I'm saying is, tesselation is not exclusive to Direct X. Programmable shaders are not exclusive to Direct X. Direct X is an implementation of them. Anything Direct X can do, another piece of software can do, albeit slightly differently.

Am I still wrong?

 

[SneakyStephan]

OpenGL?

They can pull off the same shader effects can't they?
What I'm saying is why would you suddenly expect a bunch of awesome new shaders from tech that has been tried and tested for over 3 years?

Just because it's nintendo? All the other pc devs who have worked on dx10 and openGL 4.1 games over the years are going to be shown how it's done?

What's the exciting new shit that we've seen in the last few years? SSAO, bokeh dof, per object motion blur, the indirect lighting radiosity stuff from frostbite 2 and some cool effect shaders (stuff like water, wet clothes etc) in other games.

My hd4870 (same architecture pretty much) chokes on dof and the motion blur.

I just think people should have realistic expectations of old hardware, even if it's a nice step up from ps360.
All the photorealistic and next gen talk is what makes me :rolleyes.

 

[orioto]

DX8 level shaders.

Rim lights, speculars, embm, some light scattering, nothing that puts it into the range of 360. Art design is what gives SMG its luster. Well... the Conduit and its sequel are using engines much more technically advanced, and they look much worse than SMG. Normal maps don't mean much if your team is full of deviant artists.

Deviant art is full of awesome artists

 

[Thunder Monkey]

What I'm saying is, tesselation is not exclusive to Direct X. Programmable shaders are not exclusive to Direct X. Direct X is an implementation of them. Anything Direct X can do, another piece of software can do, albeit slightly differently.

Am I still wrong?

You are not.

The TEV in the Wii is a shader. Just doesn't have the programmability of the Xbox's. The 3DS doesn't have a traditional shader set up, but definitely has a more advanced featureset than the Xbox featuring a "programmable" set.

Deviant art is full of awesome artists

Smartass.

You know what I meant.

 

[Log4Girlz]

They can pull off the same shader effects can't they?
What I'm saying is why would you suddenly expect a bunch of awesome new shaders from tech that has been tried and tested for over 3 years?

Just because it's nintendo? All the other pc devs who have worked on dx10 and openGL 4.1 games over the years are going to be shown how it's done?

What's the exciting new shit that we've seen in the last few years? SSAO, bokeh dof, per object motion blur, the indirect lighting radiosity stuff from frostbite 2 and some cool effect shaders (stuff like water, wet clothes etc) in other games.

My hd4870 (same architecture pretty much) chokes on dof and the motion blur.

I just think people should have realistic expectations of old hardware, even if it's a nice step up from ps360.
All the photorealistic and next gen talk is what makes me :rolleyes.

Photo-realism is not an absurd wish in certain titles. Considering the type of game Pikmin is for instance, if they chose that art direction, they could certainly get really close to photo-realism if they chose.

 

[wsippel]

OpenGL?

It's GX, actually. An API based on Silicon Graphics IRIS GL, the proprietary predecessor of OpenGL.

 

[brain_stew]

1GB ram is a a big no-no botleneck if PC/MS/Sony are much higher

Sony hasnt learn anything. NGP uses absolutely bleeding edge CPU and GPU for mobile. 2x everything on the iPad 2. Sony doesnt need to put in a $200 Bluray drive this time around..

No, the NGP uses a 4 year old GPU. It's the most conservative design in their history.

 

[Log4Girlz]

No, the NGP uses a 4 year old GPU. It's the most conservative design in their history.

But aren't there 4 of them?

NGP is kinda like a hotrod. Throw a bunch of relatively high performance, though antiquated, parts together and muscle your way to the performance level you want on the cheap.

Good analogy? Bad?

 

[Mr_Brit]

But aren't there 4 of them?

NGP is kinda like a hotrod. Throw a bunch of relatively high performance, though antiquated, parts together and muscle your way to the performance level you want on the cheap.

Good analogy? Bad?

The GPU/CPU in the NGP is very conservative, it's price will fall like a rock after launch and you can expect it to be in the low teens after around a year on the market. The biggest issue for the NGP's price is that huge OLED screen and how fast it will drop in price.

 

[v1oz]

The GCN was freaking magic in a purple box.
No system will ever outclass just how well built that thing was. Both performance wise and durability.

Yeah that was their best hardware design ever. With the one single design flaw being the practically useless ARAM.

 

[lilltias]

The GPU/CPU in the NGP is very conservative, it's price will fall like a rock after launch and you can expect it to be in the low teens after around a year on the market. The biggest issue for the NGP's price is that huge OLED screen and how fast it will drop in price.

Is it conservative in the mobile space too? Did not know that. What device today/soon uses new cutting edge stuff?

I'm genuinly interested.

 

[Log4Girlz]

The GPU/CPU in the NGP is very conservative, it's price will fall like a rock after launch and you can expect it to be in the low teens after around a year on the market. The biggest issue for the NGP's price is that huge OLED screen and how fast it will drop in price.

But, throwing 4 of them in seems like a good move right? I mean, they could have just put in 1 if they were being "cheap". What are the realistic alternatives? I believe this tech is 1 generation behind the absolute bleeding edge Power VR GPU that isn't released yet right? Could they realistically look to putting in 4 or those? Or would just having 1 of them been worthwhile because is blows their current solution out of the water?

Though conservative, I think the NGP is a pretty nice piece of kit. Not as nice as it could be, but then again we do not have a price yet.

 

[gofreak]

The GPU/CPU in the NGP is very conservative

I think the point is that if PS4 was to PS3 what NGP is to PSP, it would still be a big big jump. And very 'generous' with power vs the current high end. In fact, NGP vs generic mobile is more generous than PS3 was vs 'generic computer' (i.e. PC). Of course mobile platforms have the same thermal constraints as dedicated handhelds, which is why Sony can still be very 'big' on power there relative to other mobile devices (compared to consoles), but the point remains that they're still seem interested in rather high performance. NGP is not an example of them not being interested in big performance jumps just because they're now not doing their own R&D on bleeding edge architectures. In NGP they achieved their big performance jump with the (older) R&D investments of others, but the appetite for performance is still evident.

 

[v1oz]

If it uses rv700 it'll have a directx 10 gpu, the tech has been around on pc for like 4 years now.
There won't be anything new that you haven't seen before.

As far as I'm aware dx9 could already do any effect dx10 could anyway, so even compared to the current consoles there won't be anything spectacularly new.

If the games end up looking like the current pc equivalent of ports (and at 1080p 60 fps) you can thank the gods for that.
That's already much better than what you get right now on ps360.

You might see something looking as good as the witcher 2 but the framerate would suck badly.

But hey, seeing how batshit insane people are going over 3DS graphics when most launch games look worse than the prettiest psp games, I'm sure people will be more than content with that.

But consoles are bottlenecked by direct x. You code consoles directly to the metal so you can do stuff which isn't even implemented in direct x.

 

[wsippel]

Yeah that was their best hardware design ever. With the one single design flaw being the practically useless ARAM.

It wasn't really useless, just a lot less useful than it could have been - and too unusual for many developers. It was really damn slow, but still fast enough for audio or as a drive cache, which is exactly what it was supposed to be.

 

[Mr_Brit]

But, throwing 4 of them in seems like a good move right? I mean, they could have just put in 1 if they were being "cheap". What are the realistic alternatives? I believe this tech is 1 generation behind the absolute bleeding edge Power VR GPU that isn't released yet right? Could they realistically look to putting in 4 or those? Or would just having 1 of them been worthwhile because is blows their current solution out of the water?

Though conservative, I think the NGP is a pretty nice piece of kit. Not as nice as it could be, but then again we do not have a price yet.

Yes, the NGP is very powerful in comparison to current mobile phones but they'll soon catch up. It will fall in price quickly, be graphically competitive for years, cheap to design as it uses pre exisiting components from other manufacturers etc. The NGP is an excellently designed console, probably Sony's best so far.

I think the point is that if PS4 was to PS3 what NGP is to PSP, it would still be a big big jump. And very 'generous' with power vs the current high end. In fact, NGP vs generic mobile is more generous than PS3 was vs 'generic computer' (i.e. PC). Of course mobile platforms have the same thermal constraints as dedicated handhelds, which is why Sony can still be very 'big' on power there relative to other mobile devices (compared to consoles), but the point remains that they're still seem interested in rather high performance. NGP is not an example of them not being interested in big performance jumps just because they're now not doing their own R&D on bleeding edge architectures. In NGP they achieved their big performance jump with the (older) R&D investments of others, but the appetite for performance is still evident.

Good post. Sony set out to give a big jump over the PSP and they've done so whilst not wasting huge amounts on R&D and using cheap components whilst still delivering very high performance and graphics that will remain competitive for years.

 

[F#A#Oo]

I don't get why people get all caught up in these tech wars...

The Wii and DS have shown that it doesn't really matter...ultimately it's not Nintendo who loses out but the developers who put their ego's ahead of making $$$...

 

[stilgar]

I don't get why people get all caught up in these tech wars...

The Wii and DS have shown that it doesn't really matter...ultimately it's not Nintendo who loses out

Yes.

but the developers who put their ego's ahead of making $$$...

NO